Call No Man Father

[donadams]

Ez 36:25-27

Baptism washes us clean
White as snow
Sins forgiven

Notice new heart so we can fulfill Deut. 6:5 love of God

Rom 5:5 5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.

All in baptismal regeneration!

Thanks be to God!

 

[donadams]

Mark 16:16
Does that Scripture teach that baptism is required for salvation? The short answer is, no, it does not. In order to make it teach that baptism is required for salvation, one must go beyond what the verse actually says. What this verse does teach is that belief is necessary for salvation.

Ephesians 4:5.
When we read the CONTEXT of the passage we see that Paul IS NOT speaking of water baptism at all but is focused on the baptism of the Holy Spirit after one comes to Christ.

Acts 8:36
This Scripture does not say or suggest anything about baptism being needed to be saved.
What is actualy says is....."And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?"

Everyone who accepts Christ should follow in baptism just as did the eunuch did.

Acts 22:16
You are only Concerned with the words, "be baptized, and wash away your sins," .
However, again when we actually read the whole contextual focus of the passage we learn that because Paul was already cleansed spiritually at the time Christ appeared to him, He accepted Christ and therefore these words refer to the symbolism of baptism. Baptism is a picture of God’s inner work of washing away sin

1 Peter 3:20-21
I think that you do not understand the Jewish economy. You see my friend. The people in the Old Test brought an offering to the Tabernacle or Temple as a token to God for saving them. Then The Old Testament Jew was saved before he brought the offering. That offering was only his outward testimony that he was placing faith in the Lamb of God of whom these sacrifices were a type....Water baptism is the outward testimony of the believer’s inward faith.

The point is.....the believer is baptized AFTER he is saved because he is saved by faith and baptism is an out testimony of an inward decision.

Ark is a type of baptism according to scriptures 1 pet 3:20-21 says so why doubt it?

Faith & Baptism is the initiation of the new and eternal covenant!

You cannot enter on you’re own or by “faith alone”!

You cannot receive Christ or grace by “faith alone”!

“Accept Christ as you’re personal lord and savior” is fundamentalist tradition not found scripture!

Jn 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Baptismal regeneration a new creation in Christ! 2 Cor 5:17

A sacrament is an oath! A sacred promise from God! Ez 36:25-27
Acts 2:38-39 (this promise)

No baptism no grace!
No union with God and His saints thru Christ the mediator!

A sacrament is an outward sign for all men including infants And a gift from God to help us see what he does inwardly and invisibly by his grace!

As grace Washes our souls in the merits of Jesus blood from original and personal sin, so the outward action of washing is visible!

without the outward action the inward action cannot take place!

Jn 3:5 Titus 3:5 water and washing
acts 22:16 wash away your sin!

Jn 3:5 Born again BY water and the spirit! Not by “faith alone”!

They did not go to Jerusalem and preach “accept Christ as you’re personal Lord and savior “

They went to the river (water) and they baptized! Jn 3:22

A covenant requires an outward sign of the inward action of grace!

Ez 36:25 I will sprinkle you with clean water and you shall be made white as snow.

Acts 22:16 washing away your sins.

Eph 4:5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism.

1 pet 3:21 baptism saves you.

You cannot enter on you’re own or by faith alone! Jn 3:5

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Heb 2:11 For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,


Baptism!

God breathed life into Adam, gen 2:7 and we received this life from our fathers!

Christ breathed on the apostles our spiritual fathers, we receive the new covenant life of God’s grace from them thru faith & baptism! Jn 20:21-23 Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38 eph 2

Born again! Born from above!

'The Father has set his seal' on Christ (John 6:27) and also seals us in him (cf. 2 Corinthians 1:22; Ephesians 1:23, 4:30). Because this seal indicates the indelible effect of the anointing with the Holy Spirit in the sacrament of Baptism,

Baptism indeed is the seal of eternal life." The faithful Christian who I has "kept the seal" until the end, remaining faithful to the demands of his Baptism, will be able to depart this life "marked with the sign of faith," with his baptismal faith, in expectation of the blessed vision of God - the consummation of faith - and in the hope of resurrection.

St. Paul tells the faithful at Ephesus that they have been “sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.” This is in terms of an indelible character imprinted on the soul in the sacraments of baptism and confirmation. It is not as if this invisible mark is simply decorative. Rather, through it, we are enabled to participate in Christ’s mission and in his offices of priest, prophet, and king. Eph 1:13 and cannot be repeated

Sealed by God eph 1:13 sealed by God (ez 36:25-27) in the ark of salvation by baptism just as Noah was sealed by God in the ark of the flood gen 7:16

1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark of Noah none were saved, outside the church (the ark of salvation) none are saved!)

Sealed in the ark, sealed in the church the ark of salvation by God thru baptism!


Christ instituted the holy church to teach and sanctify all men unto eternal salvation. (repent and believe the gospel) with the institution of the sacraments to convey grace to sanctify souls!
Matt 28:19

 

[donadams]

Church fathers

Sacred tradition commanded by Christ, go teach all men! Matt 28:19

Testimony of the early church in the successors of the apostles! Verified by acts 2:42

Acts 1:8 witnesses of Christ with the power of the Holy Spirit!

We must hear the apostolic church! Matt 18:17

A) "It does not suffice to believe. He who believes and is not yet baptized, but is only a Catechumen, has not yet fully acquired salvation." St. Thomas Aquinas

B) "Now, even the Catechumen believes in the Cross of the Lord Jesus, but unless he be baptized in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost, he cannot receive remission of his sins nor the gift of spiritual grace." St. Ambrose

C) "Without the Sacrament of Baptism, no one is ever justified. If anyone says that Baptism is optional, that is, not necessary for salvation: let him be anathema." Council of Trent

D)
“There are three ways in which sins are forgiven: in baptism, in prayer, and in the greater humility of penance; yet God does not forgive sins except to the baptized” (Sermons to Catechumens on the Creed 7:15 [A.D. 395]).
St. AUGUSTINE

E) “As many as are persuaded and believe that what we [Christians] teach and say is true, and undertake to be able to live accordingly . . . are brought by us where there is water, and are regenerated in the same manner in which we were ourselves regenerated. For, in the name of God, the Father and Lord of the universe, and of our Savior Jesus Christ, and of the Holy Spirit, they then receive the washing with water. For Christ also said, ‘Except you be born again, you shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven’ [John 3:3]” (First Apology 61 [A.D. 151]).
JUSTIN MARTYR

TERTULLIAN
“Happy is our sacrament of water, in that, by washing away the sins of our early blindness, we are set free and admitted into eternal life. . . . [But] a viper of the [Gnostic] Cainite heresy, lately conversant in this quarter, has carried away a great number with her most venomous doctrine, making it her first aim to destroy baptism—which is quite in accordance with nature, for vipers and.asps . . . themselves generally do live in arid and waterless places. But we, little fishes after the example of our [Great] Fish, Jesus Christ, are born in water, nor have we safety in any other way than by permanently abiding in water. So that most monstrous creature, who had no right to teach even sound doctrine, knew full well how to kill the little fishes—by taking them away from the water!” (Baptism 1 [A.D. 203]).

“Without baptism, salvation is attainable by none” (ibid., 12).

ORIGEN
“It is not possible to receive forgiveness of sins without baptism” (Exhortation to the Martyrs 30 [A.D. 235]).

CYRIL OF JERUSALEM
“If any man does not receive baptism, he does not have salvation.

St. AUGUSTINE
“There are three ways in which sins are forgiven: in baptism, in prayer, and in the greater humility of penance; yet God does not forgive sins except to the baptized” (Sermons to Catechumens on the Creed 7:15 [A.D. 395]).

POPE LEO I
“And because of the transgression of the first man, the whole stock of the human race was tainted; no one can be set free from the state of the old Adam save through Christ’s sacrament of baptism, in which there are no distinctions between the reborn, as the apostle [Paul] says, ‘For as many of you as were baptized in Christ did put on Christ; there is neither Jew nor Greek . . . ‘ [Gal. 3:27–28]” (Letters 15:10[11] [A.D. 445]).

FULGENTIUS OF RUSPE
“From that time at which our Savior said, ‘If anyone is not reborn of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven’ [John 3:5], no one can, without the sacrament of baptism, except those who, in the Catholic Church, without baptism, pour out their blood for Christ, receive the kingdom of heaven and life eternal” (The Rule of Faith 43 [A.D. 524]).

Irenaeus
He [Jesus] came to save all through himself – all, I say, who through him are reborn in God; INFANTS, and children, and youths, and old men. Therefore he passed through every age, becoming an INFANT for INFANTS, sanctifying INFANTS; a child for children, sanctifying those who are of that age . . . [so that] he might be the perfect teacher in all things, perfect not only in respect to the setting forth of truth, perfect also in respect to relative age (Against Heresies 2:22:4 [A.D. 189]).

Hippolytus
Baptize first the children, and if they can speak for themselves let them do so. Otherwise, let their parents or other relatives speak for them (The Apostolic Tradition 21:16 [A.D.215]).

Origen
THE CHURCH RECEIVED FROM THE APOSTLES the tradition of giving baptism even to infants. The APOSTLES, to whom were committed the secrets of divine sacraments, knew there is in everyone innate strains of [original] sin, which must be washed away through water and the Spirit (Commentaries on Romans 5:9 [A.D. 248]).

Cyprian
As to what pertains to the case of INFANTS: You [Fidus] said that they ought not to be baptized within the second or third day after their birth, that the old law of circumcision must be taken into consideration, and that you did not think that one should be baptized and sanctified within the eighth day after his birth. In our council it seemed to us far otherwise. No one agreed to the course which you thought should be taken. Rather, we all judge that the mercy and grace of God ought to be denied to no man born" (Letters 64:2 [A.D. 253]).

 

[donadams]

And Jesus who we both say is God said..."Call no man your heavenly father".

Actually, until about the year 400, a bishop was called "papa" for Father; this title was then restricted solely to addressing the Bishop of Rome, the successor of St. Peter, and in English was rendered "pope."

I know that you will agree that you as a Catholic refer to the Pope as the "Holy Father".

As scripture says Isa 22:21-22

1 Corinthians 4:15
For though ye have ten thousand instructers in Christ, yet have ye notmany fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.


Matt 23:9
Call no man father? Jesus is condemning pride and spiritual pride of the Pharisees?

Or is this absolute?

God calls men father!

Ex 3:6 Moreover he said, I am the God of thy fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. And Moses hid his face; for he was afraid to look upon God.

Jesus calls men father!

Jn 6:49 Your fathers did eat manna in the wilderness, and are dead.

Mary calls men father!

Lk 1:55 As he spake to our fathers, to Abraham, and to his seed for ever.

Peter calls men father!

Acts 3:13 The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go.

Acts 3:22 Moses said unto the fathers…

The stephen calls men father!

Acts 7 Stephen quotes the fathers over and over!

Apostles call men father!

1 Jn 2:13 I write unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I write unto you, young men, because ye have overcome the wicked one. I write unto you, little children, because ye have known the Father.

14 I have written unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I have written unto you, young men, because ye are strong, and the word of God abideth in you, and ye have overcome the wicked one.

The Bible calls men father!

Luke 16:24
And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.


Acts 3:13
The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go.


Jn 4:20 Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship.

Jesus does not rebuke her for calling men father!


Then there is spiritual fathers who have care for our souls! Heb 13:7-17

Isa 22 the administrator of the kingdom is called father, so the same for Peter, the apostles, and their successors!

 

[Hopeful 2]

If you are saved why do you need mercy?

If one is "saved", they have found their name in the book of life, on the last day.
God's mercy got them to that point.
He promised us that we will never be tempted above what we can handle...in 1 Cor 10:13.

 

[Rodger]

Ark is a type of baptism according to scriptures 1 pet 3:20-21 says so why doubt it?

Faith & Baptism is the initiation of the new and eternal covenant!

You cannot enter on you’re own or by “faith alone”!

You cannot receive Christ or grace by “faith alone”!

“Accept Christ as you’re personal lord and savior” is fundamentalist tradition not found scripture!

Jn 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Baptismal regeneration a new creation in Christ! 2 Cor 5:17

A sacrament is an oath! A sacred promise from God! Ez 36:25-27
Acts 2:38-39 (this promise)

No baptism no grace!
No union with God and His saints thru Christ the mediator!

A sacrament is an outward sign for all men including infants And a gift from God to help us see what he does inwardly and invisibly by his grace!

As grace Washes our souls in the merits of Jesus blood from original and personal sin, so the outward action of washing is visible!

without the outward action the inward action cannot take place!

Jn 3:5 Titus 3:5 water and washing
acts 22:16 wash away your sin!

Jn 3:5 Born again BY water and the spirit! Not by “faith alone”!

They did not go to Jerusalem and preach “accept Christ as you’re personal Lord and savior “

They went to the river (water) and they baptized! Jn 3:22

A covenant requires an outward sign of the inward action of grace!

Ez 36:25 I will sprinkle you with clean water and you shall be made white as snow.

Acts 22:16 washing away your sins.

Eph 4:5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism.

1 pet 3:21 baptism saves you.

You cannot enter on you’re own or by faith alone! Jn 3:5

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Heb 2:11 For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,


Baptism!

God breathed life into Adam, gen 2:7 and we received this life from our fathers!

Christ breathed on the apostles our spiritual fathers, we receive the new covenant life of God’s grace from them thru faith & baptism! Jn 20:21-23 Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38 eph 2

Born again! Born from above!

'The Father has set his seal' on Christ (John 6:27) and also seals us in him (cf. 2 Corinthians 1:22; Ephesians 1:23, 4:30). Because this seal indicates the indelible effect of the anointing with the Holy Spirit in the sacrament of Baptism,

Baptism indeed is the seal of eternal life." The faithful Christian who I has "kept the seal" until the end, remaining faithful to the demands of his Baptism, will be able to depart this life "marked with the sign of faith," with his baptismal faith, in expectation of the blessed vision of God - the consummation of faith - and in the hope of resurrection.

St. Paul tells the faithful at Ephesus that they have been “sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.” This is in terms of an indelible character imprinted on the soul in the sacraments of baptism and confirmation. It is not as if this invisible mark is simply decorative. Rather, through it, we are enabled to participate in Christ’s mission and in his offices of priest, prophet, and king. Eph 1:13 and cannot be repeated

Sealed by God eph 1:13 sealed by God (ez 36:25-27) in the ark of salvation by baptism just as Noah was sealed by God in the ark of the flood gen 7:16

1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark of Noah none were saved, outside the church (the ark of salvation) none are saved!)

Sealed in the ark, sealed in the church the ark of salvation by God thru baptism!


Christ instituted the holy church to teach and sanctify all men unto eternal salvation. (repent and believe the gospel) with the institution of the sacraments to convey grace to sanctify souls!
Matt 28:19

Toooooooooo long to reply to.

 

[Rodger]

A

Acts 22:16

Not a mere symbol!

“Baptismal regeneration” is the initiation into the new covenant!

Christian baptism is an outward sign of the inward action of grace, or merits of Christ’s passion blood and death applied to our souls!

We cannot see the inward action of grace purifying the soul, so God gave us the outward “sign” of water washing the body to indicate the inward action of grace and connected the two in one action, the water manifests the power of the spirit!

Acts 1:8
Witness of Augustine!

It is this one Spirit who makes it possible for an infant to be regenerated . . . when that INFANT is brought to baptism; and it is through this one Spirit that the infant so presented is reborn. For it is not written, "Unless a man be born again by the will of his parents" or "by the faith of those presenting him or ministering to him," but, "Unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Spirit." The water, therefore, manifesting exteriorly the sacrament of grace, and the Spirit effecting interiorly the benefit of grace, both regenerate in one Christ that man who was generated in Adam (Letters 98:2 [A.D. 408]).

“The sacrament of baptism is most assuredly the sacrament of regeneration” (ibid., 2:27:43).

“Baptism washes away all, absolutely all, our sins, whether of deed, word, or thought, whether sins original or added, whether knowingly or unknowingly contracted” (Against Two Letters of the Pelagians 3:3:5 [A.D. 420]).

“This is the meaning of the great sacrament of baptism, which is celebrated among us: all who attain to this grace die thereby to sin—as he himself [Jesus] is said to have died to sin because he died in the flesh (that is, ‘in the likeness of sin’)—and they are thereby alive by being reborn in the baptismal font, just as he rose again from the sepulcher. This is the case no matter what the age of the body. For whether it be a newborn infant or a decrepit old man—since no one should be barred from baptism—just so, there is no one who does not die to sin in baptism. Infants die to original sin only; adults, to all those sins which they have added, through their evil living, to the burden they brought with them at birth” (Handbook on Faith, Hope, and Love 13[41] [A.D. 421]).

Why do you insist on posting Catholic dogma to me. If it is not the Bible then you are wasting your time.

 

[Rodger]

Everyone who accepts Christ should follow in baptism just as did the eunuch did.

That makes baptism meaningless!

Then the Christian sacrament of baptism that washes away sin and makes us white as snow with the grace of justification is just a fantasy?

Yes.

That is exactly what I said.

Correct! The Catholic sacrament of baptism that washes away sin and makes us white as snow with the grace of justification is just a fantasy.

I have said it over and over and over and yet we are still going back and forth. Water baptism does one thing....it gets you WET!

The Catholic dogma of water baptism in effect is saying that plain, wet water has as much saving power AS THE BLOOD OF GOD!

Think about that for a minute mu friend. If water was all that important then why in the world did God have to be incarnated and then die to pay for our sins???

 

[Rodger]

Mk 16:16 same word as eph 2:8
“Saved”

Mk 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved…

Must mean saved as you said

You do realize that Mark 16 is not in any of the newer manuscripts...right? Mark 16 ends at verse #9.

But nonetheless.......If water is that important in our salvation, then why did God come in flesh to shed His blood to appease God's wrath and pay for mans sin.

 

[Rodger]

When did the children of Israel “EVER” keep the commandments much less have the testimony of Jesus Christ???

There only testimony to Christ was to reject, crucify and kill Him!

Thks

We agree and the answer is never!

When did Mary go into the wilderness????

In addition, The woman cannot be Mary, because Rev 12:17 shows that the woman's children are the church.

Then factually....The church came into existence after Christ. The church, therefore, did not give birth to Christ and cannot be the woman of Revelation 12.

 

[donadams]

"Not of yourselves" .

With no disrespect to you, but the fact that I have to explain what that means says a lot about why you are asking such fundamental questions.

So then, The best and easiest explanation is that this refers to the whole plan and process of “salvation by grace through faith,” rather than any specific element of it—although, admittedly, the bottom line is hardly any different. Salvation-by-grace-through-faith is not from ourselves but is “a gift of God, not of works.” Once again, the nature of grace is reiterated. This whole plan and process of salvation comes from God as a gift, not from ourselves as the result of works or good things that we have done.

If the plan and process of salvation were from ourselves, based on our good works, then, when we achieved the necessary level of goodness to warrant salvation, we could boast. “I did it!” we might say, or, “I gave it my all and overcame tremendous obstacles, but I finally ascended to the highest levels of goodness and holiness, and God gave me what I deserved!” And we could look down on those who did not make it: “Those others failed because they lacked the fortitude, insight, and piety that I cultivated.” Boasting would abound. If the plan and process of salvation were based on human works, then we would elevate ourselves over other people and even in some sense over God Himself, because our salvation was our own doing, not His. Ephesians 2:8–9 says an emphatic NO.

Not natural works or works alone!

Dogma

118. Grace cannot be merited by natural works.

Jn 15:5 apart from me you can do nothing.

So how do our acts become meritorious and salutary?

Philippians 4:13
I can do all things through Christ which strengthens me.

Union with Christ and Grace give life to our acts.

109. There is a supernatural intervention of God in the faculties of the soul, which precedes the free act of the will.

111. For every salutary act internal supernatural grace of God (gratia elevans) is absolutely necessary.

112. Internal supernatural grace is absolutely necessary for the beginning of faith and of salvation.

127. Sanctifying grace sanctifies the soul.
128. Sanctifying grace makes the just man a friend of God.
129. Sanctifying grace makes the just man a child of God and gives him a claim to the inheritance
of Heaven.
130. The three Divine or Theological Virtues of Faith, Hope and Charity are infused with
Sanctifying grace.

133. Grace can be increased by good works.
134. The grace by which we are justified may be lost, and is lost by every grievous [mortal,
serious] sin.
135. By his good works the justified man really acquires a claim to supernatural reward from
God.
136. A just man merits for himself through each good work an increase of sanctifying grace,
eternal life (if he dies in a state of grace) and an increase of heavenly glory.

Revelation 2:10
Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.

 

[donadams]

No sir.

The redemption of the Lord Jesus Christ rest solely and completly in Christ and we have nothing to do with it whatsoever.

We share in his life by grace and receive of His fullness Jn 1:16:17
And participate with him in redeeming others.

What is lacking in the sufferings of Christ?

Colossians 1:24 Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church:

Our participation!

Thks

 

[donadams]

I have no failed as I was not asked. Now I will be glad to do so.

As I have explained to you already...."ALL sin = death" and in the Bible, death is seperation from God.

“What’s the sin that does not lead to death?” is any sin — any sin that we are still, by grace, able to authentically, humbly confess and repent from. That sin does not lead to death.

That’s not what John is referring to
All sin can be repented of if we are still living

 

[Rodger]

That’s not what John is referring to
All sin can be repented of if we are still living

That is correct and I never said any different.

Again, The 'sin unto death' is apostasy which is abandoning or renouncing faith in Jesus and thus belief in God. Anyone who believes the overwhelming truth of salvation through Jesus' death and resurrection for the forgiveness of all sin and then, turns back to sin, choosing sinful pleasure over eternal life, is apostate and beyond forgiveness.

 

[Rodger]

We share in his life by grace and receive of His fullness Jn 1:16:17
And participate with him in redeeming others.

What is lacking in the sufferings of Christ?

Colossians 1:24 Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church:

Our participation!

Thks

No sir that is not Biblical. "Repeating" it over and over does not make it factual.

We can witness to others about the gospel and explain Jeus to the lost, but it is up to God to convict the lost of their sin and turn them to Christ.

If that is what you mean by "participate with him in redeeming others" then yes, I agree.

 

[Rodger]

Ez 36:25-27

Baptism washes us clean
White as snow
Sins forgiven

Notice new heart so we can fulfill Deut. 6:5 love of God

Rom 5:5 5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.

All in baptismal regeneration!

Thanks be to God!

How can water, dirty, stagnant most of the time wash you clean and remove your sin and make you acceptable and white as snow.

There is NO SUCH THING in the Bible as Baptismal Regeneration!

Receiving salvation is not a process or a multi-step formula. Salvation is a finished product, not a recipe. What must we do to be saved? Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, and we will be saved.

Please read this and understand that the Bible teaches us that Regeneration is a sovereign work of God the Holy Spirit.

YES, baptism is a sign of regeneration, but that doesn’t mean the sign is conveyed automatically by the sacrament itself but instead is an act of obedience which follows the decision to accept Christ and in and of itself, it has NO saving power.

Now the opposite is just as true in that we can’t assume that just because somebody has been baptized that, therefore, they are regenerate or as we say....saved.

Now, I in all honesty can not keep repeating myself over and over to you and then seeing you continue to post Catholic teachings over and over without any Bible validity.

Yes..... you have posted Scriptures but you do not seem to be able to correctly disseminate their meanings and instead apply them to what you want them to say to support your Catholic understandings.

Now, I say that so that you will understand that I am not going to continue to respond to the same thing over and over and over.

 

[donadams]

If one is "saved", they have found their name in the book of life, on the last day.
God's mercy got them to that point.
He promised us that we will never be tempted above what we can handle...in 1 Cor 10:13.

But he said the beatitudes are for the saved!

And Matt 5:7 is mercy forgiveness of sin

Why do saved people (if that was possible Mk 13:13 Matt 24:13) need God’s mercy and forgiveness or to have charity cover their sins?

Thks

 

[donadams]

Toooooooooo long to reply to.

Sorry baptism is the largest subject with tons of scripture support

Ez 36:25-27
Three things
Washed clean
New heart (ability to love)
The spirit

 

[donadams]

Why do you insist on posting Catholic dogma to me. If it is not the Bible then you are wasting your time.

That’s not dogma

So you don’t believe any dogma

Dogma: thee Christian faith revealed by God and taught by the apostolic church binding on all Christians

Example

#12 there is only one God!

See nothing to be afraid of just concise statements of the faith we all must believe to have salvation! Jn 3:16

Thks

 

[donadams]

Yes.

That is exactly what I said.

Correct! The Catholic sacrament of baptism that washes away sin and makes us white as snow with the grace of justification is just a fantasy.

I have said it over and over and over and yet we are still going back and forth. Water baptism does one thing....it gets you WET!

The Catholic dogma of water baptism in effect is saying that plain, wet water has as much saving power AS THE BLOOD OF GOD!

Think about that for a minute mu friend. If water was all that important then why in the world did God have to be incarnated and then die to pay for our sins???

It is the merits of his blood (grace) applied to our souls

So baptists do not in believe baptism!

How ironic!