CONFESSING OUR BELIEFS

[jerry63935]

'only job is to feed the flock'. They are:

• To equip the saints [the holy ones of God] for the work of service/ministry;
• To build up the body of Christ, i.e. edify Christians.

if i am feeding which i do they are being equipped and edified Jesus told peter feed my sheep . equipping and feeding comes in many ways.. i rest mycase

 

[OzSpen]

if i am feeding which i do they are being equipped and edified Jesus told peter feed my sheep . equipping and feeding comes in many ways.. i rest mycase

jerry,

In over 50 years of being a Christian, I don't remember one pastor who had an interest in equipping the congregation for their ministries. Most of the time it was a one-way street with pastor dominating the teaching roll.

Oz

 

[jerry63935]

because pastor-teacher is seen in this passage as the one gift. However, we know from other NT passages the gift of teacher is mentioned as a separate gift (e.g. 1 Cor 12:28-29; Rom 12:7).

not all preachers/pastors are excellent Bible teachers. i can teach it is how i started out .then i was called to preach.i am evangelistic and if i teach sometimes rabbit pops up and i chase it.. then get back on track . a real Bible teacher that can expound bring scriptures out .helps preacher out in many ways, iam geared to preach ..one of the t.v pastors that i enjoy is David Jeremiah .he doesn't preach like i do but he is very good. everyone is gifted in a different way. i have deep respect for charles stanley. but i had rather listen to him by radio

 

[jerry63935]

jerry,

In over 50 years of being a Christian, I don't remember one pastor who had an interest in equipping the congregation for their ministries. Most of the time it was a one-way street with pastor dominating the teaching roll.

Oz

then for 50 years you been in the wrong churches . i can show you numerous that equips the flock .some of them are fire and brimstone preachers .i dont know a thing about your nation. there are most likely some as you described ...but the ones i know do. i cant give account for any but me.

 

[OzSpen]

not all preachers/pastors are excellent Bible teachers. i can teach it is how i started out .then i was called to preach.i am evangelistic and if i teach sometimes rabbit pops up and i chase it.. then get back on track . a real Bible teacher that can expound bring scriptures out .helps preacher out in many ways, iam geared to preach ..one of the t.v pastors that i enjoy is David Jeremiah .he doesn't preach like i do but he is very good. everyone is gifted in a different way. i have deep respect for charles stanley. but i had rather listen to him by radio

jerry,

Since we are in lock-down mode here because of COVID-19, I watched both of those preachers on TV yesterday morning. Both were excellent, but my preference would be Dr Jeremiah.

Oz

 

[GodsGrace]

wondering,

I didn't mention in my response to you that I have taught church history at the Bible College level.

I have a special interest in NT history as my PhD dissertation (dissertation-only in the British system) dealt with how John Dominic Crossan had wrecked an historical understanding of Jesus.

My dissertation is available at: Crossan and the resurrection of Jesus : rethinking presuppositions, methods and models

Be warned! It may be heavy going for you and others who follow the link. This year I plan to create 6 articles from the dissertation to present to academic journals.

I consider church history important because it opens up a panorama of how the church has stayed on track with Scripture or has veered away from the centrality of the Word of God.

Oz

EXACTLY!!
The above highlighted and underlined is also why I'm very interested in the history of the church.

Here is what you said:
I consider church history important because it opens up a panorama of how the church has stayed on track with Scripture or has veered away from the centrality of the Word of God.

 

[GodsGrace]

then for 50 years you been in the wrong churches . i can show you numerous that equips the flock .some of them are fire and brimstone preachers .i dont know a thing about your nation. there are most likely some as you described ...but the ones i know do. i cant give account for any but me.

I do believe that edifying the congregation and teaching the congregation is not the same as equipping them to do real witnessing or teaching to others.

I think I agree with OzSpen on this.

What helped me a lot to understand the importance of witnessing and apologetics so that I could explain my faith/Christian religion to others was a one year course I took on Discipleship with a pastor that did this on a regular basis for his church members and who was very good at it.
It literally changed the way I saw Christianity and made me understand my responsibility toward it more. (in the sense that it needs to be shared).

Some churches don't even do any teaching, but just preach.
We need everything,,,but nothing should be ignored....

 

[jerry63935]

I do believe that edifying the congregation and teaching the congregation is not the same as equipping them to do real witnessing or teaching to others.

edifying is equipping which is all done through teaching/ preaching .. i dont have time to hash this out this morning. i have go to work

 

[Butch5]

Well" wondering", I see you did it. Your quite the go getter.

I like the way you set it up with the 3 questions you started your post with.
I will add one question and answer it too. "IS IT IMPORTANT TO KNOW "BIBLE" history?
All 4 questions could be topics of their own.

I'll have to think and pray on those questions before I post an answer.

They'll probably come one at a time, as I think the answers will possibly be lengthy.

God bless you for your "Tenacious Faith" .
My name is OLIGOS

I commend you on your study. I too have come to many of the same conclusions based on the reasons you mentioned in your post.

 

[Prycejosh1987]

1. Is it important to know church history?

2. How, or what, can make us feel secure when standing before God (even in this life)

3. In light of Matthew 7:21, who are the few that will find the narrow gate?

1. Not really, it helps but its not important.
2. Knowing that we took the measures and do the things we needed to do to be saved.
3. Self and personal sacrifice. Worldly Christians will not find that narrow gate, and wilful consistent sinners will not either.

 

[OzSpen]

1. Not really, it helps but its not important.
2. Knowing that we took the measures and do the things we needed to do to be saved.
3. Self and personal sacrifice. Worldly Christians will not find that narrow gate, and wilful consistent sinners will not either.

Pryce,

Church history is especially important because ...

• It demonstrates how the church has fallen into traps of false teaching, even heresy. Take a read of Irenaeus and Against Heresies (2nd -3rd centuries) to see what Irenaeus had to challenge in deviations from Scripture.
• If we don't know church history, we could be doomed to repeat the errors of the past.
• It demonstrates what has brought the church to its knees through back-sliding and what has renewed the church through revivals.
• It demonstrates the need to have sound doctrine as the basis of any church.
• If it weren't for the early church historian, Eusebius, we would not know a lot of the details of what happened in the early church.

Oz

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

1. Not really, it helps but its not important.
2. Knowing that we took the measures and do the things we needed to do to be saved.
3. Self and personal sacrifice. Worldly Christians will not find that narrow gate, and wilful consistent sinners will not either.

Pryce,

Church history is especially important because ...

• It demonstrates how the church has fallen into traps of false teaching, even heresy. Take a read of Irenaeus and Against Heresies (2nd -3rd centuries) to see what Irenaeus had to challenge in deviations from Scripture.
• If we don't know church history, we could be doomed to repeat the errors of the past.
• It demonstrates what has brought the church to its knees through back-sliding and what has renewed the church through revivals.
• It demonstrates the need to have sound doctrine as the basis of any church.
• If it weren't for the early church historian, Eusebius, we would not know a lot of the details of what happened in the early church.

Oz

I love the way both these posters have separate opinions, and the way their opinions work great for each of them, but no deviseiveness between them on this topic.

I love the way Love conquers all.

My name is OLIGOS

As a side note, I think it's pretty great the way this topic came back up after the last post April 6 this year.
I forgot all about it.
We had a lot of fun on this thread. It was fun going back and re-reading all the posts including yours.