devils

[jeremiah1five]

A doctrine of men .

So you believe Christ died for the "acts" or "choices" of sin.
Where does sin come from?
Scripture says "wickedness comes from the wicked" which is the same thing as saying, "sin comes from sinner."

 

[hawkman]

So you believe Christ died for the "acts" or "choices" of sin.

Jesus died because he loved us .

Where does sin come from?

Choices .

 

[jeremiah1five]

Jesus died because he loved us .

Jesus died for His Church who is also His Bride who is also Israel.
Eph. 5:25.

Choices .

So, then the doctrine of imputation should read:

21 For he hath made him [to be] the choices of sin for us, who knew no choices of sin; that we might be made the righteous choices of God in him. 2 Cor. 5:21.

Your holding of what sin is destroys the doctrine of imputation for the doctrine describes a nature-swap. Christ took our sin nature because we take His righteous nature. The completion of our sanctification in which we are made and conformed into the image of Christ who is the image of the invisible God.

The definition of "harmatia" which is translated as "sin" in the KJV means "missing the mark." It doesn't mean "choices." As saith the ancients, wickedness comes from the wicked (personal pronoun)" 1 Sam. 24:13.
This is the same as saying "sin comes from sinner."
Paul says in Romans 7 that the Law/Command of God shows us we are sinners. If there's no Law against something and you that thing for which there is no Law prohibiting it then there is no transgression. Simple.
Now, let's go to the Garden.

17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. Gen. 2:17.

Here is God's command and restriction prohibiting Adam from performing. It wasn't the choice to eat of it but was the actual eating of it that Adam was prohibited from doing. I can choose millions of things to do but until I do the thing I haven't done it.

Paul explains:

7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
Rom. 7:7.

Nothing's changed. What applies to us post-sin of Adam occurs the same pre-sin, and that is the same reasoning Paul explained above about the Law showing we are Lawbreakers. Let's apply it to Adam but use Paul's words:

What shall we say then? Is the command sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the command: for I had not known disobedience, except the command had said, thou shalt not [eat of it].

Before Adam made the choice to sin as you say is the sin, he was already a sinner. And since there is no record of any sin he committed before eating the fruit of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil I can only conclude that God created Adam fallen short of the glory of God and "missing the mark" of the glory of God and the word for that is "sin" not the choice to sin.
There is only ONE God, there is NONE like Him, and He gives His glory to NO ONE.
If this is all true, then what was Adam at his creation except being created fallen short of the glory of God and "missing the mark" of the glory of God?
Even for those that believe Adam was holy or righteous the fact remains He committed sin. Sin does not come from holy, and sin does not come from righteous. The last Adam [Christ] proved this. He was Holy, He was righteous, and He did no sin even when tempted.
There's a Latin term for this with regard to Christ:
able not to sin (posse non peccare); unable to sin (non posse peccare).

But the fact of the Law/Command of God in the Garden of Eden restricting him from some deed or action shows Adam was a sinner before he sinned for sin comes from sinner.
Christ did not die for the choice of/to sin. Christ took our sin nature which killed Him and we take His righteous nature which gives us life.

 

[hawkman]

Your holding of what sin is destroys the doctrine of imputation for the doctrine describes a nature-swap. Christ took our sin nature because we take His righteous nature. The completion of our sanctification in which we are made and conformed into the image of Christ who is the image of the invisible God.

I can't find a verse in the bible that has "sin nature" in it . A doctrine of St. Augustine .

 

[jeremiah1five]

I can't find a verse in the bible that has "sin nature" in it . A doctrine of St. Augustine .

No, not Augustine. I've never read Augustine, nor have I read Calvin in the 46 years being a Christian even though I reached mostly the same conclusions on my own in studying the Scripture as they have. So, what's indicated?
My posts are my own study through the best translation the KJV and James Strong as my linguist and the Holy Spirit who teaches me in accordance with my calling and spiritual gifts revealed to me before my church fellowship through prophecy
(Acts 13:1-4.)
I am not concerned about my holdings knowing that at present time they may be seen as controversial and as yet 'unheard of' and such, but I am confident that the things the Lord reveals to me in Scripture is only a continuation of doctrine that through the progression of time and the light of God upon His people to understand His Word have become widely understood and accepted by the brethren as biblical truth.
I have been posting at forums and discussion boards since 2007 and have been banned by many of those sites for my doctrine but I am not troubled anymore. For my calling and ministry to my Lord, He has provided me outlet and expression of my gifts and I am satisfied with His result.
I know a great deal and am learning more through interaction with others on this forum and others.
I know one thing: I plant, another waters but God gives the increase. And although the person I post with who may not agree with me there are others who are not participant in these immediate discussions that receive something through my words and biblical thought. I am always prepared to prove my assertions through Scripture even though the person I interact with may not see what I see. God opens the mind and closes the mind. After all, He's blinded Israel to His Messiah for the time being but there will come a time when the Times of the Gentiles will end, and God turns His full attention back to Israel, remove their blindness and allow them to see the greatest gift God has given to His covenant people. Whether I am alive when that happens, I cannot tell, but it will be a time of suffering for Israel and the Gentile Church as they both go through the so-called 'Great Tribulation' together.
As concerning the 'sin nature' of man I have posted a great deal on that and have used Scripture and reason (and logic) to support my beliefs. All a person has to do is ask.
Seek.
Knock.
A door will be opened.

 

[bondedkaos]

They even told me they were demons. I believe we still deal with attacks from spirits of darkness. It is spiritual warfare. We are supposed to test the spirits. That's all I am trying to say. It isn't because I have done something bad in my heart. It is because Satan's goal is to kill and steal and destroy our souls.

I have nightly experiences it is a bit overwhelming at times

 

[bondedkaos]

Our thoughts are hopelessly selfish we only have our own experiences and our perceptions of our perceptions,it is the wretched man Paul speaks of .We are hopelessly open for manipulation,I say hopelessly but we do have a friend in Jesus if we choose to except divine council .It however must come from a place of Humility.Our council is seated in Heavenly places.

 

[bondedkaos]

They even told me they were demons. I believe we still deal with attacks from spirits of darkness. It is spiritual warfare. We are supposed to test the spirits. That's all I am trying to say. It isn't because I have done something bad in my heart. It is because Satan's goal is to kill and steal and destroy our souls.

I can tell you not from my opinion or doctrinal belief but from rather exhausting experience that unclean spirits in fact do exist

 

[donadams]

James 4:7
Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.

Saint Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle. Be our protection against the wickedness and snares of the devil; May God rebuke him, we humbly pray; And do thou, O Prince of the Heavenly Host, by the power of God, thrust into hell Satan and all evil spirits who wander through the world for the ruin of souls.

Hebrews 1:14
Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

Thanks