Did God originally want women to work?

[mdougie]

Well if we really don't want women to have to work we shouldn't have let the ultra right capitalists destroy the unions so that normal men could earn enough to support a family. As it stands our society believes that work should go to the lowest possible bidder, and that women and children should be forced to work so that capital can make the greatest possible return on investment.

 

[Claudya]

Stay at home moms are a rather modern bourgeoise accomplishment.
For most people in mankind's history it just wasn't possible to live like that. Besides taking care of the children women had to help with their husband's trade. Work and home weren't seperate things either for many people in history. They were living on their farm or in the same building where they did their crafting work or had their shops. Only the industrialisation seperated workplace and home for many people.
And for many people living today it isn't possible to live of only one income. Not to mention all unmarried women.

So I doubt stay at home moms ever were God's plan at all. He probably doesn't object it, though. Maybe He's neutral about that issue.

 

[Classik]

Stay at home moms are a rather modern bourgeoise accomplishment. For most people in mankind's history it just wasn't possible to live like that. Besides taking care of the children women had to help with their husband's trade. Work and home weren't seperate things either for many people in history. They were living on their farm or in the same building where they did their crafting work or had their shops. Only the industrialisation seperated workplace and home for many people. And for many people living today it isn't possible to live of only one income. Not to mention all unmarried women.So I doubt stay at home moms ever were God's plan at all. He probably doesn't object it, though. Maybe He's neutral about that issue.

That's brilliant of you

 

[farouk]

Stay at home moms are a rather modern bourgeoise accomplishment.
For most people in mankind's history it just wasn't possible to live like that. Besides taking care of the children women had to help with their husband's trade. Work and home weren't seperate things either for many people in history. They were living on their farm or in the same building where they did their crafting work or had their shops. Only the industrialisation seperated workplace and home for many people.
And for many people living today it isn't possible to live of only one income. Not to mention all unmarried women.

So I doubt stay at home moms ever were God's plan at all. He probably doesn't object it, though. Maybe He's neutral about that issue.

Claudya:

Although Titus 2.5 highlights how some women are ideally gifted to be 'keepers at home', yet like you say also, women's other gifts qualify them for many ways in which to excel.

From Scripture, it's interesting that the woman of Proverbs 31, 'considereth a field, and buyeth it' and even in the Jewish culture of the day was evidently trusted to do so. In the New Testament, in Acts, Lydia, was 'a seller of purple' and employed people and was clearly a shrewd businesswoman.

In some parts of North America, property prices are comparatively low and it's possible for a family to own a house with a few bedrooms, and be on one income; but this is often not the case in crowded Europe, or even along the eastern seaboard of the US; and so it serves no purpose for some people supposedly to moralize against people who live in a more heavily populated area where it's part of the economic set up for women to go out to work.

 

[P31Woman]

Notice too she does not eat the bread of idleness. Bread is bad! The P31woman ate bon bons!

Notice too all the work this gal did and what her husband was doing......He was sitting around with the guys talking politics!

 

[Claudya]

He was sitting around with the guys talking politics!

I know, right? Always made me giggle. The lady is running the business, while the guy is just being lazy. That proverbs text is not shedding a very positive light on men.

Oh, I just noticed you named yourself after that proverbs woman. That's a very good choice of a name!!!

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Stay at home moms are a rather modern bourgeoise accomplishment.
For most people in mankind's history it just wasn't possible to live like that.

I disagree, and again point you to Proverbs 31. The woman worked, but out of the home, so she could keep an eye on it.

Besides taking care of the children women had to help with their husband's trade. Work and home weren't seperate things either for many people in history. They were living on their farm or in the same building where they did their crafting work or had their shops. Only the industrialisation seperated workplace and home for many people.
And for many people living today it isn't possible to live of only one income. Not to mention all unmarried women.

Well stated, Claudya.

So I doubt stay at home moms ever were God's plan at all. He probably doesn't object it, though. Maybe He's neutral about that issue.

Stay-at-home moms were His plan. Non-working moms, not so much.

 

[Claudya]

I disagree, and again point you to Proverbs 31. The woman worked, but out of the home, so she could keep an eye on it.

Like I said, home and workplace where the same or close to another for many families in history. Not every family could afford a lazy politician husband ;), most men did actually earn their living from somewhere around their house, like the proverbs woman. Although men and women often did different kind of jobs, it's hard to determine if some particular work a family member did was houskeeping or breadwinning.

Stay-at-home moms were His plan. Non-working moms, not so much.

Maybe today's economy should allow for more home office jobs so people can stay at home, be around their kids, and still work. That would be close to what the ancient biblical society was like. But the housewife mother is gonna remain something that only wealthy people can afford. And quite honestly, many women will feel unsatisfied with only caring for the house and kids. While housekeeping and child rearing can be a very challenging job many people don't feel it's enough, especially as a permanent way of life for decades. Working from home could be a good alternative, since we have such awesome new ways of communication today.

 

[Kaileymarie]

Like I said, home and workplace where the same or close to another for many families in history. Not every family could afford a lazy politician husband ;), most men did actually earn their living from somewhere around their house, like the proverbs woman. Although men and women often did different kind of jobs, it's hard to determine if some particular work a family member did was houskeeping or breadwinning.


Maybe today's economy should allow for more home office jobs so people can stay at home, be around their kids, and still work. That would be close to what the ancient biblical society was like. But the housewife mother is gonna remain something that only wealthy people can afford. And quite honestly, many women will feel unsatisfied with only caring for the house and kids. While housekeeping and child rearing can be a very challenging job many people don't feel it's enough, especially as a permanent way of life for decades. Working from home could be a good alternative, since we have such awesome new ways of communication today.

I am a stay at home mom with three kids four and under. My husband didnt go to college and makes about $14 an hour plus a side job every month or two. We have two cars with no payments and a mortgage on a 1000 sq ft house with three bedrooms that we are not behind on. We go to the park, beach, camping, etc for entertainment so

 

[Kaileymarie]

We don't spend extra money on that. We don't buy more than we need and we are comfortable.

I think staying at home is great but once the kids get older I would think most women would be dying to get out of the house! Ha!

 

[reba]

I was blessed to be able to stay home with the kids... I went "to work" as if home aint work, when they were grown... We did not have a boat, or a new car all the time, not a lot of fancy stuff. Wife/mom was what I wanted. I am thankful I was able to have that

 

[for_his_glory]

Personally I don't think God had in mind of anyone having to obtain jobs outside of that of the Garden of Eden as God gave provision to man and women to live off the land as man and women were equals back then until sin entered and messed everything up to where we have to now work for our living.

Genesis 1:29 And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.

Genesis 3:
17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;
19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

Genesis 3:24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.

 

[handy]

But the housewife mother is gonna remain something that only wealthy people can afford.

: Sorry Claudya, but this makes me laugh. I've been a housewife mother for over 10 years now and we can only dream of being wealthy.

I think staying at home is great but once the kids get older I would think most women would be dying to get out of the house! Ha!

Same here. I worked before we got our kids, but that kind of "work" was nothing compared to the work I do now. It will be nice to get back to working a day job, but I'm glad we're making the sacrifices and I'm able to stay with the kids.

 

[Kaileymarie]

: Sorry Claudya, but this makes me laugh. I've been a housewife mother for over 10 years now and we can only dream of being wealthy.



Same here. I worked before we got our kids, but that kind of "work" was nothing compared to the work I do now. It will be nice to get back to working a day job, but I'm glad we're making the sacrifices and I'm able to stay with the kids.

Agreed. I see my nephew going to daycare five days a week so his mom can work, but I know how much my brother makes. She works so she can go shopping and eat out all the time. My brother is a mechanic so he is by no means wealthy, but if you really live modestly you should be able to make it on one income.

 

[Kaileymarie]

Personally I don't think God had in mind of anyone having to obtain jobs outside of that of the Garden of Eden as God gave provision to man and women to live off the land as man and women were equals back then until sin entered and messed everything up to where we have to now work for our living.

Genesis 1:29 And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.

Genesis 3:
17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;
19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

Genesis 3:24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.

I agree with you here.

I think God would prefer we have no money, just grow our food and help each other out.

The Amish may have some extreme beliefs but I admire their work ethic, simple life and sense of community. If we all lived in a similar way the world would be far less polluted and there would be no GMO foods giving us cancer. Just yummy, healthy food.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Like I said, home and workplace where the same or close to another for many families in history. Not every family could afford a lazy politician husband ;), most men did actually earn their living from somewhere around their house, like the proverbs woman.

I believe your characterization of him would not hold up, given the type of men who were chosen as leaders in Israel. Men of Israel owned land which they put into productions, some also were merchants and traders, and all had some say in the management of their communities.

Although men and women often did different kind of jobs, it's hard to determine if some particular work a family member did was houskeeping or breadwinning.

Not really. It is obvious the Proverbs 31 woman and her husband were both bread winners.

Maybe today's economy should allow for more home office jobs so people can stay at home, be around their kids, and still work.

That's the trend in the US. Service provision is the fasting growing career, and manyh are choosing to leave the corporate grind to provide services of myriad types within their communities. Typically, if there is a shop or warehouse involved, the husband manages the day to day operations, and the wife takes care the financial aspects.

That would be close to what the ancient biblical society was like.

While biblical societies kept their business close to home, it wasn't necessarily in the home, though certainly businesses of that type existed, too.

But the housewife mother is gonna remain something that only wealthy people can afford.

I don't agree with that, either. Many women manage a real estate or sales career out of their homes while providing primary care for their children while Dad is out working either in the corporate or small business world, or managing the family business outside the home.

And quite honestly, many women will feel unsatisfied with only caring for the house and kids.

Those are the ones who -- frankly, and at the rist of offending -- don't accept the role laid out biblically for the wife. That role does not preclude career, but it establishes their primary role as caregiver to the children and the husband.

While housekeeping and child rearing can be a very challenging job many people don't feel it's enough, especially as a permanent way of life for decades.

Which is why the Proverbs 31 example is working for millions of women, whether Christian or not, today in the US.

Working from home could be a good alternative, since we have such awesome new ways of communication today.

And that's why it is working for millions of women today.

 

[farouk]

: Sorry Claudya, but this makes me laugh. I've been a housewife mother for over 10 years now and we can only dream of being wealthy.



Same here. I worked before we got our kids, but that kind of "work" was nothing compared to the work I do now. It will be nice to get back to working a day job, but I'm glad we're making the sacrifices and I'm able to stay with the kids.

Agreed. I see my nephew going to daycare five days a week so his mom can work, but I know how much my brother makes. She works so she can go shopping and eat out all the time. My brother is a mechanic so he is by no means wealthy, but if you really live modestly you should be able to make it on one income.

Kaileymarie:

Your brother, the mechanic; he's also the tattooist, right? I guess the tattooing would be more of a passion than a money maker. At least, for some people it would be.

I think a lot depends also on the area in which a couple lives, and the price of property, etc. There are of course vast differences.

Blessings.

PS: There is also an assumption about whether the woman is married or not.

 

[cherovis]

Notice the 31 woman also had servants...modern day housekeeper and yardman. She also kept her own money.

If I had servants & yardsmen I could do it too ! lololol

 

[Sparkey]

This question hearkens back to the time of the original curse. The answer is "Yes."

It was her labor (workload) in childbearing that was increased. This increase in her labor did not contain any prohibition such as, "You shall not grow a garden," but it did contain a promise to her (and her seed) and to us. In fact when we turn to other Scriptural examples we can clearly see prohibiting work was not the intent of the Lord. My mind goes to the Shulamite, found in the Song of Solomon, who was forced to tend her brothers gardens and who had neglected her own. Song of Solomon 1:5 "Dark am I, yet lovely, daughters of Jerusalem ... "

Strangely enough, the Lord has invited us into His work. God is good.

My hat's off to stay at home moms

My hat's off to them too, and doubly off to the work-a-day Mom's and single Moms who do not get the acknowledgement and often get the stigma while they struggle to support others whom the Lord has given to them. Still, and while looking back at the increase to the workload given specifically to women at the time of Genesis, we see it even then associated with motherhood. But what about women who have not had children. There is a special place in the Lord for them too. "Rejoice ye barren..." but that's a different story, for a different thread and I privately think it was written to me too. There is neither Jew nor Gentile also implies that there is no gender difference in the one who declares, "I am no respecter of persons..." There are many things to consider here. How can the "weaker vessel" carry more? Again, another story, another thread...

Pretty sure we are in perfect agreement on this one too, Edward. I was blessed as a single Dad who raised two sons from the time the youngest was 3 years old. During that time I had the support of my employer and admiration of others for a difficult job well done. That's not the same case for many single Moms today. It's not the case for the "stay-at-home" married Moms either. Strange world we live in, isn't it?

 

[jasoncran]

god tolerated slavery but he never planned for it to be.