Did the Master truly forgive?

[Classik]

I overhead my dad discussing Mathew 28 : 21 - 34 with his friend. At the end he tried to ask a question saying, 'Did the master really forgive his wicked servant who punished another servant?'

Below is the parable: Mathew 28 NKJV
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The Parable of the Unforgiving Servant

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21 Then Peter came to Him and said, Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? Up to seven times?

22 Jesus said to him, I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven.

23 Therefore the kingdom of heaven is like a certainking who wanted to settle accounts with his servants.

24 And when he had begun to settle accounts, one was brought to him who owed him ten thousand talents.

25 But as he was not able to pay, his master commanded that he be sold, with his wife and children and all that he had, and that payment be made.

26 The servant therefore fell down before him, saying, Master, have patience with me, and I will pay you all.

27 Then the master of that servant was moved with compassion, released him, and forgave him the debt.

28 But that servant went out and found one of his fellow servants who owed him a hundred denarii; and he laid hands on him and took him by the throat, saying, Pay me what you owe!

29 So his fellow servant fell down at his feet and begged him, saying, Have patience with me, and I will pay you all
30 And he would not, but went and threw him into prison till he should pay the debt.

31 So when his fellow servants saw what had been done, they were very grieved, andcame and told their master all that had been done.

32 Then his master, after he had called him,said to him, You wicked servant! I forgave you allthat debt because you begged me.

33 Should you not also have had compassion on your fellow servant, just as I had pity on you?

34 And his master was angry, and delivered him to the torturers until he should pay all that was due to him.
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Now look at verse 27 again

'Then the master of that servant was moved with compassion, released him, and forgave him the debt.'

It says, the master released and FORGAVE him (the servant) the debt.
But this servant was so cruel that he did not forgive another debtor who was like him:
verse 28 - 30.
But when his fellow servant reported his wickedness to their master their master was so bitter and said:
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You wicked servant! I forgave you all that debt because you begged me.
33 Should you not also have had compassion on your fellow servant, just as I had pity on you?
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Now verse 34:
34 And his master was angry, and delivered him to the torturers until he should pay all that was due to him.
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Compare verses 27 and 34.

Question:
Did the master really forgive this wicked servant?

 

[eddy]

No he did not.

 

[handy]

Then the master of that servant was moved with compassion, released him, and forgave him the debt.

Yes...it states right there that he did.

This should be a sobering text, not one that is glossed over that somehow the Master's "forgiveness" of the servant wasn't genuine.

 

[Christ_empowered]

Yes, he forgave, but it was conditional. Just as the master forgave servant A is massive debt, servant A was expected to forgive servant B (and presumably others) his relatively minor debt. Similarly, we are forgiven so long as we forgive others (judge not lest ye yourself be judged).

Its like being forgiven, with strings attached. It would appear that God doesn't do cheap grace--salvation and forgiveness cost us something.

 

[eddy]

Yes...it states right there that he did.

This should be a sobering text, not one that is glossed over that somehow the Master's "forgiveness" of the servant wasn't genuine.

It states he said he did not if he was genuine.

What makes me say no is that he forgave debt which is the same as giving money. The master did not say I will give you this money as long as you give money to others.

Then the Master turns around and turns the servant over to authories and said what? This man owes me money. Obviously he didn't genuinly forgive the debt if he turns around and says he still owes it.

 

[Cheyenne K]

The debt was forgiven. However, the subsequent cruel treatment of the other servant was not. Thus, punishment.

 

[eddy]

The debt was forgiven. However, the subsequent cruel treatment of the other servant was not. Thus, punishment.

It says he turned him in for the debt he earlier say was forgiven. So in the end the debt was not forgiven.

 

[Mike]

Classic, brother, get an NIV where Matthew 28 is about the Resurrection and Great Commission! :D

Just kidding. :p

It says he turned him in for the debt he earlier say was forgiven. So in the end the debt was not forgiven.

The Father never truly Forgives you your sins? Your Father harbors a grudge?

Matthew 18:35 “This is how my heavenly Father will treat each of you unless you forgive your brother from your heart.â€

 

[eddy]

The Father never truly Forgives you your sins? Your Father harbors a grudge?

Matthew 18:35 “This is how my heavenly Father will treat each of you unless you forgive your brother from your heart.”

If you don't forgive you will not be forgiven.

In the op example the debt was obviously not forgiven. One cannot be tortured for something they don't owe. If the debt was truly forgiven it wouldn't be owed.

 

[Mike]

If you don't forgive you will not be forgiven.

In the op example the debt was obviously not forgiven. One cannot be tortured for something they don't owe. If the debt was truly forgiven it wouldn't be owed.

Matthew 18
"<sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV1984-23758">32</sup> “Then the master called the servant in. ‘You wicked servant,’ he said, ‘I canceled all that debt of yours because you begged me to. <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV1984-23759">33</sup> Shouldn’t you have had mercy on your fellow servant just as I had on you?’ "

And then Jesus goes on with Verse 35, saying this is how the Father will be. Again, I ask you, is this your view of God's Forgiveness?

I see in verse 32 & 33 that this is a response to his servant's unforgiveness in spite of what he was forgiven himself. They are related, but they are not the same. The master had forgiven him, so the parable goes. Since Jesus relates this to the Father, I'm going to take Him at His Word and suggest he was Forgiven until he abused this Forgiveness and rained on the other servant.

Unless there is another way to read Hebrews 8:12, "For I will forgive their wickedness and will remember their sins no more."

 

[eddy]

Unless there is another way to read Hebrews 8:12, "For I will forgive their wickedness and will remember their sins no more."[/B]

I don't see how the story of the master and servant jives with this. The master certainly remembered, the debt then reinstated it after it was "forgiven".

 

[Mike]

I don't see how the story of the master and servant jives with this. The master certainly remembered, the debt then reinstated it after it was "forgiven".

Who is the master like in verse 35?

Does God keep record of your sins after He Forgives them?

 

[reformed baptist]

I don't see how the story of the master and servant jives with this. The master certainly remembered, the debt then reinstated it after it was "forgiven".

Perhaps we shuld not be forcing the parable to have meanings beyond the main point of the illsutration that Jesus was making in context. The point is, unless we forgive, we not be forgiven.

Remember the master is not actually God, it is a story about a man, therefore the forgiveness of the story does not have to be a perfect and divine forgiveness, but is an imperfect, human forgiveness. We forgive all the time, but we do not always forget do we? It is the principle that holds true for God, that he does not forgive those who cannot forgive others.

 

[eddy]

Who is the master like in verse 35?

Does God keep record of your sins after He Forgives them?

I don't know who the master is like in that verse?

I don't know if God keeps record of our sins after they are forgiven, but in the parable the servant would be guilty of new sin against his fellow servant. God would judge based on that not the former.

 

[handy]

I do think we need to view the "master" in the parable as being God, as this is the explanation Jesus gives:

"My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.†(Matthew 18:35)

I don't think there is a lot of mystery about this particular parable...it just that it goes against what (in my view) is a false impression that many Christians today have...that God is such a great guy and a pal that He'd never hold anything against us.

When we confess and repent, then God does indeed forgive us our sins and they will be remembered no more. However, this parable show us that if we refuse to walk like one who has had much forgiven us, in other words, refuse to obey the commandments of loving God and others, then our sins will indeed be remembered.

I think the key to understanding this passage is to remember what Jesus said at at the beginning and end:

Then Peter came and said to Him, “Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me and I forgive him? Up to seven times?†Jesus *said to him, “I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven. For this reason the kingdom of heaven may be compared to a king who wished to settle accounts with his slaves..."

and He wraps up with:

"And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.â€

The warning here is that we need to walk and act as those who will live out the Lord's commandments to love God and love our neighbors as ourselves. If we refuse to do so, if we refuse to walk in the newness of the life He gives us, then we can lose that forgiveness we had achieved.

It is indeed terrifying thing to fall into the hands of a living God. I know this goes against the current trend of thinking that God is just our Great Big Buddy in the Sky...but we need to rightfully view God...loving, yes, wanting to forgive yes, but He will hold us to a standard...as Christ Empowered said, God doesn't give cheap grace.

The man's debt was forgiven. If he had extended to others the same mercy and love that was extended to him, that debt would never had been recalled. But, it was due to the lack of love he had towards his fellows.