Do you support OSAS(once saved always saved)?

[Jethro Bodine]

...he's gonna realize what a mistake he made and that there's no way to correct it. He's going to go into eternal damnation knowing it didn't have to be this way.

I think this is what it means for that 'Day' to be hotter for some than others. There will be those who are more keenly aware of what they purposely forsook in the kingdom in favor of what they had and wanted in the world...which they will lose too.

 

[gr8grace3]

2 Peter 2
20 For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning.


The "beginning" Peter is referring to, is the state of the individual before they came to the knowledge of the Lord.

It is clearly explained in verse 21.


21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them.


They were better off as a nonbeliever.
.

Do you think that ALL men will get a bona fide chance at salvation?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Hey, allen baby. Jesus said the kingdom can be compared to the king who forgave the slave in the parable in Matthew 18:23-35 NASB. In that parable the king forgave the debt of the slave, but when it was reported to him that the slave did not have the same mercy on his fellow servant that the king had on him the king reinstated his debt.

Because Jesus said the kingdom can be compared to what happened in that parable Jesus is showing us that he will indeed truly forgive people who beg for that forgiveness but who will later not act in the expected and obligatory way a forgiven person acts and will have that forgiveness rescinded.

 

[Deborah13]

Do you think that ALL men will get a bona fide chance at salvation?

Absolutely

 

[Gary]

And Notice that Believing is not mentioned in those verses and the Lord never knew them.

It doesn't have to be mentioned. The mere fact that they're doing these works in Jesus' name is an indication that they believed. Why else would they do that? And if they didn't believe, why did they fully expect to get into heaven?

"Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’"

We can use it for people who are around the Gospel all their lives and are truly relying on their water baptism to save them. They live the life of a Christian and say lord , lord. But in reality they were counting on water baptism to save them. But the Lord never knew them.

It doesn't matter if the Lord never knew them. The fact is, they believed.
.

 

[Gary]

Do you think that ALL men will get a bona fide chance at salvation?

2 Peter 3
9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

 

[Deborah13]

It doesn't have to be mentioned. The mere fact that they're doing these works in Jesus' name is an indication that they believed. Why else would they do that? And if they didn't believe, why did they fully expect to get into heaven?

"Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’"




It doesn't matter if the Lord never knew them. The fact is, they believed.
.

Did they believe? Or were they just name droppers, using the Lord's name to profit themselves?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

It is incumbent on the person who has placed their trust in Christ for the forgiveness of sin to keep trusting in that forgiveness to the very end. The question is, can a person stop trusting in the blood of Christ? That is the key question regarding OSAS. It's not even a question about what will happen if a person stops believing. The Bible makes that clear. The question is, "is that possible?"

 

[gr8grace3]

2 Peter 3
9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

Agreed. So going with your 2 Pet 2:20 verse. Do you believe that man can reject that offer? A Bona fide chance at salvation.

 

[Gary]

Did they believe? Or were they just name droppers, using the Lord's name to profit themselves?

Why did they use that name and truly expect to gain entrance into the kingdom because of it? There had to be belief involved with that name.

Question: Do you believe that all denominations that preach Christ crucified are redeemed? There are over 30,000.
.

 

[gr8grace3]

It doesn't have to be mentioned. The mere fact that they're doing these works in Jesus' name is an indication that they believed. Why else would they do that? And if they didn't believe, why did they fully expect to get into heaven?

"Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’"




It doesn't matter if the Lord never knew them. The fact is, they believed.
.

Where does it say they believed in the Lord Jesus Christ for their salvation?

13 But also some of the Jewish exorcists, who went from place to place, attempted to name over those who had the evil spirits the name of the Lord Jesus, saying, “I adjure you by Jesus whom Paul preaches.” 14 Seven sons of one Sceva, a Jewish chief priest, were doing this. 15 And the evil spirit answered and said to them, “I recognize Jesus, and I know about Paul, but who are you?”16 And the man, in whom was the evil spirit, leaped on them and subdued all of them and overpowered them, so that they fled out of that house naked and wounded.

 

[Gary]

Agreed. So going with your 2 Pet 2:20 verse. Do you believe that man can reject that offer? A Bona fide chance at salvation.

Hebrews 2
1 Therefore we must give the more earnest heed to the things we have heard, lest we drift away.
2 For if the word spoken through angels proved steadfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just reward,
3 how shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation, which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed to us by those who heard Him,
4 God also bearing witness both with signs and wonders, with various miracles, and gifts of the Holy Spirit, according to His own will?

James 5
19 Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back,
20 let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins.

You ask if someone can reject that offer. Ask some of the atheists here what they think.
.

 

[Gary]

Where does it say they believed in the Lord Jesus Christ for their salvation?

Did they or did they not expect to get into heaven?

13 But also some of the Jewish exorcists, who went from place to place, attempted to name over those who had the evil spirits the name of the Lord Jesus, saying, “I adjure you by Jesus whom Paul preaches.” 14 Seven sons of one Sceva, a Jewish chief priest, were doing this. 15 And the evil spirit answered and said to them, “I recognize Jesus, and I know about Paul, but who are you?”16 And the man, in whom was the evil spirit, leaped on them and subdued all of them and overpowered them, so that they fled out of that house naked and wounded.

Point?

 

[Deborah13]

Why did they use that name and truly expect to gain entrance into the kingdom because of it? There had to be belief involved with that name.

Question: Do you believe that all denominations that preach Christ crucified are redeemed? There are over 30,000.
.

I don't believe denominations, or nations for that matter are redeemed. I believe people individually are redeemed.

 

[Deborah13]

Why did they use that name and truly expect to gain entrance into the kingdom because of it? There had to be belief involved with that name.

Question: Do you believe that all denominations that preach Christ crucified are redeemed? There are over 30,000.
.

I see your point on the first question. How many people do you think believe they will go to heaven because they are good people and are living a good life, following the big 10, etc. But they don't have a personal relationship with the Lord? Combine that with Rev. people, Lord, Lord, and yeah they thought they would go to heaven.

Right now one of my dearest and oldest friends is sure she is going to heaven because she forgives the best she can, is pretty generous (more than some Christians), is a faithful good wife and mother. She believes in a god and she even told me once that I would be happy to know she had talked to Jesus. I was thrilled, hugged her, told her yes I was happy because we be together in heaven, now that she knew Him as her Savior. She said, oh no I was going to heaven anyway. Later she gave me material for something she was studying. That's what it was all about. Something dreamed up by a Jewish medium, can't remember the woman's name.

 

[evenifigoalone]

I do, I hold to OSAS. I don't see how if Jesus covered ALL sins, anything we could do would change that. Y'know?
My conviction is that sin separates us from God, but that doesn't change Jesus' blood being atonement for our sins. Rather than losing salvation over sin (and really, most of us probably sin nearly constantly in some way), it temporarily hinders our connection to God through prayer. And God can't use us when we have unconfessed sin in our lives.

Now, this is a hotly contested topic not only on this forum, but probably every Christian forum in existence and among Christians in general.
And I don't debate on it because it's an area I struggle with--even though I hold to OSAS, doubts exist. At one point I spent several nights terrified to fall asleep because I was wondering what would happen if I died while sleeping. The threat of a burning hell is a terrifying thing, even if you know you are in right standing with God.
Living with fear that you may have fallen out of salvation seems pretty miserable to me, honestly. God has to have better in store for his children than that?
There are things I struggle with on a daily basis, and it's the most comforting thing to me to know that no matter how bad I mess up God will always forgive me and let me start over. Being out of God's will? I've been there. It was miserable. But I don't think that if I had died while in that place I would have gone to hell.

But of course I realize that plenty of counterarguments exist. I've heard them before. And there are counterarguments to those counterarguments, but I'm not going to debate it personally. Although I understand that by posting in the debate section my post is as subject to criticism as anybody elses'.

 

[MarkT]

If you want to know what saves, it's the word of God. If the word of God is in your heart, that's what saves. True believers store up his words. I even know some who say they don't know him, but the word of God is in their heart and on their lips. It is active in them somehow. But God can save whomever he wills.

It's fine to say you believe and you will never fall. God won't let it happen. But what is it that you believe? Jesus Christ and him crucified? OK That's a start. But do you know what he said? Did you store up his words? Are his words active in you? Has the word of God divided your soul and your spirit?

The Spirit of God would not lead us to say once saved always saved. It's circular logic. If I say I am saved, no power can unsave me. OK, if you are saved. But your belief that you are saved is not what saves. Like I said, what saves is the word of God. Let his words shine in your heart.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Hey, allen baby. Jesus said the kingdom can be compared to the king who forgave the slave in the parable in Matthew 18:23-35 NASB. In that parable the king forgave the debt of the slave, but when it was reported to him that the slave did not have the same mercy on his fellow servant that the king had on him the king reinstated his debt.

Because Jesus said the kingdom can be compared to what happened in that parable Jesus is showing us that he will indeed truly forgive people who beg for that forgiveness but who will later not act in the expected and obligatory way a forgiven person acts and will have that forgiveness rescinded.

Yes, Master Bodine, what is your point?
That you can't fool God?
That you can't ask Jesus for forgiveness and then go out and sin purposely, instead of what?
Having a change of heart?
You can't use God for your own purpose and get away with it?

Master Bodine, you seem to me walking on the fence again.
Be careful not to fall off of it.
You may end up falling on the wrong side.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Yes, Master Bodine, what is your point?
That you can't fool God?
That you can't ask Jesus for forgiveness and then go out and sin purposely, instead of what?
Having a change of heart?
You can't use God for your own purpose and get away with it?

Master Bodine, you seem to me walking on the fence again.
Be careful not to fall off of it.
You may end up falling on the wrong side.

Allen baby, we can't just ignore the plain words of scripture, can we? We the church need to stop doing this! Why have we taught ourselves to look past plain words and adopt this mantra of 'it doesn't really mean what it says'. I'm done doing that. I repent of that deceitful wickedness.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Isn't anyone going to come out and play today?