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Bible Study Ecclesiastes, A Bible Study by Chopper & Reba.

Chopper said:
I wonder what kind of situations would prompt Solomon to make this statement, "he who increases knowledge increases sorrow."
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I would liken that statement in a way to that in Revelation where he is told to eat the book, and when he did it was sweet as honey in his mouth, but in his belly it was bitter.

There is the old statement: Ignorance is bliss!


Also consider:

Romans 7:9-10
For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died. And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
 
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Chopper said:
1:18 For in much wisdom is much vexation, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow.
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In the music world we 'tag' our music to cause reflection and here in verse 18 is a tag driving home a lesson every Veteran knows, even if he or she does not realize it yet. Life is full of wisdom and wisdom is evil and wisdom saves lives.

Solomon had about seven hundred women to keep happy and by the time of his writing these words he knew that no man should ever have more than one lady to have need to please. As soon as that six month old little Vietnamese baby died in my arms, I knew I would not sto pulling the triggers on my M60S but I also knew that every round I fed into that gun would cause me sorrow that would and hat doe haunt me to this day.

Knowing my M16, my M60 and my 357 Python intimately saved my life, often. That is wisdom that is worthy. And yet all of my guns have awarded me another lesson of wisdom and the blood will haunt me, right up until Jesus takes it and awards me with a Glorified Body with a cleansed mind.

Wisdom is a double edged sword. It is like a good Katana. i saw, recently, where a pistol was held solid with mechanical devises and a Katana was held vertical with a vise and the bullet was fired at it. The Katana split the bullet in half. Wisdom is like that. Bullets will not break the sword and no matter what wisdom and the Katana will stand leaving us to deal with the results.
 
Maybe there's another reason to 1:18.
If you look at it as having worldly wisdom, understanding what is going on around you, it can bring great inner sorrow, and knowledge that puffs us up that only causes grief.
1 Corinthians 8:1 says; Knowledge puffs up, but love builds up.

Is there something here do you think?
 
Chopper said:
At this point in time for Solomon, there doesn't seem to be any purpose for his life. I find Solomon's statement, being a psychologist, classic depression. This kind of depression leads to suicide.
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Maybe not suicide, but at least wanting to die and not interested in pursuing this life anymore.
 
Chopper said:
1:2 Vanity of vanities, says the Preacher, vanity of vanities! All is vanity.
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Getting back to the study, If Solomon had remained on the straight and narrow, he could not have said this. The kings of Judah which feared the LORD had no such observations. They were too busy doing God's will and looking after His people. The fact is that no one was given the privileges and blessings which were received by Solomon, and no one played the fool like he did.

Another lesson from the kings of Judah is that evil fathers do not necessary produce evil sons, and righteous fathers do not necessarily produce righteous sons. God hold each individual accountable individually.
 
th1b.taylor said:
In the music world we 'tag' our music to cause reflection and here in verse 18 is a tag driving home a lesson every Veteran knows, even if he or she does not realize it yet. Life is full of wisdom and wisdom is evil and wisdom saves lives.

Solomon had about seven hundred women to keep happy and by the time of his writing these words he knew that no man should ever have more than one lady to have need to please. As soon as that six month old little Vietnamese baby died in my arms, I knew I would not sto pulling the triggers on my M60S but I also knew that every round I fed into that gun would cause me sorrow that would and hat doe haunt me to this day.

Knowing my M16, my M60 and my 357 Python intimately saved my life, often. That is wisdom that is worthy. And yet all of my guns have awarded me another lesson of wisdom and the blood will haunt me, right up until Jesus takes it and awards me with a Glorified Body with a cleansed mind.

Wisdom is a double edged sword. It is like a good Katana. i saw, recently, where a pistol was held solid with mechanical devises and a Katana was held vertical with a vise and the bullet was fired at it. The Katana split the bullet in half. Wisdom is like that. Bullets will not break the sword and no matter what wisdom and the Katana will stand leaving us to deal with the results.
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I am not quite sure how the battlefield wisdom life application that you are sharing relates to Spiritual Wisdom of the Kingdom, or at least I am not seeing any connection. To me you are describing the wisdom of the world, the wisdom of men. I am reminded of the temptation in the wilderness, when the devil said if you are the son of God, then cast yourself of this cliff, for the angels shall bear thee.... And Jesus replied, thou shall not tempt the Lord thy God. To me, the Spiritual Wisdom would be "do not tempt." But the application of your stories would seem to be the wisdom found by one who had jump of the cliff, and how the angels had bear you up.

I say this not to be critical of the war stories and its kingdom application, but rather to try and draw a distinction between Spiritual Wisdom and Kingdom application in contrast to the Wisdom of Men gained by their experiences in this world. While the book of Ecclesiastes is a book of wisdom, is it a book of Spiritual wisdom, or is it a book of the Wisdom of Men, and in particular, the wisdom of Solomon? It seems to me it is a book of worldly wisdom and the wisdom of man, but one where Spiritual Wisdom can be sought.

So what are we more interested in, Spiritual Wisdom or the wisdom of men?
 
Malachi said:
Getting back to the study, If Solomon had remained on the straight and narrow, he could not have said this.
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I've been wanting to go back and address early posts, especially the one where you said it's only when one is outside of God that they see what Solomon observed about life under the sun (this life). I've walked the straight and narrow, growing up in the Lord for 30 years now, and I assure you one does not have to leave the straight and narrow to make the observations he made. In fact, I would say it's the opposite. It is the faithful saint (not perfect, I'm not saying that) who continually lives for and seeks God that is going to come to Solomon's conclusions. Jesus said you can not be his disciple until you hate your own life. And I now know he means that very literally.
 
Malachi said:
Getting back to the study, If Solomon had remained on the straight and narrow, he could not have said this. The kings of Judah which feared the LORD had no such observations. They were too busy doing God's will and looking after His people. The fact is that no one was given the privileges and blessings which were received by Solomon, and no one played the fool like he did.

Another lesson from the kings of Judah is that evil fathers do not necessary produce evil sons, and righteous fathers do not necessarily produce righteous sons. God hold each individual accountable individually.
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You sound as though you think Solomon was not righteous before God.
Is that true?
 
Rollo Tamasi said:
Rollo sits quietly in class, waiting for the teacher and other students to show up.
Nobody comes.
He is alone.
So he leaves, his head hanging low.
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Do you see now that Solomon was not offering a lesson on the mechanics of how the sun moves from east to west, but rather that the sun has done that over and over and over and over again in this mundane, meaningless life, and will continue to do that?
 
Jethro Bodine said:
Jesus said you can not be his disciple until you hate your own life. And I now know he means that very literally.
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Can you elaborate what that is like in regards to your experience. If that's too personal to say, I understand. Just need an example.
 
Jethro Bodine said:
Do you see now that Solomon was not offering a lesson on the mechanics of how the sun moves from east to west, but rather that the sun has done that over and over and over and over again in this mundane, meaningless life, and will continue to do that?
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No, I don't see that.
 
Angel said:
Can you elaborate what that is like in regards to your experience. If that's too personal to say, I understand. Just need an example.
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Glad you asked, because I think this truth is not addressed honestly enough in the church....especially in this age where the prosperity gospel is winning so many Christians--a gospel that essentially teaches Christians to covet the things of this life, not despise them (speaking very generally, of course).

I'm 53 years old. I know what life is about now...the things we feel so compelled to chase after. Marriage is a good example. When I was young it felt so 'me', what I want, what I desire, what I long for, a personal choice that I wanted to fulfill. Now I see how programmed we are by virtue of the flesh to fulfill a continuing cycle of reproduction. So many other things are like this. When we are young we think we are fulfilling personal likes and desires, but the truth is we are slaves to the biology of our human bodies which includes our thoughts. Everything revolves around the flesh. Now that I know this I have no desire to continue in it.
 
Jethro Bodine said:
Glad you asked, because I think this truth is not addressed honestly enough in the church....especially in this age where the prosperity gospel is winning so many Christians--a gospel that essentially teaches Christians to covet the things of this life, not despise them (speaking very generally, of course).

I'm 53 years old. I know what life is about now...the things we feel so compelled to chase after. Marriage is a good example. When I was young it felt so 'me', what I want, what I desire, what I long for, a personal choice that I wanted to fulfill. Now I see how programmed we are by virtue of the flesh to fulfill a continuing cycle of reproduction. So many other things are like this. When we are young we think we are fulfilling personal likes and desires, but the truth is we are slaves to the biology of our human bodies which includes our thoughts. Everything revolves around the flesh. Now that I know this I have no desire to continue in it.
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So, how do we despise our lives? What about hobbies or goals or dreams?
 
ezrider said:
It seems to me it is a book of worldly wisdom and the wisdom of man, but one where Spiritual Wisdom can be sought.
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What you are noting is how God's wisdom is viewed from man's viewpoint. That doesn't make it any less wise. It's simply God's truths framed in the context of the world man lives in.
 
Angel said:
So, how do we despise our lives? What about hobbies or goals or dreams?
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I have learned how incredibly self serving my personal goals and desires are, even the things I desire to do in my service to Christ. I play guitar, and want to do that in the church again, but I'm not chasing it with the zeal I did when I played in the church in my 20's, because I see how deeply rooted the desire is for people to notice and praise my skill, not just enter into worship with my brothers and sisters and do something good for God. (You folks don't know me and will never hear me play so I have no problem sharing this).

So, I've learned how even my desire to do good and holy things, even considering them my 'interests', are so pathetically rooted in my human desire for praise and adulation and love from others. It's all part of the 'talent search' mentality of us humans. Which is especially prevalent in this time in human history. It's sickening when you can honestly see it for what it is. And when you see it as an honest Christian you then hate it.
 
How hard it must have been on Solomon the wisest man in the world to realize his vanity.. He seems to lament about being so full of himself..
Vanity is something we do not want to see in ourselves.. We spot it RIGHT NOW in the other guy.. But OUR thoughts are just.

While having everything God offered Solomon he sought the world .. The good ol simple grass is greener .. He had to be full of the world to see how empty he truly became..
There is no wisdom in 700 wives
 
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