[_ Old Earth _] Evolution is not based on empirical evidence

[Guest]

Here is where your so called blah blah blah....

You should have a liscense to drive. Driving wreckless is against the law. People who have a good driving record are free to drive alot more
often. Safety first. When you know what you are doing,you make better
choices,amen.

Did I say that people drive wrecklessly? No, driving misshaps happen all the time, it's nobodies fault. Sometimes people die as a result of it, and nobody is to blame. Yet every day we all take the risk in getting in that car, that maybe, a car will slip on some ice, or in the rain, and someone will die. This happens even to people who know what they are doing.

:B-fly: I'd love for you to tell this garbage to MADD,Mothers Against Drunk Drivers!!!

 

[Guest]

[quote="The Tuatha'anDid I say that people drive wrecklessly? No, driving misshaps happen all the time, it's nobodies fault. Sometimes people die as a result of it, and nobody is to blame. Yet every day we all take the risk in getting in that car, that maybe, a car will slip on some ice, or in the rain, and someone will die. This happens even to people who know what they are doing.

:roll: What does that have to do with calling an abortion clinic and
scheduling an abortion? Is an abortion an accident? Only when the baby
is wanted. Sexual sin is not an accident,it's a choice,so if you cannot live
with your choice,don't risk it!

 

[Asimov]

AND as I have already told you,ABORTION is MURDER,it is also HATE!
Not only does it punish an innocent life,but it's a hate crime!!!
I do not beat up on my children,but what does that have to do with
abortion,a clear act of violence and hate?
I happen to love children,but what would you know about children?

What does that have to do with calling an abortion clinic and
scheduling an abortion? Is an abortion an accident? Only when the baby
is wanted. Sexual sin is not an accident,it's a choice,so if you cannot live
with your choice,don't risk it!

Blue...I said I was done with discussing abortion...it's not an issue that is relevant to here, you are derailing the thread, if you wish to talk about abortion, make another thread, and get back on topic.

We were discussing Parents punishing their children. Don't mention abortion again.

I'd love for you to tell this garbage to MADD,Mothers Against Drunk Drivers!!!

What does madd have to do with the discussion. You said:

You should have a liscense to drive. Driving wreckless is against the law. People who have a good driving record are free to drive alot more
often. Safety first. When you know what you are doing,you make better
choices,amen.

And I said in reply that not everyone who gets in an accident drives wrecklessly, accidents sometimes happen! That's it!

[quote="The Tuatha'an]Did I say that people drive wrecklessly? No, driving misshaps happen all the time, it's nobodies fault. Sometimes people die as a result of it, and nobody is to blame. Yet every day we all take the risk in getting in that car, that maybe, a car will slip on some ice, or in the rain, and someone will die. This happens even to people who know what they are doing.

What does that have to do with calling an abortion clinic and
scheduling an abortion? Is an abortion an accident? Only when the baby
is wanted. Sexual sin is not an accident,it's a choice,so if you cannot live
with your choice,don't risk it!

We aren't discussing abortion!!

I do not beat up on my children,but what does that have to do with
abortion,a clear act of violence and hate?

We weren't discussing abortion, you just dropped that in there for no reason!!

You don't hit your children? Then you are going against God's Will in the Bible.

 

[Guest]

AND as I have already told you,ABORTION is MURDER,it is also HATE!
Not only does it punish an innocent life,but it's a hate crime!!!
I do not beat up on my children,but what does that have to do with
abortion,a clear act of violence and hate?
I happen to love children,but what would you know about children?

[quote:d62c2]What does that have to do with calling an abortion clinic and
scheduling an abortion? Is an abortion an accident? Only when the baby
is wanted. Sexual sin is not an accident,it's a choice,so if you cannot live
with your choice,don't risk it!

Blue...I said I was done with discussing abortion...it's not an issue that is relevant to here, you are derailing the thread, if you wish to talk about abortion, make another thread, and get back on topic.

We were discussing Parents punishing their children. Don't mention abortion again.

I'd love for you to tell this garbage to MADD,Mothers Against Drunk Drivers!!!

What does madd have to do with the discussion. You said:

You should have a liscense to drive. Driving wreckless is against the law. People who have a good driving record are free to drive alot more
often. Safety first. When you know what you are doing,you make better
choices,amen.

And I said in reply that not everyone who gets in an accident drives wrecklessly, accidents sometimes happen! That's it!

[quote="The Tuatha'an]Did I say that people drive wrecklessly? No, driving misshaps happen all the time, it's nobodies fault. Sometimes people die as a result of it, and nobody is to blame. Yet every day we all take the risk in getting in that car, that maybe, a car will slip on some ice, or in the rain, and someone will die. This happens even to people who know what they are doing.

What does that have to do with calling an abortion clinic and
scheduling an abortion? Is an abortion an accident? Only when the baby
is wanted. Sexual sin is not an accident,it's a choice,so if you cannot live
with your choice,don't risk it!

We aren't discussing abortion!!

I do not beat up on my children,but what does that have to do with
abortion,a clear act of violence and hate?

We weren't discussing abortion, you just dropped that in there for no reason!!

You don't hit your children? Then you are going against God's Will in the Bible.[/quote:d62c2]

:B-fly: How many times do you have to mention "we are not talking
about abortion" in one post?
I don't believe it's disobeying God when you don't hit your children.
My children don't need alot of discipline like worldly children may need.
Also,what do you know about children? What is your motive in bringing
up children?

 

[Asimov]

How many times do you have to mention "we are not talking
about abortion" in one post?

As many times until you stop bringing it up.

I don't believe it's disobeying God when you don't hit your children.

spare the rod, spoil the child?
you hate your child if you don't discipline it?

My children don't need alot of discipline like worldly children may need.
Also,what do you know about children? What is your motive in bringing
up children?

You brought up children!

 

[goliwog man]

ok... last i heard we were talking bout evolution is not based on empirical evidence..... lets restart with the basics.....

In genisis 1v 1 it says In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

Evolution says In the begging there was a big bag (correct me if I'm wrong)

What gets me about that is how no body was there? how could something come out of nothing.

verse 2 b And god moved upon the face of the waters....

evolution say the world was gases?

water would have to be the most important thing ever to cross the face of humanity what can live without water. And what can live with gases? For thing to have life wouldnt they need water?

I have to go now will post more later

 

[Guest]

ok... last i heard we were talking bout evolution is not based on empirical evidence..... lets restart with the basics.....

In genisis 1v 1 it says In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

Evolution says In the begging there was a big bag (correct me if I'm wrong)

What gets me about that is how no body was there? how could something come out of nothing.

verse 2 b And god moved upon the face of the waters....

evolution say the world was gases?

water would have to be the most important thing ever to cross the face of humanity what can live without water. And what can live with gases? For thing to have life wouldnt they need water?

I have to go now will post more later

:wink: goliwog man,I like many of your posts. You are right on!
I sure loved the post where you said that stupidity results from the
belief in evolution so it's good that it isn't a belief.
Keep up the great Job!

 

[Quath]

In genisis 1v 1 it says In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

Well, this is tricky because if God is eternal, is there a beginning?

Evolution says In the begging there was a big bag (correct me if I'm wrong)

Evolution does not postulate the Big Bang. That is cosmology. Evolution just starts with the assumption that life exists and is reproducing and there is a selection process.

What gets me about that is how no body was there? how could something come out of nothing.

Well, it is the same type of question for religion. How can an intelligent being just exist with no cause?

evolution say the world was gases?

Here is the Big Bang in a nutshell:
1. Universe came into existance. This includes time and space being created. So there is no "before" the Big bang since there was no time "before" it.
2. The Universe appears to be infinite in space and filled with infinite amount of matter. Due to the speed of light, we can only see the observable universe which is a finite size.
3. Matter and anti-matter anhiliate, but there is enough breaking of symmetry that matter dominates.
4. The universe cools by expansion. (This is one weird part. It expands further into infinity. It is the same as saying that at one time the universe was infinite size and at another time it was twice that size. Fun with infinities).
5. As the universe cools, gravity, weak, string and electromagetism separate into their own identities and are no longer the same type of force.
6. Further cooling allows for matter to form. And then for atoms of hydrogen and helium.
7. Further cooling (which is just energy density getting smaller or mass density geting smaller) allows for galaxes and stars to form. (Only elements are hydrogen and helium (and maybe a small amount of other elements).
8. First stars start burning and creating heavier elements. They nova and create up to uranium and spew this stuff around.
9. These elements fall back together under gravity and form a new star. The heavy elements form planets like Earth or gas giants like Jupiter.

water would have to be the most important thing ever to cross the face of humanity what can live without water. And what can live with gases? For thing to have life wouldnt they need water?

It is hard to concieve of life without water since it is so useful. However, there is so much chemistry that we do not know that we don't know what all is possible.

Quath

 

[goliwog man]

Evolution would say organisms are continuously changing. Whereas the bible says in genesis 1 v24-25 And God said, let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle and creeping thing , and beast of the earth after his kind and it was so. And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind and everything that creapeth upon the earth after his kind and God saw that it was good.

Evolution states that we evolved from monkeys yet The bible says in genesis 2v 7 it says And the lord God formed man of the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life.

Facts.
Lets have a look at evolutions chart of monkey to man

Heidelberg man- Built from a jaw bone that was conceded by many to be quite human

Nebraska man- Scientifically built from one tooth and later found to be the tooth of an extinct pig

Piltdown man- the jaw bone turned out to belong to a modern ape.

Peking man- 500,000 years old all evidence has disappeared

Neanderthal man- At the Intl congress of zo-ology (1958) Dr A.J.E Cave said this examination showed that the famous Neanderthal skeleton found in France over 50 years ago is that of an old man that suffered from arthritis.

Cro-Magnon man- One of the earliest and best established fossils is at least equal in physique and brain compacity to modern man so what’s the difference.

Modern man- this genius thinks we evolved from monkeys

Tell me what are your arguments?

Now creation says man was made from the dust (soil or clay). Lets have a look at some elements. Sodium, chlorine, calcium, phosphorus, potassium, sulphur, iodine, copper, iron, cobalt, manganese, fluorine, zinc, molybdenum, chromium, selenium, and silicon are just some of the elements found in soil (or dust) and the human body. It makes sense we were made from dust we share similarities.

 

[Asimov]

Evolution would say organisms are continuously changing. Whereas the bible says in genesis 1 v24-25 And God said, let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle and creeping thing , and beast of the earth after his kind and it was so.

Where does it say in Genesis that animals cannot change?

Evolution states that we evolved from monkeys yet The bible says in genesis 2v 7 it says And the lord God formed man of the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life.

Evolution does not say that we evolved from monkeys. Genesis is a metaphorical story.

Facts.
Lets have a look at evolutions chart of monkey to man

Heidelberg man- Built from a jaw bone that was conceded by many to be quite human

Nebraska man- Scientifically built from one tooth and later found to be the tooth of an extinct pig

Piltdown man- the jaw bone turned out to belong to a modern ape.

Peking man- 500,000 years old all evidence has disappeared

Neanderthal man- At the Intl congress of zo-ology (1958) Dr A.J.E Cave said this examination showed that the famous Neanderthal skeleton found in France over 50 years ago is that of an old man that suffered from arthritis.

Cro-Magnon man- One of the earliest and best established fossils is at least equal in physique and brain compacity to modern man so what’s the difference.

Modern man- this genius thinks we evolved from monkeys

Tell me what are your arguments?

What?? This isn't the lineage of humans....

Now creation says man was made from the dust (soil or clay). Lets have a look at some elements. Sodium, chlorine, calcium, phosphorus, potassium, sulphur, iodine, copper, iron, cobalt, manganese, fluorine, zinc, molybdenum, chromium, selenium, and silicon are just some of the elements found in soil (or dust) and the human body. It makes sense we were made from dust we share similarities.

so....?

 

[goliwog man]

The Tuatha'an

I would appreciate answears that arent umms oos or arrs If evolution doesnt say we come from monkeys were did we evolve from have they changed thier mind again?

After thier own kind means giving birth to your own e.g kangaroo gives birth to a kangaroo. Not one day a dinasaur layed an egg and out popped a chicken.

Genesis is a metaphorical story.

prove it

 

[cubedbee]

goliwog, find me one single scientific article or book on evolution that claims we came from monkeys. There is none. It was never part of the theory of evolution, and to claim that it is shows that you have gained all your knowledge of evolution from creationist propaganda sites. Humans and monkeys have a common ancestor, one did not turn into the other.

 

[Free]

Although you are right B^3, the point still stands - what difference does it make if we came from monkeys or have a common ancestor? Whether monkeys are the intermediaries or there are some yet to be found intermediaries, it makes no difference. What is the common ancestor anyway?

 

[goliwog man]

The monkey (or ape) have a common ancestor with humans? The dna of a monkey is said to be anywere between 96-98.7% the same. Does this mean we have common ancestors. however we also share 50% of our dna with bananas does that mean we are common ancestors with bananas?

Also the eye of an octopus is said to be the same of a human meaning we have common ancestors but the only link found so far is taht of a cankerworm which doesnt even have eyes.

goliwog, find me one single scientific article or book on evolution that claims we came from monkeys.

ok....

the new oxford illustrated dictionary volume 1 pg578
the hutchinson dictionary of science pg 297 sub title human species
http://www.asa3.org/archive/evolution/199905/0122.html

havent got time right now will come back with a host of others later

 

[Asimov]

The monkey (or ape) have a common ancestor with humans? The dna of a monkey is said to be anywere between 96-98.7% the same. Does this mean we have common ancestors. however we also share 50% of our dna with bananas does that mean we are common ancestors with bananas?

Also the eye of an octopus is said to be the same of a human meaning we have common ancestors but the only link found so far is taht of a cankerworm which doesnt even have eyes.

Yes, all life shares a common ancestor at some point. Be it billions of years ago, or hundreds of millions...what is your point?

ok....

the new oxford illustrated dictionary volume 1 pg578
the hutchinson dictionary of science pg 297 sub title human species
http://www.asa3.org/archive/evolution/199905/0122.html

This doesn't say that man evolved from monkeys, it says that man IS an ape, which is true.

 

[Quath]

Here is a website of prominent fossils from human's ancestors (up to about 6 or 7 million years ago): http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/homs/specimen.html

Quath

 

[Guest]

In genisis 1v 1 it says In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

Well, this is tricky because if God is eternal, is there a beginning?

:B-fly: God doesn't have a beginning,but what he created would of
cause have a beginning. We make a big mistake when we try to limit
God and treat him the same as human beings,ect.....
We are not greater or equal to God,and why should we be?

 

[Featherbop]

About common ancestry, why, neccesarily does it indicate common ancestry from similaritys between animals/humans. I do not see any indication of this. common design, it seems(common creator) and nothing more, but perhaps designed in a way where it is not possible to tell for sure.

Personally, I would need to observe common ancestry in order to believe it. Problem is, can never observe many, or any of the claims, making them thouroughly useless to me. Hmph.

 

[Asimov]

About common ancestry, why, neccesarily does it indicate common ancestry from similaritys between animals/humans. I do not see any indication of this. common design, it seems(common creator) and nothing more, but perhaps designed in a way where it is not possible to tell for sure.

Common ancestry does not exclude a Creator designing. And just in response to the Octopus eye being the same as a human eye, that is false, Octopus eyes are slightly better "designed" than the human eye.

Evidence such as endogenous retroviruses, which are genetic flaws in the DNA that are passed on hereditarily that we share with chimps and other apes, showing that we have a common ancestor. Not to mention similarity in intelligence between apes, similarity in bone structure and appearance.

Personally, I would need to observe common ancestry in order to believe it. Problem is, can never observe many, or any of the claims, making them thouroughly useless to me. Hmph.

What do you mean by observe?

 

[Featherbop]

I mean I would have to witness the process of humans evolving from the [insert whatever you beleive they evolved from]. Observe it.