[_ Old Earth _] Evolution

[felix]

Now we need to convince people that theology should followobservations. Not, "squeezing",observation to match a theology. There is noevidence to suggest that god did not use evolution to create man.

As I already mentioned above, theology does follow observations. These observations are not blind faith but an active communication, communion, conversation with God and most importantly His response back to Christians. You should call the right number using His name for God to reply back. Doubting or expecting evidence or an observation is not a problem because, God will surely show you such things. However, it is the heart of man that ultimately rejects and wanting to believe anything other than God which is the problem.

Jas 1:6 But let him ask in faith, with no doubting, for he who doubts is like a wave of the sea driven and tossed by the wind.
Jas 1:7 For let not that man suppose that he will receive anything from the Lord;
Jas 1:8 [he is] a double-minded man, unstable in all his ways.

Have you ever asked anything in Faith? Are you trying to convince people who had already "observed" what is written in Jas 1:6-8 ?

If God did use evolution to create man, then spirit and soul is a problem because, they too had to be evolved. Other personalities like "Satan", "sons of God" too had to be evolved which is nonsense for any true Christian who believes in God's abilities and His awesome power.

 

[lordkalvan]

No. Nothing actually says that I am evolved...

Nope, but the evidence strongly indicates it.

.... nor any of what you mentioned actually proves evolution.

Proof is for alcohol and maths. The evidence is just about overwhelming, however.

Evolution is actually "assumed" based these features.

They're not just features, they're a range of consilient, consistent evidence from different fields of research that all point in the same direction. I would be pleased to read your account of this evidence that explains it in as least as consistent and consilient way as does evolution.

Since God is not assumed nor included in science these days, the natural fall back and the only assumption left is evolution.

As several notable evolutionary scientists are Christians - Francis Collins and Kenneth Miller spring to mind - your argument seems to have little merit. Is it beyond the capabilities and imagination of God as you conceive of him to have simply created the conditions in which the Universe could begin and then everything else, including life, could develop by entirely naturalistic processes?

If observation is all what you are after, try this:
Matt 5:8 Blessed [are] the pure in heart, For they shall see God.

Have you ever tried Matt 5:8 ?

Tried it for what?

 

[felix]

If observation is all what you are after, try this:
Matt 5:8 Blessed [are] the pure in heart, For they shall see God.

Have you ever tried Matt 5:8 ?

Tried it for what?

To observe! Refusing to try is simply "not willing to observe".

 

[lordkalvan]

To observe! Refusing to try is simply "not willing to observe".

To observe what?

 

[felix]

To observe what?

To see God for yourself.

 

[VirginShallConceive]

This post says a lot about your outlook:

Since God is not assumed nor included in science these days,

This segment clearly reveals that you actually believe that God is neither assumed nor included in science these days.

1)Why do you believe that?

2)If your belief is true, then why is it that God is neither assumed nor included in science these days?

the natural fall back and the only assumption left is evolution.

You clearly illustrated that evolution isn't your first assumption. However, you most certainly gave evolution the "silver medal" of "assumptions". You even further solidified its "silver medal standing" in your scientific view by recognizing it to be "the natural fall back".

Am I mistaken?

 

[felix]

This post says a lot about your outlook:


This segment clearly reveals that you actually believe that God is neither assumed nor included in science these days.

1)Why do you believe that?

2)If your belief is true, then why is it that God is neither assumed nor included in science these days?

Because, people are becoming fools in saying there is no God. Nor do they acknowledge His creation abilities.

You clearly illustrated that evolution isn't your first assumption. However, you most certainly gave evolution the "silver medal" of "assumptions". You even further solidified its "silver medal standing" in your scientific view by recognizing it to be "the natural fall back".

Am I mistaken?

Yes, you are most certainly mistaken because, that is not "my" assumption. I don't "assume" God created. I most certainly without a doubt know that God created the heavens and the earth, and everything in it, either seen or unseen.

 

[VirginShallConceive]

Because, people are becoming fools in saying there is no God. Nor do they acknowledge His creation abilities.

Is there a particular reason that people are becoming fools, or is it in the realm of "the unknown"?

Yes, you are most certainly mistaken because, that is not "my" assumption. I don't "assume" God created. I most certainly without a doubt know that God created the heavens and the earth, and everything in it, either seen or unseen.

After reviewing your post for the second time, and taking your most recent post into consideration, I still get the jist that you were awarding evolution the "silver medal" of "assumptions".

I would like to ask you an honest question. Why do you think that some scientists even accept the theory of evolution? Do you think that they admire Charles Darwin because of his looks? Do you think that Satan has penetrated their minds? Has God hardened their hearts? What is it?

 

[felix]

Is there a particular reason that people are becoming fools, or is it in the realm of "the unknown"?

Because, people want to profess themselves to be wise as in Rom 1:22.

After reviewing your post for the second time, and taking your most recent post into consideration, I still get the jist that you were awarding evolution the "silver medal" of "assumptions".

I would like to ask you an honest question. Why do you think that some scientists even accept the theory of evolution? Do you think that they admire Charles Darwin because of his looks? Do you think that Satan has penetrated their minds? Has God hardened their hearts? What is it?

2Pet 3:1 Beloved, I now write to you this second epistle (in [both of] which I stir up your pure minds by way of reminder),
2Pet 3:2 that you may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us, the apostles of the Lord and Savior,
2Pet 3:3 knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts,
2Pet 3:4 and saying, "Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as [they were] from the beginning of creation."
2Pet 3:5 For this they willfully forget: that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of water and in the water,
2Pet 3:6 by which the world [that] then existed perished, being flooded with water.
2Pet 3:7 But the heavens and the earth [which] are now preserved by the same word, are reserved for fire until the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
2Pet 3:8 But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day [is] as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

 

[VirginShallConceive]

Because, people want to profess themselves to be wise as in Rom 1:22.

Okay. You seem to be professing your self to be wise. Does that mean that you just became a fool?

In other words, you just presented a terribly weak argument . . . for all to see.

2Pet 3:1 Beloved, I now write to you this second epistle (in [both of] which I stir up your pure minds by way of reminder),
2Pet 3:2 that you may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us, the apostles of the Lord and Savior,
2Pet 3:3 knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts,
2Pet 3:4 and saying, "Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as [they were] from the beginning of creation."
2Pet 3:5 For this they willfully forget: that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of water and in the water,
2Pet 3:6 by which the world [that] then existed perished, being flooded with water.
2Pet 3:7 But the heavens and the earth [which] are now preserved by the same word, are reserved for fire until the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
2Pet 3:8 But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day [is] as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

"Scoffers coming in the last days" is a prediction.

It is not a reason.

I am asking you, what is the reason for these evolution believers to believe something that is wrong? And why them in particular? What is their motive?

What is their motive for going against The Creator of the Universe, if believing in evolution is just that?

 

[felix]

Okay. You seem to be professing your self to be wise. Does that mean that you just became a fool?

In other words, you just presented a terribly weak argument . . . for all to see.

You asked for it and I presented Rom 1:22. If Rom 1:22 is weak argument for you, don't assume whatever you think is for all.

"Scoffers coming in the last days" is a prediction.

It is not a reason.

I am asking you, what is the reason for these evolution believers to believe something that is wrong? And why them in particular? What is their motive?

What is their motive for going against The Creator of the Universe, if believing in evolution is just that?

Read Romans 1. Everything is there.

They want to suppress the truth with a lie, even though God had revealed Himself to them through His creation and glory.

 

[VirginShallConceive]

You asked for it and I presented Rom 1:22. If Rom 1:22 is weak argument for you, don't assume whatever you think is for all.




Read Romans 1. Everything is there.

They want to suppress the truth with a lie, even though God had revealed Himself to them through His creation and glory.

Let's narrow it down.

Do you think that believing in the Theory of Evolution is going against God?

 

[lordkalvan]

To see God for yourself.

I'm sorry, but I don't believe it is possible to see imaginary beings. My apologies if this statement offends you. Maybe we should get back on topic?

 

[felix]

Let's narrow it down.

Do you think that believing in the Theory of Evolution is going against God?

Gen 2:7 And the LORD God formed man [of] the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being.

It is not only going against God, but denying the creation and everything what God did in Genesis account of creation.

Believing in Evolution is denying Him as Creator.

 

[felix]

I'm sorry, but I don't believe it is possible to see imaginary beings. My apologies if this statement offends you. Maybe we should get back on topic?

How do you know it is imaginary? Have you tried doing what I said?

How can you expect a result without doing an experiment? Is this what you call science?

 

[Barbarian]

It is not only going against God, but denying the creation and everything what God did in Genesis account of creation.

Evolution is quite compatible with the Bible. God says that man was created from the earth like other animals, but that He directly gives each of us a soul, making us different. How we came from the Earth is not discussed.

However, Young Earth, with its "life ex nihilo" doctrine is directly opposed to God's creation of life.

 

[felix]

Evolution is quite compatible with the Bible. God says that man was created from the earth like other animals, but that He directly gives each of us a soul, making us different. How we came from the Earth is not discussed.

However, Young Earth, with its "life ex nihilo" doctrine is directly opposed to God's creation of life.

Does spirit had to evolve too?

 

[VirginShallConceive]

Gen 2:7 And the LORD God formed man [of] the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being.

It is not only going against God, but denying the creation and everything what God did in Genesis account of creation.

Believing in Evolution is denying Him as Creator.

God allowed you and me to be born in a world that is full of lies. Right?

God created us with minds that can think. Right?

If this is a world where Genesis isn't exactly accurate or Genesis was truly inspired by the Creator of the Universe to be metaphorical, then God has still blessed you more than He has blessed many other humans that were indoctrinated from birth by their parents or others in their given culture to believe in a god(or gods) that is so far from the character in Genesis that you and I recognize as God. You are believing in a God that gives you the "infallible Book of Genesis" but throws you the "misleading' biological evidence of evolution. How different is that than believing in a God who uses evolution as part of His divine plan but throws you the "misleading" Book of Genesis?

 

[lordkalvan]

How do you know it is imaginary? Have you tried doing what I said?

How can you expect a result without doing an experiment? Is this what you call science?

This thread isn't about my lack of belief in supernatural divinities, nor about how I should go about redressing that lack of belief to your satisfaction. Let's stick to the topic. I won't reply to any further questions along these lines.

 

[felix]

God allowed you and me to be born in a world that is full of lies. Right?

God created us with minds that can think. Right?

If this is a world where Genesis isn't exactly accurate or Genesis was truly inspired by the Creator of the Universe to be metaphorical, then God has still blessed you more than He has blessed many other humans that were indoctrinated from birth by their parents or others in their given culture to believe in a god(or gods) that is so far from the character in Genesis that you and I recognize as God. You are believing in a God that gives you the "infallible Book of Genesis" but throws you the "misleading' biological evidence of evolution. How different is that than believing in a God who uses evolution as part of His divine plan but throws you the "misleading" Book of Genesis?

If Genesis is a metaphorical, then He created nothing and you just denied Him to be a Creator.

If God had to use evolution to create you, then God is not your creator because, you are a product of natural selection.

If God had to use evolution to create you, then God never knew you before the foundation of this world, nor your name was written in book of Life.

By the way, there is no biological evidence of evolution.