Fig tree 101

[Stormcrow]

All end-time prophecy revolves around that Temple Mount, that Mount was the location of the First and Second Temples of Israel, that Mount is the location that the antichrist shall set up his false temple, that Mount is where Christ shall set His Millennial Temple, and that Mount shall be the location of God's eternal Heavenly Temple which will descend from above. That location is God's favorite place in the universe, God married that place (spiritually):

This is the kind of hyper-literalism that sees symbolic language as literal but refuses to take literal words - like "soon", "near", "quickly" and "at hand" literally.

It boggles the mind.

You all (preterist)stay with your prophecy ended back in the day,Christ second coming will be seen by the whole world,not just a few that you claim saw it in AD 70 and this generation we are in now, will see it happen....Keep watching!!!

We've been watching people like Harold Camping, Arnold Murray and Tim LaHaye embarrass themselves and the church. People - like these - have come and gone in church history having never seen the alleged promise of His return, though everyone of them had absolute certainty that He would return for all to see, just as you have said.

In the meantime, He said when He would return ("that generation"), why He would return (to show them - whom they crucified - His power and glory in judgment) and even gave His disciples the signs to look for!

Therefore, either Christ was lying or these "end-time charlatans" are! You can choose to side with them. I'll take Christ's word over yours or theirs any day of the week and twice on Sunday!

 

[warfrog]

I agree with both n2 and Storm.

End times do revolve around the temple.
Just not the brick and mortar temple, but the temple made of flesh and blood, and no im not speaking of Christ only, but of all men.
Alot of end time prophecy revolves around the location of Jerusalem and is also a worldwide event.

Storm reread what you said, doesnt it sound alot like the scoffers speak in scripture? I know thats not your intention, is it not the same?

 

[n2thelight]

This is the kind of hyper-literalism that sees symbolic language as literal but refuses to take literal words - like "soon", "near", "quickly" and "at hand" literally.

It boggles the mind.



We've been watching people like Harold Camping, Arnold Murray and Tim LaHaye embarrass themselves and the church. People - like these - have come and gone in church history having never seen the alleged promise of His return, though everyone of them had absolute certainty that He would return for all to see, just as you have said.

In the meantime, He said when He would return ("that generation"), why He would return (to show them - whom they crucified - His power and glory in judgment) and even gave His disciples the signs to look for!

Therefore, either Christ was lying or these "end-time charlatans" are! You can choose to side with them. I'll take Christ's word over yours or theirs any day of the week and twice on Sunday!

Don't do Camping,nor Lahaye,however I do study with Murray,so I would like to no his embarrasment.....

Christ didn't say,that generation,He said this,meaning the figtree generation....Never before in the history of mankind has man been able to see whats going on in the world as it happens,for preterist to say that Christ returned already,with only a hanfull of people actually seeing it,flies in the face of scripture,saying the WHOLE world would see.....

To make it simple,as long as you are in a flesh body,Christ has not returned.....

satan comes at the 6th trump pretending to be Christ....Christ returns at the 7th,neither of which has happened yet.....

All these people you all think was the man of sin can't work,none of them fell from Heaven,in other words,were kicked out of Heaven...

The below scripture starts the beginning of the end,it has not happened yet....

Revelation 12:7 "And there was war in heaven: Mi'-cha-el and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,,"

Revelation 12:8 "And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven."

Revelation 12:9 "And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Sa'-tan, which deceived the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him."

satan and his angels are supernatural,God will allow them to use this against mankind,weather you believe it or not,it shall happen,for it is written.........

 

[Stormcrow]

I do study with Murray

Mr. Murray, or Pastor Murray, as his followers call him, teaches a brand of theology that has many problems. Mr. Murray denies the doctrine of the Trinity, denies the existence of hell and the rapture, and states that Eve had sexual relations with the devil and that this union produced Cain.

In addition, it seems that he has made a false prophecy as is documented by the Ontario Consultants on Religious Tolerance, a secular religious analysis organization.

Mr. Arnold Murray also frequently refers to the Christian identity movement which teaches that the British and, therefore, the Americans and Canadians, are the true descendants of the ancient Israelites the 10 lost tribes. Jews in Israel are really descended from Cain who was the result of sexual intercourse between Eve and Satan. Murray also teaches that all people had a pre-existence in spirit-bodies before they were born here on earth.

Mr. Murray supports his off-base theological positions by interpreting verses in light of his pre-conceived ideas, sometimes stripping biblical verses of their context. He also selectively appeals to the Strong's concordance, cites what Greek and Hebrew words mean, and weaves his theological positions into the text. In reality, all he has done is justify his ideas through his unsound interpretive techniques.

You might want to find a better teacher: one that isn't a false prophet and that doesn't lead a "Christian Identity" cult.

 

[Zinc]

He wouldn't tell you to learn it if it didn't mean something,that something is what most people can't see......

Of course it, "means something", just not what you think.

You are allegorizing the text.

 

[Elijah674]

Fig Tree Parable.
Yes Lord, 'i' have read & believed why, & for who, these parables were given from you for. Mark 4:33-34 + verses 10-12. (converted?) And indeed, these ones are of the multitude! Very sad!

---Elijah

 

[n2thelight]

Of course it, "means something", just not what you think.

You are allegorizing the text.

Okay,so what does it mean?????

 

[Zinc]

Okay,so what does it mean?????

It was speaking of a literal fig tree, just an example from nature, as an analogy for something else.


"Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh"

"Summer" relates to a literal fig tree, not a symbolic fig tree.



Luke has:

"ye see and know of your own selves"

Note: this was something that they already had a knowledge of. That fits with it being, as I say, just an example from nature.

 

[n2thelight]

It was speaking of a literal fig tree, just an example from nature, as an analogy for something else.


"Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh"

"Summer" relates to a literal fig tree, not a symbolic fig tree.



Luke has:

"ye see and know of your own selves"

Note: this was something that they already had a knowledge of. That fits with it being, as I say, just an example from nature.

It's much deeper than that,the tree was literal,as you say but it was also symbolic

Mark 11:13 "And seeing a fig tree afar off having leaves, He came, if haply He might find any thing thereon, (and when He came to it He found nothing but leaves); for the time of the figs was not yet."

In as much as Jesus is the Son of God, and He is the creator of all that is and moves on the earth: Of course Jesus knew the seasons, and the exact date that the figs come on the trees. So quite obviously Jesus is about to teach a lesson to His disciples. Jesus is making a point concerning the fig tree. Jesus is going to make an example of this fig tree to even us living today. Later Jesus will command us "to learn the parable of the fig tree" In the parable there are both good figs and there are bad figs as it is prophesied in Jeremiah 24.

Jeremiah 24:1 "The Lord shewed me, and, behold, two baskets of figs were set before the temple of the Lord, after that Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon had carried away captive Jeconiah the son of Jehoiakim king of Judah, and the princes of Judah, with the carpenters and smiths, from Jerusalem, and had brought them to Babylon."

This parable deals with the time of the end, and God is showing Jeremiah this parable that shall take place. The parable starts out with two baskets of figs setting in front of the temple in Jerusalem, and in this parable the captivity has already taken place. The king of Babylon, Nebuchadrezzar has already taken God's people captive, and we know that the Babylon of the end times is Jerusalem, and it's king is Satan in his role as the Antichrist. This parable is given to let you and I know that this king of the end times, Satan, is coming. His identity is given in Revelations 9:11.

Revelation 9:11 "And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon."

Then in Revelation 12:9 we are given other name of Satan, which all are given to show the roles that he shall play in deceiving mankind. "And the great dragon was cast out, the old serpent, called the Devil and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels."

We will see this king of Babylon, the devil, serpent, dragon or whatever other of his names he will be called by, in our generation. This parable of the fig tree is a simple story that will tell us exactly what will take place. It happens in Jerusalem and the two baskets of figs represent the good figs, those of brother Judah; and the bad figs, that of the Kenites. Notice here that the name "Jeconiah" is given, however we know him under the name "Jehoiachin" which means "one whom God appoints". "Jeconiah" on the other hand means "one whom God established". It is saying that it is God that put his people in captivity, and it is He also that will establish Satan in his role as deceiver, the Antichrist in the end times.

Jeremiah 24:2 "One basket had very good figs, even like the figs that are first ripe: and the other basket had very naughty figs, which could not be eaten, they were so bad."

When you go into horticulture of the figs, we are talking about goat figs here, the male tree. We know that this tree was set out in the year 1948 when only Judah returned to Jerusalem to establish that tiny nation of Israel. The tribe of Judah, the house of Judah went with the bad figs, or Kenites to reestablish the nation. Both baskets returned to set up this nation of Israel, "the very good figs, and the very naughty figs". These naughty figs are the Kenites, those people that the churches of Smyrna and Philadelphia knew and understood exactly who they were. This is what the parable of the fig tree is all about. Knowing these Kenites for who they are, and what and how they spread their false doctrines. The parable of the fig tree has a direct recognizing to the city of Jerusalem and the people that are therein, to where Jesus is now about to make entry.

 

[Zinc]

It's much deeper than that,the tree was literal,as you say but it was also symbolic

Where is there anything in the context to indicate it's symbolic?

 

[reba]

Where is there anything in the context to indicate it's symbolic?

maybe because it was a parable

 

[warfrog]

maybe because it was a parable

Yep and since it was a parable, review all other parables, all of them have a meaning in thier interpretation outside of the parable itself both with literal and symbolic interpretation imbued together.

The parable of the fig tree is no different, it has literal and symbolic text with meaning that coverges together in the interpretation.

 

[Zinc]

If we ignore or go outside of the plain meaning of the text (where the fig tree is strictly literal) then you are lost in subjective "private" interpretations.

 

[Zinc]

Where is there anything in the context to indicate it's symbolic?

maybe because it was a parable

Quote:

A parable is a succinct story, in prose or verse, which illustrates one or more instructive principles, or lessons, or (sometimes) a normative principle....

The word "parable" comes from the Greek παραβολή (parabolē), meaning "comparison, illustration, analogy"

Parable - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


There is nothing in the nature of a parable that I'm aware of that would require symbolism of the fig tree.

If a fig tree is just being used as an analogy, then that seems to fit fine with what a "parable" is.

 

[Zinc]

88 Reasons: What Went Wrong?

by Dean C. Halverson

CRI Journal - CRJ0023A


To many, "Edgar Whisenant" has recently become a household name. Whisenant, a former NASA rocket engineer turned prophecy teacher, became famous through a booklet that included two of his works: 88 Reasons Why the Rapture Could Be in 1988 and On Borrowed Time.[1] In this booklet, Whisenant predicted that Jesus would return to rapture His church sometime during the Jewish holiday of Rosh-Hashanah in 1988, which was from sunset, September 11, to sunset, September 13. Before those dates, The World Bible Society, which published the booklet, printed 3.2 million copies[2] and distributed 200,000 of them to pastors throughout the United States.[3]

When the September prediction failed, Whisenant updated the time to October 3. Now that date, too, has fallen through. Whisenant nevertheless remains undaunted: "The evidence is all over the place that it is going to be in a few weeks anyway."[4]

What has been the response to Whisenant's predictions? Thousands took the booklet seriously, some even quitting their jobs to prepare for the rapture. Attendance increased in some churches.[5] Many Christians shrugged the booklet off as being part of a fanatic fringe. Many others, though, while not accepting the specific predictions, praised the booklet for reminding them of the imminence of the Rapture....


However they responded, it sadly appeared that most Christians were unable to discern why Whisenant's reasoning was biblically unsound....


MISTAKENLY INTERPRETS A SYMBOL

In at least one instance Whisenant incorrectly interprets a biblical symbol, and then proceeds to build his predictions upon the shaky foundation of that faulty interpretation. The instance occurs in Reason #7 where Whisenant quotes Jesus' words in Matthew 24:32-33 as follows, "`Now learn this lesson from the fig tree: as soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. Even so, when you see all these things,...I [Jesus] tell you the truth, this wicked generation (1948-1988) will certainly not pass until all these things have happened" (ellipses and emphasis in original).[25] Whisenant interprets the above verse in the following way: "This last generation spoken of above started on 14 May 1948, the day Israel became a nation. Israel is the time clock of God throughout history. Israel is the blooming fig tree, and the last generation will end 40 wicked gentile years later on 14 May 1988."[26]

Contrary to Whisenant's interpretation, the context of Jesus' words in Matthew 24:32-33 gives no warrant to the idea that Jesus was using the figure of the fig tree as anything more than an illustration of how the Jews were able to tell when summer was near. Just as the blooming of the fig tree indicates that summer is approaching, so the previous signs that Jesus had mentioned (e.g., nations rising against nations, famines, earthquakes, and the preaching of the gospel to the entire world) are indications that the end is near.

 

[warfrog]

88 Reasons: What Went Wrong?

by Dean C. Halverson

CRI Journal - CRJ0023A


To many, "Edgar Whisenant" has recently become a household name. Whisenant, a former NASA rocket engineer turned prophecy teacher, became famous through a booklet that included two of his works: 88 Reasons Why the Rapture Could Be in 1988 and On Borrowed Time.[1] In this booklet, Whisenant predicted that Jesus would return to rapture His church sometime during the Jewish holiday of Rosh-Hashanah in 1988, which was from sunset, September 11, to sunset, September 13. Before those dates, The World Bible Society, which published the booklet, printed 3.2 million copies[2] and distributed 200,000 of them to pastors throughout the United States.[3]

When the September prediction failed, Whisenant updated the time to October 3. Now that date, too, has fallen through. Whisenant nevertheless remains undaunted: "The evidence is all over the place that it is going to be in a few weeks anyway."[4]

What has been the response to Whisenant's predictions? Thousands took the booklet seriously, some even quitting their jobs to prepare for the rapture. Attendance increased in some churches.[5] Many Christians shrugged the booklet off as being part of a fanatic fringe. Many others, though, while not accepting the specific predictions, praised the booklet for reminding them of the imminence of the Rapture....


However they responded, it sadly appeared that most Christians were unable to discern why Whisenant's reasoning was biblically unsound....


MISTAKENLY INTERPRETS A SYMBOL

In at least one instance Whisenant incorrectly interprets a biblical symbol, and then proceeds to build his predictions upon the shaky foundation of that faulty interpretation. The instance occurs in Reason #7 where Whisenant quotes Jesus' words in Matthew 24:32-33 as follows, "`Now learn this lesson from the fig tree: as soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. Even so, when you see all these things,...I [Jesus] tell you the truth, this wicked generation (1948-1988) will certainly not pass until all these things have happened" (ellipses and emphasis in original).[25] Whisenant interprets the above verse in the following way: "This last generation spoken of above started on 14 May 1948, the day Israel became a nation. Israel is the time clock of God throughout history. Israel is the blooming fig tree, and the last generation will end 40 wicked gentile years later on 14 May 1988."[26]

Contrary to Whisenant's interpretation, the context of Jesus' words in Matthew 24:32-33 gives no warrant to the idea that Jesus was using the figure of the fig tree as anything more than an illustration of how the Jews were able to tell when summer was near. Just as the blooming of the fig tree indicates that summer is approaching, so the previous signs that Jesus had mentioned (e.g., nations rising against nations, famines, earthquakes, and the preaching of the gospel to the entire world) are indications that the end is near.

Why would Christ's return not be included in what He just spoke of, Its clear He says when all these thing take place summer is near and His return was one of the things spoken of in "all these things" therefore summer isnt present, but near even after Christ's return.

 

[Sinthesis]

88 Reasons: What Went Wrong?

by Dean C. Halverson

CRI Journal - CRJ0023A


To many, "Edgar Whisenant" has recently become a household name. Whisenant, a former NASA rocket engineer turned prophecy teacher, became famous through a booklet that included two of his works: 88 Reasons Why the Rapture Could Be in 1988 and On Borrowed Time.[1] In this booklet, Whisenant predicted that Jesus would return to rapture His church sometime during the Jewish holiday of Rosh-Hashanah in 1988, which was from sunset, September 11, to sunset, September 13. Before those dates, The World Bible Society, which published the booklet, printed 3.2 million copies[2] and distributed 200,000 of them to pastors throughout the United States.[3]

When the September prediction failed, Whisenant updated the time to October 3. Now that date, too, has fallen through. Whisenant nevertheless remains undaunted: "The evidence is all over the place that it is going to be in a few weeks anyway."[4]

What has been the response to Whisenant's predictions? Thousands took the booklet seriously, some even quitting their jobs to prepare for the rapture. Attendance increased in some churches.[5] Many Christians shrugged the booklet off as being part of a fanatic fringe. Many others, though, while not accepting the specific predictions, praised the booklet for reminding them of the imminence of the Rapture....


However they responded, it sadly appeared that most Christians were unable to discern why Whisenant's reasoning was biblically unsound....


MISTAKENLY INTERPRETS A SYMBOL

In at least one instance Whisenant incorrectly interprets a biblical symbol, and then proceeds to build his predictions upon the shaky foundation of that faulty interpretation. The instance occurs in Reason #7 where Whisenant quotes Jesus' words in Matthew 24:32-33 as follows, "`Now learn this lesson from the fig tree: as soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. Even so, when you see all these things,...I [Jesus] tell you the truth, this wicked generation (1948-1988) will certainly not pass until all these things have happened" (ellipses and emphasis in original).[25] Whisenant interprets the above verse in the following way: "This last generation spoken of above started on 14 May 1948, the day Israel became a nation. Israel is the time clock of God throughout history. Israel is the blooming fig tree, and the last generation will end 40 wicked gentile years later on 14 May 1988."[26]

Contrary to Whisenant's interpretation, the context of Jesus' words in Matthew 24:32-33 gives no warrant to the idea that Jesus was using the figure of the fig tree as anything more than an illustration of how the Jews were able to tell when summer was near. Just as the blooming of the fig tree indicates that summer is approaching, so the previous signs that Jesus had mentioned (e.g., nations rising against nations, famines, earthquakes, and the preaching of the gospel to the entire world) are indications that the end is near.

The important part of the above post is this:

The context of Jesus' words in Matthew 24:32-33 gives no warrant to the idea that Jesus was using the figure of the fig tree as anything more than an illustration of how the Jews were able to tell when summer was near. Just as the blooming of the fig tree indicates that summer is approaching, so the previous signs that Jesus had mentioned (e.g., nations rising against nations, famines, earthquakes, and the preaching of the gospel to the entire world) are indications that the end is near.

The same idea:

Luk 12:54 ¶ And he said also to the people, When ye see a cloud rise out of the west, straightway ye say, There cometh a shower; and so it is.
Luk 12:55 - And when [ye see] the south wind blow, ye say, There will be heat; and it cometh to pass.
Luk 12:56 - [Ye] hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky and of the earth; but how is it that ye do not discern this time?​

 

[Sinthesis]

Why would Christ's return not be included in what He just spoke of, Its clear He says when all these thing take place summer is near and His return was one of the things spoken of in "all these things" therefore summer isnt present, but near even after Christ's return.

Perhaps you are not looking for a return in the right way?

 

[Lehigh3]

Rev.6:12-14 NKJV,
Sixth Seal: Cosmic Disturbances


12 I looked when He opened the sixth seal, and behold, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became like blood. 13 And the stars of heaven fell to the earth, as a fig tree drops its late figs when it is shaken by a mighty wind. 14 Then the sky receded as a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved out of its place.

This is the only answer about the figurative parable:
YouTube - ‪Full Preterism - Israel's Fig Tree‬‏

 

[warfrog]

Perhaps you are not looking for a return in the right way?

Why would you say that? Jesus just said all these things take place and summer is near, Jesus spoke of His return last with all those events, therefore His return is included.
If your going to try and tell me Christ's return is spiritual, i will blatently tell you that is foolishness, there is more than enough scripture to support a literal return and a literal resurrection at that return, other than spiritually putting that out there i dont know why you would even say that, you might want to be more precise.