Freewill religion is the Man of Sin !

[savedbygrace57]

What the man of sin preachers and followers want us to believe, but they do lie, that man by nature, dead in sin, can perform a righteous act [Rom 3:10] mainly referring to believing, that merits them everlasting life. Yes they will deny that it is their merit, but they do lie, because in their antichrist thinking, God rewards them for something they did. Many of them point to Heb 11:6 for confirmation of this wicked thought process, where scripture says of Faith, that God is a rewarder [wage payer] of them that diligently seek Him [Rom 3:11], and without it, it is impossible to please Him ! Faith here that pleases God is the New Birth ! So in essence, the followers of the man of sin say God does reward them, pays them wages because of their act of in the flesh, that pleased God ! The man of sin religions totally disregards man's condition by nature, that man does not seek God ever, not the True God anyway Rom 3:11. Seek here and in Heb 11:6 is the same. If we really believe and understand Rom 3:11, we would know that the natural man does not have that faith, that diligently seeks after God, as described in Heb 11:6, so the one there must be a born again person who seeks Him in Spirit and in Truth !

The man of sin followers deny that, and teach that the natural man in the flesh, does rightly seek after God in Faith !

 

[savedbygrace57]

Isa 14:27

27 For the Lord of hosts hath purposed, and who shall disannul it? and his hand is stretched out, and who shall turn it back?

Ps 33:10

11 The counsel of the Lord standeth for ever, the thoughts of his heart to all generations.

Even as God thinks [His Thoughts] so shall it come to pass, what He has purposed so shall it stand. Now in 1 Tim 2:4, the word will here means purpose :

It is the greek word thelō:


to will, have in mind, intend

a) to be resolved or determined, to purpose

b) to desire, to wish

c) to love

1) to like to do a thing, be fond of doing

d) to take delight in, have pleasure

1 Tim 2:4

Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

Now the false religionists says that God, the Lord of Hosts, can purpose, be resolved, to intend, even determine for a man to be saved, but that man by his freewill can and does often times disannul it ! They say God's purpose for a man can be defeated and frustrated by mans freewill, this is some of the highest blasphemy that can come from a persons mouth about God, and shows a total lack of the Fear of God !
__________________

 

[Elijah674]

????
It seem's that some would run out of gas with their constant [[WORK]] for salvation? Conditions for Eternal Life are of God's REQUIREMENTS, not satans. And that REQUIREMENT is a WORK which ever one's free choice is??

And the one of posting over & over again like a broken record, is what?? The same old stuff of one just being a brain/dead programed robot!:robot

PS: and no, it is your 'posted stuff' that is blasphemy against the WORD of God.

 

[savedbygrace57]

My counsel SHALL stand !


Isa 46:9-10

Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me,

10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

The God of the Bible states, My Counsel shall stand ! What Counsel ? Eph 1:11

11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:

The Counsel of His Own Will, thats what Counsel !

Yes, even when men reject His Counsel [Lk 7:30], That is still the Counsel of His own Will standing !!

God's Own Counsel will stand regardless of man's idol freewill ! The God of the Bible states " I will do all my pleasure" This word pleasure means desire, purpose !

Now in light of this, how can it be the will or pleasure or desire of God, for all men without exception to be saved and come into the Knowledge of the Truth, and he not do it ? What prevents Him ? Is it the almighty freewill of man ? That is what false religionists would have us to believe ! They teach that God's counsel will not always stand !

 

[Stan53]

This is why I believe this is True !
2 Thess 2:1-4

These verses do NOT talk about freewill. They talk about the rapture.

Isa 14:13-14

Again this is talking about Satan, NOT freewill.

Man's own freewill by far is the most believed and popular religious conviction throughout the whole world. Rev 13:1;5-8

It's NOT a religious conviction, it is a meta-physical FACT, just as Adam & Eve had freewill and we have inherited what they had, then we have the same freewill. The verses in Rev 13 are talking about the Tribulation, NOT freewill.

It's adherents are linked to all the various denominations, and sects, yes, even the non religious adhere to man's freewill.
So John writes Rev 13:16
That is all follow this deadly concept or philosophy of man's freewill !

Freewill is demonstrable with just about any person. Dictators may impede freewill, but people will still rebel. Governments may legislate to force people to act against their freewill, like with seat belts, but some will still not wear them. Children are often disciplined when they exercise their freewill because they do so WITHOUT understanding the concept of consequences, which is why God established the family unit. This does not negate freewill nor make it wrong. When we are born again we learn to subjugate our freewill to Jesus and follow the leading of the Holy Spirit. We were NOT created as ROBOTS. We WERE created as freewill moral agents. God designed us to be able to recognize His authority and submit our freewill to His will, accept His redemption by asking His Son to be our Saviour.
Freewill is EXACTLY what God created us with so we could submit it and surrender it to His will and His guiding.

John 3:16-22
For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son. 19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. 20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that their deeds will be exposed. 21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what they have done has been done in the sight of God.


This is ALL done by our freewill, our choice.

 

[savedbygrace57]

The difference !

The difference between True Religion that Honors Christ and His Atoning , Saving Death, and false religion that does not, but is antichrist of His Saving Death is this, the antichrist say Christ's Death becomes effectual by the sinners receiving of it, whereas True Believers say ones receiving is because Christ Death was effectual ! That Christ's Death produces the redemptive qualities of Faith and Repentance, for they are fruits of His Death ! The antichrist followers deny that Christ's death alone secures the Salvation of the sinner and relegates that act to the act of the sinner's appropriation. Those who hold such antichrist views should never be considered of the Household of Faith, but should be earnestly contended against !

 

[Stan53]

The difference !

The difference between True Religion that Honors Christ and His Atoning , Saving Death, and false religion that does not, but is antichrist of His Saving Death is this, the antichrist say Christ's Death becomes effectual by the sinners receiving of it, whereas True Believers say ones receiving is because Christ Death was effectual ! That Christ's Death produces the redemptive qualities of Faith and Repentance, for they are fruits of His Death ! The antichrist followers deny that Christ's death alone secures the Salvation of the sinner and relegates that act to the act of the sinner's appropriation. Those who hold such antichrist views should never be considered of the Household of Faith, but should be earnestly contended against !

So you and James diagree then. He says; Pure and undefiled religion in the sight of our God and Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their distress, and to keep oneself unstained by the world. James 1:27

Maybe you can supply a verse or two that supports your assertions here?

 

[Elijah674]

The difference !

The difference between True Religion that Honors Christ and His Atoning , Saving Death, and false religion that does not, but is antichrist of His Saving Death is this, the antichrist say Christ's Death becomes effectual by the sinners receiving of it, whereas True Believers say ones receiving is because Christ Death was effectual ! That Christ's Death produces the redemptive qualities of Faith and Repentance, for they are fruits of His Death ! The antichrist followers deny that Christ's death alone secures the Salvation of the sinner and relegates that act to the act of the sinner's appropriation. Those who hold such antichrist views should never be considered of the Household of Faith, but should be earnestly contended against !

SO?? You want to just execute them that do have the mind of Christ? You know, 666 with no free will.

 

[Elijah674]

This is why I believe this is True !

2 Thess 2:1-4

1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

2That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Isa 14:13-14

13For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:


I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

Man's own freewill by far is the most believed and popular religious conviction throughout the whole world. Rev 13:1;5-8

1And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

5And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

6And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.

7And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

It's adherents are linked to all the various denominations, and sects, yes, even the non religious adhere to man's freewill.

So John writes Rev 13:16

And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:

That is all follow this deadly concept or philosophy of man's freewill !

Hi FORUM: This post needs to be kept near the top for all to see what is being taught 'for Truth' by this post's Re: Freewill religion is the man of sin!
And that does not include James 2:10's many other false teachings by doctrine of the same denonination.

--Elijah

 

[rainbows]

"Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son." 1 John 2:22

The definition of an antichrist is one who denies Jesus is the messiah.

An antichrist has nothing to do with freewill nor predestination.

John 3:16 For this is the way God loved the world: He gave his one and only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life.

This is the Gospel, this is how we are saved, by Grace lest any one should boast.

Jesus Christ was predestined from eternity to die for us.

 

[Stan53]

"Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son." 1 John 2:22

The definition of an antichrist is one who denies Jesus is the messiah.

An antichrist has nothing to do with freewill nor predestination.

John 3:16 For this is the way God loved the world: He gave his one and only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life.

This is the Gospel, this is how we are saved, by Grace lest any one should boast.

Jesus Christ was predestined from eternity to die for us.

Good on ya mite!

 

[rainbows]

Thanks Stan53, I dislike theology, I love the scriptures though.

 

[savedbygrace57]

Eph 1:13

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

"after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise" !

Now many of those who handle the word of God deceitfully, have hijacked this this scripture and forced it to say , that after one believes the Gospel, he is then born again of the spirit; however that is not what it says, it says that they were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise after they believed. The sealing here is a work the spirit does after believing, and it has more to do with authenticating, or certifying a thing. I believe it is the Spirit's work begun of witnessing to our spirits that we are the sons of God Rom 8:16

The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

Its that inner testification of the Spirit that Paul refers to here 1 Tim 2:6

Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

He confirms the Testimony of the Gospel in them as per 1 Cor 1:6

Even as the testimony of Christ was confirmed in you:

So upon believing the True Gospel, its confirmed in us by the Sealing Ministry of the Spirit ! This is a spiritual sealing also designating us as an Heir, a Child of Promise Rom 8:16-17

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

For remember, the Ephesians Believed or Trusted After they heard the Gospel of their Salvation, so it was already theirs or as Paul said yours, when they heard it Spiritually and is why they heard it Spiritually. So everyone believing on Christ through the Gospel, has the right to be called a Child of God, and Heir of God, and as a Heir received the seal of the covenant, circumcision, so does the Spiritual Child of the Covenant receive the seal of spiritual circumcision in the heart Rom 2:29

29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

 

[Elijah674]

8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. (James 2:10 finds most!)

And Acts 5:32 defines who these are, or once were! No Obedience NO HOLY SPIRIT, or CHRIST, just more of the Rev. 17:1-5 'has/beens' stuff from the Jer. 17:5 ones. (and some had been IN Christ at one time as is seen in Obad. 1:16 + Heb. 6:6 & 2 Peter 2:19-22 VOMIT's!

And it is not over until Christ's work is FINISHED as the saved ones High Priest. Eccl. 12:13-14 + (Eccl. 3:14) Rev. 22:18-19's tabulation in the Book of Judgement.

And God knowing is not the point of faith!

--Elijah

 

[Stan53]

Eph 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
"after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise" !
Now many of those who handle the word of God deceitfully, have hijacked this this scripture and forced it to say , that after one believes the Gospel, he is then born again of the spirit; however that is not what it says, it says that they were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise after they believed. The sealing here is a work the spirit does after believing, and it has more to do with authenticating, or certifying a thing.

In a modern English version, most people would not have a problem understanding what the word says. Only when forced or mandated to use OLD English versions, do they become confused with the syntax of the outdated grammar.
Eph 1:13; And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit. Paul talks about a process here, sometimes all happening at once, and other times happening in degrees. We are drawn by God's Spirit, we hear the Good News, we believe, we get baptized in water and then we receive the infilling of the Holy Spirit. Sometimes these last two parts are switched as happened in Acts 10.

I believe it is the Spirit's work begun of witnessing to our spirits that we are the sons of God, Rom 8:16
The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

If you read just a little further in Romans 8, you will find verses 28_30, which pretty clearly tells us the process of salvation.

Its that inner testification of the Spirit that Paul refers to here 1 Tim 2:6
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

It actually reads; who gave himself as a ransom for all people. This has now been witnessed to at the proper time.

He confirms the Testimony of the Gospel in them as per 1 Cor 1:6
Even as the testimony of Christ was confirmed in you:

Again in proper English, it actually reads; God thus confirming our testimony about Christ among you.

So upon believing the True Gospel, its confirmed in us by the Sealing Ministry of the Spirit ! This is a spiritual sealing also designating us as an Heir, a Child of Promise Rom 8:16-17
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

This "sealing" thing seems to be a big thing for some. It must be how you arrive at the OSAS belief? Again the modern English reads; The Spirit himself testifies with our spirit that we are God’s children. 17 Now if we are children, then we are heirs —heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory.
It seems the key here is that we should be suffering AS Jesus did. Are we?

For remember, the Ephesians Believed or Trusted After they heard the Gospel of their Salvation, so it was already theirs or as Paul said yours, when they heard it Spiritually and is why they heard it Spiritually. So everyone believing on Christ through the Gospel, has the right to be called a Child of God, and Heir of God, and as a Heir received the seal of the covenant, circumcision, so does the Spiritual Child of the Covenant receive the seal of spiritual circumcision in the heart.
Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Well as I've just pointed out, the Ephesians believed WHEN they heard, NOT after, but regardless, was there a point you wanted to make here about the OP?

 

[Elijah674]

"Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son." 1 John 2:22

The definition of an antichrist is one who denies Jesus is the messiah.

An antichrist has nothing to do with freewill nor predestination.

John 3:16 For this is the way God loved the world: He gave his one and only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life.

This is the Gospel, this is how we are saved, by Grace lest any one should boast.

Jesus Christ was predestined from eternity to die for us.

Hi, perhaps a few earlier verses are needed to understand? you say 'The definition of an antichrist is one who denies Jesus is the messiah.' & this is agreed to by me. Yet, in 2 John we find a little more of John knowledge. (and he of course penned many books)

2 John 1
[9] Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the [doctrine of Christ], hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
[10] If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:
[11] For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.

I find it hard to believe that John did not understand the Eternal Plan of Salvation of Christ/God before He became Christ/man/God or the second Adam. And you are correct in the predestination remark, except for what the Godhead had given in Rom. 4:17 last part of the verse. Yet, antichrist surely is to be included it seems to me in forknowledge along with the Eternal Gospel in full understanding by John in Rev. 14:6.

Perhaps the post did not come across just right to me?

--Elijah

 

[savedbygrace57]

Eph 1:13

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

The word heard here is the greek word akouō:


to be endowed with the faculty of hearing, not deaf

2) to hear

b) to attend to, consider what is or has been said

c) to understand, perceive the sense of what is said

3) to hear something

a) to perceive by the ear what is announced in one's presence

b) to get by hearing learn

c) a thing comes to one's ears, to find out, learn

d) to give ear to a teaching or a teacher

e) to comprehend, to understand

This is important, because we know those who are not born again cannot hear spiritually, by nature we are deaf to spiritual things.

Also by nature we do not comprehend spiritual Truth, nor understand !

Paul writes Rom 3:11

11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

Also he writes in 1 Cor 2:14

But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Now this is important because the word receive here is the greek word dechomai and means:

to receive favourably, give ear to, embrace, make one's own, approve, not to reject

The natural man cannot give ear to spiritual things as to embrace them or not to reject them !

Paul goes to write that neither can they know them ! This word know is the greek word ginōskō and does mean:


to know, understand, perceive, have knowledge of

a) to understand

So the Natural man has no ability to hear the Gospel spiritually as in Eph 1:13.

So, if they did hear, as the verse plainly states they did, then we know that they had to be people who were not of nature and had to be already born again in order to Hear and Understand the Gospel, which is also confirmed by the teaching of Christ here Matt 13:23

But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

The good ground both hears the word and understands it ! Good Ground is a New Heart given in New Birth.

So this exposes the false teachers who teach that Eph 1:13 is teaching New Birth after believing, its impossible, simply because if they had not been already born again, they could not hear [spiritually] or Understand spiritually, the word of Truth. I challenge anyone to prove this conclusion wrong !

 

[Stan53]

Eph 1:13

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

The word heard here is the greek word akouō:


to be endowed with the faculty of hearing, not deaf

2) to hear

b) to attend to, consider what is or has been said

c) to understand, perceive the sense of what is said

3) to hear something

a) to perceive by the ear what is announced in one's presence

b) to get by hearing learn

c) a thing comes to one's ears, to find out, learn

d) to give ear to a teaching or a teacher

e) to comprehend, to understand

This is important, because we know those who are not born again cannot hear spiritually, by nature we are deaf to spiritual things.

Also by nature we do not comprehend spiritual Truth, nor understand !

Paul writes Rom 3:11

11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

Also he writes in 1 Cor 2:14

But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Now this is important because the word receive here is the greek word dechomai and means:

to receive favourably, give ear to, embrace, make one's own, approve, not to reject

The natural man cannot give ear to spiritual things as to embrace them or not to reject them !

Paul goes to write that neither can they know them ! This word know is the greek word ginōskō and does mean:


to know, understand, perceive, have knowledge of

a) to understand

So the Natural man has no ability to hear the Gospel spiritually as in Eph 1:13.

So, if they did hear, as the verse plainly states they did, then we know that they had to be people who were not of nature and had to be already born again in order to Hear and Understand the Gospel, which is also confirmed by the teaching of Christ here Matt 13:23

But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

The good ground both hears the word and understands it ! Good Ground is a New Heart given in New Birth.

So this exposes the false teachers who teach that Eph 1:13 is teaching New Birth after believing, its impossible, simply because if they had not been already born again, they could not hear [spiritually] or Understand spiritually, the word of Truth. I challenge anyone to prove this conclusion wrong !

It would appear that you have no interest in actually discussing anything on this thread. You continually post the same thing and ignore others posts. In light of this I will not comment any further on anything you have to say, and will unsubscribe from this thread.

 

[Elijah674]

Me again with some more of.. CHRIST'S [WORD!]
Belief & Trust + Faith??

John 14
[21] He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.
[22] Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world?

[23] Jesus answered and said unto him, [[If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him]].

[24] He that [[loveth me not keepeth not my sayings]]: and [[the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me]].

 

[savedbygrace57]

Who are the ones who hear ?


Those who do hear spiritually the word of Truth are Christ's Sheep made spiritually alive, for it is promised they shall hear His voice, which the Gospel of Salvation is,m His Voice to them Jn 10:16

16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

They are His Spiritual seed, by birth of His Spirit, which are born Heirs of an Inheritance 1 Pet 1:3-5

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,

5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

And the sealing of the Holy Spirit, seals them Heirs as an Birth Right !

Their believing the word of Truth was because of the Sanctification of the Spirit as Paul states here 2 Thess 2:13

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

So those who spiritually heard the word of Truth in Eph 1:13, did so because of the Spirit's work of 2 Thess 2:13 !