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Give us your absolute bottom-line Christian essentials

Free said:
And yet you have continually avoided addressing the arguments being made, including the Greek of John 1:1. At the core of Christianity is the belief that Jesus is God. Indeed, there is no salvation if he isn't. Jesus claimed to be God and that is precisely why John, Paul, and Peter wrote that Jesus was God.
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Yahshua is (a god / elohiym.) elohiym = "god-s of The Living One."
 
Free said:
And yet you have continually avoided addressing the arguments being made, including the Greek of John 1:1. At the core of Christianity is the belief that Jesus is God. Indeed, there is no salvation if he isn't. Jesus claimed to be God and that is precisely why John, Paul, and Peter wrote that Jesus was God.
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These are all lies because you have been dismissing Jesus' own word.

Jesus never claimed to be God, period.

If you have been reading the Bible, you can never come up with "Jesus is God" dogma.

You know it is not there if you have been reading the Bible yourselves.

You guys are blindly following your corrupt leaders.
 
grace2 said:
These are all lies because you have been dismissing Jesus' own word.

Jesus never claimed to be God, period.

If you have been reading the Bible, you can never come up with "Jesus is God" dogma.

You know it is not there if you have been reading the Bible yourselves.

You guys are blindly following your corrupt leaders.
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I've given you the passages, which you dismiss without even addressing. I've studied this for a very long time and the Bible definitely teaches that Jesus is God. From there it logically follows that the Holy Spirit is as well, yet neither of them are the Father nor are each other. The Trinity is certainly taught in the Bible.

I've also warned you before that if you don't start actually addressing arguments and dealing with passages of scripture that others post, and instead just keep making these disparaging comments, I will regard them as trolling and start banning you from these discussions.

grace2 said:
Father is God, Jesus is God make polytheism.
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No, there is only one God. That is foundational to Trinitarianism. There is one substance, one being, that is God and three persons, where each is truly and fully God.
 
grace2 said:
You believe Jesus is God and Jesus claims otherwise.

Your belief has nothing to do with Jesus' own word.

Still running from simple Truth.
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No one's running. Standing firm on the Truth. Acrually, Jesus did not "claim otherwise." Jesus put himself in the role of Yawheh and assumed divine prerogatives. But let's stay on point. There's no point going further if you refuse to acknowledge basic factual points one John 1.1

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

When one party is unwilling to acknowledge basic points of fact in a discussion, then there's no way to have a meaningful discussion
 
Free said:
I've given you the passages, which you dismiss without even addressing.
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I don't follow your manipulative comments.

You have been void of Jesus' own word.

That makes you guys not Jesus' followers.

Jesus' followers don't dismiss any of Jesus' words.

Jesus is the Lord!
 
grace2 said:
Trin believers are running from the Truth and following man-made faith.
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You have zero credibility as long as you refuse to recognize basic indisputable facts like the correct translation of a text (John 1.1).

Your position is little different from flat earthers who refuse to acknowledge simple facts that are obvious, recognized and established in the rest of the world

It is unfortunate that you reject Christ's deity and true Christianity
 
Free said:
Then you're a polytheist, which is also very much against scripture.


It certainly does. Jesus is God, but God isn't Jesus; God is the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.
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There are many gods, real and imagined. The people in heaven are called gods because they have life immortal. There is only one true God, and that is Yahwah our Holy Father.

The Son is not the Father. Yahshua is not Yahwah.

Here is the correct translation.
Isaiah 9:6
For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: And the government shall be upon his shoulders: And he shall be called Wonderful Counselor of The Mighty God and Everlasting Father; (שַׂר / minister-ing) in peace.
The Son is not the Father.



Only Yahwah is called "Mighty God" and "Father."
  • Isaiah 9:6
    For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor of the Mighty God, and Everlasting Father, (שַׂר / minister-ing) in peace.

  • Isaiah 10:21
    A remnant will return, a remnant of Jacob will return to the Mighty God.

  • Jeremiah 32:18
    You show love to thousands but bring the punishment for the parents’ sins into the laps of their children after them. Great and mighty God, whose name is (the Lord / Yahwah Almighty,)

  • Luke 22:69
    But from now on, the Son of Man will be seated at the right hand of the mighty God.”
 
CherubRam said:
There are many gods, real and imagined. The people in heaven are called gods because they have life immortal. There is only one true God, and that is Yahwah our Holy Father.

The Son is not the Father. Yahshua is not Yahwah.

Here is the correct translation.
Isaiah 9:6
For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: And the government shall be upon his shoulders: And he shall be called Wonderful Counselor of The Mighty God and Everlasting Father; (שַׂר / minister-ing) in peace.
The Son is not the Father.



Only Yahwah is called "Mighty God" and "Father."
  • Isaiah 9:6
    For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor of the Mighty God, and Everlasting Father, (שַׂר / minister-ing) in peace.

  • Isaiah 10:21
    A remnant will return, a remnant of Jacob will return to the Mighty God.

  • Jeremiah 32:18
    You show love to thousands but bring the punishment for the parents’ sins into the laps of their children after them. Great and mighty God, whose name is (the Lord / Yahwah Almighty,)

  • Luke 22:69
    But from now on, the Son of Man will be seated at the right hand of the mighty God.”
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I've asked you for your source regarding Isaiah 9:6

You never supplied it.

Do you have a PhD in Hebrew or biblical text?
Perhaps you could convince your peers to correct biblical verses?
 
wondering said:
I've asked you for your source regarding Isaiah 9:6

You never supplied it.

Do you have a PhD in Hebrew or biblical text?
Perhaps you could convince your peers to correct biblical verses?
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Here, study this:

And this:

שַׂר - Translation into English - examples Hebrew | Reverso Context

Translations in context of "שַׂר" in Hebrew-English from Reverso Context: שר הטבעות, שר החינוך, שר המשפטים, שר החוץ, שר האוצר
context.reverso.net context.reverso.net
 
CherubRam said:
Here, study this:

And this:

שַׂר - Translation into English - examples Hebrew | Reverso Context

Translations in context of "שַׂר" in Hebrew-English from Reverso Context: שר הטבעות, שר החינוך, שר המשפטים, שר החוץ, שר האוצר
context.reverso.net context.reverso.net
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I just looked at SCRPTURE 4 ALL

The translation is the same as the translation I, and the rest on this thread, have been using.

Did YOU read it?
Really, perhaps I missed something.

Here is what it states for Isaiah 9:6


that־-יֶלֶ דildboyיֻלַּ דildhe-is-mborn־-לָ נוּl·nuto·usבֵּ ןbnsonנִ תַּ ןnthnhe-is-given־-לָ נוּl·nuto·usוַתְּ הִ יu·theiand·she-shall-becomeFor unto us a child isborn, unto us a son is given:and the government shall beupon his shoulder: and hisname shall be calledWonderful, Counsellor, Themighty God, Theeverlasting Father, ThePrince of Peace.

6הַ מִּ שְׂ רָ הe·mshrethe·chieftainshipעַ לolon־-שִׁ כְ מshkm·ushoulder-blade-of·himוַיִּ קְ רָ אu·iqraand·he-shall-callשְׁ מshm·uname-of·himפֶּ לֶ אphlaone-marvelousיעֵ ץiuotzone-counselingאֵ לalElגִּ בּרgburmasterfulאֲבִ יעַ דabiodFather-of-futureשַׂ רshrchief-of־-שָׁ לםshlumwell-being::
 
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CherubRam said:
Here, study this:

And this:

שַׂר - Translation into English - examples Hebrew | Reverso Context

Translations in context of "שַׂר" in Hebrew-English from Reverso Context: שר הטבעות, שר החינוך, שר המשפטים, שר החוץ, שר האוצר
context.reverso.net context.reverso.net
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Like I stated to you, (not sure it was you) I know full well how difficult it is to translate a language properly.
Imagine one that was spoken thousands of years ago and in a different culture where words were understood differently.

What does GIVE ME A HAND mean to a man reading it 2 thousand years from now that does not take into consideration our culture, our slang, our expressions?

This is why I trust those that have translated the entire bible.

And, again, I don't know how we could trust a God that states He is in need of a counselor, which is how YOU have it translated.
 
CherubRam said:
There are many gods, real and imagined. The people in heaven are called gods because they have life immortal. There is only one true God, and that is Yahwah our Holy Father.

The Son is not the Father. Yahshua is not Yahwah.

Here is the correct translation.
Isaiah 9:6
For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: And the government shall be upon his shoulders: And he shall be called Wonderful Counselor of The Mighty God and Everlasting Father; (שַׂר / minister-ing) in peace.
The Son is not the Father.



Only Yahwah is called "Mighty God" and "Father."
  • Isaiah 9:6
    For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor of the Mighty God, and Everlasting Father, (שַׂר / minister-ing) in peace.

  • Isaiah 10:21
    A remnant will return, a remnant of Jacob will return to the Mighty God.

  • Jeremiah 32:18
    You show love to thousands but bring the punishment for the parents’ sins into the laps of their children after them. Great and mighty God, whose name is (the Lord / Yahwah Almighty,)

  • Luke 22:69
    But from now on, the Son of Man will be seated at the right hand of the mighty God.”
Click to expand...
Again, no point going over these other verses when you won't acknowledge basic indisputable facts like how to translate a text (John 1.1). You have zero credibility.
 
13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. Ec 12:13–14.
 
wondering said:
Like I stated to you, (not sure it was you) I know full well how difficult it is to translate a language properly.
Imagine one that was spoken thousands of years ago and in a different culture where words were understood differently.

What does GIVE ME A HAND mean to a man reading it 2 thousand years from now that does not take into consideration our culture, our slang, our expressions?

This is why I trust those that have translated the entire bible.

And, again, I don't know how we could trust a God that states He is in need of a counselor, which is how YOU have it translated.
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People pick and choose. Nothing new there.
 
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