How do we know that the Bible is the Word of God?

[francisdesales]

You called me stubborn & likened me to an angry child. That is victimization. At least own up to it even if your unwilling to apologize for it.

You are a victim because I call you stubborn...

Sorry, that is a gross exaggeration of reality.

I didn't say or mean to imply Josephus wasn't biased.

Yes you did. You said that the Bible could not be accepted as legitimate history because of its bias - and you said that Josephus was the only material that could be historically trusted - implying that HE was unbiased.

Put two and two together and you get an unbiased Josephus, the only evidence you will accept for the existence of Jesus on a historical basis...

I am giving you this last opportunity to just bow out, save face, and drop out.

Continued conversation on this matter will NOT aid your case, I guarantee it. Your stance doesn't have a leg to stand on - and I assure you that as a historian, I can dissect your position and continue to make you look exceedingly foolish.

Just drop it, Rick.

Regards

 

[sonlover]

How do you know that the Bible is the Word of God? :-?

I'm not challenging the assertion, just asking for opinions. :wink: I mean, the Bible claiming that it is the Word of God doesn't prove that it is. It's a circular argument. So why do you believe in the Bible as the Word of God? Please don't flame me : I'm just wondering.

Laudate!! Hi there.
:smt038
I believe it's the Word of God.
One reason is because it doesnt return void (experientially)
Another reason is because the Holy Spirit bears witness with my spirit. (Rhema)
Another reason is because it doesnt contradict itself. (Logic)
etc.
I guess the biggest reason for me would be the first.
I've watched God watch over His Word to perform it.
:smt045
But since many scholars study the Bible and come to different
conclusions, my theory is that it's something God must reveal
to us, in His own way, in His own time, according to the condition
of our hearts (soil)

BLESSINGS!
sonlover

 

[sonlover]

Laudate Dominum :shades
Stopped by to see if you'd replied yet.

 

[simonthezealot]

Sonlover and Otto...
woohoo

 

[wavy]

They are dishonest "historians" with a theological predisposition. Atheist historians MUST discount ALL writings that mention Jesus. Unfortunately for them, this shows their incredible lack of consistency. Again, I pointed out that we have NO eyewitness accounts that are extant of Alexander the Great. The writings we have on him supposedly are written BASED on other historians who did know him. Yet, we have two different sets of writings that claim to be eyewitnesses of Jesus...

Must I further explain the different set of standards that such philosophically-challenged men erect? By setting different standards for the existence of Jesus of Nazareth, (vs. Alexander the Great), they have removed any claim to their being unbiased and proper historians. Allowing one's philosophy to interfere with the data is poor history. The data clearly shows a lot about someone named Jesus of Nazareth. Now, whether one believes He was the Son of God and rose from the dead, that is another story that relies more on faith - but not altogether devoid of historical study.

Lol, wait...

Where in the world did you get that from?


Thanks,
Eric

 

[Solo]

Is the Bible truly God's Word?

Question: "Is the Bible truly God's Word?"

Answer: Our answer to this question will not only determine how we view the Bible and its importance to our lives, but also it will ultimately have an eternal impact on us. If the Bible is truly God’s Word, then we should cherish it, study it, obey it, and ultimately trust it. If the Bible is the Word of God then to dismiss it is to dismiss God Himself.

The fact that God gave us the Bible is an evidence and illustration of His love for us. The term "revelation" simply means that God communicated to mankind what He is like and how we can have a right relationship with Him. These are things that we could not have known had not God divinely revealed them to us in the Bible. Although God’s revelation of Himself in the Bible was given progressively over approximately 1500 years, it has always contained everything that man needed to know about God in order to have a right relationship with Him. If the Bible is truly the Word of God, then it is the final authority for all matters of faith, religious practice, and morals.

The question we must ask ourselves is how can we know that the Bible is the Word of God and not just a good book? What is unique about the Bible that sets it apart from all other religious books ever written? Is there any evidence that the Bible is truly God’s Word? These are the type of questions that must be looked at if we are to seriously examine the biblical claim that the Bible is the very Word of God, divinely inspired, and totally sufficient for all matters of faith and practice.

There can be no doubt about the fact that the Bible does claim to be the very Word of God. This is clearly seen in Paul’s commendation to Timothy: “. . . from infancy you have known the holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work†(2 Timothy 3:15-17).

There are both internal and external evidences that the Bible is truly God’s Word. The internal evidences are those things within the Bible that testify of its divine origin. One of the first internal evidences that the Bible is truly God’s Word is seen in its unity. Even though it is really sixty-six individual books, written on three continents, in three different languages, over a period of approximately 1500 years, by more that 40 authors who came from many walks of life, the Bible remains one unified book from beginning to end without contradiction. This unity is unique from all other books and is evidence of the divine origin of the words as God moved men in such a way that they recorded His very words.

Another of the internal evidences that indicate the Bible is truly God’s Word is seen in the prophecies contained within its pages. The Bible contains hundreds of detailed prophecies relating to the future of individual nations including Israel, to the future of certain cities, to the future of mankind, and to the coming of One who would be the Messiah, the Savior of not only Israel, but all who would believe in Him. Unlike the prophecies found in other religious books or those done by Nostradamus, the biblical prophecies are extremely detailed and have never failed to come true. There are over three hundred prophecies concerning Jesus Christ in the Old Testament alone. Not only was it foretold where He would be born and what family He would come from, but also how He would die and that He would rise again on the third day. There simply is no logical way to explain the fulfilled prophecies in the Bible other than by divine origin. There is no other religious book with the extent or type of predictive prophecy that the Bible has.

A third internal evidence of the divine origin of the Bible is seen in its unique authority and power. While this evidence is more subjective than the first two, it is no less a very powerful testimony of the divine origin of the Bible. The Bible has a unique authority that is unlike any other book ever written. This authority and power are best seen in the way countless lives have been transformed by the supernatural power of God’s Word. Drug addicts have been cured by it, homosexuals have been set free by it, derelicts and deadbeats have been transformed by it, hardened criminals reformed by it, sinners are rebuked by it, and hate has been turned to love by reading it. The Bible does possess a dynamic and transforming power that is only possible because it is truly God’s Word.

There are also external evidences that indicate the Bible is truly the Word of God. One of those evidences is the historicity of the Bible. Because the Bible details historical events, its truthfulness and accuracy are subject to verification like any other historical documentation. Through both archaeological evidences and other writings, the historical accounts of the Bible have been proven time and time again to be accurate and true. In fact, all the archaeological and manuscript evidence supporting the Bible makes it the best documented book from the ancient world. The fact that the Bible accurately and truthfully records historically verifiable events is a great indication of its truthfulness when dealing with religious subjects and doctrines and helps substantiate its claim that it is the very Word of God.

Another external evidence that the Bible is truly God’s Word is the integrity of the human authors. As mentioned earlier, God used men from many walks of life to record His words to us. In studying the lives of these men, there is no good reason to believe that they were not honest and sincere men. Examining their lives and the fact that they were willing to die often excruciating deaths for what they believed in, it becomes clear that these ordinary yet honest men truly believed that God had spoken to them. The men who wrote the New Testament and many hundreds of other believers (1 Corinthians 15:6) knew the truth of their message because they had seen and spent time with Jesus Christ after He had risen from the dead. The transformation of seeing the risen Christ had a tremendous impact on them. They went from hiding in fear to being willing to die for the message God had revealed to them. Their lives and deaths testify to the fact that the Bible truly is God’s Word.

A final external evidence that the Bible is truly God’s Word is the indestructibility of the Bible. Because of its importance and its claim to be the very word of God, the Bible has suffered more vicious attacks and attempts to destroy it than any other book in history. From early Roman Emperors like Diocletian, through communist dictators and on to modern day atheists and agnostics, the Bible has withstood and outlasted all of its attackers and is still the most widely published book in the world today.

Throughout time, skeptics have regarded the Bible as mythological, but archeology has established it as historical. Opponents have attacked its teaching as primitive and outdated, but its moral and legal concepts and teachings have had a positive influence on societies and cultures throughout the world. It continues to be attacked by science, psychology, and political movements, and yet it remains just as true and relevant today as it was when it was first written. It is a book that has transformed countless lives and cultures throughout the last 2000 years. No matter how its opponents try to attack, destroy, or discredit it, the Bible remains just as strong, just as true, and just as relevant after the attacks as it was before. The accuracy which has been preserved despite every attempt to corrupt, attack, or destroy it, is clear testimony to the fact that the Bible is truly God’s Word and is supernaturally protected by Him. It should not surprise us that no matter how the Bible is attacked, it always comes out unchanged and unscathed. After all, Jesus said, “Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away†(Mark 13:31). After looking at the evidence one can say without a doubt that yes, the Bible is truly God’s Word.

Recommended Resource: Taking a Stand for the Bible: Today's Leading Experts Answer Critical Questions About God's Word by Ankerberg & Burroughs.

Retrieved from http://www.gotquestions.org/Bible-God-Word.html

 

[MarkT]

Christ Jesus is the Word of God. The Bible is the book Isaiah predicted.

Isa 29:18 -
In that day the deaf shall hear the words of a book, and out of their gloom and darkness the eyes of the blind shall see.

 

[wavy]

There can be no doubt about the fact that the Bible does claim to be the very Word of God. This is clearly seen in Paul’s commendation to Timothy: “. . . from infancy you have known the holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work†(2 Timothy 3:15-17).

First mistake: This is 2Timothy, not the bible, and there was no bible when it was written. The bible is singularly an artificial 'book'. It is really a compilation of several works, put together by men other than the original authors.

There are both internal and external evidences that the Bible is truly God’s Word. The internal evidences are those things within the Bible that testify of its divine origin. One of the first internal evidences that the Bible is truly God’s Word is seen in its unity. Even though it is really sixty-six individual books, written on three continents, in three different languages, over a period of approximately 1500 years, by more that 40 authors who came from many walks of life, the Bible remains one unified book from beginning to end without contradiction. This unity is unique from all other books and is evidence of the divine origin of the words as God moved men in such a way that they recorded His very words.

This 'unity' is totally imposed. 66 books (or however many you like) that were not all written independently on 3 continents (which is an irrelevant fact) in 3 languages (which is also an irrelevant fact) over approx. '1500' years (which is also an irrelevant fact given their interdependence and common religion) by more than '40' authors (ibid.)--and without contradiction? Don't think so. Then there's the fact that the books in the bible were selected to be there. These might give the verisimilitude of 'unity' or 'consistency' but it's only all superficial.

So this is ridiculous. It amazes me what some Christians will say is 'evidence' for the bible's truth.

Another of the internal evidences that indicate the Bible is truly God’s Word is seen in the prophecies contained within its pages. The Bible contains hundreds of detailed prophecies relating to the future of individual nations including Israel, to the future of certain cities, to the future of mankind, and to the coming of One who would be the Messiah, the Savior of not only Israel, but all who would believe in Him. Unlike the prophecies found in other religious books or those done by Nostradamus, the biblical prophecies are extremely detailed and have never failed to come true. There are over three hundred prophecies concerning Jesus Christ in the Old Testament alone. Not only was it foretold where He would be born and what family He would come from, but also how He would die and that He would rise again on the third day. There simply is no logical way to explain the fulfilled prophecies in the Bible other than by divine origin. There is no other religious book with the extent or type of predictive prophecy that the Bible has.

A book full of vague predictions, self-fulfilled predictions, and failed predictions, so yeah.

A third internal evidence of the divine origin of the Bible is seen in its unique authority and power. While this evidence is more subjective than the first two, it is no less a very powerful testimony of the divine origin of the Bible. The Bible has a unique authority that is unlike any other book ever written. This authority and power are best seen in the way countless lives have been transformed by the supernatural power of God’s Word. Drug addicts have been cured by it, homosexuals have been set free by it, derelicts and deadbeats have been transformed by it, hardened criminals reformed by it, sinners are rebuked by it, and hate has been turned to love by reading it. The Bible does possess a dynamic and transforming power that is only possible because it is truly God’s Word.

Because Christianity, as a religion, is the only religion that changes lives (for better or often worse)...right.

There are also external evidences that indicate the Bible is truly the Word of God. One of those evidences is the historicity of the Bible. Because the Bible details historical events, its truthfulness and accuracy are subject to verification like any other historical documentation. Through both archaeological evidences and other writings, the historical accounts of the Bible have been proven time and time again to be accurate and true. In fact, all the archaeological and manuscript evidence supporting the Bible makes it the best documented book from the ancient world. The fact that the Bible accurately and truthfully records historically verifiable events is a great indication of its truthfulness when dealing with religious subjects and doctrines and helps substantiate its claim that it is the very Word of God.

Just as studying and validating the contents of Greek history in turn validates their pagan religions or philosophies. Also, to speak of the 'historicity' of the 'bible' is a category error, since the bible is not, in fact, a unit by any literary standard. Suffice to say, some parts of the bible agree with external evidences and others do not.

Another external evidence that the Bible is truly God’s Word is the integrity of the human authors. As mentioned earlier, God used men from many walks of life to record His words to us. In studying the lives of these men, there is no good reason to believe that they were not honest and sincere men. Examining their lives and the fact that they were willing to die often excruciating deaths for what they believed in, it becomes clear that these ordinary yet honest men truly believed that God had spoken to them. The men who wrote the New Testament and many hundreds of other believers (1 Corinthians 15:6) knew the truth of their message because they had seen and spent time with Jesus Christ after He had risen from the dead. The transformation of seeing the risen Christ had a tremendous impact on them. They went from hiding in fear to being willing to die for the message God had revealed to them. Their lives and deaths testify to the fact that the Bible truly is God’s Word.

We don't even know who most of the authors of the books in the bible were, much less have the tools to 'study' them as people...from millenia ago.

A final external evidence that the Bible is truly God’s Word is the indestructibility of the Bible. Because of its importance and its claim to be the very word of God, the Bible has suffered more vicious attacks and attempts to destroy it than any other book in history. From early Roman Emperors like Diocletian, through communist dictators and on to modern day atheists and agnostics, the Bible has withstood and outlasted all of its attackers and is still the most widely published book in the world today.

And yet Christians can't agree on what constitutes 'the bible', and biblical scholarship, furthermore, has made this even more complicated through literary and textual criticism.

Throughout time, skeptics have regarded the Bible as mythological, but archeology has established it as historical. Opponents have attacked its teaching as primitive and outdated, but its moral and legal concepts and teachings have had a positive influence on societies and cultures throughout the world. It continues to be attacked by science, psychology, and political movements, and yet it remains just as true and relevant today as it was when it was first written. It is a book that has transformed countless lives and cultures throughout the last 2000 years. No matter how its opponents try to attack, destroy, or discredit it, the Bible remains just as strong, just as true, and just as relevant after the attacks as it was before. The accuracy which has been preserved despite every attempt to corrupt, attack, or destroy it, is clear testimony to the fact that the Bible is truly God’s Word and is supernaturally protected by Him. It should not surprise us that no matter how the Bible is attacked, it always comes out unchanged and unscathed. After all, Jesus said, “Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away†(Mark 13:31). After looking at the evidence one can say without a doubt that yes, the Bible is truly God’s Word.

The bible has also fostered ignorance, justified violence and hatred, and despite whatever this paragraph may say, is, in fact, a product of a primitive culture that often contradicts what we know today and is counter-productive to progress in the modern world since there are those who want to force such a primitive book to be relevant to modern concerns.

Can we see some real evidence that the bible is the word of God?

Thanks,
Eric

 

[MarkT]

First mistake: This is 2Timothy, not the bible, and there was no bible when it was written. The bible is singularly an artificial 'book'. It is really a compilation of several works, put together by men other than the original authors.

Didn't Jesus read from the scriptures? I think you're confusing Paul's letter with scripture. But then again, you're not alone. Even Christians do it. What kind of reasoning is it when you call the Bilble artificial? - it is really a compilation. So what? So is an Encyclopedia a compilation. Those who can read it are informed, not ignorant. There is no reason not to read it - unless you're against books for some reason.

The bible has also fostered ignorance, justified violence and hatred, and despite whatever this paragraph may say, is, in fact, a product of a primitive culture that often contradicts what we know today and is counter-productive to progress in the modern world since there are those who want to force such a primitive book to be relevant to modern concerns.

It has certainly created divisions between good and evil. But it does not contradict anything I know to be true. The modern world is progressing towards evil - a base minded existence; nothing but sex, greed and violence - not because men have not heard the words of God, but because they have grown tired of hearing, and have forsaken his words. Lovers of self, they worship the creature instead of the Creator. God promised death. And this generation of people love death and violence more than they love God. (there is so much death and violence in this culture, especially on TV). Yes, you are headed for destruction. I must warn you.

 

[Solo]

There can be no doubt about the fact that the Bible does claim to be the very Word of God. This is clearly seen in Paul’s commendation to Timothy: “. . . from infancy you have known the holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work†(2 Timothy 3:15-17).

First mistake: This is 2Timothy, not the bible, and there was no bible when it was written. The bible is singularly an artificial 'book'. It is really a compilation of several works, put together by men other than the original authors.

There are both internal and external evidences that the Bible is truly God’s Word. The internal evidences are those things within the Bible that testify of its divine origin. One of the first internal evidences that the Bible is truly God’s Word is seen in its unity. Even though it is really sixty-six individual books, written on three continents, in three different languages, over a period of approximately 1500 years, by more that 40 authors who came from many walks of life, the Bible remains one unified book from beginning to end without contradiction. This unity is unique from all other books and is evidence of the divine origin of the words as God moved men in such a way that they recorded His very words.

This 'unity' is totally imposed. 66 books (or however many you like) that were not all written independently on 3 continents (which is an irrelevant fact) in 3 languages (which is also an irrelevant fact) over approx. '1500' years (which is also an irrelevant fact given their interdependence and common religion) by more than '40' authors (ibid.)--and without contradiction? Don't think so. Then there's the fact that the books in the bible were selected to be there. These might give the verisimilitude of 'unity' or 'consistency' but it's only all superficial.

So this is ridiculous. It amazes me what some Christians will say is 'evidence' for the bible's truth.

[quote:1g1a4juk]Another of the internal evidences that indicate the Bible is truly God’s Word is seen in the prophecies contained within its pages. The Bible contains hundreds of detailed prophecies relating to the future of individual nations including Israel, to the future of certain cities, to the future of mankind, and to the coming of One who would be the Messiah, the Savior of not only Israel, but all who would believe in Him. Unlike the prophecies found in other religious books or those done by Nostradamus, the biblical prophecies are extremely detailed and have never failed to come true. There are over three hundred prophecies concerning Jesus Christ in the Old Testament alone. Not only was it foretold where He would be born and what family He would come from, but also how He would die and that He would rise again on the third day. There simply is no logical way to explain the fulfilled prophecies in the Bible other than by divine origin. There is no other religious book with the extent or type of predictive prophecy that the Bible has.

A book full of vague predictions, self-fulfilled predictions, and failed predictions, so yeah.

A third internal evidence of the divine origin of the Bible is seen in its unique authority and power. While this evidence is more subjective than the first two, it is no less a very powerful testimony of the divine origin of the Bible. The Bible has a unique authority that is unlike any other book ever written. This authority and power are best seen in the way countless lives have been transformed by the supernatural power of God’s Word. Drug addicts have been cured by it, homosexuals have been set free by it, derelicts and deadbeats have been transformed by it, hardened criminals reformed by it, sinners are rebuked by it, and hate has been turned to love by reading it. The Bible does possess a dynamic and transforming power that is only possible because it is truly God’s Word.

Because Christianity, as a religion, is the only religion that changes lives (for better or often worse)...right.

There are also external evidences that indicate the Bible is truly the Word of God. One of those evidences is the historicity of the Bible. Because the Bible details historical events, its truthfulness and accuracy are subject to verification like any other historical documentation. Through both archaeological evidences and other writings, the historical accounts of the Bible have been proven time and time again to be accurate and true. In fact, all the archaeological and manuscript evidence supporting the Bible makes it the best documented book from the ancient world. The fact that the Bible accurately and truthfully records historically verifiable events is a great indication of its truthfulness when dealing with religious subjects and doctrines and helps substantiate its claim that it is the very Word of God.

Just as studying and validating the contents of Greek history in turn validates their pagan religions or philosophies. Also, to speak of the 'historicity' of the 'bible' is a category error, since the bible is not, in fact, a unit by any literary standard. Suffice to say, some parts of the bible agree with external evidences and others do not.

Another external evidence that the Bible is truly God’s Word is the integrity of the human authors. As mentioned earlier, God used men from many walks of life to record His words to us. In studying the lives of these men, there is no good reason to believe that they were not honest and sincere men. Examining their lives and the fact that they were willing to die often excruciating deaths for what they believed in, it becomes clear that these ordinary yet honest men truly believed that God had spoken to them. The men who wrote the New Testament and many hundreds of other believers (1 Corinthians 15:6) knew the truth of their message because they had seen and spent time with Jesus Christ after He had risen from the dead. The transformation of seeing the risen Christ had a tremendous impact on them. They went from hiding in fear to being willing to die for the message God had revealed to them. Their lives and deaths testify to the fact that the Bible truly is God’s Word.

We don't even know who most of the authors of the books in the bible were, much less have the tools to 'study' them as people...from millenia ago.

A final external evidence that the Bible is truly God’s Word is the indestructibility of the Bible. Because of its importance and its claim to be the very word of God, the Bible has suffered more vicious attacks and attempts to destroy it than any other book in history. From early Roman Emperors like Diocletian, through communist dictators and on to modern day atheists and agnostics, the Bible has withstood and outlasted all of its attackers and is still the most widely published book in the world today.

And yet Christians can't agree on what constitutes 'the bible', and biblical scholarship, furthermore, has made this even more complicated through literary and textual criticism.

Throughout time, skeptics have regarded the Bible as mythological, but archeology has established it as historical. Opponents have attacked its teaching as primitive and outdated, but its moral and legal concepts and teachings have had a positive influence on societies and cultures throughout the world. It continues to be attacked by science, psychology, and political movements, and yet it remains just as true and relevant today as it was when it was first written. It is a book that has transformed countless lives and cultures throughout the last 2000 years. No matter how its opponents try to attack, destroy, or discredit it, the Bible remains just as strong, just as true, and just as relevant after the attacks as it was before. The accuracy which has been preserved despite every attempt to corrupt, attack, or destroy it, is clear testimony to the fact that the Bible is truly God’s Word and is supernaturally protected by Him. It should not surprise us that no matter how the Bible is attacked, it always comes out unchanged and unscathed. After all, Jesus said, “Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away†(Mark 13:31). After looking at the evidence one can say without a doubt that yes, the Bible is truly God’s Word.

The bible has also fostered ignorance, justified violence and hatred, and despite whatever this paragraph may say, is, in fact, a product of a primitive culture that often contradicts what we know today and is counter-productive to progress in the modern world since there are those who want to force such a primitive book to be relevant to modern concerns.

Can we see some real evidence that the bible is the word of God?

Thanks,
Eric[/quote:1g1a4juk]
Eric,

You continually prove that the Scriptures are the Word of God. Let me give you a couple of examples:

• 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
  1 Corinthians 2:14
  
  The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
  Psalm 14:1
  
  The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Corrupt are they, and have done abominable iniquity: there is none that doeth good.
  Psalm 53:1
  
  The wise in heart will receive commandments: but a prating fool shall fall.
  Proverbs 10:8
  
  He that troubleth his own house shall inherit the wind: and the fool shall be servant to the wise of heart.
  Proverbs 11:29
  
  Wherefore is there a price in the hand of a fool to get wisdom, seeing he hath no heart to it?
  Proverbs 17:16
  
  A fool hath no delight in understanding, but that his heart may discover itself.
  Proverbs 18:2
  
  He that trusteth in his own heart is a fool: but whoso walketh wisely, he shall be delivered.
  Proverbs 28:26

 

[Cornelius]

I am posting this against my better judgment, because many , many Christians do not even believe that the New Testament is the Word of God. They have fallen from the truth.

We see here, that Paul was even thankful in his days, that when he preached to the Thessalonians , they at least were granted the grace to understand that Paul was not bringing the "word of men" but indeed the "Word of God". He is not talking about the Old Testament here, he mentions the word that ......"worketh in you that believe"

1Th 2:13 And for this cause we also thank God without ceasing, that, when ye received from us the word of the message, even the word of God, ye accepted it not as the word of men, but, as it is in truth, the word of God, which also worketh in you that believe.

We call it the "Bible". It was not called that in the days of Paul. All the letters were called "the Word of God" as we can see in the above text.This "book" needed completion , it started with an Old Covenant and then God had to finish writing it when the New Covenant came into being.

God wrote it in the very same manner, as He wrote the first half :Through men (plural) Yes, God breathed His very Word into these vessels as they wrote down HIS Words. Christ unfolded in the pages as they wrote. As John wrote.......Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. John was part of this final writing of the Word. This finishing of the Scriptures.

They are not just inspired, "inspired" is such a weak translation of such an awesome truth. God breathed the Scriptures.


θεÃŒÀνεÅÃĀοÂ
theopneustos
theh-op'-nyoo-stos
From G2316 and a presumed derivative of G4154; divinely breathed

2Ti 3:16 Every scripture inspired of God is also profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for instruction which is in righteousness.

 

[Cornelius]

People with no eyes to see , will laugh and say: "So is the Bible Jesus?"

They have no understanding. The Bible tells us that the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.THIS book of prophecy, we call the Bible, has a spirit. That spirit is in the words.

Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that giveth life; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I have spoken unto you are spirit, are are life. This life (zoe) that is IN the words are found in the spirit of the word. This spirit carries the true meaning and is backed up by the Old. The Old carries the letter and the New is the spiritual fulfillment.Rev 19:10 ......... the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

Notice, the testimony of Jesus, is not prophecy (in the letter) but it is the "spirit" of that letter.There indeed you will find Jesus Christ. When you allow the spirit of the truth of the letter, which is written in the book we call the Bible, to enter your heart, you allow Christ to enter your heart.

It is only then that you can be transformed into the image of Christ.

The rest is just pure religion and has nothing to do with the spiritual reality we call: The Word of God: Jesus Christ.

C

 

[oneisgod]

[quote="Laudate Dominum":367g668w]How do you know that the Bible is the Word of God? :-? ....

[/quote:367g668w]

Because when we put the teachings of Jesus Christ into practice they work in solving all problems as Jesus said they would and bring true peace and purpose to life.

 

[AnnieHere]

How Do I Know the Bible is True?

http://www.familyradio.com/graphical/li ... tml#in_mes

 

[Paidion]

Cornelius quoted:

1Th 2:13 And for this cause we also thank God without ceasing, that, when ye received from us the word of the message, even the word of God, ye accepted it not as the word of men, but, as it is in truth, the word of God, which also worketh in you that believe.

So you think Paul meant the Bible or the New Testament when he spoke here of "the word of God"?
The New Testament didn't exist at that time.

Paul was speaking of the gospel which he and the other apostles proclaimed. The phrase "the word of God" occurs frequently in the book of Acts. Every occurrence there refers to the gospel.

1 Peter 1:25 but the word of the Lord abides for ever." That word is the good news which was preached to you. RSV

 

[wavy]

Didn't Jesus read from the scriptures? I think you're confusing Paul's letter with scripture.

Uh, no, I think you just missed the point.

But then again, you're not alone. Even Christians do it. What kind of reasoning is it when you call the Bilble artificial? - it is really a compilation. So what? So is an Encyclopedia a compilation. Those who can read it are informed, not ignorant. There is no reason not to read it - unless you're against books for some reason.

Who said anything about not reading books?

Anyway, of course an encyclopedia is a compilation of scholarly articles. But an encyclopedia is supposed to be a compilation of scholarly articles. That's exactly their purpose: to convey reliable information on a wide range of subject matter. The bible is not such a compilation. The books of the bible were written separately in every sense of the word, selected (to the exclusion of other books from the same cultural-religious milieu), and put together by men other than the original authors that were addressing individual concerns, not contributing to a future volume called 'the bible'.

That is the difference, and that is why the bible is truly an artificial unit.

It has certainly created divisions between good and evil. But it does not contradict anything I know to be true. The modern world is progressing towards evil - a base minded existence; nothing but sex, greed and violence - not because men have not heard the words of God, but because they have grown tired of hearing, and have forsaken his words. Lovers of self, they worship the creature instead of the Creator. God promised death. And this generation of people love death and violence more than they love God. (there is so much death and violence in this culture, especially on TV). Yes, you are headed for destruction. I must warn you.

Every generation of Christianity since Jesus himself has said this very same thing. This is nothing new.


Thanks,
Eric

 

[wavy]

Eric,

You continually prove that the Scriptures are the Word of God. Let me give you a couple of examples:

• 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
  1 Corinthians 2:14
  
  The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
  Psalm 14:1
  
  The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Corrupt are they, and have done abominable iniquity: there is none that doeth good.
  Psalm 53:1
  
  The wise in heart will receive commandments: but a prating fool shall fall.
  Proverbs 10:8
  
  He that troubleth his own house shall inherit the wind: and the fool shall be servant to the wise of heart.
  Proverbs 11:29
  
  Wherefore is there a price in the hand of a fool to get wisdom, seeing he hath no heart to it?
  Proverbs 17:16
  
  A fool hath no delight in understanding, but that his heart may discover itself.
  Proverbs 18:2
  
  He that trusteth in his own heart is a fool: but whoso walketh wisely, he shall be delivered.
  Proverbs 28:26

All this 'proves' is how religion operates and disseminates its message: by threats (e.g., believe or go to hell), ad hominems (e.g., fools don't believe in my religion), and special pleading (only when you believe what I believe can you understand).

If I said that you were stupid or naive for not being an atheist, or for being religious, does that validate my worldview? You think about it.


Thanks,
Eric

 

[Solo]

Eric,

You continually prove that the Scriptures are the Word of God. Let me give you a couple of examples:

• 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
  1 Corinthians 2:14
  
  The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
  Psalm 14:1
  
  The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Corrupt are they, and have done abominable iniquity: there is none that doeth good.
  Psalm 53:1
  
  The wise in heart will receive commandments: but a prating fool shall fall.
  Proverbs 10:8
  
  He that troubleth his own house shall inherit the wind: and the fool shall be servant to the wise of heart.
  Proverbs 11:29
  
  Wherefore is there a price in the hand of a fool to get wisdom, seeing he hath no heart to it?
  Proverbs 17:16
  
  A fool hath no delight in understanding, but that his heart may discover itself.
  Proverbs 18:2
  
  He that trusteth in his own heart is a fool: but whoso walketh wisely, he shall be delivered.
  Proverbs 28:26

All this 'proves' is how religion operates and disseminates its message: by threats (e.g., believe or go to hell), ad hominems (e.g., fools don't believe in my religion), and special pleading (only when you believe what I believe can you understand).

If I said that you were stupid or naive for not being an atheist, or for being religious, does that validate my worldview? You think about it.


Thanks,
Eric

No, it shows your pride and contempt for the truth, and how the natural man cannot understand the spiritual things of God for they are foolishness to him.

• 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
  1 Corinthians 2:14

All you have is opinion with no substance or evidence of backing much like the blind man cannot describe or define what the color blue looks like; or like the deaf man trying to defend his position on what Beethoven's Symphony No. 5 should sound like.

When you can humble yourself from atop your self-built mountain of pride, then you have a chance to learn the truth. Until then you are just treading time, and will be in the same condition that I was in. I do know that if you want to fight a war of words, you will have to come with much more ammunition than you have at your disposal. I know because I was once in the boat that you are adrift in.

May God give you His wisdom and understanding; and may you be bright enough to not allow your heart to harden beyond reach.

Michael

PS I am a lot nicer than God is going to be to you if you continue in your rejection of Him. You don't have to choose to fear him now since all is fine, but know that one day you will remember my words with pain and sorrow as you find out that these words are truth.

 

[MarkT]

Anyway, of course an encyclopedia is a compilation of scholarly articles. But an encyclopedia is supposed to be a compilation of scholarly articles.

And the Bible is supposed to be what in your mind?

That's exactly their purpose: to convey reliable information on a wide range of subject matter. The bible is not such a compilation. The books of the bible were written separately in every sense of the word, selected (to the exclusion of other books from the same cultural-religious milieu), and put together by men other than the original authors that were addressing individual concerns, not contributing to a future volume called 'the bible'.

Well the scriptures are the law and the prophets. Rightly they should be included. Obviously they are more ancient than the gospels, and the letters of the apostles. And what does 'written separately' mean? Paul's letters were written separately? I don't know what you mean. Paul wrote a number of letters to the churches he founded. It makes no sense to say his letters were written separately and therefore they are artificial. Of course he wrote them separately. They were written to the leaders of the churches to share with the members. Anyways, the writings that were being used by the early churches were collected, and the ones that we have are the ones that were included. Mysteriously, they are the 'book' Isaiah predicted. What does, 'put together by men other than the original authors' mean? Of course. There were twelve apostles. Paul's people had Paul's letters. Peter's people had Peter's letters. After centuries of quarrelling, the 'book' was put together.

 

[wavy]

No, it shows your pride and contempt for the truth, and how the natural man cannot understand the spiritual things of God for they are foolishness to him.

• 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
  1 Corinthians 2:14

All you have is opinion with no substance or evidence of backing much like the blind man cannot describe or define what the color blue looks like; or like the deaf man trying to defend his position on what Beethoven's Symphony No. 5 should sound like.

When you can humble yourself from atop your self-built mountain of pride, then you have a chance to learn the truth. Until then you are just treading time, and will be in the same condition that I was in. I do know that if you want to fight a war of words, you will have to come with much more ammunition than you have at your disposal. I know because I was once in the boat that you are adrift in.

May God give you His wisdom and understanding; and may you be bright enough to not allow your heart to harden beyond reach.

Michael

PS I am a lot nicer than God is going to be to you if you continue in your rejection of Him. You don't have to choose to fear him now since all is fine, but know that one day you will remember my words with pain and sorrow as you find out that these words are truth.

Just as I said: threats, ad hominem, and special pleading.


Thanks,
Eric