Carry_Your_Name
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Historical facts, not interpretation. Also, bible is used to interpret history - and current events, not the other way around, that's called wisdom of discernment.
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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Historical facts, not interpretation. Also, bible is used to interpret history - and current events, not the other way around, that's called wisdom of discernment.
I never said anything of what I post is of private interpretation as there is no such thing. God's word is for all with only the Holy Spirit teachings us all truths.
I'm not here to argue, but to give my understanding like everyone else. If you do not agree, then so be it as there is no room for the "I am right, you are wrong" types of discussions as we are all still learning.You disagree because you neglected Lk. 21:20-24, you didn't combine that with Matthew's account, thereby you didn't see the whole picture. Does it really make any sense that Jesus would skip the catastrophic destruction of Jerusalem in 70AD that directly ruined the city into an "abomination of desolation" - when some of his disciples were still alive - and jump right into those other 23 sieges? Maybe it is so to me, but not to me and those "many".
I'm not here to argue either. God commanded us to scrutinize teachings and check if they match the fact. If a teaching is truly from the Holy Spirit, especially prophecy, then it must match the fact. Valid historic documents determine who's right and who's wrong.I'm not here to argue, but to give my understanding like everyone else. If you do not agree, then so be it as there is no room for the "I am right, you are wrong" types of discussions as we are all still learning.
What about all the other destruction's that were abominations in Jerusalem throughout history way before that of 70AD.You disagree because you neglected Lk. 21:20-24, you didn't combine that with Matthew's account, thereby you didn't see the whole picture. Does it really make any sense that Jesus would skip the catastrophic destruction of Jerusalem in 70AD that directly ruined the city into an "abomination of desolation" - when some of his disciples were still alive - and jump right into those other 23 sieges? Maybe it is so to me, but not to me and those "many".
There were no such destruction between Jesus's ministry and 70AD. Jerusalem may have been destroyed twice, but as I said, the temple was only destroyed ONCE, and that's what the discipled asked and what Jesus referred to.What about all the other destruction's that were abominations in Jerusalem throughout history way before that of 70AD.
During its long history, Jerusalem has been destroyed at least twice, besieged 23 times, attacked 52 times, and captured and recaptured 44 times.
Matthew 24:1 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to show him the buildings of the temple. 2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. 3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?There were no such destruction between Jesus's ministry and 70AD. Jerusalem may have been destroyed twice, but as I said, the temple was only destroyed ONCE, and that's what the discipled asked and what Jesus referred to.
You're just muddying the water without responding to the specificity and exclusivity of the reference in Jesus's answer. "These things" are none other than the "buildings of the temple" which the disciples marveled at, "not one stone shall be left upon another" is ONLY referring to destruction of those "buildings of the temple" - THE second temple, and that temple was only destroyed ONCE in 70AD.Matthew 24:1 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to show him the buildings of the temple. 2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. 3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?
Israel (those who follow after Judaism seeking other gods) lost there right to be called Gods chosen people, but God did save a generational remnant out of the 12 tribes who have always been faithful to God in their obedience to His commandments, 1Kings 9:1-9; Rev 7. God’s judgment against them led them to be captured, 605 – 537 B.C., by Nebuchadnezzar and taken into Babylon for seventy years while Nebuchadnezzar’s army killed many Jews in Judah and Jerusalem destroying the whole city of Jerusalem including the first Temple that was built through King Solomon’s reign in Jerusalem.
The second Temple was built under Ezra’s leadership and Israel continued practicing Judaism and their Temple was desecrated as part of an effort to impose Greek-oriented culture and customs on the entire population. Roman rule refurbished the temple as Herod, Romans vassal king, rules the land of Israel. In 70 A.D. the Temple is once again destroyed. The Temple Mount was taken over in 691 A.D. as the Arab nation built the Dome of the Rock and there has not been any other Temple built since that time on the original Temple Mount.
Rev 13 the beast (revived Babylonian Empire) rises up out of the sea as the sea here is symbolic of people and nations as in a sea of humanity, Daniel Chapter 7:1-8; Revelation 17:15. This beast out of the sea gives power to the beast out of the earth who is the son of perdition/false prophet, 2Thessalonians 2:3-12 who will declare a peace treaty, 1Thessalonians 5:1-5, with the Arab nations and will be given the refurbished (being refurbished now) Dome of the Rock (Temple Mount) where he will sit on his throne to rule over the nations. This is the abomination that causes desolation that Daniel spoke of in Daniel Chapter 7 and that Jesus spoke of in Matthew 24:15,16.
During its long history, Jerusalem has been destroyed at least twice, besieged 23 times, attacked 52 times, and captured and recaptured 44 times. We will see its last attack by that of Gods hands as He gathers all nations to fight against Jerusalem in the end of days, Zechariah 14:1-3; Luke 21:20-22; Rev 19:11-21. All of this because Israel has never repented and lost her right to be called Gods chosen people, (God did save a faithful remnant), as they fell into idolatry worshiping other gods as they allowed themselves to fall from Gods grace as they followed the lust of their own hearts as they practiced Judaism, 1Kings 9:1-9.
You have a blessed dayYou're just muddying the water without responding to the specificity and exclusivity of the reference in Jesus's answer. "These things" are none other than the "buildings of the temple" which the disciples marveled at, "not one stone shall be left upon another" is ONLY referring to destruction of those "buildings of the temple" - THE second temple, and that temple was only destroyed ONCE in 70AD.
Hey Shilohsfoal
I'd say drop the reference to Benjamin Netanyahu and that his kingdon is somehow the 'son of God'. Israel, the nation, is filled with God's children that are His children through the Abrahamic promise. And God still loves them. You know why? Because they did everything that God needed them to do to bring us salvation through His Son, Jesus.
The people of Israel, wrote the Scriptures. The people of Israel put God's Son, our Messiah, to death. All of that was God's plan when he called a man named Abram from the city of Ur some 4,000 years ago. God still loves Israel, though just like the believers in Jesus, we are still a bunch of stiff-necked people. Just as there are hundreds of thousands of Jews who don't understand what God is doing and has done, there are hundreds of thousands of people sitting in pews/chairs on Sunday/Saturday morning who don't understand what God is doing and has done.
God loves Israel and His own words are that His love for them is an undying love. He has promised that His punishment for them will not last forever. And that's what we're seeing.
Israel, the nation, it doesn't matter who is leading the nation, is the apple of God's eye. You might also recall that throughout the old covenant about 80% of the kings of Israel and Judah were wicked leaders. Why do you think that's any different today? Maybe PM Netanyahu is a wicked leader in God's sight, I don't know, but that doesn't make the nation of Israel any less loved in God's sight and according to His testimony.
I expect this to be fulfilled in about 4 years from now.Hey Shilohsfoal
I'd say drop the reference to Benjamin Netanyahu and that his kingdon is somehow the 'son of God'. Israel, the nation, is filled with God's children that are His children through the Abrahamic promise. And God still loves them. You know why? Because they did everything that God needed them to do to bring us salvation through His Son, Jesus.
The people of Israel, wrote the Scriptures. The people of Israel put God's Son, our Messiah, to death. All of that was God's plan when he called a man named Abram from the city of Ur some 4,000 years ago. God still loves Israel, though just like the believers in Jesus, we are still a bunch of stiff-necked people. Just as there are hundreds of thousands of Jews who don't understand what God is doing and has done, there are hundreds of thousands of people sitting in pews/chairs on Sunday/Saturday morning who don't understand what God is doing and has done.
God loves Israel and His own words are that His love for them is an undying love. He has promised that His punishment for them will not last forever. And that's what we're seeing.
Israel, the nation, it doesn't matter who is leading the nation, is the apple of God's eye. You might also recall that throughout the old covenant about 80% of the kings of Israel and Judah were wicked leaders. Why do you think that's any different today? Maybe PM Netanyahu is a wicked leader in God's sight, I don't know, but that doesn't make the nation of Israel any less loved in God's sight and according to His testimony.
The way out is to be beheaded:Soon we will be faced with the mark of the beast. We will have no options if we don't, there will be no way to have access to survival. You should be looking for options right now to evade the inevitable before the door closes.
Another reason not to resist, but gladly die for Christ is our weakness.Soon we will be faced with the mark of the beast. We will have no options if we don't, there will be no way to have access to survival. You should be looking for options right now to evade the inevitable before the door closes.
The voice coming from the altar signifies this is God’s answer to the prayers for justice by the saints (Rev. 6:10; 8:3-5). The TARES who betrayed the wheat will now get their just reward.13 Then the sixth angel sounded: And I heard a voice from the four horns of the golden altar which is before God,
14 saying to the sixth angel who had the trumpet, “Release the four angels who are bound at the great river Euphrates.”
15 So the four angels, who had been prepared for the hour and day and month and year, were released to kill a third of mankind.
16 Now the number of the army of the horsemen was two hundred million; I heard the number of them.
17 And thus I saw the horses in the vision: those who sat on them had breastplates of fiery red, hyacinth blue, and sulfur yellow; and the heads of the horses were like the heads of lions; and out of their mouths came fire, smoke, and brimstone.
18 By these three plagues a third of mankind was killed– by the fire and the smoke and the brimstone which came out of their mouths.
19 For their power is in their mouth and in their tails; for their tails are like serpents, having heads; and with them they do harm.
20 But the rest of mankind, who were not killed by these plagues, did not repent of the works of their hands, that they should not worship demons, and idols of gold, silver, brass, stone, and wood, which can neither see nor hear nor walk.
21 And they did not repent of their murders or their sorceries (5331 φαρμακεία pharmakeia) or their sexual immorality or their thefts. (Rev. 9:13-10:1 NKJ)
I agree fully. I find a pre trib rapture a dangerous doctrine. We MUST be prepared to go through the Tribulation. If somebody puts all their faith in a pre Trib Rapture and they are not taken, they will be lost. Jesus never promised an easy road. Jesus and ALL of the Apostles faced tribulations of their own, even death.Personally, and I hope if you want to we can have a theological discussion about it, I found in my studies of scripture that it supports a post tribulation rapture.
Plus I know a lot of Christians don't really want to suffer for God so they just hope God will send the rapture so they won't have to face any trouble, and none of the things Jesus said would happen to Christians would come true and they can just get away Scott free, while the rest of the world suffers.
The problem with that idea is, if we are left to go through the Tribulation, we will be here to WORK. The ONLY reason for the Tribulation is to gather the last lost sheep. We are meant to be the shepherds. If we just give up and allow ourselves to be killed early so that we do not have to suffer, we will not be doing our jobs.Another reason not to resist, but gladly die for Christ is our weakness.
Suppose you are able to "live off the grid" or do as some stupid movies have it, put on a fake mark of the beast. Everyday, every minute of the day you are seeking to preserve your life.
Will you die for Christ when the "jig is up?" After months of "preserving your pathetic life" would you now surrender it when you can't hide anymore?
Or would you then take the mark of the beast?
Why take that chance. When they come for me, I'll gladly die for Christ. After all, He died for me.
If Israel could effectively hunt down the leaders of Hezbollah in a few weeks, with today's technology...how much easier will it be for the Beast with a quantum computing AI networked with every smart device, that reports in real time everything happening around them?The problem with that idea is, if we are left to go through the Tribulation, we will be here to WORK. The ONLY reason for the Tribulation is to gather the last lost sheep. We are meant to be the shepherds. If we just give up and allow ourselves to be killed early so that we do not have to suffer, we will not be doing our jobs.
When the Beast makes his headquarters in Jerusalem (as the false Christ), those who believe the real Jesus Christ will flee. Scripture does give a location where they may be safe for a time. In the land of Jordan and Negev desert of Israel:Soon we will be faced with the mark of the beast. We will have no options if we don't, there will be no way to have access to survival. You should be looking for options right now to evade the inevitable before the door closes. I have know for 30 years a way out but we must act now before it to late. God told Abraham to go into the wilderness and he would provide. What if we built a community outside of this mess. What if we worked together and started fresh off grid, say 100 families. Each of us contributes a skill I may have a sawmill others cover raising livestock a year round greenhouse making jams honey preserves etc cover the needs of the community working together. No money changes hands. Perhaps a credit system instead. I run the sawmill you need a house and an outbuilding to work on your contribution to the community. You help cut the lumber and all your brothers come out to build your home and shop. Raising you up. Eventually our combined efforts give us all we need to flourish. I know how to make free power as I have been working on this for over 30 years. if we pick the right spot we could build a lodge for tourists hunting fishing nature adventures. This would generate cash flow until the people are forced to take the mark of the beast. The lodge becomes a place of worship with a large commercial kitchen and large dining room where we all meet for dinner ever day a chance to air any concerns, ideas, problems and settle disputes. Imagine a place where you are near your family both parents within reach of there children teaching them life skills working alongside of our kids bring them to the greenhouse to weed the garden so they can identify what's a weed. Life skills survival skills. Faith in God and the love of the entire community, brotherhood. A school without political interference to confuse them. A love and understanding of nature. We are literally standing on eden we just need to take our place as the guardians of nature. Plant berries in every meadow around us, a full bear is harmless. Nature would Benefit and flourish. Harmony with God's creatures. God made nature abundant one tomato has enough seeds to feed hundreds. It's not like this lifestyle doesn't exist look at the Amish the hutterites the minonites the quakers. The biggest threat to there lifestyle is there proximity to outsiders. I have been trying to find solid Christians to make this a reality people who believe 100% THAT GOD EXSISTS and want to live guided by his word. I could go on for hours about this subject I've had a long time to think it thru. Time is running out evil is winning we need to act fast before we are trapped. I have wanted to get this idea out in the world. I just signed up to this site today to give you all a message of hope a way to live as God intended. I'm 66 and don't have much time left in this world I hope to see this take life before I go. I think God would approve. I have had a safe place in mind to do this and if we combined our skills and financial resources we could make it happen. Hard work brotherhood and gods word is the foundation. Blowing around like a leaf in the wind uncertain about a future you have no control over is not the answer you don't need the corvette and the big house you'll never pay off. Spending very little time with your family to put food on the table and bills that never end. Nature heals us we just need to take our rightful place. I love God and thank him everyday I love Jesus and can't belive all that he suffered to save me no man I have ever met could bear what he went thru for us all. Give this idea some thought. please make this happen with or without me.
Feed the light share the love.
The people who are killed during the tribulation who do not worship the beast,or it's image,nor receive it's mark die while doing their job.The problem with that idea is, if we are left to go through the Tribulation, we will be here to WORK. The ONLY reason for the Tribulation is to gather the last lost sheep. We are meant to be the shepherds. If we just give up and allow ourselves to be killed early so that we do not have to suffer, we will not be doing our jobs.
The beasts headquarters is already in Jerusalem.When the Beast makes his headquarters in Jerusalem (as the false Christ), those who believe the real Jesus Christ will flee. Scripture does give a location where they may be safe for a time. In the land of Jordan and Negev desert of Israel:
40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.
41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon. (Dan. 11:40-41 KJV)
- Edom was situated to the south of the Dead Sea, mostly in modern southern Jordan, but it also extended into the Negev desert of modern Israel.
- Moab lay to the east of the Dead Sea, in central Jordan. It was situated between the Arnon River (now the Wadi Mujib) and the Zered River (Wadi al-Hasa).
But I seriously doubt "living off the grid" entirely, hoping to avoid discovery by the Quantum AI Image that will be networked with every smart device, which will give the Beast "god like" ability to see and hear in real time, everything near a microphone or camera, PLUS and vast satallite technology that can see into the crust of the earth....will have any long term success.
Hence it is written armed resistance is futile, and to die a martyr is a special blessing, an opportunity for those who have faith in Jesus:
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.
10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints. (Rev. 13:8-10 KJV)
11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them. (Rev. 14:11-13 KJV)
"But when they arrest you and deliver you up, do not worry beforehand, or premeditate what you will speak. But whatever is given you in that hour, speak that; for it is not you who speak, but the Holy Spirit. (Mk. 13:11 NKJ)