If God Loved everyone !

[glorydaz]

Reconciliation is not salvation.

Reconciliation is a change of relationship between God and man based on the work of the cross.

Enmity between God and sinful man was removed by the death of Christ.
Reconciliation is then appropriated by each individual sinner through Faith.

Here it is typified...

And he slew it; and Moses took the blood, and put it upon the horns of the altar round about with his finger, and purified the altar, and poured the blood at the bottom of the altar, and sanctified it, to make reconciliation upon it.

And when he hath made an end of reconciling the holy place, and the tabernacle of the congregation, and the altar, he shall bring the live goat:

The work of the cross removed the barrier between man and God...giving us access to the resurrected life. The blood gave all men equal access to God...we need only accept it by faith and be born again.
A measure of faith has been given to all men so we are without excuse.

 

[savedbygrace57]

glory says:

Reconciliation is not salvation.

says what verse ?

 

[glorydaz]

glory says:

Reconciliation is not salvation.

says what verse ?

Have you read anything I've posted?
I gave you the verses in Lev., you should study up on those chapters.
They are a type shown of how the middle wall of partition was broken down by the blood of Jesus, and man could gain access to God. That was the reconciliation Christ accomplished on the cross. Access to God is not enough for salvation, however...the resurrection...new birth was needed for that.

13But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. 14For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; 15Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; 16And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: 17And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. 18For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father. 19Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;

Notice...we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son. (the cross)
Much more...we shall be saved from wrath through him. (the resurrection)
By the cross we gained access to God...then through faith we believe and enter into eternal life.
The cross gave every man access to God, but not all will be justified by faith and be saved.

8But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. 9Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. 10For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. 11And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement. 12Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned: 13(For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law. 14Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come. 15But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.

 

[savedbygrace57]

Salvation is multi faceted, it is comprised of redemption, sanctification, Justification and reconciliation, forgiveness of sins and ect..

One cannot be reconciled and not be saved..

The word reconciled in the greek per rom 5:

10For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

The word is: katallass? and means:


to change, exchange, as coins for others of equivalent value

a) to reconcile (those who are at variance)

b) return to favour with, be reconciled to one

c) to receive one into favour


One who is reconciled, has been recieved into God's Favor, sin is no longer a variant from fellowship with Him and they have been accepted into Gods Grace..

eph 1:

6To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.

Now, all those so accepted into favor, having been reconciled by christ death, will experience conversion, another form of saving, by the work of the Holy Ghost..

This saving is described Here titus 3:

5Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

All that are reconciled to God by Christ death, will experience the saving of the spiritual renewal of the Holy Ghost, in other words, they shall be born of the spirit..

Thats what paul means that they who have been reconciled by His death, shall be saved by His resurrected Life, whereby He sheds upon them the Holy Ghost of promise..This is conversion..

 

[RND]

One cannot be reconciled and not be saved..

Mankind is already reconciled to God through the blood of Jesus.

2Cr 5:18 And all things [are] of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; 2Cr 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

Rom 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

In other words through the work of Christ on the cross mankind is now reconciled back to God. It is through Christ that man now has the opportunity, the free choice, to reconcile himself back to God. In fact we can now approach the throne room of grace with much boldness.

 

[glorydaz]

One cannot be reconciled and not be saved..

Mankind is already reconciled to God through the blood of Jesus.

2Cr 5:18 And all things [are] of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; 2Cr 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

Rom 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

In other words through the work of Christ on the cross mankind is now reconciled back to God. It is through Christ that man now has the opportunity, the free choice, to reconcile himself back to God. In fact we can now approach the throne room of grace with much boldness.

:amen

 

[savedbygrace57]

rnd says:

Mankind is already reconciled to God through the blood of Jesus.

Not all, the seed of the serpent is not reconciled..only the sheep..1 pet 2:

25For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls..

The word returned here is the greek word:

epistreph?:


to cause to return, to bring back

Its also in the passive voice, that is they are being brought back to the bishop of their souls..

The word also means to be converted as in acts 3:

Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.

Now, its the sheep that christ must bring Jn 10:

16And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

This is accomplished by the death of christ 1 pet 3:


18For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

The death of christ, His blood brings about conversion and repentance for the sheep..but not all mankind, for all mankind do not belong to the sheep of christ..

 

[RND]

Not all, the seed of the serpent is not reconciled..only the sheep..

Serpent seed doctrine is discouraged around these parts. It's completely unbiblical.

The death of christ, His blood brings about conversion and repentance for the sheep..but not all mankind,

You obviously don't understand how the death of Christ reconciled all of mankind back to God.

for all mankind do not belong to the sheep of christ..

For the one's that have no desire to know Christ this is certainly true. The fact remains that because of Jesus Christ's sacrifice God no longer looks as us as enemies! The blood of Christ is for all who will recognize Him as Lord and Savior.

 

[Hawkins]

Hebrews 10:29
How much more severely do you think a man deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God under foot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified him, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace?

God forgive only His sheep, not the goats nor the wolves. God's sheep recognise His voice.

 

[RND]

Hebrews 10:29
How much more severely do you think a man deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God under foot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified him, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace?

God forgive only His sheep, not the goats nor the wolves. God's sheep recognise His voice.

How does a goat become a sheep?

 

[Hawkins]

It is said clearly that God will judge. We have to love our known enemies because they may well be God's sons and daughers.

Do you mean that we should love those who are thrown to the Lake of Fire?

How are we to know who will be thrown into the lake of fire?

We're to love our enemies and those who despitefully use us for our own sake...not theirs.
We're to hate no one...only sin. Just as God does. That's why we know God loves His enemies...He wouldn't tell us to do what He doesn't do Himself.

Do you mean that even God dosen't know who are to be thrown to the Lake of Fire?

We don't know, that's we need to love our enemies. But God loves only His sheep, those with their names written in the Book of Life before our creation.

 

[Hawkins]

Hebrews 10:29
How much more severely do you think a man deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God under foot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified him, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace?

God forgive only His sheep, not the goats nor the wolves. God's sheep recognise His voice.

How does a goat become a sheep?

A goat doesn't need the sherperd. They think that they can survive the wildness. While the sheep's names are already on the Book of Life.

 

[Hawkins]

Hey, savedbygrace, I'm curious. Who is it that God has "reconciled because he loved them"? Why did he choose to NOT love others, thus having no desire to reconcile THEM?

The same reason as why the Law system 'hates' the crinminals and sends them to prison.

God sets up Law for the universe to obey.

 

[glorydaz]

It is said clearly that God will judge. We have to love our known enemies because they may well be God's sons and daughers.

Do you mean that we should love those who are thrown to the Lake of Fire?

How are we to know who will be thrown into the lake of fire?

We're to love our enemies and those who despitefully use us for our own sake...not theirs.
We're to hate no one...only sin. Just as God does. That's why we know God loves His enemies...He wouldn't tell us to do what He doesn't do Himself.

Do you mean that even God dosen't know who are to be thrown to the Lake of Fire?

We don't know, that's we need to love our enemies. But God loves only His sheep, those with their names written in the Book of Life before our creation.

Where did I even come close to saying God doesn't know?

Jesus loves the little children...all the children of the world.
He ripped apart the veil that hid men from God.
Now all who will enter, can.

 

[RND]

Hebrews 10:29
How much more severely do you think a man deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God under foot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified him, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace?

God forgive only His sheep, not the goats nor the wolves. God's sheep recognise His voice.

How does a goat become a sheep?

A goat doesn't need the sherperd. They think that they can survive the wildness. While the sheep's names are already on the Book of Life.

That's not what I asked. I asked: How does a goat become a sheep? Do you know?

 

[glorydaz]

Hey, savedbygrace, I'm curious. Who is it that God has "reconciled because he loved them"? Why did he choose to NOT love others, thus having no desire to reconcile THEM?

The same reason as why the Law system 'hates' the crinminals and sends them to prison.

God sets up Law for the universe to obey.

Yes, not only the universe, but man, himself.
If man is called to obey, doesn't he need to choose to obey?
God calls all men to repent.
To repent mustn't a man exercise his free will?

Doesn't man have to choose to believe?
Just because God knows who will choose to answer His call, doesn't mean His call is not given to all.
Some obey, some don't. Unlike the universe, we have free will.

 

[RND]

The same reason as why the Law system 'hates' the crinminals and sends them to prison.

The system of law doesn't hate criminals. It feeds, houses and clothes them and eventually lets them out of prison in some cases.

God sets up Law for the universe to obey.

Well, in that everyone is guilty of breaking this law then God must 'hate' everyone according to your logic.

 

[Orion]

Hey, savedbygrace, I'm curious. Who is it that God has "reconciled because he loved them"? Why did he choose to NOT love others, thus having no desire to reconcile THEM?

The same reason as why the Law system 'hates' the crinminals and sends them to prison.

God sets up Law for the universe to obey.

1. Are infants innocent? I would hope you would say "yes" to that.
2. What is it called when the life of an innocent is taken? I would hope you would call that murder.
3. How many infants died in the "Noah flood"? Obviously, all of them.
4. Which commandment was broken? The answer, "you shall not kill".
5. Who broke that one? _____________. (Hint-You pray to him.)

 

[savedbygrace57]

orion asks:

Are infants innocent? I would hope you would say "yes" to that.

No, they are not innocent, but not because of any personal sins in time they committed, but because they sinned in and through their head, which is what paul teaches here:

rom 5:

12Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Paul is saying here that all men sinned by Adam's sin..

13(For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

14Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

Now who are these:

even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression

These are babies..death reigned over them, not because of their personal transgressions in the time state, but because they incurred guilt and death through their head Adam..God is saying they babies sinned in adam, hence they die too..

see job 4:7

Remember, I pray thee, who ever perished, being innocent? or where were the righteous cut off?

 

[Orion]

Then that is a completely IMMORAL and corrupt system, and I will have nothing to do with a system that damns others for the "mistake" of a predecessor. :naughty