"I'm Christian, unless you're gay"

[Mike S]

Ok get you bible out and prove it.

Oh, the Pharisee returns to his proof texts, as the dog returns to his vomit!

 

[Hitch]

Oh, the Pharisee returns to his proof texts, as the dog returns to his vomit!

:toofunny:toofunny:toofunny

Originally Posted by Hitch
Sodomy is in special class like it or not.

But on a personal note ,you complain in practically every post of judgmentalism on the part of 'some christians' , and on this thread ,so far, when it comes to judgmentalism you;re the king.

Not to worry you will never get into trouble for attacking me .

Ok get you bible out and prove it.

I know your could start by explaining how that whole Sodom & Gamorrah thing has been misinterpreted all these years.

 

[jasoncran]

theres a lot of hetero couples that commit sodomy. i shall oblidge a list:

oral sex
anal sex
sadomaschism
skah
orgies
wife swapping and husband swapping(key party)

yet do we know if that cute couple at church doesnt do that? we dont unless we are told or divingly told. i have the gaydar, with the lbgt the knose knows, i use wisdom. i dont look or gaze and point. i talk to them if see the opputurnity to ask. i also will ask then what their name and then when the time comes and if i will ask them if they want to be saved and healed. the holy spirit works far better then this fool.

 

[Mike S]

theres a lot of hetero couples that commit sodomy. i shall oblidge a list:

oral sex
anal sex
sadomaschism
skah
orgies
wife swapping and husband swapping(key party)

yet do we know if that cute couple at church doesnt do that? we dont unless we are told or divingly told. i have the gaydar, with the lbgt the knose knows, i use wisdom. i dont look or gaze and point. i talk to them if see the opputurnity to ask. i also will ask then what their name and then when the time comes and if i will ask them if they want to be saved and healed. the holy spirit works far better then this fool.

Do they also tell you about YOUR sin? If not, maybe I can pay you a visit and do it for them.

The Holy Spirit works with or without you.

 

[jasoncran]

this fool has learned to let the spirit lead and when he does then they have no choice to but listen to the counsel of god.

today, i got into a debate with a coworker who is into the course of miracles. if you know anything about the christ consciencious that isnt so easy to deal with as these types are so close yet so far.


but i did force him to realise that his views cant deal with evil as its not real nor universal to him.

 

[handy]

Hitch,

I'm not Mark, so I know your challenge wasn't to me, but I'll jump in anyway.

Ok get you bible out and prove it.

1 Corinthians 6:9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, <sup class="versenum" id="en-NASB-28478">10</sup> nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. <sup class="versenum" id="en-NASB-28479">11</sup> Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

The effeminate and homosexuals are right there with the fornicators and adulterers, not to mention the thieves, the covetous, drunkards (and I think we could put drug addicts), revilers and swindlers. Paul points out that the Corinthians were well acquainted with these sins.

Here is another text in which homosexuality is equated with other sins, sins that many have committed.... and been forgiven for:

1Timothy 1:8 But we know that the Law is good, if one uses it lawfully, <sup class="versenum" id="en-NASB-29706">9</sup> realizing the fact that law is not made for a righteous person, but for those who are lawless and rebellious, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers <sup class="versenum" id="en-NASB-29707">10</sup> and immoral men and homosexuals and kidnappers and liars and perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to sound teaching, <sup class="versenum" id="en-NASB-29708">11</sup> according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, with which I have been entrusted.

 

[jasoncran]

Do they also tell you about YOUR sin? If not, maybe I can pay you a visit and do it for them.

The Holy Spirit works with or without you.

i have been confronted by men and women of god who didnt know me at all and told me that i was in sin. recently that happened at church.

surely your sin will find you out. i use wisdom far more then you are thinking. i see things then pray about them long before i act.its was that type of thing that got me to repent, as a muslim friend told his mother a believer that i was gay male who came out of the closet, being grieved she a fasted then prayed and waited a week and then made that call. she has the office of a prophetess and did that work and i was brought of the sin that i was in.

when she did confront me it was after much fasting and prayer and i KNEW it was god that told me that i was wrong.

 

[Hitch]

Hitch,

I'm not Mark, so I know your challenge wasn't to me, but I'll jump in anyway.

Ok get you bible out and prove it.

1 Corinthians 6:9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, <sup class="versenum" id="en-NASB-28478">10</sup> nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. <sup class="versenum" id="en-NASB-28479">11</sup> Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

The effeminate and homosexuals are right there with the fornicators and adulterers, not to mention the thieves, the covetous, drunkards (and I think we could put drug addicts), revilers and swindlers. Paul points out that the Corinthians were well acquainted with these sins.

Here is another text in which homosexuality is equated with other sins, sins that many have committed.... and been forgiven for:

1Timothy 1:8 But we know that the Law is good, if one uses it lawfully, <sup class="versenum" id="en-NASB-29706">9</sup> realizing the fact that law is not made for a righteous person, but for those who are lawless and rebellious, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers <sup class="versenum" id="en-NASB-29707">10</sup> and immoral men and homosexuals and kidnappers and liars and perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to sound teaching, <sup class="versenum" id="en-NASB-29708">11</sup> according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, with which I have been entrusted.

Well Handy have you ever read any post of mine that is contradictory to any part of what you put up ,just now?


But I must insist that stop referring to people as murderers. They wont like it if you call them that and when they refuse Jesus it will all be your fault.

Silly isnt it? This is my point here. Its foolish to give the Sodomites the choice of terms and choice of battle field in the public debate, case in point;

By Heidi Blake
Published: 1:05PM BST 02 May 2010

Dale McAlpine was charged with causing "harassment, alarm or distress" after a homosexual police community support officer (PCSO) overheard him reciting a number of "sins" referred to in the Bible, including blasphemy, drunkenness and same sex relationships.

The 42-year-old Baptist, who has preached Christianity in Wokington, Cumbria for years, said he did not mention homosexuality while delivering a sermon from the top of a stepladder, but admitted telling a passing shopper that he believed it went against the word of God.

Police officers are alleging that he made the remark in a voice loud enough to be overheard by others and have charged him with using abusive or insulting language, contrary to the Public Order Act.

Mr McAlpine, who was taken to the police station in the back of a marked van and locked in a cell for seven hours on April 20, said the incident was among the worst experiences of his life.

"I felt deeply shocked and humiliated that I had been arrested in my own town and treated like a common criminal in front of people I know," he said.

"My freedom was taken away on the hearsay of someone who disliked what I said, and I was charged under a law that doesn't apply."

Christian campaigners have expressed alarm that the Public Order Act, introduced in 1986 to tackle violent rioters and football hooligans, is being used to curb religious free speech.

Sam Webster, a solicitor-advocate for the Christian Institute, which is supporting Mr McAlpine, said it is not a crime to express the belief that homosexual conduct is a sin.
"The police have a duty to maintain public order but they also have a duty to defend the lawful free speech of citizens," he said.

"Case law has ruled that the orthodox Christian belief that homosexual conduct is sinful is a belief worthy of respect in a democratic society."

Mr McAlpine was handing out leaflets explaining the Ten Commandments or offering a "ticket to heaven" with a church colleague on April 20, when a woman came up and engaged him in a debate about his faith.

During the exchange, he says he quietly listed homosexuality among a number of sins referred to in 1 Corinthians, including blasphemy, fornication, adultery and drunkenness.

After the woman walked away, she was approached by a PCSO who spoke with her briefly and then walked over to Mr McAlpine and told him a complaint had been made, and that he could be arrested for using racist or homophobic language.

The street preacher said he told the PCSO: "I am not homophobic but sometimes I do say that the Bible says homosexuality is a crime against the Creator".

He claims that the PCSO then said he was homosexual and identified himself as the Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender liaison officer for Cumbria police. Mr McAlpine replied: "It's still a sin."

The preacher then began a 20 minute sermon, in which he says he mentioned drunkenness and adultery, but not homosexuality. Three regular uniformed police officers arrived during the address, arrested Mr McAlpine and put him in the back of a police van.

At the station, he was told to empty his pockets and his mobile telephone, belt and shoes were confiscated. Police took fingerprints, a palm print, a retina scan and a DNA swab.
He was later interviewed, charged under Sections 5 (1) and (6) of the Public Order Act and released on bail on the condition that he did not preach in public.

Mr McAlpine pleaded not guilty at a preliminary hearing on Friday at Wokingham magistrates court and is now awaiting a trial date.

The Public Order Act, which outlaws the unreasonable use of abusive language likely to cause distress, has been used to arrest religious people in a number of similar cases.
Harry Hammond, a pensioner, was convicted under Section 5 of the Act in 2002 for holding up a sign saying "Stop immorality. Stop Homosexuality. Stop Lesbianism. Jesus is Lord" while preaching in Bournemouth.

Stephen Green, a Christian campaigner, was arrested and charged in 2006 for handing out religious leaflets at a Gay Pride festival in Cardiff. The case against him was later dropped.

Cumbria police said last night that no one was available to comment on Mr McAlpine's case.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/rel...rested-for-saying-homosexuality-is-a-sin.html

 

[Mike S]

Hitch,

I'm not Mark, so I know your challenge wasn't to me, but I'll jump in anyway.

Ok get you bible out and prove it.

1 Corinthians 6:9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, <SUP id=en-NASB-28478 class=versenum>10</SUP> nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. <SUP id=en-NASB-28479 class=versenum>11</SUP> Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

The effeminate and homosexuals are right there with the fornicators and adulterers, not to mention the thieves, the covetous, drunkards (and I think we could put drug addicts), revilers and swindlers. Paul points out that the Corinthians were well acquainted with these sins.

Here is another text in which homosexuality is equated with other sins, sins that many have committed.... and been forgiven for:

1Timothy 1:8 But we know that the Law is good, if one uses it lawfully, <SUP id=en-NASB-29706 class=versenum>9</SUP> realizing the fact that law is not made for a righteous person, but for those who are lawless and rebellious, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers <SUP id=en-NASB-29707 class=versenum>10</SUP> and immoral men and homosexuals and kidnappers and liars and perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to sound teaching, <SUP id=en-NASB-29708 class=versenum>11</SUP> according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, with which I have been entrusted.

I know your comment wasn't directed to me, but I want to say thank you. This is the reason I don't like dueling scriptures. When someone quotes one scripture, there is always another that puts a different interopretaion to the issue.

I believe that no single scripture gives us the complete Christian message. I believe it's to be found by reading the total Bible and looking for the grand themes. A theme running through Christ's ministry is love, and compassion, and forgiveness.

 

[felix]

(1John 4:16-17) And we have known and believed the love that God has for us. God is love, and he who abides in love abides in God, and God in him. Love has been perfected among us in this: that we may have boldness in the day of judgment; because as He is, so are we in this world.

The role of God's love is to have boldness in the day of Judgement. You simply cannot separate God's love from His judgement.

While the below verses are often referred for denial of marriages between believes and unbelievers, the chapter has nothing to do with marriage:

(2Cor 6:14-18) Do not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness? And what accord has Christ with Belial? Or what part has a believer with an unbeliever? And what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For you are the temple of the living God. As God has said: "I will dwell in them And walk among [them.] I will be their God, And they shall be My people." Therefore "Come out from among them And be separate, says the Lord. Do not touch what is unclean, And I will receive you. I will be a Father to you, And you shall be My sons and daughters, Says the LORD Almighty."

1. not yoked together
2. no fellowship
3. no communion
4. no accord
5. no part
6. no agreement
7. not to be among them

If you can follow all the above 7 points and still be a friend of a gay, then you are either not a christian or don't believe in scriptures.

 

[Mike S]

i have been confronted by men and women of god who didnt know me at all and told me that i was in sin. recently that happened at church.

surely your sin will find you out. i use wisdom far more then you are thinking. i see things then pray about them long before i act.its was that type of thing that got me to repent, as a muslim friend told his mother a believer that i was gay male who came out of the closet, being grieved she a fasted then prayed and waited a week and then made that call. she has the office of a prophetess and did that work and i was brought of the sin that i was in.

when she did confront me it was after much fasting and prayer and i KNEW it was god that told me that i was wrong.

I'm happy for you jason. I'm glad God's love helped heal you.

 

[felix]

We all sin and fall short of how God wants us to live. Is your sin any less hurtful to God than the sin of homosexuality?

Not all sins lead to death:
(1John 5:17) All unrighteousness is sin, and there is sin not [leading] to death.
But, homosexuals are:
(Rom 1:32) who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.

Not all sins are equal.

 

[Mike S]

(1John 4:16-17) And we have known and believed the love that God has for us. God is love, and he who abides in love abides in God, and God in him. Love has been perfected among us in this: that we may have boldness in the day of judgment; because as He is, so are we in this world.

The role of God's love is to have boldness in the day of Judgement. You simply cannot separate God's love from His judgement.

While the below verses are often referred for denial of marriages between believes and unbelievers, the chapter has nothing to do with marriage:

(2Cor 6:14-18) Do not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness? And what accord has Christ with Belial? Or what part has a believer with an unbeliever? And what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For you are the temple of the living God. As God has said: "I will dwell in them And walk among [them.] I will be their God, And they shall be My people." Therefore "Come out from among them And be separate, says the Lord. Do not touch what is unclean, And I will receive you. I will be a Father to you, And you shall be My sons and daughters, Says the LORD Almighty."

1. not yoked together
2. no fellowship
3. no communion
4. no accord
5. no part
6. no agreement
7. not to be among them

If you can follow all the above 7 points and still be a friend of a gay, then you are either not a christian or don't believe in scriptures.

Here's a word of wisdom for you. YOU have noe moral authority to decide who is and isn't a Christian, any more than Jim Jones or David Koresh did.

Everyone works out his own salvation with fear and trembling. Pay attention to your own salvation and leave the rest of us to God.

 

[jasoncran]

geem felix what would you do if your son or daughter went that way? disown them? sometimes we need to be their for them and yet let them know that we dont aprove their lifestyle. if i took it that way then we shouldnt buy nor sell or talk to sinner unless its repent thou sinner.

i dont go that far with sinners when it comes to fellowship but that doesnt mean i dont have friends that arent saved. hmm i wasnt saved when that prophetess would talk to me. i talked to her for a year before i came to christ. its a long story on that time on my life. i wont go there as its rather a bad and hurtful time in my life.

 

[Hitch]

Here's a word of wisdom for you. YOU have noe moral authority to decide who is and isn't a Christian, any more than Jim Jones or David Koresh did.

Everyone works out his own salvation with fear and trembling. Pay attention to your own salvation and leave the rest of us to God.

Now that was royally judgmental :waving Maybe if you would pray from more tolerance of others views?

 

[Hitch]

LOL only on a 'Christian' forum could this be considered a hateful position;

"Jesus made friends of repentant sinners."

 

[felix]

Here's a word of wisdom for you. YOU have noe moral authority to decide who is and isn't a Christian, any more than Jim Jones or David Koresh did.

Everyone works out his own salvation with fear and trembling. Pay attention to your own salvation and leave the rest of us to God.

Sorry, that is not what great commission is all about and I do not know the god you are talking about who asks to work out their own salvation because according to Scriptures of Christianity, Christ is the salvation and He is the author of it and can never be worked out.

 

[reba]

Are you sure you've been reading my comments? I've never said I accept homosexual behavior as moral. I just don't endlessly hector gays - who know my religious beliefs - for the way they live.

How about you? How many of the people sitting next to you in church or living in your neighborhood, with whom you carry on normal relationships, live perfect sin free lives? We all sin and fall short of how God wants us to live. Is your sin any less hurtful to God than the sin of homosexuality?

Mark i did not call you out in my post. Yes i have read the comments almost every post.


1Co 6:18 Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.
1Co 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
1Co 6:20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.
It does seem to me that 'sex' sins have been slightly set apart in the Word of God.

 

[felix]

geem felix what would you do if your son or daughter went that way? disown them? sometimes we need to be their for them and yet let them know that we dont aprove their lifestyle. if i took it that way then we shouldnt buy nor sell or talk to sinner unless its repent thou sinner.

i dont go that far with sinners when it comes to fellowship but that doesnt mean i dont have friends that arent saved. hmm i wasnt saved when that prophetess would talk to me. i talked to her for a year before i came to christ. its a long story on that time on my life. i wont go there as its rather a bad and hurtful time in my life.

If that is the scenario, then it means, I had never been a good parent who had properly disciplined by child. I would never allow such a scenario to exist.

Just to give a background of my home, I don't have TV, never have any rooms for children and my children cannot be or do anything in private. We make sure children are not allowed on their own after school. We don't buy mobiles to kids. We don't give importance to academic but consider spiritual purity as the highest priority.

Unless you teach them the pollution of this world, they will never know them.

 

[jasoncran]

If that is the scenario, then it means, I had never been a good parent who had properly disciplined by child. I would never allow such a scenario to exist.

Just to give a background of my home, I don't have TV, never have any rooms for children and my children cannot be or do anything in private. We make sure children are not allowed on their own after school. We don't buy mobiles to kids. We don't give importance to academic but consider spiritual purity as the highest priority.

Unless you teach them the pollution of this world, they will never know them.

lol, so i guess that cult which btw had more control over me then most parents could ever imagine nor want.

yet at age 10 i had the very desire to like men. i didnt want it and i kept it to myself.you may try all you want you aint GOD. GOD FAILED with adam and eve if you want to say it that way, there was that devil, kids are curious and i bet they will sneak around when you arent there to notice it and sin. i did it and i know nathan does it. i catch him when he does it but there will come a time when i have done all that is possible and he will either choose the devil or the lord. the choice freely will be his.

in the 80s generally save menudo and or john elton there wasnt any gay entertainers in the open. and i didnt listen to elton then nor much on menudo, yet it happened. satan has his ways of getting the foot in. it will happen. you can try to stop them from that temptation but he will try to get to them. its what he does.