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Is believing/faith a work ?

brightfame52 said:
2 Tim group



At that point was you saved, regenerated ? Yes or No. And what cleansed your heart ?
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I would say yes, the heart has been cleansed, or, Regenerated as you say.

It is the Circumcision of Christ that relieves a person from being held captive of the Devil (to do his will). It is Christ who cleanses a heart. So what is a cleansed heart? It is one that has been separated from any and all Curses. This is a separate Work of Christ, separate, that is, from granting Repentance, to granting the Holy Spirit, to paying the debt for sins (and ultimately placing belief in Christ and the Power that raised Him from the grave).

Colossians 2:9-15 gives the single most comprehensive explanation of the removal of the Flesh (Sarx - the Greek word that describes the sinful state of a person).
 
2nd Timothy Group said:
I would say yes, the heart has been cleansed, or, Regenerated as you say.

It is the Circumcision of Christ that relieves a person from being held captive of the Devil (to do his will). It is Christ who cleanses a heart. So what is a cleansed heart? It is one that has been separated from any and all Curses. This is a separate Work of Christ, separate, that is, from granting Repentance, to granting the Holy Spirit, to paying the debt for sins (and ultimately placing belief in Christ and the Power that raised Him from the grave).

Colossians 2:9-15 gives the single most comprehensive explanation of the removal of the Flesh (Sarx - the Greek word that describes the sinful state of a person).
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So it takes a saved heart to believe in Jesus. Is that correct ?
 
brightfame52 said:
So it takes a saved heart to believe in Jesus. Is that correct ?
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To believe in Christ, one must be separated from the captivity of the Devil. Once that person has been freed, their eyes are opened and will, by default, do the only thing reasonable, and that is to turn to the one, True, and Living God . . . Jesus Christ.

Jesus grants the ability to turn and Repent.

Jesus sends the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Jesus pays the price for our sins. Placing Faith in the Power that raised Him from the dead is what ultimately makes us right with God.
 
2nd Timothy Group said:
To believe in Christ, one must be separated from the captivity of the Devil. Once that person has been freed, their eyes are opened and will, by default, do the only thing reasonable, and that is to turn to the one, True, and Living God . . . Jesus Christ.

Jesus grants the ability to turn and Repent.

Jesus sends the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Jesus pays the price for our sins. Placing Faith in the Power that raised Him from the dead is what ultimately makes us right with God.
Click to expand...
brightfame52 said:
So it takes a saved heart to believe in Jesus. Is that correct ?
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What is your favorite translation? I like to relay Scripture to folks in their preferred translation . . . makes things easier. :)
 
2nd Timothy Group said:
To believe in Christ, one must be separated from the captivity of the Devil. Once that person has been freed, their eyes are opened and will, by default, do the only thing reasonable, and that is to turn to the one, True, and Living God . . . Jesus Christ.

Jesus grants the ability to turn and Repent.

Jesus sends the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Jesus pays the price for our sins. Placing Faith in the Power that raised Him from the dead is what ultimately makes us right with God.
Click to expand...
Again, so it takes a saved heart to believe in Jesus Christ, correct ? You seem reluctant to simply say yes or no
 
2 Tim 2 group

Jesus pays the price for our sins. Placing Faith in the Power that raised Him from the dead is what ultimately makes us right with God.
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So you dont believe the mere solo fact that Christ died for ones sins and put them away, made them right with God apart from placing your faith in Jesus ?
 
brightfame52 said:
Again, so it takes a saved heart to believe in Jesus Christ, correct ? You seem reluctant to simply say yes or no
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No. A person is not made Right with God until Faith has been placed into the Son.

Romans 3:25-26 NLT - "For God presented Jesus as the sacrifice for sin. People are made right with God when they believe that Jesus sacrificed his life, shedding his blood. This sacrifice shows that God was being fair when he held back and did not punish those who sinned in times past, 26 for he was looking ahead and including them in what he would do in this present time. God did this to demonstrate his righteousness, for he himself is fair and just, and he declares sinners to be right in his sight when they believe in Jesus."

Colossians 2:12 NLT - "For you were buried with Christ when you were baptized. And with him you were raised to new life because you trusted the mighty power of God, who raised Christ from the dead."

However, those of the Old Testament, they received Spiritual Circumcision, the ability to turn and Repent, and also received the Holy Spirit, but as Romans chapter 3 above states, they had to wait for the Day of Christ, for the Lord is fair and just. This means that the likes of Abraham Truly were Righteous, Holy, and Pure, but they were not yet made right with God (unless the Lord so chose to do so, after all, Abraham was declared Righteous . . . it is something to at least consider).

Isn't this part of the Gospel amazing?
 
brightfame52 said:
No they dont, however they need to know they are saved. Faith is the Spiritual Knowledge of one's Salvation Lk 1:77

To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,
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No, you are saved by the remission of sin. We know this plainly from the full counsel of scripture. This is normally not even in debate. We are saved because our sins are forgiven. And that forgiveness is secured through faith/trust in the blood of Christ. You've got it backwards and have people receiving faith because they are saved. You have people being saved, by, uh...nothing. Meanwhile, the true Biblical gospel of salvation is that people are saved by having their sins forgiven.
 
Jethro Bodine said:
Please allow me to interject here.

Acts 15:9
9He made no distinction between us and them, for He cleansed their hearts by faith.

That's what the Bible says. But you say you have a cleansed regenerated heart THEN you are able to have faith.
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Verses 8 and 9 are so amazing . . .

Acts 15:8-9 NLT - "God knows people's hearts, and he confirmed that he accepts Gentiles by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as he did to us. He made no distinction between us and them, for he cleansed their hearts through faith."
 
2nd tim group

No. A person is not made Right with God until Faith has been placed into the Son.
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Okay so you in my honest opinion, based on your answer here, believe in salvation by works, by what you do, placing your faith in Jesus is something you do. You also deny that Christs death alone for a person saved them.
 
brightfame52 said:
Okay so you in my honest opinion, based on your answer here, believe in salvation by works,
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Wow. Your interpretation of me and what I've written concerns me. If you can't discern what I am saying, even though I am alive and available to clarify, how can I be sure that you are interpreting the Word of God correctly . . . whom you cannot speak to and thus confirm?
 
jethro b

No, you are saved by the remission of sin.
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Right thats what I just said. But a person can have remission of sins because Christ died for them Matt 26:28 and not know it. However sooner or later they will receive a knowledge of it by Faith Lk 1:77

To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,

Acts 26:18


To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.
 
2nd Timothy Group said:
Wow. Your interpretation of me and what I've written concerns me. If you can't discern what I am saying, even though I am alive and available to clarify, how can I be sure that you are interpreting the Word of God correctly . . . whom you cannot speak to and thus confirm?
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Yeah, Im going by what you posted. You said that a person isnt right with God until they do something, that something being placing their faith in Jesus. Thats works !
 
2nd Timothy Group said:
That is correct. There is more to the Gospel than just Jesus dying. I take a deeper approach to the Gospel . . . not a shallow, unclear, mud-puddle-like view of the Gospel.
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Im glad you admit that, even though Im not glad you believe that, because it means you deny the saving efficacy of Christs death which is not good friend.
 
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