Is Quran evil work?

[Sinthesis]

If the Qu'ran points a pagan towards God and Christ, then it has served a good purpose.

Perhaps, but the fact that the Qu'ran teaches Jesus as just a prophet might be a bit of a speed bump, don't you think?

The fact is that the Qu'ran is not sufficient to teach saving faith, but it could temp a reader to look at other information on Jesus; information that is true. Since when was the road to salvation without bumps?

 

[Kaliani]

It is truly irritating to me that someone who makes a claim that "Islam is peaceful" can never explain the suras such as I quoted.

Trust me, you don't want to meet the ones who ARE defiant about those suras.

When a Muslim is unwilling to make excuses for them, that's not bad. That's great.

At the very least, you can take comfort that they're unlikely to engage in the psychopathic behaviour prescribed.

And at best? They just might be ready for Christ. Score.

 

[By Grace]

Perhaps, but the fact that the Qu'ran teaches Jesus as just a prophet might be a bit of a speed bump, don't you think?

Respectfully, I disagree.

I suspect that you may have not delved into the Qu'ran, nor do you know what it teaches about Jesus Christ. I do NOT recommend that anyone casually read the Qu'ran because it will NOT lead anyone unto salvation. It teaches a totally different jesus than is found in Scripture alone.

Thus, I know that your post is well-intentioned, but it is also highly naive.

 

[By Grace]

And at best? They just might be ready for Christ. Score.

This reply is not to scold you; it is to help you gain another perspective.

Sorry, but I do not keep score because I believe that apologetics is not a score-keeping game; instead it is a battle against powers and principalities where the church takes advances, and breaks down strongholds and the gates of hell to save some.

When a Muslim is unwilling to make excuses for them, that's not bad. That's great.

You are thinking like a Westerner in stating this. For a Muslim, it is required that they "defend the prophet", and that to renounce as untrue any of the suras in the Qur'an is to apostatize, and the penalty for either permitting the "prophet to be insulted" or renouncing the Qu'ran is death. Thus I was deliberately presenting the Muslims who read with a dilemma.: do as the Qu'ran says, or call yourself a liar.

At the very least, you can take comfort that they're unlikely to engage in the psychopathic behaviour prescribed.

That is an unwarranted assumption. These people are lead by the Prince of Demons, and to murder anyone who disagrees with them is not out of the question. Look at what happening now in Great Britian and the populace of the nation being fed up with the capitulation of the scardy-cat politicitians to the Shiriah rules. Iit is akin to permitting the camel to put his nose under the tent in a sand storm. By permitting that, the tent dweller will soon have a camel inside his tent. That is not a good situation, and it is just exactly what is happening in Great Britain. and it is a tragedy that most likely not be able to be rolled back.

 

[Kaliani]

the church takes advances, and breaks down strongholds and the gates of hell to save some.

And the church's success would be a good thing, which is why I said 'Score'.

I was deliberately presenting the Muslims who read with a dilemma: do as the Qu'ran says or call yourself a liar.

First hand experience speaking, 'do as the Q'uran says or take a look at these here saner Christian scriptures' might work better to bring them to Christ.

 

[Matthew G]

I suspect that you may have not delved into the Qu'ran, nor do you know what it teaches about Jesus Christ.

You would be correct, but in my opinion, I don't have to in order to know it's a fraud.

Think about bank tellers. They are not trained to know every subtle nuance of every type of forgery that's floating around. Instead, they are taught to know every subtle nuance of legal currency. That way, the moment something slides across their counter that isn't genuine, they will know it for a fake immediately.

Likewise, I don't have to know what other religions teach about Jesus. I just need to know what the Word teaches about Jesus, and when a fake comes along (in this example the Qu'ran), I'll spot it.

I will concede to Sinthesis that the road to salvation is indeed never without bumps, and reading the Qu'ran may spark someone's interest to learn the truth about Jesus.

However, in my opinion that's kind of like saying being in a car wreck could tempt someone to learn the truth about driving. It's dangerous, and borders on being foolish.

But back to By Grace, how exactly was my post naive?

It teaches a totally different jesus than is found in Scripture alone.

I already knew that, so I don't see the naivete of my post. Not sure how I'm coming across, but I'm being sincere. I'm always open to being corrected when it's called for, but I honesty don't see that in this case. Can you expand on that some?

 

[By Grace]

But back to By Grace, how exactly was my post naive?

Here is your answer, but in giving it, I am not calling you nasty things other than being well-intentioned but naive, OK?

The road to salvation is paved by the effectual calling of Holy Spirit, who binds Satan, and opens the eyes of those seeking to know JesusChrist as Lord and Savior. To indicate that a phony religion, inspired by the Father of Lies, who denegrates Jesus Christ to the level of a prophet in the Qu'ran, among whom would be Mohammed is to blaspheme Holy Spirit. That is because the person saying that is ultimately implying that stating that both the Bible and the Qur'an are equally inspired by Holy Spirit. Because you did not make that connection, therein is the source of your naivete.

I don't have to in order to know it's a fraud.

The same holds for the Book of Mormon; it is a fraud. But would you dare to say that it could lead someone to Jesus Christ? Again, I am assuming for your benefit that you may not know the sorts of bologna that are in it.

Think about bank tellers. They are not trained to know every subtle nuance of every type of forgery that's floating around. Instead, they are taught to know every subtle nuance of legal currency. That way, the moment something slides across their counter that isn't genuine, they will know it for a fake immediately.

Since the nature of currency is physical, and the nature of religion is spiritual, you are making the logical error of making an equality of unequals in your analogy. While the believer can never be torn from the hand of Jesus (John 10:27) it is extremely foolhardy to minimize the temporal authority given to Satan, the god of this world. He can and does provide many avenues to discredit or to obliterate in a scandal the testimony of a believer. Therefore the net effect of your statment is to say that it is OK to play in Satan's playground because it might lead a person to Jesus Christ.

in my opinion that's kind of like saying being in a car wreck could tempt someone to learn the truth about driving. It's dangerous, and borders on being foolish.

That is why the role of the apologist is so critical. The apologist usually has the gifts of teaching and the prophetic. He/she can see the longer term implications of things, and then help others to avoid pitfalls that are easilly apparent (due to the nature of the gifts) that those who have other gifts may not see.

I will concede to Sinthesis that the road to salvation is indeed never without bumps...

Could you please explain what you mean here? I do not wish to presume.

reading the Qu'ran may spark someone's interest to learn the truth about Jesus

Hopefully. I think that you may now be able to see the error in that statement.
Above all, my intention is NOT to scold or to belittle, but to explain why I say these things. I will be willing to discuss it further if you wish.

Not sure how I'm coming across, but I'm being sincere.

That is EXACTLY how I took it, and I hope that you see that I am treating you as a beloved brother in Christ.

 

[By Grace]

First hand experience speaking, 'do as the Q'uran says or take a look at these here saner Christian scriptures' might work better to bring them to Christ.

That is what I was trying to get to when I ended post 17 with this question: "On the other hand, if these statements are NOT true, will you then publicly admit that you bore false witness to yourself? "
Unfortunately, but it is true, many people must come to the end of their ropes in order to look at Jesus Christ as the sane alternative.

That seems to have been your situation, and I am wondering if you could grace us with a short testimony about the grace of Jesus Christ made a change in your life.

 

[Kaliani]

First hand experience speaking, 'do as the Q'uran says or take a look at these here saner Christian scriptures' might work better to bring them to Christ.

That is what I was trying to get to when I ended post 17 with this question: "On the other hand, if these statements are NOT true, will you then publicly admit that you bore false witness to yourself? "
Unfortunately, but it is true, many people must come to the end of their ropes in order to look at Jesus Christ as the sane alternative.

You and Matthew just agreed that waiting to get into a car wreck before learning to drive properly is unwise.

Why dare a Muslim to obey the Q'uran? That's the last thing we want anyone to do! What if he decides to cave in to your goading and live by these suras? THEN you'll introduce the Bible?

I am wondering if you could grace us with a short testimony about the grace of Jesus Christ made a change in your life.

Perhaps, in the appropriate forum.

 

[By Grace]

Why dare a Muslim to obey the Q'uran? That's the last thing we want anyone to do! What if he decides to cave in to your goading and live by these suras? THEN you'll introduce the Bible?

I am placing the Muslim into a dilemma of conscience when I do that. Those who are claiming that Islam is peaceful, are stating in their own way that the radicals are wrong, and the that people in Gitmo are sociopaths and murderers. In my dealings with Ex-Mormons on this board,they needed to be shown the falseness of their religion before they turned to Christianity.

You and Matthew just agreed that waiting to get into a car wreck before learning to drive properly is unwise.

A more appropriate analogy is turning the channel on TV when something inappropriate comes on. People need to see that the current situation is bad, hence the TV analogy, then they will zap it to another appropriate channel. ALL apologetics (both evidential and propositional) is based on the concept that the person must first be led to see the incompatible things their present beliefs before they can accept the truth found only in Jesus.

Have you read any books on apologetics? Evidence that Demands a Verdict by McDowell is good for the evidentiary apologetics viewpoint and the books by van Til, BB Warfield and the guys from Ligoneer are very good. For the latter GO HERE for the former, GO HERE
http://www.reformed.org/apologetics/

 

[waterloome]

no

 

[turnorburn]

Not evil?

http://www.thedustininmansociety.org/thousand_words/pics_england.html

tob

 

[By Grace]

Re: Is Quran evil work? no

Please explain your reasoning, and then please respond to the quotes from the Qu'ran given on THIS POST

 

[cyberjosh]

What does it say about Jesus?

That's your answer.

I think Deborah has the right answer here. We must consult Scripture for this issue. 1 John 2:22 "Who is the liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, he who denies the Father and the Son." Islam does not acknowledge that Jesus is the son of God. It appears that they actually use his title of "Messiah", anointed one, but do not believe that Jesus was sent from God and has also ascended back to Him. There are a series of inscriptions inside the Dome of the Rock, taken from the Quran, along the octagonal arcade which read "O People of the Book! Do not exaggerate in your religion nor utter aught concerning God save the truth. The Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, was only a Messenger of God, and His Word which He conveyed unto Mary, and a spirit from Him. So believe in God and His messengers, and say not 'Three' - Cease! (it is) better for you! - God is only One God. Far be it removed from His transcendent majesty that He should have a son."

Consider then when weighed against the evidence of Scripture whether this claim about Father God is true: that He cannot have a son. Though they may call him "messiah" yet they deny the Father and the Son as such. What then must our conclusion be from this verse in 1 John 2:22 (And elsewhere in the book of John)?

See these pages about the inscription:

http://www.disciples-of-jesus.net/dome_of_the_rock.html

http://www.islamic-awareness.org/History/Islam/Inscriptions/DoTR.html

 

[By Grace]

no

Wanna change your answer in the face of facts. I just saw this on the Drudge Report

Catholic Priest Beheaded in Syria by Al-Qaeda-Linked Rebels as Men and Children Take Pictures and Cheer


Syrian Catholic priest Francois Murad killed last weekend by jihadi fighters was beheaded, according to a reportt by Catholic Online which is linking to video purportedly showing the brutal murder.


As TheBlaze reported http://www.theblaze.com/blog/2013/06/25/catholic-priest-murdered-by-our-syrian-rebel-allies/ last week, Murad, 49, was setting up a monastery in Gassanieh, northern Syria. Last Sunday, on the Christian leader’s Sabbath, extremist militants trying to topple President Bashar Assad breached the monastery http://syriareport.net/catholic-priest-executed-as-foreign-weapons-flow-into-syria/ and grabbed Murad.


While earlier reports suggested Murad may have been shot to death, Catholic Online reported Saturday: “The Vatican is confirming the death by beheading of Franciscan Father, Francois Murad, who was martyred by Syrian jihadists on June 23.”

The Catholic news service quotes local sources who report that the radical Al-Qaeda-linked Jabhat al-Nusra, or Al-Nusra Front, was behind the savage killing.


In video posted by Live Leak purporting to show the execution, dozens of men and boys are seen cheering on as three men are seated on the ground awaiting their grisly fate.


The men are methodically beheaded one at a time by men holding what appears to be a simple kitchen knife after which the heads are placed on top of the bodies.


According to Catholic Online, the first victim was Murad.


A frenzy ensues, with dozens drawing out their smartphones to capture the bloody scene, as a chorus of Allahu Akbar (“Allah is the greatest”) are sung with jihadi rapture. Several observers are seen moving within inches of the bodies in an effort to capture close-up photos.

<SNIP>

Bob Dylan said it best:

How many years can a mountain exist
Before it is washed to the sea?
Yes, an' how many years can some people exist
Before they're allowed to be free?
Yes, an' how many times must a man turn his head
An' pretend that he just doesn't see?

The answer, my friend, it is blowin' in the wind
An' the answer is blowin' in the wind

​

 

[JCitoL]

Is muslims Quran an evil work?

unfortunately it is more or less a return to the inimical ordinances of the old testament

Blessings

 

[skrwitch]

The Quran is quite evil. Just as most Christians also say. I have a Christian friend who says that Islam isn't evil. Muslim individuals may be evil or not. I have a Muslim friend and he isn't evil, and just peaceful.

 

[a1laserexperts]

Short answer: yes.

 

[By Grace]

I have a Muslim friend and he isn't evil, and just peaceful.

The Quran is quite evil.

How about doing an experiment with that friend?

Show both friends the things that you believe are evil, I created a list of some things in the Qur'an HERE, and then ask them if he agrees that these things are evil. Most likely your Muslim friend will not, but if he does, ask him is he will make a statement of condemnation of those things. That he will NEVER do because to renounce any part of the Qur'an is considered "insulting the prophet" which will make him an infidel, and having a fatwah placed on him calling for his death because he would then be an "infidel".

One dodge that you may get is that the words are in English, not Arabic therefore they are not "translated correctly". So you can ask him for a better translation, or if the English substantially represents the Arabic. Because the laws are different in the UK, I recommend (as an apologist) that you push the issue of written evil in the Qur'an as far as you can go, then ask him if he is comfortable being in a religion that says those sorts of things.

At this stage, all you can do is to plant seeds of doubt by exposing the truth, and let Holy Spirit do His work.

You see it is one thing to be "peaceful", but quite another thing to denounce some hateful and evil things found in the Qur'an if you are a Muslim.

 

[Brother Mike]

No more evil that any other fictional work. The bad guys don't even follow it, but make up their own rules anyway.

Mike.