If nobody knows, why assume it is evil ?
1 John 1:8 addresses those walking in sin-darkness.
Sinners cannot honestly day they have no sin.
Walk in the light, in God, in Whom is no darkness-sin.
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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
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Is repentance needed for salvation?
- Thread starter reddogs
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1 John 1:8 addresses those walking in sin-darkness.
Sinners cannot honestly day they have no sin.
Walk in the light, in God, in Whom is no darkness-sin.
Absolutely.
My repentance from sin was real, so from then on I have been a non-sinner.
God gives the gift of the Holy Ghost to the truly repentant, so I have that great help to keep walking in the light.
Corinth77777
Member
"So if the "turn from" isn't from sin, God won't hear us...right ? (1 Peter 3:12)"
Corinth77777
Member
Hi dan
There is something I'd ask my Dad years ago.
He was a Pastor. And that was If you think you cannot be sinless what's going to make you try?
And of course I am not talking about sinless without the help of the Spirit. And may e I should define that the way I see it later.
However, I believe God wants us to trust Him
Abraham was told to walk before HIM blameless and He'd make a Covenant with Him. And Abraham is the father of us all.
For discussion purposes Let's go to Romans
“O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?”
Romans 7:25
“I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.”...
After reading chapter 7..
Watch what is said in 8 then please share what you see.
Romans 8:1
“There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.”
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin a
“For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:”
That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.”
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[Is repentance needed for salvation?]
It’s good to define terms such as repentance and salvation. You can be saved from your enemies without having repented, or possibly by having repented of your military aims.
Do you mean something like, Is our pre-Christian repentance from our sins, needed to become Christian? For this I don’t think that it is. Though for some it helps to see their sinfulness, the main thing IMO is to see Christ as doorway to the father. I do think that repentance regarding Christ is essential (Jhn.1:12). Biblically μετανοια/metanoia has the core idea of switching around our hearts/minds, a core reorientation. Truly entering the messianic community (Christianity) requires our true welcome-acceptance of messiah whom we had not welcomed before, metanoia. Christianity is one type of salvation.
Do you mean something like, Is our pre-Christian repentance from our sins, needed to enter heaven? For this I don’t think that it is. Ethnic Israel had never felt any eternal need to evangelise Gentiles—did they deem them all inevitably hell bound? The primitive church never felt any eternal need to evangelise Gentiles— did they deem them all inevitably hell bound? God had to kickstart general evangelism through Cornelius to offer the Christian life. Peter switched from parochial to global vision. And as John Calvin said, had Cornelius died before Peter preached, heaven would still have been his home. Heaven is the ultimate type of salvation.
It’s good to define terms such as repentance and salvation. You can be saved from your enemies without having repented, or possibly by having repented of your military aims.
Do you mean something like, Is our pre-Christian repentance from our sins, needed to become Christian? For this I don’t think that it is. Though for some it helps to see their sinfulness, the main thing IMO is to see Christ as doorway to the father. I do think that repentance regarding Christ is essential (Jhn.1:12). Biblically μετανοια/metanoia has the core idea of switching around our hearts/minds, a core reorientation. Truly entering the messianic community (Christianity) requires our true welcome-acceptance of messiah whom we had not welcomed before, metanoia. Christianity is one type of salvation.
Do you mean something like, Is our pre-Christian repentance from our sins, needed to enter heaven? For this I don’t think that it is. Ethnic Israel had never felt any eternal need to evangelise Gentiles—did they deem them all inevitably hell bound? The primitive church never felt any eternal need to evangelise Gentiles— did they deem them all inevitably hell bound? God had to kickstart general evangelism through Cornelius to offer the Christian life. Peter switched from parochial to global vision. And as John Calvin said, had Cornelius died before Peter preached, heaven would still have been his home. Heaven is the ultimate type of salvation.
daninthelionsden
Member
It's all about a relationship with our Lord.
Amen to that.
And notice that Rom 8:2 is the answer to Paul's plaint in Rom 7:23...
Rom 7:23..."But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members."
Rom 8:2..."For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death."
Before, and after.
GodsGrace
CF Ambassador
I agree with you and Calvin in this case.
I just want to say that there were many types like Cornelius throughout history....
Not sure God used him only, but he certainly was the one mentioned in the NT.
Hey All,
Reddogs2, if you do not repent, from what are you being saved? Repentance is the mark of salvation. If you don't love Jesus more than the sin that put Him on the cross, are you really saved? Scripture completely backs up what you have stated. Good job!
Keep walking everybody.
May God bless,
Taz
Reddogs2, if you do not repent, from what are you being saved? Repentance is the mark of salvation. If you don't love Jesus more than the sin that put Him on the cross, are you really saved? Scripture completely backs up what you have stated. Good job!
Keep walking everybody.
May God bless,
Taz
Corinth77777
Member
My interpretation is that one is free from being in bondage only to sin...now with the Spirit you have an out ... For example
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There was once only one way our lives could go..
But given the Spirit there is another way.
Therefore it's a natural law. LIKE, HAVING THE SEED OF AN APPLE TREE GROWS INTO AN APPLE TREE.
.......
ONE DEFINITION OF SIN IS TO MISS THE MARK
DOES ONE MISS THE MARK IN FELLOWSHIP WITH GOD?
Or if they are upholding the law?
Isn't the key about about our conscience being clean before God? 1Peter 3:21, Hebrews 9:13
What I'd say is if one says they will never sin again then they don't need a new body. The scripture does say somewhere: So let the one who thinks he is standing be careful that he does not fall. 1 Cor 10:2
Scripture somewhere 1 Thess 5 says: May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
And my last comment...Adam, I believe was made to be in alignment with God, yet Adam out of Alignment, was seperated from life.
Why? Because the effects of His disobedience now made Him accountable for His actions. Which means He had to pay the price of His disobedience having had open knowledge of God's command?
So how can we receive a clear conscience before God? Putting away the deeds of the flesh by the Spirit...For this brings life.
Does having Life make you sinless...if sinless means without missing the mark? Well there you have it....
Edit..
My fav scripture...God is not the God of the dead but the living...
I agree, though I don't know why you wrote "only to sin", like we are in bondage to more than one thing.
No, as those in fellowship with God are walking in the light. (1 John 1:7)
There is no sin in the light.
If the Law you refer to is "love God with all your soul, heart, and mind; and love your neighbor as you love yourself"...Christians won't miss that mark.
Yes.
Why would you say that ?
The vessel will deteriorate with time, so needs to be replaced by a vessel that won't deteriorate.
Indeed it does.
Paul is not hoping for the impossible.
It brings rebirth from God's seed.
Yes, it does make us sinless, as God's seed cannot bring forth the fruits of the devil.
God is not the God of those dead in trespasses and sins.
Except that is not what that verse is saying. Verse 8 clearly states that believers sin and to deny that, is to be self-deceived and without the truth. More than that, verse 10 says that if we claim to not have sinned, "we make [God] a liar, and his word is not in us."
Never are believers told they are sinless. Not once. They are told if they confess their sins, "[God] is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness" (1 John 1:9, ESV).
It's probably best to not spiritualize a text that is clearly talking about those who are physically dead. Spiritualizing Scripture when there is no warrant to do so will lead to problematic doctrine 10 times out of 10.
You are missing the fact that alternate verses refer to those who walk in the light, God, and those who walk in darkness, sin.
Verse 7 refers to those in God and verse 8 refers to those in sin.
You don't believe in the remission of past sins ?
If someone's past sins have been washed away, they have no sin.
"They" are those walking in sin---darkness.
If they confess and are washed of their past sins by the blood of Christ, they too can start walking in the light...which is God in whom is no darkness.
What are you talking about ?
Your misinterpretation denies men the ability to walk in God.
Corinth77777
Member
What I was trying emphasize by the term "only"...was it was to the Law of sin...seeing that you wrote it and what you believe. I explain afterwards that we exist with only oneway to turn out until we Have the word another seed we can nourish. I was just explaining how in a sense, one is freed from sin. Meaning it's not that sin disappeared but one can now choose not to serve sin. The ability is there. As one may ask Can Jesus sin. He most likely can but would not because of His nature.
Referring to the verse
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Ok, though our freedom from the law of sin also frees us from committing sin.
OK, and that way is continued dead in sins.
If one is freed from the law of sin they won't sin again.
Seeing as it is the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus that makes us free, (Rom 8:2), it indicates that we are no longer walking in and after the flesh, but in and after the Spirit.
Those walking in the light won't walk in darkness.
You didn't reply ?
Corinth77777
Member
I think that we are at the Mercy of our own Ideals.
.....
I think at that point as one scripture states in
Deuteronomy 30-19: We can now choose not to be in bondage -because we have God's seed. Which is the way out if one chooses to follow that way and remain in Him.
Duet
Deuteronomy 30:19
"I am now giving you the choice between life and death, between God's blessing and God's curse, and I call heaven and earth to witness the choice you make..."
Basically Yes
That's not how I interpret that- you are free only because you have a way of escape. You now have a choice.
For example: if you know of the board came checkers. Sometimes you don't have no other move with one checker until your opponent must jump your other men. Now your checker has a way of escape. So its not in bondage because a way of escape was made.
While that may be true, I believe you must choose to follow for that to be the case.
The Spirit of Life is IN Christ Jesus
"I am the vine; you are the branches. If a man remains in me and I in him, he will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing. If anyone does not remain in me, he is like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned."
Well you are putting 2 diff passages together that I do not believe mean the same thing..The law of the life giving Spirit is a natural law, that you will be tranformed to the image of Christ as you remain; meaning take your substence from it. I believe its what one attached themselve to.
For example an Apple seed natural (law)procees ends in becoming an apple tree as long as certain conditions are met; Soil, water, and Sun.
But for the fact that many are at the mercy of their own ideals, all things do not always come to what they are intended to be.
Why for example do some flowering plant seeds start to grow but then die.
this is true by itself
I was just indicating the passage that I was referencing, " the law of the life giving spirit"
So what happens when a Christian committs sin, as I can guarantee you that everyone including every Christian, me especially included, has sinned whether intentionally, unintentionally, knowing or unknowingly just yesterday. How do you justify that. And there is no verse that connects being free from the law equates being free from sin.
Have you sinned since your salvation? Would you say that you were still in freedom from the law when you sinned?
That doesn't really make any sense......
It is our choice on whether or not to be perfectly obedient to God.
Those that have found the escape have already made their choice.
Jesus did the "jumping" for us.
Our freedom from sin is His legacy.
Of course.
It is our choice of whether or not to flourish or be cast away.
How can that be, as it is the law of the Spirit in Christ Jesus that makes us free from the law of sin and death ? (Ro 8:2)
How is that a natural law ?
I see that transformation happening instantly, at one's rebirth from God's seed.
An apple seed has no choice but to be an apple tree, and God's seed has no choice but to bear Godly fruit.
I have no idea what that means.
Because it is of this natural, fallen, world.
Yes, it is...especially since afterward this is written..."and he cannot sin, because he is born of God." (1 John 3:9)
OK.
They don't commit sin, because they have been reborn from God's seed. (1 John 3:9)
As James makes it clear that sin requires lust, temptation, enticement, and conception, (James 1:14-15), it isn't possible for any sin to be committed without knowledge of it happening.
My "salvation" will be granted on the last day.
A better question would have been..."Have you sinned since your conversion, or, rebirth from God's seed?"
My answer is NO.
To the glory of God and the name of Jesus Christ !
Tenchi
Member
Well, be careful not to layer on stuff that isn't contained within the idea of repentance. Repentance simply means to change your mind, your thinking, about something. In the case of salvation, repentance means that you change your mind about the fact that you're a sinner in desperate need of a Savior; that the sin in your life is, in fact, sin; that God is real and will judge all unrepentant sinners, casting them into eternal hell; that God has made a way through Christ to reconcile sinners to Himself, making it possible for them to escape eternal punishment for their sin. About these things (and others) the lost sinner must change his mind - repent - forsaking old beliefs and values and taking up new ones presented to him in the Gospel and the Bible more broadly.
What repentance does NOT include is changed behavior. Genuine repentance leads to a change in behavior, but repentance comes before this change and is distinct from it. When people add onto repentance a changed life, they smuggle in a kind of works-salvation, making their conduct the basis for their salvation, rather than the perfect atoning work of Christ on the cross. But Scripture is crystal clear that no one is saved on the basis of their deeds:
Titus 3:5-7
5 he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,
6 whom he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
7 so that being justified by his grace we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
2 Timothy 1:9
9 who saved us and called us to a holy calling, not because of our works but because of his own purpose and grace, which he gave us in Christ Jesus before the ages began,
Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,
9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Nowhere in the New Testament is a lost sinner "cleaning up their act" ever made a part of being "born-again." Be very careful, then, that in urging people to repent, you don't encourage them into a false Gospel of works-salvation, too.