Jesus Is God: Part 1

[Randy]

This is God himself who made man from the dust of the earth, and he made a body for himself from one of His own creations. Jesus is God with us on earth.

The Father prepared the body for Jesus. Jesus is NOT the Father.
Therefore, when Christ came into the world, he said: “Sacrifice and offering you did not desire, but a body you prepared for me;

"Father into your hands I commit My spirit"

The Father created through Jesus or by Jesus in the beginning. The Deity in Jesus is the Fathers the only true God.

 

[Cooper]

The Father prepared the body for Jesus. Jesus is NOT the Father.
Therefore, when Christ came into the world, he said: “Sacrifice and offering you did not desire, but a body you prepared for me;

"Father into your hands I commit My spirit"

The Father created through Jesus or by Jesus in the beginning. The Deity in Jesus is the Fathers the only true God.

Yes. We know the God of the Jews needed a body preparing for the one who was to be (a) the perfect sacrifice to take away their sins and (b) the one to rule over them for ever. His name on earth was Jesus.

(26) And in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God unto a city of Galilee, named Nazareth,
(27) To a virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin's name was Mary.
(28) And the angel came in unto her, and said, Hail, thou that art highly favoured, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.
(29) And when she saw him, she was troubled at his saying, and cast in her mind what manner of salutation this should be.
(30) And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favour with God.
(31) And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS.
(32) He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:
(33) And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end. Luke 1:26-33
(The house of Jacob is the nation of Israel. This is your God you are talking about. He pre-existed his birth on earth so that a body could be prepared for him.)

 

[eddif]

Here's some more food for thought. In His letters to the churches Paul opens with a greeting. It's something to the effect, grace to you and peace from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. If we have three, separate, distinct, persons, why doesn't Paul ever mention the third person? Why doesn't he say, grace to you and Peace From God the Father, the Lord Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit?

This isn't proof, but one does have to wonder why Paul would leave out this greeting where you'd expect one if he believed in three persons of a Trinity.

John 16:13 kjv
13. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

The Holy Spirit does not make statements from himself. There will be no greeting from the Holy Spirit.

eddif

 

[Randy]

Yes. We know the God of the Jews needed a body preparing for the one who was to be (a) the perfect sacrifice to take away their sins and (b) the one to rule over them for ever. His name on earth was Jesus.

(26) And in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God unto a city of Galilee, named Nazareth,
(27) To a virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin's name was Mary.
(28) And the angel came in unto her, and said, Hail, thou that art highly favoured, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.
(29) And when she saw him, she was troubled at his saying, and cast in her mind what manner of salutation this should be.
(30) And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favour with God.
(31) And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS.
(32) He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:
(33) And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end. Luke 1:26-33
(The house of Jacob is the nation of Israel. This is your God you are talking about. He pre-existed his birth on earth so that a body could be prepared for him.)

Yet you wrote =>This is God himself who made man from the dust of the earth, and he made a body for himself from one of His own creations. Jesus is God with us on earth.

When in fact the one who Jesus came to do the will of (the Father) prepared a body for Jesus.

I believe Mary conceived by the Holy Spirit.

 

[Butch5]

John 16:13 kjv
13. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

The Holy Spirit does not make statements from himself. There will be no greeting from the Holy Spirit.

eddif

I didn't say the Holy Breath (Spirit) would greet people. I was talking about the apostle Paul's greetings. He wishes the churches grace and peace from the Father and the Son, but never mentions the Holy Spirit. If the Holy Spirit is a third person we'd expect Paul to wish grace and peace from him too.

 

[Butch5]

Here's some more food for thought. Jesus said,

'All things were delivered to me by my Father, and none doth know the Son, except the Father, nor doth any know the Father, except the Son, and he to whom the Son may wish to reveal Him. (Matt. 11:27 YLT)

Jesus said no one knows the Son but the Father and no one knows the Father but the Son. If we have three, coequal, coeternal, persons, how can it be that the Holy Breath (Spirit) doesn't know the Father or the Son?

Some may say, the Son revealed the Father to the Breath (Spirit). But, if that's the case then it indicates that there was a time when the Breath (Spirit) didn't know the Father. But, if they are three, coequal, coeternal, persons all of one God, how can that be?

 

[Cooper]

Yet you wrote =>This is God himself who made man from the dust of the earth, and he made a body for himself from one of His own creations. Jesus is God with us on earth.

When in fact the one who Jesus came to do the will of (the Father) prepared a body for Jesus.

I believe Mary conceived by the Holy Spirit.

Jesus is the I AM from the foundation of the earth that was created by His Word.

 

[Cooper]

Here's some more food for thought. Jesus said,

'All things were delivered to me by my Father, and none doth know the Son, except the Father, nor doth any know the Father, except the Son, and he to whom the Son may wish to reveal Him. (Matt. 11:27 YLT)

Jesus said no one knows the Son but the Father and no one knows the Father but the Son. If we have three, coequal, coeternal, persons, how can it be that the Holy Breath (Spirit) doesn't know the Father or the Son?

Some may say, the Son revealed the Father to the Breath (Spirit). But, if that's the case then it indicates that there was a time when the Breath (Spirit) didn't know the Father. But, if they are three, coequal, coeternal, persons all of one God, how can that be?

God is Spirit, He is the Father, and Jesus was born of the Spirit, in whom the Father dwells. Jesus and the Father are One. It was the Father in Jesus who turned the water into wine, stilled the waves, and raised the dead. Jesus is God with us and people disrespect him.
.

 

[Randy]

Jesus is the I AM from the foundation of the earth that was created by His Word.

You have multiple sources in the NT that speak of the Father AND Jesus (Son) in the creation. From whom - Father Through Whom -Son

I myself am interested in the truth. If you want to believe Jesus is the Father your free to do so but I don't share your view.

 

[Cooper]

You have multiple sources in the NT that speak of the Father AND Jesus (Son) in the creation. From whom - Father Through Whom -Son

I myself am interested in the truth. If you want to believe Jesus is the Father your free to do so but I don't share your view.

You are right to seek the truth. I had an interesting conversation with a Trinitarian this morning. It ended when I pointed out that Father, Son, and Spirit are three titles of the One God and not three persons. Believe you me, there is only one God, He came down, this is the creator, from heaven's glory and taking on human flesh made himself visible and we call him Son. People think we worship three gods, but nothing could be further from the truth. The One God is the 'I AM.' He appeared to Moses, and he identified as the 'AM' on earth. They crucified him because he claimed to be God and Jesus never lied. Now remind this old man what we are arguing about.

 

[jaybo]

God is Spirit, He is the Father, and Jesus was born of the Spirit, in whom the Father dwells. Jesus and the Father are One. It was the Father in Jesus who turned the water into wine, stilled the waves, and raised the dead. Jesus is God with us and people disrespect him.
.

My Bible says that it was Jesus who turned the water into wine, not God, His father.

John 2:7-11, " Jesus told the servants, "Fill the water jars with water.” So they filled them up to the very top. Then he told them, “Now draw some out and take it to the head steward,” and they did. 9 When the head steward tasted the water that had been turned to wine, not knowing where it came from (though the servants who had drawn the water knew), he called the bridegroom and said to him, “Everyone] serves the good wine first, and then the cheaper wine when the guests are drunk. You have kept the good wine until now!” Jesus did this as the first of his miraculous signs in Cana of Galilee. In this way he revealed his glory, and his disciples believed in him." NET

It's not a good idea to add to (or detract from) what Scripture clearly says.

 

[Randy]

You are right to seek the truth. I had an interesting conversation with a Trinitarian this morning. It ended when I pointed out that Father, Son, and Spirit are three titles of the One God and not three persons. Believe you me, there is only one God, He came down, this is the creator, from heaven's glory and taking on human flesh made himself visible and we call him Son. People think we worship three gods, but nothing could be further from the truth. The One God is the 'I AM.' He appeared to Moses, and he identified as the 'AM' on earth. They crucified him because he claimed to be God and Jesus never lied. Now remind this old man what we are arguing about.

As I stated you are free to believe Jesus is the Father. It's not a view I share. I also believe its not a view that Jesus shares either. If it was then that would be my testimony as well as I follow Him.

 

[Cooper]

As I stated you are free to believe Jesus is the Father. It's not a view I share. I also believe its not a view that Jesus shares either. If it was then that would be my testimony as well as I follow Him.

They crucified Jesus because he claimed to be God, but you follow him, believing him to be a man. I would never follow any man.

 

[Cooper]

My Bible says that it was Jesus who turned the water into wine, not God, His father.

John 2:7-11, " Jesus told the servants, "Fill the water jars with water.” So they filled them up to the very top. Then he told them, “Now draw some out and take it to the head steward,” and they did. 9 When the head steward tasted the water that had been turned to wine, not knowing where it came from (though the servants who had drawn the water knew), he called the bridegroom and said to him, “Everyone] serves the good wine first, and then the cheaper wine when the guests are drunk. You have kept the good wine until now!” Jesus did this as the first of his miraculous signs in Cana of Galilee. In this way he revealed his glory, and his disciples believed in him." NET

It's not a good idea to add to (or detract from) what Scripture clearly says.

Jesus did what no man can do. He manifest His glory and revealed to men that He was indeed God, manifest in the flesh. So you won’t be telling me Jesus was just a man, will you?
.

 

[jaybo]

Jesus did what no man can do. He manifest His glory and revealed to men that He was indeed God, manifest in the flesh. So you won’t be telling me Jesus was just a man, will you?
.

Nice try in changing the subject! You claimed that it was the Father in Jesus who turned the water into wine, which, as I pointed out, is contrary to Scripture. I never claimed that "Jesus was just a man"; those are your words, not mine.

I will not engage in some meaningless debate with you.

 

[Cooper]

Nice try in changing the subject! You claimed that it was the Father in Jesus who turned the water into wine, which, as I pointed out, is contrary to Scripture. I never claimed that "Jesus was just a man"; those are your words, not mine.

I will not engage in some meaningless debate with you.

It has to be God in him, it shouldn't need saying, unless of course Jesus is God with us in the likeness of man as the Bible says.

 

[Randy]

They crucified Jesus because he claimed to be God, but you follow him, believing him to be a man. I would never follow any man.

You have read everything I have posted in this thread about Jesus. You think I follow just a man?

He is the Son of God and Gods Christ. He is not the Father nor did He claim to be the Father.

But Jesus remained silent and gave no answer. Again the high priest asked him, “Are you the Messiah, the Son of the Blessed One?”
“I am,” said Jesus. “And you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”

63The high priest tore his clothes. “Why do we need any more witnesses?” he asked. 64“You have heard the blasphemy. What do you think?”

They all condemned him as worthy of death. 65Then some began to spit at him; they blindfolded him, struck him with their fists, and said, “Prophesy!” And the guards took him and beat him.

 

[Cooper]

You have read everything I have posted in this thread about Jesus. You think I follow just a man?

He is the Son of God and Gods Christ. He is not the Father nor did He claim to be the Father.

But Jesus remained silent and gave no answer. Again the high priest asked him, “Are you the Messiah, the Son of the Blessed One?”
“I am,” said Jesus. “And you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”

63The high priest tore his clothes. “Why do we need any more witnesses?” he asked. 64“You have heard the blasphemy. What do you think?”

They all condemned him as worthy of death. 65Then some began to spit at him; they blindfolded him, struck him with their fists, and said, “Prophesy!” And the guards took him and beat him.

Why do you think they accused Jesus of Blasphemy? Do you think maybe he implied he was God.
1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Failing that, perhaps you can accept Jesus is the creator.
John 1:3 All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.

Colossians 1:16 For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him.

John 1:10 He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him.

 

[Edward]

As I stated you are free to believe Jesus is the Father. It's not a view I share. I also believe its not a view that Jesus shares either. If it was then that would be my testimony as well as I follow Him.

That's right. Jesus said, I go to my Father. I go to my God and your God...

He is not talking about the same person or Himself! This makes it clear. And then we have Holy Spirit Holy Spirit Holy Spirit sprinkled all throughout the scriptures, so...yes. There is three of them. But it's still one God. One Godship.

It's a Monarchy. But you still have to obey His Son also! Same house rules.

 

[JLB]

The One God is the 'I AM.' He appeared to Moses, and he identified as the 'AM' on earth.

And the scriptures teach us it is Jesus who is the I AM.


Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad.”
Then the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?”
Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”
Then they took up stones to throw at Him; but Jesus hid Himself and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by. John 8:56-59




JLB