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electedbyhim said:
Believe as you will.

You should look in the mirror before you point fingers.

Shall I bring up your past embarassments in some of the Reformed threads?

How would any of this advance the Lords Kingdom?

Aren't we all sinful humans that make fools of ourselves from time to time.

Grace and peace to you.
Click to expand...

lets see these "embarrassments" :cool
 
GodsGrace said:
electedbyhim
SolaScriptura

Just want to say that this thread was allowed Not to denigrate JM, who might even deserve it, but to maybe discuss how churches could let us down as Christians.

How about powerful pastors,,,
Too much power?
Any solution?

All denominations are afflicted by this problem.
Click to expand...
All people are affected by sin.

All Pastors have sin.

I believe this thread was created with intent to denigrate Macarthur. However people will believe whatever they read.

Great men of God get persecuted and slandered for preaching truth. They make bad decisons and even sin. We see this troughout the Bible.

We will always be disappointed with people. I have learned this at a very young age.

Grace and peace to you.
 
GodsGrace said:
electedbyhim
SolaScriptura

Just want to say that this thread was allowed Not to denigrate JM, who might even deserve it, but to maybe discuss how churches could let us down as Christians.

How about powerful pastors,,,
Too much power?
Any solution?

All denominations are afflicted by this problem.
Click to expand...

Greetings! I do NOT dislike JM, and do listen to him sometimes as he is a solid teacher on many issues.

However, people like him and Alistair Begg, can get too "big" in themselves, and their "followers", seem to accept any nonsense that they might say!

JM did rightly call out Begg for his "advice" to the lady who called him, regarding attending a "trans wedding", which does not even exist! Begg said that she should do, and even take a gift!!! This is WRONG Biblically! However, a few years ago, JM was asked about baking a cake for a "homosexual wedding", and said that it was not a sin!!! TOTALLY WRONG!

We are living in a time where the Holy Bible is being attacked as never before, and some of the Foundation Doctrines, like the Trinity and Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit being YHWH, etc, etc. We who hold to the Great Truths taught in The ONLY Infallible Word of God, the 66 Books that God the Holy Spirit Inspired, must stand firm in what it says, and in no way compromise in this VERY WICKED and EVIL world, where UNGODLINESS is encouraged, and even rewarded by people and governments, and those who hold to God's Eternal Truths, are persecuted and even punished! It is our duty to stand firmly on the Word of God, and He will indeed bless us, and save very needy souls!
 
SolaScriptura said:
Greetings! I do NOT dislike JM, and do listen to him sometimes as he is a solid teacher on many issues.

However, people like him and Alistair Begg, can get too "big" in themselves, and their "followers", seem to accept any nonsense that they might say!

JM did rightly call out Begg for his "advice" to the lady who called him, regarding attending a "trans wedding", which does not even exist! Begg said that she should do, and even take a gift!!! This is WRONG Biblically! However, a few years ago, JM was asked about baking a cake for a "homosexual wedding", and said that it was not a sin!!! TOTALLY WRONG!

We are living in a time where the Holy Bible is being attacked as never before, and some of the Foundation Doctrines, like the Trinity and Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit being YHWH, etc, etc. We who hold to the Great Truths taught in The ONLY Infallible Word of God, the 66 Books that God the Holy Spirit Inspired, must stand firm in what it says, and in no way compromise in this VERY WICKED and EVIL world, where UNGODLINESS is encouraged, and even rewarded by people and governments, and those who hold to God's Eternal Truths, are persecuted and even punished! It is our duty to stand firmly on the Word of God, and He will indeed bless us, and save very needy souls!
Click to expand...
I agree.
Just let's not break TOS snd get this locked.
Keep it general.
 
SolaScriptura said:
Greetings! I do NOT dislike JM, and do listen to him sometimes as he is a solid teacher on many issues.

However, people like him and Alistair Begg, can get too "big" in themselves, and their "followers", seem to accept any nonsense that they might say!

JM did rightly call out Begg for his "advice" to the lady who called him, regarding attending a "trans wedding", which does not even exist! Begg said that she should do, and even take a gift!!! This is WRONG Biblically! However, a few years ago, JM was asked about baking a cake for a "homosexual wedding", and said that it was not a sin!!! TOTALLY WRONG!

We are living in a time where the Holy Bible is being attacked as never before, and some of the Foundation Doctrines, like the Trinity and Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit being YHWH, etc, etc. We who hold to the Great Truths taught in The ONLY Infallible Word of God, the 66 Books that God the Holy Spirit Inspired, must stand firm in what it says, and in no way compromise in this VERY WICKED and EVIL world, where UNGODLINESS is encouraged, and even rewarded by people and governments, and those who hold to God's Eternal Truths, are persecuted and even punished! It is our duty to stand firmly on the Word of God, and He will indeed bless us, and save very needy souls!
Click to expand...
There is a couple different videos out there.

One video where he says is ok gets cut off towards the end, it is not the full video of the conference. I will be searching for that full video at some point.

The second conference video, which is newer, I have watched in full some time ago, Macarthur says it is a sin.

Both videos Macarthur stresses it being a conscience issue and violating the conscience. The second video was more in depth.

I do agree it would be a sin to bake a cake for a gay wedding, also do not agree with Pastor beggs position on the transgender wedding.

Around 2014 or so the hotel I was working for as Executive Chef was sold out for the "gay games" The "games" were held at a hotel in downtown Cleveland, Ohio, so we got the overflow because it was booked completely. The hotel I was at is about 12 miles south of Cleveland. If anyone knows anything about the games, they will know about the debauchery and perversion that goes on.

I remember having a an issue with this if we had to provide food (banquets) for this event. providing food for this crowd would have violated my conscience therefore I would have to resign from my position. Though it turned out that they never had a banquet order and I was grateful.

We also had the log cabin members of the Republican party in 2016 book our hotel for the republican nation convention in Cleveland at the time. They also did not book any banquet events. Looking back at this, if they did book a food event, would that be a sin for me to prepare food for them given thier stance on homosexula and perversion issues? I would have to say it probably would have.

I say all this because it does touch home to me.

Pastor Beggs church is about 5 miles from my house, and I have been there many many times. I have cosidered becoming a member of his church because he is very sound in his preaching. Those comments he has made about the transgender wedding was sinful in my opinion.

There are many churches in my town and the surrounding areas. They are either seeker-friendly, Pentecosta/charismatic, methodist and the like.

I have been to a Baptist church in the area, but the preaching just did nothing for me.

So, it comes down to if I join Pastor Beggs church will it violate my conscience in sin because of his comments that i completely do not agree with?

What do others believe on this decision I am going through.

I apologize that I went off on a tangent.
 
Christ_empowered said:
One follows Jesus Christ not pastors. If he’s the best around and of God then I’d personally join…
Click to expand...
And if the best around is quicksand ? Would it be like blind leading blind both falling ?
Or if the best around is "bad company"? Bad company does not let a good moral upright person remain upright nor truthful. Bad company corrupts <even> good morals.
 
Last edited:
Christ_empowered said:
One follows Jesus Christ not pastors.
Click to expand...
I agree that we are to follow Christ.

He did give us Pastors as Shepherds as well.

It seems that I come off as a follower of pastors ad theologians, and I am.

I understand most Christians frown on this and think it is not good for me to do. My authority is the word of God of which I read and study more than listening to sermons of Pastors.

It is no just Macarthur and Begg I listen to and read.

Just to name a few.

Martyn Lloyd Jones
Spurgeon
S. Lewis Johnson
James Boice
Steve Lawson
John Owen
John Calvin
John Frame
Louis Sperry Chafer

So if "following" these men is wrong in the eyes of other Christians, then I am in the wrong in their eyes.

Ultimately the only thing that matters to me is that the Lord knows my heart and motives. My conscience is clear.

Jeremiah 17:10 “I, Yahweh, search the heart; I test the inmost being, Even to give to each man according to his ways, According to the fruit of his deeds.

Psalm 139:23-24 Search me, O God, and know my heart; Try me and know my anxious thoughts; And see if there be any hurtful way in me, And lead me in the everlasting way.

If he’s the best around and of God then I’d personally join…
Click to expand...

Begg is the best around here. Parkside is a very large chruch. I have issues with a ton of people in a setting, but I can overcome these issues by through the Lord.
 
GodsGrace said:
How about powerful pastors,,,
Too much power?
Any solution?

All denominations are afflicted by this problem.
Click to expand...
See in Ephesians, Corinthians, Colossians, and the other Epistles/Letters in the NT
what to do and/or say. God is Direct, not round-a-bout, in exposing any wickedness and warning
disciples of Jesus not to take part in any darkness (at all?) .... but rather expose it.
 
follower said:
And if the best around is quicksand ? Would it be like blind leading blind both falling ?
Or if the best around is "bad company"? Bad company does not let a good moral upright person remain upright not truthful. Bad company corrupts <even> good morals.
Click to expand...
All Pastors have sin, as all regenerated people do.

Where does one draw the line?
 
electedbyhim said:
I agree that we are to follow Christ.

He did give us Pastors as Shepherds as well.

It seems that I come off as a follower of pastors ad theologians, and I am.
Click to expand...
One thought here , if you are following a pastor or theologian you need to be sure they are following Christ . Otherwise you will find yourself following a man only and not Christ .

Yes , God has sent us some great teachers and pastors to listen to and learn from , but should we follow them in the same way that we follow Christ , no .

electedbyhim , when you first came on here at the forum you would post great portions of commentary and others writings , but now you are speaking your thoughts as the Holy Spirit reveals things to you . Praise God I am glad to see it !

I was prompted to ask you a question about a post you made and answer you gave was very inspirational !
Every one should read this .

So , how personal is your relationship with God electedbyhim ?
 
electedbyhim said:
All Pastors have sin, as all regenerated people do.

Where does one draw the line?
Click to expand...
Where? or When? - See in Scripture there are no thieves, no liars, no adulterers, no perverts, and no idolators in heaven to come.

See in Scripture the Creator's Instructions for the assemblies of His disciples - particularly

if anyone claims to be a brother, yet does not repent, put them out of the fellowship so

the whole assembly is not tarnished by their sin.
 
hawkman said:
One thought here , if you are following a pastor or theologian you need to be sure they are following Christ . Otherwise you will find yourself following a man only and not Christ .

Yes , God has sent us some great teachers and pastors to listen to and learn from , but should we follow them in the same way that we follow Christ , no .

electedbyhim , when you first came on here at the forum you would post great portions of commentary and others writings , but now you are speaking your thoughts as the Holy Spirit reveals things to you . Praise God I am glad to see it !

I was prompted to ask you a question about a post you made and answer you gave was very inspirational !
Every one should read this .

So , how personal is your relationship with God electedbyhim ?
Click to expand...
Thank you.

I cannot convey my thoughts through words and I have never been eloquent in speech. I have always used commentaries on what I agree with. These men are more educated and knowledgable than me and I can relate to their writings.

At one time in my brief life of being a Christian (19 years?), I thought I had the calling to the Pastorate, to make a long story short. I was in Gadsden, Alabama and a Baptist church was looking for a Pastor. For some reason or other I was asked to preach/teach the congregation.

I was scared out of my mind, because I cannot convey thoughts and ideas through speech, or so I thought.

I preached on Acts 2:42 and following, I studied the passages in prayer for over 40 hours. Anyhow, I was very frustrated and in fear of facing a congregation and getting it wrong and not being able to speak.

The day came and I went to the pulpit with pages of notes, I preached over an hour and when I was done they were shocked because they (Baptist) have never heard anyone preach like that before. I did not stick around for more then a few minutes to here the comments and promptly almost ran throught the front door.

I reflected on that moment in time and remembered what the Lord said in John 14:26 “But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you. I also recalled moses and his stutterin issues. As I have seen from my own life being a Pastor was not my calling and I was self-deceived in that gift.

I went on a tangent again apologies.

Thank you again for the kind words.
 
follower said:
Where? or When? - See in Scripture there are no thieves, no liars, no adulterers, no perverts, and no idolators in heaven to come.

See in Scripture the Creator's Instructions for the assemblies of His disciples - particularly

if anyone claims to be a brother, yet does not repent, put them out of the fellowship so

the whole assembly is not tarnished by their sin.
Click to expand...
Can you clarify?

Do Christians fall into sin?
 
A counter view can be found here:

What To Make Of Hohn Cho Versus Grace Community Church?

Ultimately Hohn Cho has charged GCC to “do justice” with Eileen Gray who was excommunicated using Matthew 18 on the basis of unsubstantiated refusal to reconcile her marriage. If Eileen Gray never confided anything that David Gray would eventually be charged with and refused to cooperate with...
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