You realize, I hope, that I have my own opinions, yes?
Got a scripture for that ?
Why would I have a scripture for what would be going on in the church for the next 300-400 years plus? I'm referring to church history.
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https://christianforums.net/threads/charismatic-bible-studies-1-peter-2-11-17.109823/
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Got a scripture for that ?
I hope you are not saying that Paul's Tom 7:24 complaint wasn't answered in Rom 6:6.You realize, I hope, that I have my own opinions, yes?
You did say "early church", and most of their issues were addressed in the epistles.Why would I have a scripture for what would be going on in the church for the next 300-400 years plus? I'm referring to church history.
I hope you are not saying that Paul's Tom 7:24 complaint wasn't answered in Rom 6:6.
You did say "early church", and most of their issues were addressed in the epistles.
I hate to see you building on sand.And I hope you will excuse me if I'm not all that interested in debating the issue if I think it's going to be little more than a long, drawn out waste of time. No offense and certainly nothing personal in any of the instances, but I've declined it a few times already, not just with you.
Early church to me is just what is written in the bible.The term "Early church" refers to the ante-Nicean period.
Early Christianity - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
Early church to me is just what is written in the bible.
Anything after that is suspect.
I agree, but with the Holy Ghost's help.The early church in the next generation took their cues and their theology from a proper understanding of the apostles and their teachings.
I think the break-aways started well before John died.See, there are some who come under the strange notion that the church was receiving instruction from the Holy Spirit up until the time John passed away, and then all of a sudden the lights went out, and the church descended immediately into darkness and heresy.
My early church dads all had their writings published in the bible.This is a deeply illogical assumption to make, and is based on a faulty interpretation of New Testament teachings, IMO, not because there is any real truth in it. I've read the writings of the early fathers, and they are much more powerful and much more consistent with New Testament teaching than most of what you will hear today.
One drop of darkness taints the entire mixture.It reads much more like scripture because their teachings were much more grounded in scripture. Granted, they began to diverge in various ways, a little here, a little there, until things started getting increasingly corrupted by around 250 to 300 A.D. But the notion that they went from total light into total darkness in the blink of an eye is just an incredibly illogical conclusion to make, and it doesn't bear out when reading the writings of the early church, especially the first 200 years of it.
Walking in the Spirit after the destruction of the "flesh" accomplishes the same thing.That said, fasting was universally understood to be the answer for bringing the sex drive under submission. They didn't make it up. It was passed down.
Whom do you cite on the fasting methodology ?I'm presuming you will ask for scriptures at this point, and maybe we can cover several of the passages that teach it some day, but for now I know how it will go, and I'd rather wait. Just answering your direct comment. It's a common position, but it's highly flawed IMO.
I agree, but with the Holy Ghost's help.
I think the break-aways started well before John died.
The real church is still pure.
My early church dads all had their writings published in the bible.
The things that followed seem to be dilutions of holiness and accommodations for sin.
One drop of darkness taints the entire mixture.
Walking in the Spirit after the destruction of the "flesh" accomplishes the same thing.
And Paul wrote of that earlier than the late comers.
Whom do you cite on the fasting methodology ?
Yep.Ok... curious statement. I'm assuming you are saying John was pure,
Gnostic, and whatever else was coming down the pike that differed from the apostles writings.so are you talking about Gnostic documents that were being published that early or ones attributable to early church leaders?
If they are indeed Christian leaders, their writings will mirror the apostles' writings.Fine by me. I'm easy. But for the sake of discussing this issue without getting bogged down in semantics, what term do you wish to use to define Christian leaders between the late 1st century and the early 4th?
Peter was in the unenviable position of hosting Jewish visitors who were still under the undue influence of the Law.One drop of darkness....
One drop of darkness can occur very easily in the teachings of a Christian, even a strong one. Peter was allowing the Gentile Christians to be marginalized when Jewish leaders came to visit Christian congregations where Gentiles were present. He drew back from them and had to be corrected for it by Paul. under the undue influence of the Law
That is correct.You are saying you have not a single drop of darkness in any of your teachings, Hopeful? Because if you have a drop of darkness, the above statement kinda makes you liable.
As I have no writings, per se, I don't know what writings you are referring to.By your own standards your teachings would disqualify you from being read, yes?
Will God accept any sinner on the day of judgement ? (Matt 7:21-23)I like many others in this community disagree with you on the doctrine of sinless perfection, if that's what you are ultimately alluding to. Not gonna get into it with you, but no it does not accomplish the same thing.
Would you kindly provide one of your NT verses that deal with fasting to decrease anything ?Several New Testament passages, several Old Testament passages, several early "dad" sources, some from the Medieval period, and several modern sources, including those who have done lab studies on the effects of decreased diet on the sex drive.
As I have no writings, per se, I don't know what writings you are referring to.
Some articles said that fasting increases libido,so who knows?.
Yeah, I guess we could consider my forum entries as writings.Everything you post at Cf.Net and other forums.
Would you kindly provide one of your NT verses that deal with fasting to decrease anything ?
I do think fasting is a great way to remind the body that the mind is in control !
Fasting increases HGH within the body. Which could temporarily increase testosterone. It makes sense because if you're starving, you need that extra strength and energy to find a food source.Just use this as your search engine;'Early Christians Fasted To Decrease Sex Drive',there is some interesting reading.The one article stated that fasting to decrease libido was used by Monks.Some articles said that fasting increases libido,so who knows?.Well,Time for breakfast.
OK, perhaps when you get some time you can start a thread.I can try later. There are several passages that advise and recommend it which either go almost completely under the radar or are misinterpreted to say the opposite. If I have time and the Lord leads me, I'd certainly like to discuss it. I don't agree with your theology in some areas, but I do like the fact that you usually have a positive attitude about you, so we'll see.
Blessings in Christ,
- H
I will, however, stand by...the mind controls the body, and not the other way around.
I agree, with this verse from Paul in mind..."... but we have the mind of Christ."Actually, my position here is that the Spirit controls the body,
Agreed....and without the Holy Spirit a man will simply gravitate towards the desires of the flesh even if his mind objects for some reason. It won't have all that much power to change things, unless an even greater fleshly or soulish objective is being sought, in which case, it's just trading one non-Spirit-led desire for another.
Your welcome.But that might be another interesting discussion for another time.
I appreciate the politeness, and blessings in Christ.
- H
There is nothing that God can't do. Period.Is that something then, that God can't do ?
Why then, do you postulate He can't take away a "human" drive ?There is nothing that God can't do. Period.
If one can't "contain", let him marry !But there are some things He WON'T do.
To keep it on topic, there is a passage in the gospels that deals with this:
Matthew 19:10
The disciples *said to Him, “If the relationship of the man with his wife is like this, it is better not to marry.” 11 But He said to them, “Not all men can accept this statement, but only those to whom it has been given.
I will not defend a work of the "flesh".Now pair that up with what Paul said:
1 Corinthians 7:7
Yet I wish that all men were even as I myself am. However, each man has his own gift from God, one in this manner, and another in that.
Note that both say marriage and sex in marriage is a gift. Paul uses the word charisma meaning a supernatural gift, not unlike his use of it in chapter 12 for healings and miracles. Our Lord said it was ONLY "to those to whom it has been given." Yes there is a supernatural gift of celibacy. But, like healings and miracles, it is rare.
IOW, if you have that gift you can go without.
If you do NOT have that gift but try to operate in it, you will have as much success as trying to heal someone on your own.