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Paganism...

E

essentials

Member
So im in the mood for researching and posting today. What do you think of Paganism? According to one website Pagans believe in honoring all earth-based religions, such as Wicca, for example. Another website even said the Cross symbol was used in Paganism before it was used in Christianity. What do you think? You can also read about such controversies as "Christo-paganism" and "Christian Wicca"-Whilst I like the idea of Christian ceremonies in the forest, as I am a nature lover, these terms seem too contradictory to me. What do you think?
 
essentials said:
So im in the mood for researching and posting today. What do you think of Paganism? According to one website Pagans believe in honoring all earth-based religions, such as Wicca, for example. Another website even said the Cross symbol was used in Paganism before it was used in Christianity. What do you think? You can also read about such controversies as "Christo-paganism" and "Christian Wicca"-Whilst I like the idea of Christian ceremonies in the forest, as I am a nature lover, these terms seem too contradictory to me. What do you think?
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I think if you want to know more about what people in the past thought or what people other than your self think or believe than you should feel free to learn.

I don't see why there can't be Christian ceremonies in a forest. There are Christian ceremonies all the time at rivers.
 
Wicca, from Wikipedia:
Wikipedia said:
Wicca (pronounced [?w?k?]) is a Neopagan religion and a form of modern witchcraft. It is often referred to as Witchcraft or the Craft[1] by its adherents, who are known as Wiccans or Witches. Its disputed origins lie in England in the early 20th century,[2] though it was first popularised during the 1950s by Gerald Gardner, a retired British civil servant, who at the time called it the "witch cult" and "witchcraft", and its adherents "the Wica".[3] From the 1960s the name of the religion was normalised to "Wicca".[4]

Wicca is typically a duotheistic religion, worshipping a Goddess and a God, who are traditionally viewed as the Triple Goddess and Horned God. These two deities are often viewed as being facets of a greater pantheistic Godhead, and as manifesting themselves as various polytheistic deities. Nonetheless, there are also other theological positions within the Craft, ranging from monotheism to atheism. Wicca also involves the ritual practice of magic, largely influenced by the ceremonial magic of previous centuries, often in conjunction with a liberal code of morality known as the Wiccan Rede, although this is not adhered to by all Witches. Another characteristic of the Craft is the celebration of seasonally based festivals known as Sabbats, of which there are usually eight in number annually.

There are various different denominations within Witchcraft, which are referred to as traditions. Some, such as Gardnerian and Alexandrian Wicca, follow in the initiatory lineage of Gardner; these are often collectively termed British Traditional Wicca, and many of their practitioners consider the term "Wicca" to apply only to these lineaged traditions. Others, such as Cochrane's Craft, Feri and the Dianic tradition, take primary influence from other figures and may not insist on any initiatory lineage. Some of these do not use the term "Wicca" at all, instead preferring to be referred to only as "Witchcraft", while others believe that all traditions can be considered "Wiccan".[5][6]
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wicca

westtexas said:
essentials said:
"Christian Wicca"
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I believe that these 2 words are incompatible in the same phrase.

Westtexas
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Unless you put the world "not" in between. :D


----

I would also be interested in a research/discussion of pagan beliefs etc.
 
essentials said:
these terms seem too contradictory to me. What do you think?
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I agree :) It would be interesting to hear from someone who claims to be a "Christian Wiccan". I don't know much about Wiccan, just a quick google after your first post, but the little I saw i sure don't see how anyone could associate the 2 together.

Westtexas
 
essentials said:
So im in the mood for researching and posting today. What do you think of Paganism? According to one website Pagans believe in honoring all earth-based religions, such as Wicca, for example. Another website even said the Cross symbol was used in Paganism before it was used in Christianity. What do you think? You can also read about such controversies as "Christo-paganism" and "Christian Wicca"-Whilst I like the idea of Christian ceremonies in the forest, as I am a nature lover, these terms seem too contradictory to me. What do you think?
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Since Jesus was crucified by romans, the latter would have used their method for killing. The cross suited their purpose. Romans being pagans.

Christianity never used the cross for the purpose it was intended.

There is one entity who is consumed with diluting the Word of God to confuse and make stray mankind. To that end, he devises nonsense knowing only too well how well sinful minds love it. The Christian's focus must stay on Christ to keep from being deceived.
 
Christianity cannot be mixed with any religion or belief structure that will nullify Jesus's sacrifice on the cross.
1 John 5 vs 21 Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen
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I believe we are being told to stay away from anything that detracts our attention from Jesus as being our personal Saviour. This will include cultural practices that indulge in ancestral worship. Which is big in many African churches. This is also displayed in the Roman Catholic church in Haiti where voodoo and the catholic church are intertwined.

We are seeing an increasing influx of non Christian influences in the Church today, and the scary part we are embracing it. Christian Yoga, the emerging church that has started denying the purpose of Christ as a sacrifice for our sins, as they try and promote the church as an approachable institution.

Christianity is something that has to stand alone. It foundation is based on the truth of Christs suffering and death and resurrection so that all man may be saved if they believe in him. If we do not test the teachings in the church today with scripture all sorts of "idols" are going to be introduced into the church.
 
Ed the Ned said:
Christianity cannot be mixed with any religion or belief structure that will nullify Jesus's sacrifice on the cross.
1 John 5 vs 21 Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen
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I believe we are being told to stay away from anything that detracts our attention from Jesus as being our personal Saviour. This will include cultural practices that indulge in ancestral worship. Which is big in many African churches. This is also displayed in the Roman Catholic church in Haiti where voodoo and the catholic church are intertwined.

We are seeing an increasing influx of non Christian influences in the Church today, and the scary part we are embracing it. Christian Yoga, the emerging church that has started denying the purpose of Christ as a sacrifice for our sins, as they try and promote the church as an approachable institution.

Christianity is something that has to stand alone. It foundation is based on the truth of Christs suffering and death and resurrection so that all man may be saved if they believe in him. If we do not test the teachings in the church today with scripture all sorts of "idols" are going to be introduced into the church.
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Good post. I went on a few mission trips to Brazil, far away from Rio to the southern tip. There is a lot of spiritism there, and I would assume everywhere throughout the world, but this was very glaring. They would take advantage of desperate people willing to give up everything for the immediate promise to take away pain and provide wealth. We were supporting a small Christian church that was across the street from such a building. It was packed with people. :sad These people are desperate and scared. They dedicate their children to the goddess and put all their stock in this fallacy. They literally sell their soul to the goddess. The pastor we support lives in that environment every day. Talk about throwing yourself into the thick of spiritual warfare. :pray :pray :pray

I wonder why, when pastors feel they've been called, they rarely feel that they've been call outside their own country? :confused

Sorry, I didn't mean to derail the thread here. It's fine to learn about things (happyjoy, please don't accuse me of being afraid of knowledge) in order that Christianity would stand out as the Truth, but we shouldn't become obsessed with it. I believe, even if our purpose is to defend Christianity, spending too much time in another religion or becoming obsessed is not what God would have you do. Learn so you can respond, but get back to what you know is True. This is worthy of your time.
 
mjjcb-by the sounds of it you don't think other religions or belief systems have any validity at all. Is this correct? Also, is the "spiritism" you're talking about Santeria? I am probably younger than you and this could be partially responsible for our different points of view, but I don't think examples like the one you spoke of have to be "spiritual warefare". Was/is the church and other house of worship in direct conflict with each other about anything? Are they going through any kind of feud? As long as they are not causing harm to anyone people can believe in whatever they want in my opinion.

NOTE-I am not promoting any of these other religions, I just feel people deserve freedom of choice.
 
I know this wasn't directed at me, but I still would like to answer, if I may.

essentials said:
you don't think other religions or belief systems have any validity at all.
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When you're standing in front of God, and He is judging your life and you don't have Jesus, then you stand no chance. Yes, sure some belief systems promote some good morals, but Christianity promotes all good morals, not just some. And more. You've also got to look at the motivation for doing good works. For example, lets just say hypothetically I give lots of money to chartiy, but I am not a Christian. Even if I do this with a humble heart and want to help others in need, it cannot stand up to the same works that a Christian who does it out of reverence of God and His commandments and to see Him glorified. :twocents

essentials said:
I just feel people deserve freedom of choice.
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Well yes, people are free to reject the lifeboat that God has provided for them.
 
essentials said:
mjjcb-by the sounds of it you don't think other religions or belief systems have any validity at all. Is this correct? Also, is the "spiritism" you're talking about Santeria? I am probably younger than you and this could be partially responsible for our different points of view, but I don't think examples like the one you spoke of have to be "spiritual warefare". Was/is the church and other house of worship in direct conflict with each other about anything? Are they going through any kind of feud? As long as they are not causing harm to anyone people can believe in whatever they want in my opinion.

NOTE-I am not promoting any of these other religions, I just feel people deserve freedom of choice.
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I would have said much of what Nick said :thumb

Also, I'm not sure what you mean by other beliefs having validity. I believe since God IS Truth, all truths come from Him. If another religion has some truths in their beliefs, and it seems most do have some, those would have been set before them by God. The source of their untruths is evil.

If you mean to ask if I find them valid to the point of being good. No notta one! There's only 1 Truth, and I believe my God owns it - is it. :amen

I don't remember the name of the other group. I hesitate to even call them a church. As I said they lured many more of these desolate people in than did the Christian church we sponsored. They would stand out in front of their building every day, yelling and screaming, laughing at the local people that were called to follow Jesus. They yelled obscene comments at them. The pastor had faith and patience I've never since witnessed as did his family and church members. He never returned volley and instructed his members not to (at least when I was there on two separate trips). He would plead with his members to remain committed to the Truth and "store up riches in Heaven", not be lured in by false promises of wealth. Would you call this spiritual warfare? I'd call it their own little nuclear spiritual war! He has remained in the ministry he was called to with his wife and two children for 8 years! One day, he will no doubt here the words, "Well done, my good and faithful servant"!!! :amen

Do we all deserve the choice? NO! WE ALL DESERVE DESTRUCTION!! But by His Grace He gives us the choice. We can choose right and we can choose wrong. We don't deserve this choice, but He gives it to us.
 
this is like being a christian-jw. :D

i speak this from experience. while its good to debate here and learn of other things. it also affected my walk at times and some here i have allowed to steal my joy. no more. balence is the key. one cant chase alot of rabbits and get them all.
 
NOTE-I am not promoting any of these other religions, I just feel people deserve freedom of choice.
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I've stewed over this comment and I think it is important to us as Christians and others to understand that God gives us the freedom to choose. It is your choice to decide if you wish to follow Christ or not. Whether we deserve that choice, I am not sure.
So as a Christian I respect the fact that we have the right to choose. Our choice is what defines our eternal destiny. Our choice determines how we live our lives. When Christians speak of the Truth we are talking about the one and only God. Who sent his Son (One and Only) to die on the cross for our sins. He had no sin yet sacrificed himself for us. He was rose on the 3rd day. whoever believes in him will have eternal life.

When talking about other religions we need to be careful not to identify what may be good in that religion with the Truth. We have been given Scripture to prepare us and teach us and if another religion conflicts with the Word of God then we must not try and blend it into Christianity for the sake of pleasing others, we must remove it in totality from our belief structures. As soon as we start accepting and promoting not Christian beliefs into the Church we start destroying it from the inside. Just what the devil wants!

The CHOICE IS YOURS! THAT WAS GODS DECISION! HE WANTS YOU TO BE SAVED, THAT IS GODS DESIRE!
 
Ed the Ned said:
The CHOICE IS YOURS! THAT WAS GODS DECISION! HE WANTS YOU TO BE SAVED, THAT IS GODS DESIRE!
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Then why does his predetermined plan include sending people to Hell? Why would he create us if he knew we were going to burn?
 
demented cookies said:
[quote="Ed the Ned":4149f6pm]The CHOICE IS YOURS! THAT WAS GODS DECISION! HE WANTS YOU TO BE SAVED, THAT IS GODS DESIRE!
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Then why does his predetermined plan include sending people to Hell? Why would he create us if he knew we were going to burn?[/quote:4149f6pm]
Uh, He provided a way out. He offered us a lifeboat when we were on a sinking island. It is your choice whether to take it or not.

I'm not going to speculate on why God created us if He knew we would rebel.
 
Yeah to add to demented cookies question-If he WANTS us to be saved, would he not save as at the end no matter what? If God forgives our sins in this life, would he not forgive our sins in the next life too? As long as you dont actively speak out against God or the Holy Spirit, and as long as you're a decent person, I don't see why he wouldn't forgive us, no matter what, in the life to come. Maybe im missing something here? Enlighten me...
 
essentials said:
Yeah to add to demented cookies question-If he WANTS us to be saved, would he not save as at the end no matter what? If God forgives our sins in this life, would he not forgive our sins in the next life too? As long as you dont actively speak out against God or the Holy Spirit, and as long as you're a decent person, I don't see why he wouldn't forgive us, no matter what, in the life to come. Maybe im missing something here? Enlighten me...
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I am sensing some Universal Reconciliaton, am I not?

Only those who repent and have faith will be saved. This is clearly written in the Bible.

There is no sitting on the fence. If you are not for God, you are against God. Ignoring God or not disliking Him are just as bad as outright attacking Him. But everytime we sin we are going against God's Will.
 
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