Tessa
Member
I did too as a child. We had to say it that often i never even thought about the words.
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Are you taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Wearing the right shoes, and properly clothed spiritually?
Join Elected By Him for a devotional on Ephesians 6:14-15
https://christianforums.net/threads/devotional-selecting-the-proper-shoes.109094/
Praying to Mary
- Thread starter Mungo
- Start date
Mungo
Member
There are many traditional prayers but the "Hail Mary" is the most common.
Hail Mary, full of grace, The Lord is with thee (from Lk 1:28)
Blessed art thou among women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. (from Lk 1:42)
Holy Mary, (she is holy)
Mother of God (a correct title)
Pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen (request for her intercession)
Mungo
Member
I disagree.
Mungo
Member
Mary as Mediatrix
The Second Vatican Council in it's document Lumen Gentium (Dogmatic Constitution on The Church)starts in para 60 starts There is but one Mediator as we know from the words of the apostle, "for there is one God and one mediator of God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself a redemption for all".(298)”
(298) is a reference to footnote 256 - 1Tim2:5-6.
The Catholic Church does not teach against this scripture but supports it. Other references to Jesus being the one Mediator can be found in the following paragraphs:
8 (one Mediator)
14 (one Mediator)
28 (sole mediator)
41 (unique Mediator)
49 (one Mediator)
56 (one and only Mediator)
62 (one Mediator)
The Church is quote clear that there is only one Mediator – and that is not Mary.
The same document in referring to Mary as Mediatrix states (para 62): This, however, is to be so understood that it neither takes away from nor adds anything to the dignity and efficaciousness of Christ the one Mediator.
Therefore in the way that the Church understands the term it does not imply that Jesus’ work is insufficient.
What therefore does the Catholic Church mean by the title Mediatrix?
The first point to clarify is in what way is Jesus a Mediator?
1Tim 2:5 says For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man ChristJesus.
Therefore:
a) Jesus reconciles us to the Father (Rom 5:10, 2Cor 5:18-19).
b) Jesus is the mediator of the New Covenant (Heb 9:15, 12:24).
Regarding Mary’s mediation we must note two things:
1. Intercede and mediate are synonyms. We are all called to intercede for each other. Just prior to the quote from 1Tim 2:15, Paul writes (verses 1-4)
First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all men, for kings and all who are in high positions, that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life, godly and respectful in every way. This is good, and it is acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour..
Paul promises to pray for others (e.g. Col 1:3) and in his turn asks others to pray for him (e.g. Col 4:3). This is all a form of mediation.
2. We believe that Mary is our mother, given to us at the cross. Lumen Gentium says:
She conceived, brought forth and nourished Christ. She presented Him to the Father in the temple, and was united with Him by compassion as He died on the Cross. In this singular way she cooperated by her obedience, faith, hope and burning charity in the work of the Saviour in giving back supernatural life to souls. Wherefore she is our mother in the order of grace. (para 61)
And continues
This maternity of Mary in the order of grace began with the consent which she gave in faith at the Annunciation and which she sustained without wavering beneath the cross, and lasts until the eternal fulfilment of all the elect. Taken up to heaven she did not lay aside this salvific duty, but by her constant intercession continued to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation. (para 62, my emboldening)
Mary does not mediate us to the Father as Jesus does as Covenant Mediator but intercedes for us as we do for each other.
One more quote from Lumen Gentium (actually a continuation of my first quote):
The maternal duty of Mary toward men in no wise obscures or diminishes this unique mediation of Christ, but rather shows His power. ….... In no way does it impede, but rather does it foster the immediate union of the faithful with Christ.
The Second Vatican Council in it's document Lumen Gentium (Dogmatic Constitution on The Church)starts in para 60 starts There is but one Mediator as we know from the words of the apostle, "for there is one God and one mediator of God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself a redemption for all".(298)”
(298) is a reference to footnote 256 - 1Tim2:5-6.
The Catholic Church does not teach against this scripture but supports it. Other references to Jesus being the one Mediator can be found in the following paragraphs:
8 (one Mediator)
14 (one Mediator)
28 (sole mediator)
41 (unique Mediator)
49 (one Mediator)
56 (one and only Mediator)
62 (one Mediator)
The Church is quote clear that there is only one Mediator – and that is not Mary.
The same document in referring to Mary as Mediatrix states (para 62): This, however, is to be so understood that it neither takes away from nor adds anything to the dignity and efficaciousness of Christ the one Mediator.
Therefore in the way that the Church understands the term it does not imply that Jesus’ work is insufficient.
What therefore does the Catholic Church mean by the title Mediatrix?
The first point to clarify is in what way is Jesus a Mediator?
1Tim 2:5 says For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man ChristJesus.
Therefore:
a) Jesus reconciles us to the Father (Rom 5:10, 2Cor 5:18-19).
b) Jesus is the mediator of the New Covenant (Heb 9:15, 12:24).
Regarding Mary’s mediation we must note two things:
1. Intercede and mediate are synonyms. We are all called to intercede for each other. Just prior to the quote from 1Tim 2:15, Paul writes (verses 1-4)
First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all men, for kings and all who are in high positions, that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life, godly and respectful in every way. This is good, and it is acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour..
Paul promises to pray for others (e.g. Col 1:3) and in his turn asks others to pray for him (e.g. Col 4:3). This is all a form of mediation.
2. We believe that Mary is our mother, given to us at the cross. Lumen Gentium says:
She conceived, brought forth and nourished Christ. She presented Him to the Father in the temple, and was united with Him by compassion as He died on the Cross. In this singular way she cooperated by her obedience, faith, hope and burning charity in the work of the Saviour in giving back supernatural life to souls. Wherefore she is our mother in the order of grace. (para 61)
And continues
This maternity of Mary in the order of grace began with the consent which she gave in faith at the Annunciation and which she sustained without wavering beneath the cross, and lasts until the eternal fulfilment of all the elect. Taken up to heaven she did not lay aside this salvific duty, but by her constant intercession continued to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation. (para 62, my emboldening)
Mary does not mediate us to the Father as Jesus does as Covenant Mediator but intercedes for us as we do for each other.
One more quote from Lumen Gentium (actually a continuation of my first quote):
The maternal duty of Mary toward men in no wise obscures or diminishes this unique mediation of Christ, but rather shows His power. ….... In no way does it impede, but rather does it foster the immediate union of the faithful with Christ.
and ? you can not back your praying to mary in scripture . if you look a t the model prayer . it starts out our father who art in heaven . not our mother no place in scripture is there a word pray to mary ,,this is a doctrine of man
she does not nor can she intercede for any one. she is powerless for us to pray to
really ? more false teaching as that is not found in scripture
Mungo
Member
Mary is not the Mother of God.
God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.”
John 4:24
Mary gave birth to the flesh and blood, the body of Jesus Christ.
JLB
Here are the two things about Mary being Mediatrix.
- It’s not from scripture.
- It’s not from God.
JLB
i have and i still stand by my post. no place in the Bible does it even say we are to mention mary in prayers. once again she was a young virgin blessed chosen by God to bring the Christ seed in, apostle paul called it the fullness of time 4 But when the fullness of the time had come, God sent forth His Son, born[a] of a woman, born under the law, 5 to redeem those who were under the law, that we might receive the adoption as sons. i don't like to argue church doctrine. but i have to stand in full DISAGREEMENT WITH THE CATHOLIC DOCTRINE ON THIS . it simply does not line up with scriptures ..none not at all much like the teaching of purgatory
Brother we love Catholic people. We however are aware that some Catholic teachings are not aligned with scripture.
Just because we don’t agree with your teachings doesn’t mean we don’t love you.
JLB
wrong ..provide scripture thus saith the word of God that says that for mary the mother of God
Mungo
Member
Mungo
Member
The Bible doesn't say we are to drive cars, post on internet forums, whistle while we work etc., etc.
Just because the Bible doesn't explicitly address a particular action doesn't mean to say it is wrong to do it.
Where does it contradict scripture?
Please keep to the topic.