Roman Catholic church

[Bible]

John 10:14 I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.
John 10:15 As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.
John 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

The other sheep are outside of Israel as in being the Gentile nation. Not the Roman Catholic Church. The churches that were established in Rome were not Roman Catholic as in the Vatican and Popes, but Christian churches founded on the rock who is Christ Jesus, not Peter. It has always been the Roman Empire that have persecuted to death millions of Christians and even so today until Christ returns.

(Drunk with the blood of the saints, yes pagan Rome persecuted and killed many Catholics for 300 yrs till Christ and his church conquered Rome and converted Constantine)

(Christ is the rock who founded his church on peter,

How do you govern the church and administer the kingdom with a confession?

How do you give jurisdictional authority to a confession? (Keys of the kingdom)

How do you give a confession the power to bind and loose?


also have to explain
Isa 22:21-22
Matt 16:18
Matt 28:19
Jn 20:21-23
Eph 2:20
Matt 23

God always establishes order in the obedience to hierarchical authority!

Matt 23 the successors of Moses had the keys of authority (open and shut) and the power to bind and loose in the seat or chair of Moses (also called a cathedral) and Christ says they MUST be obeyed!
Taken from them matt 21:43 given to Peter matt 16:18 and the apostles Matt 18:18 Jn 20:21-23 eph 2:20

Matthew 5:14-16
Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid. Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house. Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.


Mt 16:18 Peter received the keys of the kingdom: (jurisdictional authority of the universal church) and the power to bind and loose:

Lk 22:32
Jesus prays for Peter:

Matt 17:27 Jesus and peter are one

Jn 21:17
Peter commanded to Feed my sheep:

Isa 2221-22 prime minister called father!
Holding the keys of the kingdom under the king Lk 1:32-33 in the line of david!
Matt 16:18


Christ founded the church on Peter!
And the apostles!
Matt 16:18 eph 2:20 Jn 20:21-23

18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

You CANNOT give the keys (jurisdictional authority) to a confession but to a person! Peter
Vs 19 I give unto thee (Peter) thou shalt bind (Peter) thou shalt loose (Peter)

Only the one true church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles and their successors and those members of Christ by faith and baptism United with them, the communion of the saints
Jn 16:10 matt 16:18 18:18 Jn 20:21-23
Jn 10:16

Ephesians 5:32
This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

The office of apostle that has the three fold office, to teach: to govern the church: and to sanctify by the sacraments or sacred oaths (promises) of the father! Acts 2:38-39 with ez 36:25-27 Heb 8:6

Teaching authority of Peter and the apostles and their successors!

Acts 2:42 doctrine of the apostles

1 Peter 3:2 That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:

Jude 1: 17 But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ;

The holy church does not usurp Christ’s authority, the holy church establishes it throughout the whole world, and thru all time!

The holy apostles do not usurp Christ’s kingdom, the apostles administer the kingdom for Christ who ascended to heaven!

Ephesians 3:21
Unto him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen.

Ephesians 5:24
Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ...

Christ and His church are one, what Christ did the church continues to do, the church is an extension of Christ!
To attack the church is to attack Christ!
Acts 9:4

What authority does Christ have?
What power does Christ have?
What mission / ministry does Christ have?

Peter, the apostles and their successors have the same authority, power, and mission! Jn 20:21 as my father sent me, even so send I you!

The apostles are Christ’s successors!
They have authority to send others as well, apostle means one who is sent!)

The title of the thread you made here is what is the first commandment. In your post #4 you said: "Why does the scripture not say what each commandment is? Instead is has the whole content of the ten in ex 20". Why can you not read all ten commandments there with the first one being "Exo 20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me".

(All I intended was to show that the “Bible alone” does not say what each commandment is, and therefore you can follow the apostolic tradition having the authority of Christ or the tradition of men having no authority)

So, what is the whole purpose of this thread, but to argue and debate that the Roman Catholic Church is the true church of God.

I thank God for all the Catholics that have come out from her having their eyes opened to truth. Catholic might mean "universal" but only in the sense of the doctrine of the Roman Catholic Church throughout the world who has made martyr's of God's people beginning with The Babylonian Empire up to present day revived Roman Empire that rules from the Vatican in Rome. Who was it that persecuted Christ whipping him, degrading Him nailing Him to a cross. Is this the church anyone would want to bow down to!!!

(Pagan Roman Empire is not the church)

 

[jaybo]

As long as we're now discussing the Roman Catholic church, I have a long list of problems I have with the RCC and its practices. I'll start with just a few...

The Old Testament is filled with people and practices that are no longer relevant in Christianity, but are continued in some form by the RCC.

1) A separate class of people called priests. The NT clearly states that we are all priests. 1 Peter 2:9, "But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, God’s special possession, that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light."

2) Worship of Mary. The first of the 10 Commandments says "“You shall have no other gods before me." Exodus 20:3

3) Worship of Mary and "saints". The second of the 10 Commandments says, "“You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below." Exodus 20:4

4) Forgiveness of sins by "works". Saying x number of "Hail Marys", praying the rosary, or some other penance. The modern equivalent of animal sacrifice.

5) Elaborate cathedrals with elaborate costumes and rituals. Equivalent to the OT tabernacle and temple rituals, neither of which are not found in the NT.

That's enough for now, but there are more...

 

[Bible]

Then why do Catholics break the first commandment bowing down to the Pope?

To a valid pope as the vicar of christ
The pope represents Christ the king
Bowing is not worship or adoration or
Latria
1 kings 2:19 Bathsheba therefore went unto king Solomon, to speak unto him for Adonijah. And the king rose up to meet her, and bowed himself unto her, and sat down on his throne, and caused a seat to be set for the king's mother; and she sat on his right hand.

In the line of david the mother of the king is queen and Jesus is king in the line of david Lk 1:32-33

 

[for_his_glory]

All graces come from the merits of Christ, from His passion and death and come thru Mary to the glory of Her only begotten Son!

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Grace does not come from the merits of Christ or through Mary as Christ is God's only begotten Son of God, not Mary as she and Joseph had children, but you refuse the scriptures that are written. Are we told in scripture to put Mary on a pedestal bowing down to her and asking her to make intercession for us, no. It is Christ who sits at the right hand of God making intersession for us hearing our prayers.

Romans 8:34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Why does the Roman Catholic Church have so many idols and graven images that are forbidden by God. I can show you pictures if you want me to.

 

[for_his_glory]

I agree with this, but you originally wrote "I don't think that Catholics bow down to the Pope, thereby making him "before" God." I don't equate the two.

I think that bowing to the Pope and kissing his ring means anything, certainly not making him more important than God.

You must be misunderstanding what I said. I said that Catholics bow down to the Pope, meaning in which they make him their god/idol as he demands to be called Holy Father.

The Papacy of the Roman Catholic Church has desecrated the ten commandments of God by changing the Sabbath to the first day of the week in support of Luciferians sun worship. The Pope claims to have inherited the title Pontifex Maximus (Pontiff) directly from Babylon. Another title is Vicarius Filii Dei meaning in the place of God as he calls himself the Holy Father and the only one who can forgive sin, Matthew 23:9. Rome’s catechism leaves out Gods second commandment as they worship many idols making various gods unto themselves as they bow down and worship them.

The Priesthood, catechism, the seven sacraments, praying to Mary, the stages of the cross, idol worshiping and the list goes on are all atrocities to God as the Roman Catholic Church takes on the form of Godliness, but denying the power thereof and turn away from God having corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith, 2 Timothy 3:1-9. The Papacy leads many into captivity whose names are not found in the Lamb’s book of life as they have no truth or understanding of Gods word. The success of the Roman Empire over the last two thousand years will be its demise in the end of days when God destroys their power as He sends it to the lake of fire forever as God establishes His Kingdom here on earth.​

 

[jaybo]

You must be misunderstanding what I said. I said that Catholics bow down to the Pope, meaning in which they make him their god/idol as he demands to be called Holy Father.

The Papacy of the Roman Catholic Church has desecrated the ten commandments of God by changing the Sabbath to the first day of the week in support of Luciferians sun worship. The Pope claims to have inherited the title Pontifex Maximus (Pontiff) directly from Babylon. Another title is Vicarius Filii Dei meaning in the place of God as he calls himself the Holy Father and the only one who can forgive sin, Matthew 23:9. Rome’s catechism leaves out Gods second commandment as they worship many idols making various gods unto themselves as they bow down and worship them.

The Priesthood, catechism, the seven sacraments, praying to Mary, the stages of the cross, idol worshiping and the list goes on are all atrocities to God as the Roman Catholic Church takes on the form of Godliness, but denying the power thereof and turn away from God having corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith, 2 Timothy 3:1-9. The Papacy leads many into captivity whose names are not found in the Lamb’s book of life as they have no truth or understanding of Gods word. The success of the Roman Empire over the last two thousand years will be its demise in the end of days when God destroys their power as He sends it to the lake of fire forever as God establishes His Kingdom here on earth.​

Great post!! Everything that you have written is true.

It makes me very, very sad that Catholicism has turned so far away from true, Biblical Christianity to a poor revival of the errors and problems of the Old Testament. Jesus sent us the Holy Spirit to be our guide, not some cadre of men and elaborate rituals and structures.

 

[Hopeful]

I agree wise man idolatry is forbidden
Only God may be worshiped



Proving That Mary is not a goddess and this tittle does not apply to Mary most holy, ever virgin mother of God!

Lk 1:28 Hail, Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee, blessed art thou amounts women.

How can a goddess be full of grace?
Hail Mary full of grace!

How can the Lord be with a goddess?
The lord is with thee!

How can a goddess be blessed!
Blessed art thou, and all generations shall call me blessed!

Lk 1: 43 And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?

How can a goddess be the mother of God?

Lk 1: 45 And blessed is she that believed: for there shall be a performance of those things which were told her from the Lord.

How could a goddess be faithful?

Lk 1: 46 And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord,

47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.

How could a goddess glorify God or have a savior?

Lk 1:48 For he hath regarded the low estate of his handmaiden: for, behold, from henceforth all generations shall call me blessed.

How could a goddess be humble?

Lk 1:49 For he that is mighty hath done to me great things; and holy is his name.

How could a goddess be the immaculate conception and the have the Holy Spirit accomplish the Miraculous conception of Jesus?

Matt 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.

22 Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying,

23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

How could a goddess be a perpetual Virgin bringing forth the savior of the world?

Jn 19:27 Then saith he to the disciple, Behold thy mother! And from that hour that disciple took her unto his own home.

How could a goddess be our spiritual mother?

Only a heretical fundamentalists brainwashing can say so!

A good tree!

Matthew 7:18
A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

That is a good verse to determine if a church has anything at all to do with God or His Son Jesus.
As so much has come to light recently about the catholic church and its ministers, it is impossible for me to see it as anything but BAD.

I didn't bother printing the rest of your idolatry.

 

[Bible]

I agree with this, but you originally wrote "I don't think that Catholics bow down to the Pope, thereby making him "before" God." I don't equate the two.

I think that bowing to the Pope and kissing his ring means anything, certainly not making him more important than God.

The pope represents Christ as king

Forgive sins by the power Christ gave the apostles Jn 20:21-23
Same mission power and authority as Christ!

 

[Bible]

As long as we're now discussing the Roman Catholic church, I have a long list of problems I have with the RCC and its practices. I'll start with just a few...

The Old Testament is filled with people and practices that are no longer relevant in Christianity, but are continued in some form by the RCC.

1) A separate class of people called priests. The NT clearly states that we are all priests. 1 Peter 2:9, "But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, God’s special possession, that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light."

(I’ll do my best to help with any questions you have, Christ is high priest in the order of Melchizedek a ministerial priesthood, true that Christians are a royal priesthood but the priesthood of Christ is of a different order, and Christ is priest forever, and high priest so there must be low priests of the same order offering perpetual propitious sacrifice of Christ Heb 7, 8, & 9 )

2) Worship of Mary. The first of the 10 Commandments says "“You shall have no other gods before me." Exodus 20:3

3) Worship of Mary and "saints". The second of the 10 Commandments says, "“You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below." Exodus 20:4

(Mary and the saints are neither God not gods, and only God may be worshiped or adored latria, images are not forbidden only worshiping images is forbidden God commanded Moses to make the ark with angels on the mercy seat)

4) Forgiveness of sins by "works". Saying x number of "Hail Marys", praying the rosary, or some other penance. The modern equivalent of animal sacrifice.

(Jn 20:21-23 christ give his apostles, his church power to forgive sins, they have the same mission power and authority as Christ, the rosary is praying and meditation on scripture the life death and resurrection of Christ, Matt 5:7
1 pet 4:8 )

(5) Elaborate cathedrals with elaborate costumes and rituals. Equivalent to the OT tabernacle and temple rituals, neither of which are not found in the NT.

That's enough for now, but there are more...

 

[Bible]

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

(Eph 2 refers to redemption not justification or salvation)

Grace does not come from the merits of Christ or through Mary as Christ is God's only begotten Son of God, not Mary as she and Joseph had children, but you refuse the scriptures that are written. Are we told in scripture to put Mary on a pedestal bowing down to her and asking her to make intercession for us, no. It is Christ who sits at the right hand of God making intersession for us hearing our prayers.

(Jn 1:16-27 Heb 4:16)

Romans 8:34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

(Refers to Christ as mediator of justice, in the communion of saints we all can pray for each other rev 5:7)

Why does the Roman Catholic Church have so many idols and graven images that are forbidden by God. I can show you pictures if you want me to.

( images are not forbidden for God commanded Moses to make images, only worshiping them is forbidden and makes them idols)

 

[Bible]

That is a good verse to determine if a church has anything at all to do with God or His Son Jesus.
As so much has come to light recently about the catholic church and its ministers, it is impossible for me to see it as anything but BAD.

I didn't bother printing the rest of your idolatry.

There is only one church in scripture jn 10:16

 

[Bible]

That is a good verse to determine if a church has anything at all to do with God or His Son Jesus.
As so much has come to light recently about the catholic church and its ministers, it is impossible for me to see it as anything but BAD.

I didn't bother printing the rest of your idolatry.

The union of the holy church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles is such that it cannot be harmed by the sins of men!

Automatic excommunication is incured upon the exercise of the intellect and will to teach error or Hersey or to commit grave sin! Men are sinners, with a sin nature and free will, but we should choose that which is good and holy! Rom 6:13

So the bride is spotless and without blemish!

The members of Christ in communion with God and each other are in a state of sanctifying grace!

We deplore the sins and outrages of abuse, most of which is done by homo’s on young boys, in any group especially those calling themselves Christian, the communists began infiltration in the seminary’s in the 30’s and the modernist’s and homo’s in the 60’s and 70’s

This is a symptom of error and Hersey
Modernism or theological liberalism, of the modern apostasy and nowhere does the true church teach anyone to do these things, nor do the Protestant sects which have the same issues!

Philippians 4:8
Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.

 

[for_his_glory]

Ever read Daniel 13 about the faith of Susana provided by God for our instruction?

Yes I have. It's the importance of truth be known in judgement as we stand in faith against our accusers as by Daniel two falsehoods were brought before the accusers. If every story as such were written there could not be enough books to contain them all. The Apocrypha is contained in parts within the Bible.

 

[for_his_glory]

(Pagan Roman Empire is not the church)

You at least got that right, but the paganism of Rome's Vatican city is found in every Roman Catholic Church and the worship of Roman sun god Ra, Dagon the fish god. The skull worship is just gross.

 

[WIP]

The pope represents Christ as king

I'm not intent on getting into this discussion but this thought came to mind. Why does anyone, particularly a fallible human, have to represent Christ as King. Is that even possible? Is He, that is Christ, not king? He does not need anyone to represent Him as King for that is what He is.

When Jesus therefore was born in Bethlehem of Juda, in the days of king Herod, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem. Saying, Where is he that is born king of the Jews? For we have seen his star in the east, and are come to adore him.
Matthew 2:1-2 DRA

And Jesus stood before the governor, and the governor asked him, saying: Art thou the king of the Jews? Jesus saith to him: Thou sayest it.
Matthew 27:11 DRA

And I saw another sign in heaven, great and wonderful: seven angels having the seven last plagues. For in them is filled up the wrath of God. And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire, and them that had overcome the beast, and his image, and the number of his name, standing on the sea of glass, having the harps of God: And singing the canticle of Moses, the servant of God, and the canticle of the Lamb, saying: Great and wonderful are thy works, O Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, O King of ages.
Revelation 15:1-3 DRA

 

[hawkman]

Bible please explain what is going on in this picture .

 

[Bible]

Yes I have. It's the importance of truth be known in judgement as we stand in faith against our accusers as by Daniel two falsehoods were brought before the accusers. If every story as such were written there could not be enough books to contain them all. The Apocrypha is contained in parts within the Bible.

According to the authority of Christ and the apostles Daniel is scripture not apocrypha
It’s the tradition of men under king James with no authority from Christ who say it’s not bible

 

[Bible]

I'm not intent on getting into this discussion but this thought came to mind. Why does anyone, particularly a fallible human, have to represent Christ as King. Is that even possible? Is He, that is Christ, not king? He does not need anyone to represent Him as King for that is what He is.

When Jesus therefore was born in Bethlehem of Juda, in the days of king Herod, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem. Saying, Where is he that is born king of the Jews? For we have seen his star in the east, and are come to adore him.
Matthew 2:1-2 DRA

And Jesus stood before the governor, and the governor asked him, saying: Art thou the king of the Jews? Jesus saith to him: Thou sayest it.
Matthew 27:11 DRA

And I saw another sign in heaven, great and wonderful: seven angels having the seven last plagues. For in them is filled up the wrath of God. And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire, and them that had overcome the beast, and his image, and the number of his name, standing on the sea of glass, having the harps of God: And singing the canticle of Moses, the servant of God, and the canticle of the Lamb, saying: Great and wonderful are thy works, O Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, O King of ages.
Revelation 15:1-3 DRA

Don’t forget acts 1 Christ ascended to heaven
And no king administers his own kingdom
Take the example of Joseph under pharaoh

Example Joseph under pharaoh administers the kingdom and his brothers obeyed and submitted to him. Gen 37

Gen 37:7 For, behold, we were binding sheaves in the field, and, lo, my sheaf arose, and also stood upright; and, behold, your sheaves stood round about, and made obeisance to my sheaf.

8 And his brethren said to him, Shalt thou indeed reign over us? or shalt thou indeed have dominion over us? And they hated him yet the more for his dreams, and for his words.

9 And he dreamed yet another dream, and told it his brethren, and said, Behold, I have dreamed a dream more; and, behold, the sun and the moon and the eleven stars made obeisance to me.

 

[Bible]

Bible please explain what is going on in this picture .

View attachment 12959

Beats me! Some modernist apostasy I suppose
Are you thinking that this is the church and a valid pope?

 

[jaybo]

Bible please explain what is going on in this picture .

View attachment 12959

Perhaps they're singing to a boat of objects from the Amazon region? I wonder if the objects can hear them...