Salvation through baptism in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth for the remission of sins.

[justbyfaith]

And in order to make yours, you need to establish proof that he had, lol. Where is it?

No, I do not need to establish proof that he had. All I need to do is establish doubt that he hadn't.

If there is even a possibility that the thief was baptized, my argument stands.

Nevertheless, I have established evidence (if not proof) that the thief was baptized; through Luke 7:29-30.

 

[gordon777]

Baptists, JW's, Trinitarians, Catholics, all divisionally created threads, proving it is an unchristian forum.

Or would behave a little better, and place controversial ( divided sects) to different areas, to obey Gods word. ( how long until the shameless acts of forums are ended.)



Romans 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

1 Corinthians 1:10 Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

1 Corinthians 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

 

[justbyfaith]

Baptists, JW's, Trinitarians, Catholics, all divisionally created threads, proving it is an unchristian forum.

Or would behave a little better, and place controversial ( divided sects) to different areas, to obey Gods word. ( how long until the shameless acts of forums are ended.)



Romans 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

1 Corinthians 1:10 Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

1 Corinthians 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

Unity at the expense of the truth will produce nothing but false religion.

Yes, if the cults are ruling and reigning in any forum, it would prove it to be un-Christian.

 

[gordon777]

Three divisional threads at the same time, nobody can miss that is done on purpose by the secret identities and owners/OPs of this Christian forum, trinity, baptists, JW's, why make a battle zone out of Christianity, as the world is a battle zone, it cant be pulled into strife and contention, without you being identified to be the divided, controversial, contentious world, that you want Christianity to be named as well.

Baptism is the hearts conscious, of Christ risen, which all are to have the same risen Lord in themselves, or only death is in them.

 

[justbyfaith]

There is nothing divisive about these threads.

However, many of them do stand for the truth and the reaction to the truth is said by scripture to be thus on the part of many:

1Co 2:14, But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

 

[Hidden In Him]

No, I do not need to establish proof that he had. All I need to do is establish doubt that he hadn't.

If there is even a possibility that the thief was baptized, my argument stands.

Nevertheless, I have established evidence (if not proof) that the thief was baptized; through Luke 7:29-30.

No it doesn't. It's built on hot air, Lol. You reject both New Testament teaching and the traditions of the early church which they were built upon in favor of a myth.

You're free to do so, but you are very badly deceived, and willing to deceive anyone who will listen to you, which is something many will be judged and condemned over in eternity.

Be careful. Teaching doctrine in the name of Christ is no game, and you will be held accountable.
- H

 

[Highway54]

I would like here to make a case for baptism in Jesus' Name.

First I want to show that scripturally baptism has the power to save.

1Pe 3:20, Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
1Pe 3:21, The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

In verse 20, it makes it clear that the baptism being spoken of in verse 21 is water baptism.

Now, I know that a case can be made that we are saved by grace through faith; as though this excluded being saved through the grace of baptism. In this post I will not argue that a person can only be saved through baptism in Jesus' Name (except in part); but that baptism in Jesus' Name has the power to save a soul;

And that therefore, if you have any doubts about your salvation, being baptized in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth for the remission of sins may be something that you might want to try.

For it is written,

Deu 4:29, But if from thence thou shalt seek the LORD thy God, thou shalt find him, if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul.

and,

Jer 29:13, And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart.

It should be clear that there is a conditional promise in holy scripture, that we can receive the gift of the Holy Ghost...

The condition being that we repent and are baptized in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth for the remission of sins:

Act 2:38, Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Act 2:39, For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

I would say, also, that if baptism does indeed save, that this salvation is in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth:

Act 4:10, Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
Act 4:11, This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.
Act 4:12, Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Now, here I will make a case for the exclusivisity in salvation of being baptized in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth for the remission of sins.

For the promise of Acts 2:38 is a conditional promise.

Act 2:39, For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

And it is given to as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Consider.

Rom 8:30, Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

If you are not among the called, then you were never predestinated unto salvation; and will not be justified.

Nevertheless, in Mark 16:16, it is those who believe not who will be damned; baptism isn't mentioned (as concerning condemnation for lack of it) except as a guarantee for salvation wherein it says, "whosoever believeth and is baptized shall be saved."

This indicates to me that, whereas in John 3:16, if you believe only, you "should" not perish, that if you believe and are baptized, you have an absolute promise of salvation...the word "shall" is an absolute one...whereas the word "should" is rather iffy.

So, I will not here preach that you must be baptized in Jesus' Name or else you will not be saved (I will allow the word of God to do that preaching for me, in verses already quoted); but I will say that if you want absolute assurance of salvation, the next step is to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth for the remission of sins.

Then, you shall receive remission of sins (1 John 3:9) and the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Baptism alone does not save, but at some point in their growth all Christians will choose to get baptized. That is why the Bible has to be taken as a whole.

 

[Fastfredy0]

No; water baptism is not a work; because a person can receive remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Ghost (salvation) as the result of it.

Maybe you should use a dictionary to define WORK instead of faulty logic.
Definition of Work: Physical or mental effort or activity directed toward the production or accomplishment of something.
Water Baptism is a WORK by definition

 

[justbyfaith]

No it doesn't. It's built on hot air, Lol. You reject both New Testament teaching and the traditions of the early church which they were built upon in favor of a myth.

You're free to do so, but you are very badly deceived, and willing to deceive anyone who will listen to you, which is something many will be judged and condemned over in eternity.

Be careful. Teaching doctrine in the name of Christ is no game, and you will be held accountable.
- H

Really, friend, if you are right and I am wrong, there will be no eternal consequences for me if I continue to exhort people to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth for the remission of sins.

But if I am right and you are wrong, there will be loss of eternal reward for you because you don't do the same. And also, if you don't receive baptism in Jesus' Name, you yourself will be eternally lost.

 

[justbyfaith]

Maybe you should use a dictionary to define WORK instead of faulty logic.
Definition of Work: Physical or mental effort or activity directed toward the production or accomplishment of something.
Water Baptism is a WORK by definition

Water baptism is submitting to an ordinance; I don't think that there is any effort involved in it at all.

 

[justbyfaith]

Baptism alone does not save, but at some point in their growth all Christians will choose to get baptized. That is why the Bible has to be taken as a whole.

I refer you to the OP, that is all.

 

[Fastfredy0]

Water baptism is submitting to an ordinance; I don't think that there is any effort involved in it at all.

This is contrary to the laws of physics. Work = Force X Displacement. It is physically impossible to go to a baptistry, stand there, probably say few things, get dunked and walk out without WORK; without Force to move and Displacement.
Then there is the mental aspect of WORK. You must determine you want to be baptized and the effort to convey that desire and conversations and co-ordinate to have it done; all a WORK.
GET REAL !!!! Stop bending the English language to fit your theology.
A WORK is any attempt to obey the laws of God. More generally, a WORK is any "Physical or mental effort or activity directed toward the production or accomplishment of something."
Even "FAITH" is a WORK. John 6:29 Jesus answered, “This is the work of God: that you believe [adhere to, trust in, rely on, and have faith] in the One whom He has sent.”

Premise 1: Titus 3:5a He saved us, not because of any works of righteousness that we have done,
Premise 2: Water Baptism is a work by definition
Conclusion: WE ARE NOT SAVED BY WORKS (Water Baptism)
(aside: this is not rocket science)

 

[justbyfaith]

In order to confess with my mouth the Lord Jesus and believe that God has raised Him from the dead, I also have to work...I have to move my tongue.

Nevertheless salvation is promised to those who confess Jesus with their mouth.

I guess they were saved by works, huh?

Salvation (remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Ghost) is absolutely promised to everyone who repents and is baptized in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth for the remission of sins...

That is an absolute truth; found in Acts 2:38-39..

So, either baptism is not a work or else we can be saved by a work.

I choose to go with the continuity of scripture with the understanding that we are not saved by works.

Therefore I believe that baptism is not a work;

Just as confessing with your mouth the Lord Jesus is not a work (although both the former and the latter are technically work).

 

[justbyfaith]

Even "FAITH" is a WORK.

Conclusion: WE ARE NOT SAVED BY WORKS

So, we are not saved by grace through faith?

 

[Fastfredy0]

So, we are not saved by grace through faith?

Incorrect again. Ephesians 2:8 For it is by grace [God’s remarkable compassion and favor drawing you to Christ] that you have been saved ... through faith.

We are NOT saved by WORKS... Ephesians 2:9 9 not as a result of [your] works [nor your attempts to keep the Law], so that no one will [be able to] boast or take credit in any way [for his salvation].

There, God put all 3 relevant point (Works, Faith and Grace) into 2 contiguous verses. God potentially damns people who believe they are saved via works (Gal. 5:2-6)

 

[justbyfaith]

Incorrect again. Ephesians 2:8 For it is by grace [God’s remarkable compassion and favor drawing you to Christ] that you have been saved ... through faith.

We are NOT saved by WORKS... Ephesians 2:9 9 not as a result of [your] works [nor your attempts to keep the Law], so that no one will [be able to] boast or take credit in any way [for his salvation].

But you said faith is a work.

So, if we are saved through faith, we are saved through works.

It is the same logic that you are using about baptism in Jesus' Name...

 

[Fastfredy0]

But you said faith is a work.

So, if we are saved through faith, we are saved through works.

It is the same logic that you are using about baptism in Jesus' Name...

Good observation ... but slightly missed the mark. I will explain.

When I say we are not saved by works it is implied that we are not save by OUR works. We are saved by work, but it is God's work. Now that's easy to say, can I prove it.

Premise 1: We are not saved by works (Ephesians 2:9; 2 Timothy 1:9; Titus 3:5; Romans 4:16; etc.)
Premise 2: God causes us to believe ... John 6:29 Jesus answered, “This is the work of God: that you believe" (also notice the verse describes believing (faith) as a work and says it's God's work
Conclusion: it is more accurate to state that we are not save by our works ... but the "our" is usually understood and not stated.

 

[justbyfaith]

Good observation ... but slightly missed the mark. I will explain.

When I say we are not saved by works it is implied that we are not save by OUR works. We are saved by work, but it is God's work. Now that's easy to say, can I prove it.

Premise 1: We are not saved by works (Ephesians 2:9; 2 Timothy 1:9; Titus 3:5; Romans 4:16; etc.)
Premise 2: God causes us to believe ... John 6:29 Jesus answered, “This is the work of God: that you believe" (also notice the verse describes believing (faith) as a work and says it's God's work
Conclusion: it is more accurate to state that we are not save by our works ... but the "our" is usually understood and not stated.

So, I would simply declare to you that baptism in Jesus' Name is a work of God and not a work of man.

It is not "our" work.

We submit to it and that is our part.

Giving to us remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Ghost is God's part; even as He promised in Acts 2:38-39.

 

[Fastfredy0]

So, I would simply declare to you that baptism in Jesus' Name is a work of God and not a work of man.

You can say that but it is a demonstrably false statement.
Like, I can say I am not typing responses to you; that it's a work of God... but we both would know I would be lying.

We submit to it and that is our part.

Submit is a weak word though even submitting would be a work... you know as well as I that a water baptism is an active human work.

You're trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. Your objections are no longer logical.

 

[justbyfaith]

It should be clear that salvation (remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Ghost) is the abject result of repenting and being baptized in Jesus' Name.

Therefore, either baptism is not a work, or else it is not a work of man, or else salvation is by works.

Which one do you choose?

It seems to me that you would choose a fourth option: that baptism doesn't save.

However, that notion is contrary to scripture (1 Peter 3:20-21, Acts 2:38-39, Romans 6:1-4, Galatians 3:27, Colossians 2:12, Ezekiel 36:25-27, etc.)