Should we obey church leadership, or the Holy Spirit?

[Carry_Your_Name]

In any case, I understand very well why no one else has walked on water, or resurrected people, or made a little bit of food multiply to feed thousands.

And so do I. Those miracles are not scientific experiments.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

So the church members gather around and a toddler girl is prayed for , for a healing of a condition the doctor said she would have to get surgery for . Much to the surprise and consternation of the doctor the toddler no longer needed surgery after being prayed for , she was healed . Now all the church members hear about this , Praise God .
Many witnesses on this healing .

Now Tenchi explain how this was NOT truly spiritually beneficial ?

This miraculous healing itself is indeed spiritual beneficial, but we all know that many people would grow a sense of entitlement, they come to God only when they seek benefits from him; and we all know the charlatans who shamelessly take advantage of people’s desperate need for healing and make a fortune out of it.

 

[hawkman]

Would God have been less deserving of praise if He hadn't healed the toddler (if that is truly what happened)?

Yes , it truly happened . My daughter was the one healed . It was even a healing you could see that had took place .
My daughter had a protruding hernia that was healed , never came back .

Hi Hawk
Just want to say that those in church probably believe a miracle happened.

Didn't just believe , they knew it . It is not all believers that are present at church services .

 

[Christ_empowered]

Jumping in here…

As a sort of side topic, do you think there should be some way to discontinue ministries and possibly even churches ️ if the spirit stops moving in them?

Some Pentecostal ministries were amazing for a season. No longer the case. I imagine this happens in other churches too just using Pentecostal ministries as an example. So…


My thinking is that the churches should not support some struggling ministries because they don’t have the spirits guidance and power. By the same logic…

Some churches should probably simply not exist if their time has passed.

Or not so much?

 

[GodsGrace]

Yes , it truly happened . My daughter was the one healed . It was even a healing you could see that had took place .
My daughter had a protruding hernia that was healed , never came back .

Didn't just believe , they knew it . It is not all believers that are present at church services .

I believe it happened.

Do you think the non believers came to a saving faith?

 

[Christ_empowered]

I agree with the Catholic Church….
Miracles can bring nonbelievers to Christ…

 

[GodsGrace]

I agree with the Catholic Church….
Miracles can bring nonbelievers to Christ…

They surely can.
But I think most are not moved by a miracle.

 

[Christ_empowered]

That’s true. Jesus Christ dealt with people who remained unrepentant even after seeing Him work miracles…

 

[GodsGrace]

That’s true. Jesus Christ dealt with people who remained unrepentant even after seeing Him work miracles…

Good point!

 

[Christ_empowered]

In my own life God’s work in my life…perhaps not miraculous but definitely going against the way the world works…
Has helped build my faith. I don’t know what if any impact it’s had on most other people in my life. My mother sees things through a Calvinist lens. Regeneration…work of the Holy Ghost.

 

[hawkman]

Do you think the non believers came to a saving faith?

@ Thirty years ago when my daughter was healed , if they did not at that time come to believe, they at least had more to think about .
Long time ago .

 

[follower]

Other opinions are welcome.

The first post, the op, has important things to notice. But those things, if drawn out, explained, are not welcome on forums, in churches, etc..... as it removes or takes away the power from those in power who are exerting power in the group and maintaining deception throughout the forum or group or cathedral or church.

 

[Christ_empowered]

To offer up a more Calvinist perspective…

His work in your daughter’s life could have been a catalyst to get some to true saving faith in and knowledge of Christ Jesus…

In His timing

 

[Christ_empowered]

The first post, the op, has important things to notice. But those things, if drawn out, explained, are not welcome on forums, in churches, etc..... as it removes or takes away the power from those in power who are exerting power in the group and maintaining deception throughout the forum or group or cathedral or church.

We are called to fellowship. I sense a distrust of groups and institutions…

 

[follower]

In my own life God’s work in my life…perhaps not miraculous but definitely going against the way the world works…
Has helped build my faith. I don’t know what if any impact it’s had on most other people in my life. My mother sees things through a Calvinist lens. Regeneration…work of the Holy Ghost.

When people admit they are truthfully seeking Jesus, and when their lives and words indicate this also,
that is good and proper and LIFE N JESUS....
When people truthfully admit they are following something or someone else,
by heart breaks for them,
but does not usually totally give up on them - God Has His Ways to save those who are not on the right path, right ! ?

 

[follower]

To offer up a more Calvinist perspective…

His work in your daughter’s life could have been a catalyst to get some to true saving faith in and knowledge of Christ Jesus…

In His timing

I have never seen a calvinist perspective as being healing, helpful, or of Jesus.

 

[Christ_empowered]

I believe so absolutely yes.
One thing…the wheat and the tares will be together till harvest time. I find that frightening and sad but it’s biblical.

 

[Christ_empowered]

I have never seen a calvinist perspective as being healing, helpful, or of Jesus.

I’ve been questioning that myself lately…

 

[follower]

We are called to fellowship. I sense a distrust of groups and institutions…

Do you remember what the very first messengers of God/ the apostles in the NT/ said concerning even their own teaching ? That if they do not teach truth, if they go off track a little or a lot in a message, DO NOT accept that. And more concerning false teachers, false teachings, and false apostles, of which there are many.

 

[follower]

I believe so absolutely yes.
One thing…the wheat and the tares will be together till harvest time. I find that frightening and sad but it’s biblical.

Why frightening ?
Sad is obvious. My heart breaks for those who by their own words or religion or choice choose to remain in death, in darkness, in a false gospel , or separated from Jesus in any case at all.