SPIRITUAL WARFARE IN US

[Mitspa]

Ephesians 6:12
12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

Galatians 5:17
17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

II Corinthians 10:4
4 (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;)

Romans 14:1
Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.


Weak brothers are still brothers, but you just are not to discuss some theology with them (foods for instance ?). God evidently receives weak Christians (they should grow up, but some evidentily have a Peter Pan desire to never grow up)

Romans 14:3
3 Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.

Romans 15:1
We then that are strong ought to bear the infirmities of the weak, and not to please ourselves.

You can not demand strength from the weak IMHO. If a person is physically dead, you can not get them to agree with you to be raised from the dead IMHO. If a person has Alzheimers you are the one praying for healing IMHO.

Hebrews 5:12
12 For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.

All the above may be your brothers. You might think they are in need of maturity, but they are not the enemy. The evil one comes to steal kill and destroy. Steal maturity, steal strength, destroy tender plants.

A kidney that is weak is still a kidney. We need to not throw away that which Jesus died for.

eddif

eddif, I agree in large part with your defense of the weak in faith, who struggle within there own conscience at the liberty we have in Christ. But we have many other scriptures that relate to the defense of our liberty, thoughout the epistles. The issue "in the Church" is not that those who are in liberty are not giving those who are weak in faith, proper time to grow and mature. In fact the issue is and has been that the legalistic are trying to impose legalism upon the "Chruch" and bring believers into bondage. They do this through different and varied teachings of the law, and religious tradition. This sort of teaching and bondage is to be resisted at all times, and the liberty of the gospel is never to be surrendered to false teaching. Even as Paul stood against these things, and was not moved for a moment from the truth of the gospel, we also are to cast out the bondwoman and her son. A very huge difference between accepting a believer in their weaknesses and allowing that person to teach false doctrine or to impose bondage on those who are in liberty.

 

[eddif]

eddif, I agree in large part with your defense of the weak in faith, who struggle within there own conscience at the liberty we have in Christ. But we have many other scriptures that relate to the defense of our liberty, thoughout the epistles. The issue "in the Church" is not that those who are in liberty are not giving those who are weak in faith, proper time to grow and mature. In fact the issue is and has been that the legalistic are trying to impose legalism upon the "Chruch" and bring believers into bondage. They do this through different and varied teachings of the law, and religious tradition. This sort of teaching and bondage is to be resisted at all times, and the liberty of the gospel is never to be surrendered to false teaching. Even as Paul stood against these things, and was not moved for a moment from the truth of the gospel, we also are to cast out the bondwoman and her son. A very huge difference between accepting a believer in their weaknesses and allowing that person to teach false doctrine or to impose bondage on those who are in liberty.

If we are not fighting each other, and I think both of us have made an attempt to be friends (and have arrived); then we may have a few days to work through some things. I get tickeled at waiting on the Holy Spirit. Time is short and the apostles did not tarry for months trying to get the Holy Ghost. The knocking at the door is complete with conversation asking for the door to be opened.
Revelation 3:20
20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

Philippians 1:18
18 What then? notwithstanding, every way, whether in pretence, or in truth, Christ is preached; and I therein do rejoice, yea, and will rejoice.

Jesus wanted the disciples to receive the Holy Spirit (one of the all things). We just can not get some things done without the Holy Spirit (sure seems it was a second blessing to me). The term second blessing is man made, but when asking if someone received the Holy Spirit since you believed (sure seems to fit somewhere in a list). Evidently not everyone has the same experience, but there could be a supernatural experience. Not a made up experience, but a supernatural thing.

I know some of Israel wanted land on the other side of Jordan. The promised land is available. I just have to see that not all want to enter.

People are taught terrible things. Fighting the students is not the way to go. Teaching the truth in love is the way to go.

I look forward to our posts. Smooth all the time--- I doubt it. Productive for both of us--- I hope so.

Excluding other posters? Not unless Admin sees the need. I do issue the request for peace that is true peace. The walls are broken down when we are in Christ.
Ephesians 2:16-17
13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.

And God grant that I am not the first to gather a few stones and plaster it over to make a whitewashed wall. I realize I have issues myself.

eddif

 

[eddif]

I dont want to take the thread off track or offend my friend eddif but I know that many believe in a literal suffering "physical" suffering yet struggle with a concept of literal and physical "healing"? Many put healing in a symbolic or "spiritual" realm, while promoting suffering as very physical and real? I find this to be VERY CONTRARY to the truth of scripture and I wonder how some who promote physical suffering, can not see the error of their doctrines?

The ONLY suffering of a New Testament believer that is shown in scripture is persecution for believeing not attempting to claim one is suffering for unbelief? The promise of healing is as much a part of the gospel as forgiveness of sins. So to say one is "suffering" for the gospel with sickness is not acceptable to those of us who see the truth. Now I do accept that satan attempts to bring sickness upon us, and we must stand fast in faith in the promise, but we dont claim that our sickness is an example of our "spiritual growth"? No truth spiritual growth comes as we partake of the divine nature Through receivng the promises of God.

So again I do not understand the logic of how some hold the truth of scripture? Physical suffering is defended, and physical healing is rejected??? This is not the Jesus shown to us in scripture.

You are probably at work. I am posting because I may be out for a few hours, and you may get to read at lunch time and prepare for a post later.

I really could use a comma or two in the following statement.

The ONLY suffering of a New Testament believer that is shown in scripture is persecution for believeing not attempting to claim one is suffering for unbelief? The promise of healing is as much a part of the gospel as forgiveness of sins. So to say one is "suffering" for the gospel with sickness is not acceptable to those of us who see the truth. Now I do accept that satan attempts to bring sickness upon us, and we must stand fast in faith in the promise, but we dont claim that our sickness is an example of our "spiritual growth"? No truth spiritual growth comes as we partake of the divine nature Through receivng the promises of God.

The only suffering of a New Testament believer:
(is persecution for believeing)

not attempting to claim one is suffering for unbelief?

Explain this "not attempting to claim one is suffering for unbelief?" Someone elses statement? Make a few more statements. I am having trouble knowing which is your belief and which is theirs. And just how the statement is made.

The promise of healing is as much a part of the gospel as forgiveness of sins.

This following statement is not to stop your statements, but to allow us to open up when / where Jesus accomplished our various benefits. In heaven now Jesus interceedes for us (later discussion).

Healing comes from suffering in Life (stripes before cross?).
I Peter 2:24
24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

I perhaps realize that stripes not carried to the cross might not be the same as just stripes (Paul was beaten with stripes). I am hoping we can open all this up (comments are welcome). The immune system function will possibly help us understand. The immune system prepares a solution for problems.

Just a start.

eddif

 

[eddif]

1. God has made a new covenant with us—one that is based on His faithfulness, not ours (Philippians 1:6, AMP, Hebrews 8:7-9, AMP).
2. “If we are faithless [do not believe and are untrue to Him], He remains true (faithful to His Word and His righteous character), for He cannot deny Himself†(2 Timothy 2:13, AMP).
   1. Many times we believe we have to meet requirements to earn God’s favor.
   2. However, even when we miss the mark, God remains faithful to His Word.
   3. We must be aware of turning spiritual activities, such as prayer, church attendance, and confessing the Word into works.
   4. To keep out of this self deception, we must keep first things first—our relationship with our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and our trust in Him.
   5. It all boils down to trust. In all that we do in faith, we should do so trusting in God’s ability, and His faithfulness.

The new covenant. Yes
Under the old covenant: if you sinned, you sometimes suffered right then (sometimes as a nation or as an individual at times).

Under the New Covenant Jesus became the curse for us.
If we sin now the church is to seek restoration of the brother. If the brother refuses to repent, then he is turned over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh so that in the day of the Lord Jesus (he might be saved).

Jesus gets the credit for having done the work. It is no longer the people that do the work, but Christ's work now working in us is accomplishing the work.

It seems like a lot of double talk in one sense, but now Jesus gets the credit.

We realize the newborn inner man is of God. We realize the flesh is still to be dealt with.

We are not all bad or all good. We are flesh with God in us. We are dealing with body soul and spirit. Nothing a 10 year old can not grasp. Through Christ on the day of the resurrection, the flesh will be changed (though as through fire in some cases).

eddif

 

[Mitspa]

You are probably at work. I am posting because I may be out for a few hours, and you may get to read at lunch time and prepare for a post later.

I really could use a comma or two in the following statement.


The only suffering of a New Testament believer:
(is persecution for believeing)



Explain this "not attempting to claim one is suffering for unbelief?" Someone elses statement? Make a few more statements. I am having trouble knowing which is your belief and which is theirs. And just how the statement is made.

The promise of healing is as much a part of the gospel as forgiveness of sins.

This following statement is not to stop your statements, but to allow us to open up when / where Jesus accomplished our various benefits. In heaven now Jesus interceedes for us (later discussion).

Healing comes from suffering in Life (stripes before cross?).
I Peter 2:24
24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

I perhaps realize that stripes not carried to the cross might not be the same as just stripes (Paul was beaten with stripes). I am hoping we can open all this up (comments are welcome). The immune system function will possibly help us understand. The immune system prepares a solution for problems.

Just a start.

eddif

Gee I posted this weeks ago, and not sure what you are responding too? My point was quiet clear, which you seemed to ignore? Suffering comes for having faith, not for having doubt. Many want to make "suffering" as a physical reality, yet reject the clear and evident truth of the healing power of God. The only biblical suffering comes from persecution for proclaiming the truth of Christ and His stripes that heal. One cannot deny the healing power and claim the are "suffering" with Christ.


2Ti 3:12
Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.

 

[Mitspa]

eddif, I agree in large part with your defense of the weak in faith, who struggle within there own conscience at the liberty we have in Christ. But we have many other scriptures that relate to the defense of our liberty, thoughout the epistles. The issue "in the Church" is not that those who are in liberty are not giving those who are weak in faith, proper time to grow and mature. In fact the issue is and has been that the legalistic are trying to impose legalism upon the "Chruch" and bring believers into bondage. They do this through different and varied teachings of the law, and religious tradition. This sort of teaching and bondage is to be resisted at all times, and the liberty of the gospel is never to be surrendered to false teaching. Even as Paul stood against these things, and was not moved for a moment from the truth of the gospel, we also are to cast out the bondwoman and her son. A very huge difference between accepting a believer in their weaknesses and allowing that person to teach false doctrine or to impose bondage on those who are in liberty.

If we are not fighting each other, and I think both of us have made an attempt to be friends (and have arrived); then we may have a few days to work through some things. I get tickeled at waiting on the Holy Spirit. Time is short and the apostles did not tarry for months trying to get the Holy Ghost. The knocking at the door is complete with conversation asking for the door to be opened.
Revelation 3:20
20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

Philippians 1:18
18 What then? notwithstanding, every way, whether in pretence, or in truth, Christ is preached; and I therein do rejoice, yea, and will rejoice.

Jesus wanted the disciples to receive the Holy Spirit (one of the all things). We just can not get some things done without the Holy Spirit (sure seems it was a second blessing to me). The term second blessing is man made, but when asking if someone received the Holy Spirit since you believed (sure seems to fit somewhere in a list). Evidently not everyone has the same experience, but there could be a supernatural experience. Not a made up experience, but a supernatural thing.

I know some of Israel wanted land on the other side of Jordan. The promised land is available. I just have to see that not all want to enter.

People are taught terrible things. Fighting the students is not the way to go. Teaching the truth in love is the way to go.

I look forward to our posts. Smooth all the time--- I doubt it. Productive for both of us--- I hope so.

Excluding other posters? Not unless Admin sees the need. I do issue the request for peace that is true peace. The walls are broken down when we are in Christ.
Ephesians 2:16-17
13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.

And God grant that I am not the first to gather a few stones and plaster it over to make a whitewashed wall. I realize I have issues myself.

eddif

Well not sure that you responded to my post at all? But you do work at your own pace and make the points you desire to make. May you be blessed

 

[eddif]

You are probably at work. I am posting because I may be out for a few hours, and you may get to read at lunch time and prepare for a post later.

I really could use a comma or two in the following statement.


The only suffering of a New Testament believer:
(is persecution for believeing)



Explain this "not attempting to claim one is suffering for unbelief?" Someone elses statement? Make a few more statements. I am having trouble knowing which is your belief and which is theirs. And just how the statement is made.

The promise of healing is as much a part of the gospel as forgiveness of sins.

This following statement is not to stop your statements, but to allow us to open up when / where Jesus accomplished our various benefits. In heaven now Jesus interceedes for us (later discussion).

Healing comes from suffering in Life (stripes before cross?).
I Peter 2:24
24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

I perhaps realize that stripes not carried to the cross might not be the same as just stripes (Paul was beaten with stripes). I am hoping we can open all this up (comments are welcome). The immune system function will possibly help us understand. The immune system prepares a solution for problems.

Just a start.

eddif

Gee I posted this weeks ago, and not sure what you are responding too? My point was quiet clear, which you seemed to ignore? Suffering comes for having faith, not for having doubt. Many want to make "suffering" as a physical reality, yet reject the clear and evident truth of the healing power of God. The only biblical suffering comes from persecution for proclaiming the truth of Christ and His stripes that heal. One cannot deny the healing power and claim the are "suffering" with Christ.


2Ti 3:12
Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.

This thread was in the blog area. I was really not allowed to have much interaction without Admin stepping in. I longed to answer at the time of your post, but really knew what would happen if I made comments. After 90 days I made a very measured general comment and after a short time another poster commented and we / I had a comment from Admin. I was not ignoring you, but knew what would happen if I commented. Admin has worked with me. I talk in riddles and I know it. Perhaps I even hear in riddles at times.

eddif

 

[eddif]

Well not sure that you responded to my post at all? But you do work at your own pace and make the points you desire to make. May you be blessed

I tried not to misquote you. If I had jumped in and not understood your statements that would have been a mistake too.

I do have points I try and make. You have points you try and make.

Now that the thread is in Apologetics & Theology I can possibly pick up the pace.

I will be blessed if we continue the conversation.

I have somewhere I want to go in what I think scripture says. You are totally able and allowed to not agree. I hope we all free to present our cases. The theology of some places I go just basically makes me almost sick (several denominations). There are good things in some of those same places though. Revelation names churches and gives peoples names, but I am not quite there yet. Admin for this site is not there either, and I have to respect that.

I will take a little time to think before I post more. Thanks for the comma, and explanation.

When I do post, feel free to rip it to shreds if necessary. LOL

eddif

 

[Mitspa]

Well not sure that you responded to my post at all? But you do work at your own pace and make the points you desire to make. May you be blessed

I tried not to misquote you. If I had jumped in and not understood your statements that would have been a mistake too.

I do have points I try and make. You have points you try and make.

Now that the thread is in Apologetics & Theology I can possibly pick up the pace.

I will be blessed if we continue the conversation.

I have somewhere I want to go in what I think scripture says. You are totally able and allowed to not agree. I hope we all free to present our cases. The theology of some places I go just basically makes me almost sick (several denominations). There are good things in some of those same places though. Revelation names churches and gives peoples names, but I am not quite there yet. Admin for this site is not there either, and I have to respect that.

I will take a little time to think before I post more. Thanks for the comma, and explanation.

When I do post, feel free to rip it to shreds if necessary. LOL

eddif

Blessings my friend, Im sure you will hear from me if i think you are getting off track?

 

[eddif]

For those who want to review how the immune system works:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immune_system

There is not just one way the immune system takes care of things but many ways:
It forms things that gobble up problem bacteria (He Himself bore our sins..by his stripes we are healed?)
Natural killer cells are at work (put to death that which is in you?)
Macrophages attack cancer cells (Greater is He that is in me than he that is in the world?)

Right now I am just working on learning which scriptures fit the immune system. Jesus / Holy Spirit takes care of bad areas of our life.

Jesus works in us to will and to do of his good pleasure. A special spiritual / physical thing is prepared for each individual problem a person has.

Symbolism is just a symbol of the reality in Christ Jesus. All this talk about the immune system is a hint installed in us at creation by God. If it seems too strange for you just push ignore eddif.

Friend or foe is what the immune system does well.

eddif

 

[eddif]

I Thessalonians 5:23
23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

That is an excellent and right goal.

I John 3:2
2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

And ole Paul says
Ephesians 4:24
23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind

The mind must be in pretty good shape
Romans 7:25
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.


I tend to think the spirit is in the mind, and Jesus is in our hearts. There are those who may think differently and I will not freak if they come two feet off the ground and tell me differently (scripture would be nice). The hidden man of the heart helps me understand.

Even though the Holy Spirit was given to Paul he still says.

Philippians 3:13
13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before
14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

Ephesians 4:23-24
23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind; 24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

And I suppose this (putting on) is completed on the day, and is not complete yet. I will say IMHO for there are different opinions:
II Timothy 2:18
18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.

More later


The Jerk from Mississippi
eddif

 

[Deborah13]

I tend to think the spirit is in the mind, and Jesus is in our hearts. There are those who may think differently and I will not freak if they come two feet off the ground and tell me differently (scripture would be nice). The hidden man of the heart helps me understand.

I Thessalonians 5:23
23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Hebrews 4:12 YLT
for the reckoning of God is living, and working, and sharp above every two-edged sword, and piercing unto the dividing asunder both of soul and spirit, of joints also and marrow, and a discerner of thoughts and intents of the heart;
soul = Gk 5590 = psyche
spirit = Gk 4151 = pneuma

These two verses started me on a word search some time ago. Then I read a book about it.
In the two scriptures above there is two different words used in the Gk for soul and spirit and a third for body (flesh and bone). So to me that says we are all three. Body of coarse just a shell or tool. But in the scriptures it is hard to always define the difference in soul and spirit, they seem to be used interchangeably at times, but I really need to do a better study than I have. Strong's gives a definition of both words that appear to be the same at least in man.

I don't disagree with you that our minds cannot have the spirit but I see it a little differently, too. I'll try to explain clearly...
So if I had to draw a picture it would look like three complete circles side by side but overlapping on each with the one next to it.
So the center one I would label Soul, the one to the right of soul I would label spirit, the one on the left I would label body. Spirit would overlap Soul but not body. Body would overlap on the left Soul but not spirit. Rather like links in a chain.

1 Corinth 2:14 YLT
and the natural man doth not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for to him they are foolishness, and he is not able to know them, because spiritually they are discerned;

natural = Gk 5591 = Gk Interlinear says psuchikos = 'soulish'
spiritually = Gk 4153 = Gk Interlinear says pneumatikOs = spiritually

So for me I understand this as, before we have the presence of the Holy Spirit our spirit is dead, when the Holy Spirit enters our spirit is made alive by the living water. (which by the way is an interesting study in the OT, this living water, the Spirit of God) the holy Spirit being made one with us in our spirit.
Even though we are a brand new creature in Christ our soulish soul is only partially renewed, our spirit being alive has a small part of our mind compared to how it is as we mature in Christ.

Ephesians 4:24
23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind

The word used here for spirit is also pneuma, not psyche.

So with my circle picture I see that my soul was all that was needed to operate my body and to function as any beast of the field in the natural. But when the spirit is made alive by God the spirit becomes operational in my mind, the Holy Spirit presences renewing my mind to the things of God and becoming a more and more the spiritual mind rather than a soulish one.

Enjoy reading your posts. Yes, sometimes they are riddles to me, "What did he say?" I have to read over again.

 

[eddif]

I tend to think the spirit is in the mind, and Jesus is in our hearts. There are those who may think differently and I will not freak if they come two feet off the ground and tell me differently (scripture would be nice). The hidden man of the heart helps me understand.

I Thessalonians 5:23
23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Hebrews 4:12 YLT
for the reckoning of God is living, and working, and sharp above every two-edged sword, and piercing unto the dividing asunder both of soul and spirit, of joints also and marrow, and a discerner of thoughts and intents of the heart;
soul = Gk 5590 = psyche
spirit = Gk 4151 = pneuma

These two verses started me on a word search some time ago. Then I read a book about it.
In the two scriptures above there is two different words used in the Gk for soul and spirit and a third for body (flesh and bone). So to me that says we are all three. Body of coarse just a shell or tool. But in the scriptures it is hard to always define the difference in soul and spirit, they seem to be used interchangeably at times, but I really need to do a better study than I have. Strong's gives a definition of both words that appear to be the same at least in man.

I don't disagree with you that our minds cannot have the spirit but I see it a little differently, too. I'll try to explain clearly...
So if I had to draw a picture it would look like three complete circles side by side but overlapping on each with the one next to it.
So the center one I would label Soul, the one to the right of soul I would label spirit, the one on the left I would label body. Spirit would overlap Soul but not body. Body would overlap on the left Soul but not spirit. Rather like links in a chain.

1 Corinth 2:14 YLT
and the natural man doth not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for to him they are foolishness, and he is not able to know them, because spiritually they are discerned;

natural = Gk 5591 = Gk Interlinear says psuchikos = 'soulish'
spiritually = Gk 4153 = Gk Interlinear says pneumatikOs = spiritually

So for me I understand this as, before we have the presence of the Holy Spirit our spirit is dead, when the Holy Spirit enters our spirit is made alive by the living water. (which by the way is an interesting study in the OT, this living water, the Spirit of God) the holy Spirit being made one with us in our spirit.
Even though we are a brand new creature in Christ our soulish soul is only partially renewed, our spirit being alive has a small part of our mind compared to how it is as we mature in Christ.

Ephesians 4:24
23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind

The word used here for spirit is also pneuma, not psyche.

So with my circle picture I see that my soul was all that was needed to operate my body and to function as any beast of the field in the natural. But when the spirit is made alive by God the spirit becomes operational in my mind, the Holy Spirit presences renewing my mind to the things of God and becoming a more and more the spiritual mind rather than a soulish one.

Enjoy reading your posts. Yes, sometimes they are riddles to me, "What did he say?" I have to read over again.

I tend to think the spirit is in the mind

I don't disagree with you that our minds cannot have the spirit but I see it a little differently, too.

Double negative be done got to me???

Let me try my diagram:
Adam's body lying on the table ready to have body activated and mind, will, emotions installed.

The Holy Spirit breathes into him and he becomes a living soul (if I got that right).

Man evidently had his death in the body area. Hindsight lets us know that the eternal man will be in sheol on a temporary basis and finally in heaven or hell permantently (rough description).

Skip way ahead to Pentecost. The Holy Ghost is put somewhere in believers (might be in the place the angel with the sword has been guarding all those years).

The torn veil in the temple is probably the place of the spirit in us opened up. The Spirit in us can be evident now (spirituals can manifest). IMHO

I just am weird (hopefully in a good way at times). Been a huntin and dranking too much a water out offen the slew) LOL.

eddif

 

[Deborah13]

Adam's body lying on the table ready to have body activated and mind, will, emotions installed.

Gotcha'

The Holy Spirit breathes into him and he becomes a living soul (if I got that right).

Gotcha'

Man evidently had his death in the body area. Hindsight lets us know that the eternal man will be in sheol on a temporary basis and finally in heaven or hell permantently (rough description).

Gotcha'

Skip way ahead to Pentecost. The Holy Ghost is put somewhere in believers (might be in the place the angel with the sword has been guarding all those years).

Hmm..interesting. That place where there is access to the Tree of Life. I like this metaphor. The heart.

The torn veil in the temple is probably the place of the spirit in us opened up. The Spirit in us can be evident now (spirituals can manifest). IMHO

This is harder for me to see. Although, maybe that torn veil leads to the ability to have that spirit renewed mind. From faith to faith and glory to glory.

Yep, you're weird, and yes in a good way.

 

[eddif]

Isaiah 28:11
11 For with stammering lips and another tongue
Will he speak to this people.

This speaking was because of failures of the people.

Isaiah 6:6
6 Then flew one of the seraphims unto me, having a live coal in his hand, which he had taken with the tongs from off the altar:

So what happens in one part of us has to be moved to another part of us. OT heart worship is not gone, but there must be some movement of heart meditation to the speech center of the brain. We are made in his image.

Related​

I Corinthians 14:21
21 In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.

When Jesus spoke to the multitudes in Greek (please do not hurl error messages from your keyboards LOL) the multitudes did not hear. The disciples even had to ask for meaning of the parable of the sower. Not that they did not speak in their language at times, but that the Greek concepts were different too. New covenant new concepts (concepts that were actually hidden in the first covenant).

Hebrews 8:10
10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

After Jesus was raised from the dead, he began to teach the disciples about himself from the OT. IMHO this is a mind thinking and not a heart pondering. The thinking part is more related to Greek thinking than Hebrew pondering.

Hebrews 8:6-7
6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.
7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.

Using the Law lawfully is always allowed. You just have a lot more references to the Mind in the NT.

When the OT angel flew from the altar (Jesus sacrificed himself) he took the offering to our Mind. This was a prophecy to take place IMHO.

This is why Paul ( a good Jewish person) can say:
Romans 7:25
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

So today we have both heart and mind in operation. In our born again mind we understand mysteries. In our flesh the crucified Jesus bore our sins and gives us healing if we confess our sins (do not bash me too much). We do not work for salvation. We do not depend on the Law for righteousness. The whole thing is a little complex.

I hope I said: I believe the Holy Spirit is in our minds. All of the eddif New Jerusalem posts point to the human body symbolism of the mind being a higher place in us. Meditate on Jesus death in the heart, and all his resurrection power in our head.

We have treasures hidden in an earthen vessel, to show that the transcending power belongs to God and not Man.

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[eddif]

If being broken helps, this thread should make progress now. I have been ripped from one end to the other as I sought to know what to post. I guess I thought (notice many capital Is), that warfare could be explained without a battle. All of a sudden it is like I was enrolled in military school. It seems the first lessons are on personal weakness. But Holy Spirit, come on, play fair (I seem to want to cry out). I want to think that the enemy is over there somewhere (hey dummy you gave the title --SPIRITUAL WARFARE IN US). Low and behold the enemy has infiltrated my camp and before the posts can help others the writer has to go back to school.


Why i took a nice little blog post and changed it into the open warfare in Ye Ole Apologetics & Theology. Well folks wanted to comment. Yeah and you thought you had something to say. Well thinking and knowing are evidently related, but not necessarily the same.

So now warfare has really come on the personal level in my mind.

The text will use: The parable of the sower.

But first​

Galatians 5:17
17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

Warfare 101 - right inside us

Paul's Romans 7:25
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

eddif

 

[eddif]

I Corinthians 10:13
13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

I understand the differences in mankind:
Jews
Greeks
Bond
Free
Male
Female
Weak
Strong
Those that can not eat food offered to idols
Those who see idols as nothing, and can eat meat
Baby Christians
Those who should be mature by now but still must hear only the milk of the word
Baptized only in John's baptism
Baptized into Jesus
Baptized in the Holy Spirit
Deacon
Elder
Regular church member
etc., etc.

I can never ( in my flesh) cover all this. Not even to mention:
Hebrews 12:1
Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,

All of us fight differing internal battles concerning external and internal issues.

Good thing we can invite the greater one inside us, that is able to help.

eddif

 

[eddif]

Mental Camouflage

I was in the grocery store today and i heard one checkout person talking to another worker "so you like camouflage. I got about 10 steps and went back. I asked if they knew mental camouflage. We had about 2 minutes before other customers came along to checkout. All I got to say was: something far greater sometimes hides in a statement

Mental camouflage would be a statement, that seems to blend in with other surrounding conversation; but inside that statement / fact is a much higher order thought that most folks miss. I ought to know, because I have missed many things over the years.

The Law is one of those areas that gave me fits. When I heard ox I thought ox. I had no idea that the ox was a bishop. I had no idea that a cloven hoof interacted with grain differently than a horse or panther paw. I had no idea that chewing the cud was meditation. Nothing like just being a slow thinking southern feller. Then God talked to me at the door that I finally cracked the door a little, and light began to come in.

A Jewish person first wrote all this. Jesus talked of living water at a well. It is just all through scripture. What a battle to see that what you thought you saw was hiding something far greater. The hunter (seeker) lurks in the shadows and seeks. You have to ask God, but when the eyes of your understanding comes open............. I wondered about pork to finally saw that we live on clean words.

Traditions are sometimes good and sometimes very hard to remove if they are off some.

Romans 2:1414 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:

When Peter preached to the Gentiles they received the Holy Spirit just like the Jewish persons. The formally separated from God folks got some insight too.

eddif

 

[eddif]

Re: Mental Camouflage

Galatians 3:6
6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

Genesis 15:6
6 And he believed in the Lord; and he counted it to him for righteousness.

I do not think Abraham would have known totally about looking forward to Jesus.

Looking at the times, the chosen people of God had to humble themselves and pray and turn from their wicked ways; they sure needed something beyond their behavior at times. That is sure an inner mind conflict at times.

Genesis 12:3
3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

Blessings hit Rahab, Ruth, and even relatives and foreign countries at times. There is that inner conflict that at times the Jewish nation (and individuals) sinned and then turned from that sin. There may even be a trail connecting the Greek language to the blessing (through possibly the Phoenicians). Once you see the Rahab and Ruth principle, you can begin to look around for other ties. I do not tend to just use history, but scripture tied to history does seem to track some nations as blessing Israel.

Romans 7:25
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.


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[eddif]

I always heard the return of physical Israel is the budding.

The return to believing in Jesus is the budding. The Messianic Judaism groups (IMHO) are the buds starting to show.

The spiritual land of belief is more real than a physical land (It took faith to take the promised land). The everlasting kingdom with Jesus on the throne is the reality and the shadow is physical Israel. Of course there is always a reality and a shadow.

Spiritual warfare in us

Boy I am slow to catch on.

The jerk from Mississippi
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