[__ Science __ ] Sweden Shuts Historic Churches for Winter to Meet Climate Goals

[Barbarian]

The problem as I see it is that the current narrative is all about automobiles, but there's much more than that. We also cook our food, heat our homes, run our well pumps, fly airplanes and jets, defend our countries, manufacture everything we need or want and most of it is done using fossil fuels.

Yep. We're making progress, of course. My home state (Iowa) gets nearly 40% of it's electrical power from wind now. It's too late to avoid consequences, which are already affecting us. But not to late to prevent even worse consequences.

 

[miamited]

Hi hawkman

You do, I suppose, realize that the article is about buildings, right? I would agree that it seems to be a really wild idea and that the world has gone overboard on all of this, 'we're going to save the world if we stop using fossil fuels' movement, but...

Sweden has put itself out there as pushing this agenda of restricting severely the use of fossil fuels and this is an attempt to follow that agenda. Personally, I rather agree that our 'awe and wonder' at silly buildings that over the years, especially during the early European era, are what we should worship and hold as dear to us, isn't likely what God is looking for among his children anyway. I mean, Jesus did say that God is looking for those who worship in spirit, not so much in fancy and ornate ancient buildings that were, likely wrongheaded, built as our way of glorifying God. Perhaps it would be good of believers to do away with such 'castles built for God' and turn their hearts to him in their practices of worship rather than 'where' they worship.

After all, God's word declares to us that it is the created heavens that declare the glory of God and not our immense and ornate buildings built by the hands of men. God's word warned His people Israel that their alters were to be built with undressed stone. That's not what I see in this picture.

 

[hawkman]

I would agree that it seems to be a really wild idea and that the world has gone overboard on all of this, 'we're going to save the world if we stop using fossil fuels' movement

Well there you go !

 

[jasonc]

Hi hawkman

You do, I suppose, realize that the article is about buildings, right? I would agree that it seems to be a really wild idea and that the world has gone overboard on all of this, 'we're going to save the world if we stop using fossil fuels' movement, but...

Sweden has put itself out there as pushing this agenda of restricting severely the use of fossil fuels and this is an attempt to follow that agenda. Personally, I rather agree that our 'awe and wonder' at silly buildings that over the years, especially during the early European era, are what we should worship and hold as dear to us, isn't likely what God is looking for among his children anyway. I mean, Jesus did say that God is looking for those who worship in spirit, not so much in fancy and ornate ancient buildings that were, likely wrongheaded, built as our way of glorifying God. Perhaps it would be good of believers to do away with such 'castles built for God' and turn their hearts to him in their practices of worship rather than 'where' they worship.

After all, God's word declares to us that it is the created heavens that declare the glory of God and not our immense and ornate buildings built by the hands of men. God's word warned His people Israel that their alters were to be built with undressed stone. That's not what I see in this picture.

Um ok so don't pain any masonry ? That's undress .not wood ,no stucco.

If you saw the temple of Solomon it was hardly plain .it has imagery that is in Johns vision .

The order the way the people lined up around the tabernacle was is also in johns vision .

A church should be allowed to use imagery of the bible to inspire .
The local native pine tree ,cypress trees pale to that stuff .

I have visited two hundred year old churches where paintings depicted scenes in the Bible and felt puny looking up at see God giving Moses the Torah

 

[miamited]

Um ok so don't pain any masonry ? That's undress .not wood ,no stucco.

If you saw the temple of Solomon it was hardly plain .it has imagery that is in Johns vision .

The order the way the people lined up around the tabernacle was is also in johns vision .

A church should be allowed to use imagery of the bible to inspire .
The local native pine tree ,cypress trees pale to that stuff .

I have visited two hundred year old churches where paintings depicted scenes in the Bible and felt puny looking up at see God giving Moses the Torah

Hey jasonc

I'm just saying that we seem to make a bigger deal about the buildings than the personage to whom they are built. Our fellowship has stained glass depictions of many scenes of Jesus' life, but it's not a particularly gargantuan structure as many of the European buildings that man has built in some form that seems to them to be worshipping God. It also seems, if I'm reading the article correctly, that it's an issue that the Swedes don't seem to be bothered about and that the church is the one making this decision. I quote:

Rather than investing in oil to maintain warmth during the colder months, the church has opted to keep the buildings closed. (bolding and underline mine)

This American Faith organization seems to want to paint this as some sort of persecution of the 'church' promulgated by the world. It reads to me like it's a purely voluntary decision by the respective fellowships that operate the facilities. It would seem that it is the church trying to save themselves some money.

 

[miamited]

Well there you go !

Hi Hawkins

Yes, I find that some, and let me loudly repeat 'some' of the measures that we are implementing to go green, are a bit overboard. Like our trying to legislate gas stoves and gas heating sources in our country. But as I quoted above, this seems to be a money saving measure for the fellowships involved as a wholly voluntary issue. I do know that many energy sources in Europe have gotten pretty expensive since the invasion of Ukraine by Russia. I'm not going to hold any condemnation against the fellowships for doing this. You many if you like.

 

[jasonc]

Hey jasonc

I'm just saying that we seem to make a bigger deal about the buildings than the personage to whom they are built. Our fellowship has stained glass depictions of many scenes of Jesus' life, but it's not a particularly gargantuan structure as many of the European buildings that man has built in some form that seems to them to be worshipping God. It also seems, if I'm reading the article correctly, that it's an issue that the Swedes don't seem to be bothered about and that the church is the one making this decision. I quote:

Rather than investing in oil to maintain warmth during the colder months, the church has opted to keep the buildings closed. (bolding and underline mine)

This American Faith organization seems to want to paint this as some sort of persecution of the 'church' promulgated by the world. It reads to me like it's a purely voluntary decision by the respective fellowships that operate the facilities. It would seem that it is the church trying to save themselves some money.

Ever heard of fire cide .meaning if you as a Church must have these in a home that uses a kitchen to feed the poor .

The FDC: What Does it Stand for and What Does it Do?

The FDC is the fire department connection portion of a fire sprinkler system or standpipe system. Its role in ensuring the effectiveness and success of a fire sprinkler system to suppress a fire is pivotal.

blog.koorsen.com

I can't convert my house into a tiny half way house to house three souls without that set up
Essentially this church just closed itself .

Buildings like it or not have meanings .property we own ,we invest time in and memories are created .

When I lost my dad .over three quarters of the restaurants he enjoyed were on the utilitiy grids. I thought of him at the closed schezuan Palace ,the old location of nankin restaurant, the lins garden now a Peruvian restaurant. The old 14th Ave steak house now something else .

I posted a ranch style shell gas station on the local fb pages to find the history of it and I got the children of several owners of it thinking of their dad and the sights ,smells .plus former workers and customers .

Imagine a firing burning down a church in Savannah,ga and that silly pre civil war building was an old slave church .likely you wouldn't call the attendees in grief ,silly over that .in ga it's still common to bury your dead out side the entrance to a church or near by.

I explored old cemeteries in ga like that and have dead to visit in one . That church pastor and elders having never met me .they knew the family as being very early county pioneers.

If your church isn't like that then I question your faith .we are so reliant on other then the church for community .the govt to feed us ,help us then what it was pre depression.so when an old church is damaged or razed because of what not it's presence that holds memories to those in it is in many ways gone .



The church was the community center in alot of ways .not in all cases but it did .

SALEM BAPTIST CHURCH

Sunday Services Sunday School 10 am Morning Worship 11 am Sanctuary Choir Practice ...

www.salembaptistpavoga.org

Salem Baptist Church Cemetery in Pavo, Georgia - Find a Grave Cemetery

Location: 305608N 0834640W Patten District

www.findagrave.com

The church has a large wall of the buried outside where you can find where exactly they are buried and they also list a Sexton ,often an elder .new churches still do this there .within a few minutes several church cemeteries exist .

It's just a building ,isn't it ?

I hunted the family name and first name that came up was the father of the woman I met up there whose son is now dead and she is well .he is buried there .I will visit and add his name and hers.i maintain kin on that link if need be .

My point is that building can be replaced but to assume it's silly that we adorn or attach emotion to them is way off .

 

[miamited]

Hi jasonc

Ever heard of fire cide .meaning if you as a Church must have these in a home that uses a kitchen to feed the poor .

Nope. Have no idea what you are speaking of here.

In your follow up explanation, you seem to equate the 'church' to the building that followers gather in. I find that to be a wrong definition of what the Scriptures are speaking of when they use the word 'church'. But yes, most building codes require that commercial buildings have some sort of fire suppression system and for really large buildings, an FDC connection for firefighters to attach hoses to. I personally don't find that to be some sort of way that the world is persecuting the church, but that's just me.

My point is that building can be replaced but to assume it's silly that we adorn or attach emotion to them is way off .

Somehow I didn't glean that point from your post, but ok. And I didn't use the word 'silly', that's your understanding of what I posted.(oops sorry, yes I did) I said that we shouldn't hold buildings that are used, or have been used in the past to worship God in such high regard as some do. God doesn't live in buildings made by man. They are often times pretty buildings, but they are just buildings. I don't think that there is anything that man can make that can equate to the glory of or represent the glory of God.

 

[KV-44-v1]

The problem is that

Easy fix. Don't build mass living-areas on the coast. Building residences on the coast is a stupid decision to begin with.
Like the Bible says, (paraphrase) : "A foolish man builds a house on sand but a wise man builds a house on rock."
If everyone built like 50-100 miles inland, that would save a LOT OF LIVES. Imagine that. Seems like the COST of building near coasts is greater than the benefits.

it will affect peoples' lives because of where we live and what we do for our lifestyles.

Christianity does that too. And for the better.

The question I keep asking is, is there really anything we can do about it right now?

Not really. The whole premise of the Green NewScam is that man can save himself. And that man has the power to end the world. They potentially COULD, but God will not let that happen. The world shall end when God ends it. Man does not have the Authority to be the one ending the world.

If the science community is correct

They are fallible men like us. Yes, they are wrong, in various ways, on this subject. They are also wrong on the origins of life, life's history, the age and origin of the earth and universe. Genesis is true, not "bears into whales" or "dinos into birds". Not mill's of years. Not "the things in the universe formed from a big explosion".

and CO2 is the primary culprit even though it only makes up about 0.04% of the total atmosphere, the only way we can stop the introduction of CO2 into the atmosphere by our lifestyles is to stop using any form of fossil or biological fuels including oil, gas, LP gas, wood, coal, etc. and that means stop using those sources to develop other types of fuel supplies such as wind, water, solar, etc. plus rethinking just about everything we do, what materials we use to do it, and the processes we use to create them.

So, assuming that is possible, that would stop any additional CO2 that we are responsible for by our lifestyles from entering our atmosphere, but would that reverse what has been done or only stop it from progressing further?

Even after finding an alternative, CO2 would still be entering the atmosphere because every living creature of the animal kingdom that breathes exhales CO2 and every living thing that exists releases CO2 when they die. Since our human population continues to grow, this too means we would still continue to add CO2 to the atmosphere just by our very existence.

We are the 'carbon' "they" want to control.

It's a matter of finding ways out of generating all that carbon where we don't have to do it. In the United States, about 93% of anthropogenic CO2 emissions comes from burning fossil fuels. So that's the place to start.

Technology is key. USA produces less emissions than many countries. US FF burning is cleaner burning.
Iran, russia, china, Nkorea, don't make a big deal of it anywhere near as much as those on the left. China has many dirty burning coal plants.

 

[Barbarian]

Easy fix. Don't build mass living-areas on the coast. Building residences on the coast is a stupid decision to begin with.
Like the Bible says, (paraphrase) : "A foolish man builds a house on sand but a wise man builds a house on rock."
If everyone built like 50-100 miles inland, that would save a LOT OF LIVES. Imagine that. Seems like the COST of building near coasts is greater than the benefits.

Or we could just stop messing up this world God gave us, and then we could use it as He intended. One of those.

The whole premise of the Green NewScam is that man can save himself.

The premise is that if we act responsibly, America won't have to be smaller and poorer in the future.

We are the 'carbon' "they" want to control.

That's just story oil companies tell you to make you think there's no solution to a darker, poorer America. By far, the biggest source of emissions is fossil fuel burning vehicles.

Technology is key.

And it's working. Some states are getting up to a third of their electrical power from wind, for example. EVs are increasing and that reduces emissions.

The cost of solar power is falling and that also is increasing. It's why you're seeing frantic propaganda from energy companies to scare people off of these technologies.

 

[jasonc]

Easy fix. Don't build mass living-areas on the coast. Building residences on the coast is a stupid decision to begin with.
Like the Bible says, (paraphrase) : "A foolish man builds a house on sand but a wise man builds a house on rock."
If everyone built like 50-100 miles inland, that would save a LOT OF LIVES. Imagine that. Seems like the COST of building near coasts is greater than the benefits.

Christianity does that too. And for the better.

Not really. The whole premise of the Green NewScam is that man can save himself. And that man has the power to end the world. They potentially COULD, but God will not let that happen. The world shall end when God ends it. Man does not have the Authority to be the one ending the world.

They are fallible men like us. Yes, they are wrong, in various ways, on this subject. They are also wrong on the origins of life, life's history, the age and origin of the earth and universe. Genesis is true, not "bears into whales" or "dinos into birds". Not mill's of years. Not "the things in the universe formed from a big explosion".





We are the 'carbon' "they" want to control.


Technology is key. USA produces less emissions than many countries. US FF burning is cleaner burning.
Iran, russia, china, Nkorea, don't make a big deal of it anywhere near as much as those on the left. China has many dirty burning coal plants.

You can't have ports then at all .

No shipping .Florida was the best test bed for rockets.no place on earth that isn't at risk
Mountains ? Might be a volcano .
Mud slides ,snow storms .

Earth quakes are near those areas .

Also ahem isreal ,hardly able to be that far in . Remember that until the modern age most cities where near water ,I can post late 1800s communities and they proximity to water .the train came and changed alot .

You can see this with looking at st Augustine .it's early and oldest section is not a mile from the ocean .