Tasted Death for every Man !

[brightfame52]

Christ died so all men could cast away he flesh and walk in the Spirit.
He died to take away the sin of everybody in the world.
But most of the world rejected Him.
He did His part, but we must do our part too.

You are presenting a false Gospel that denies the efficacy of Christs saving death. Every man Christ tasted death for is saved unto Glory Heb 2:9-10

9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

10 For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings

 

[brightfame52]

Jesus did His part, dying to take away the sin of the world, so I can't say He failed at anything.

You are saying Jesus failed His Part, for His Part is taste death for them He died and bring them to Glory. Heb 2:9-10

 

[brightfame52]

I rejoice in the fact that Jesus made it possible for as many as want to, to join Him in His atoning, sanctifying, justifying, consecrating death.

False Gospel you are witnessing to, Jesus by His death sanctified them He died for, not make it possible Heb 10:10

10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Again you deny the efficacy of Christs death, unbelief

 

[brightfame52]

You've got the cart in front of the horse.

When Christ died, it purged away the sins of them He died for, they are Justified from all sin, regardless of their condition Heb 1:3

3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

He accomplished that by Himself, but you deny it, its unbelief

 

[journeymanisnothing]

Those for whom Christ died.....

Are here,

Christ died for the ungodly....while we were yet sinners...when we were enemies Rom.5....But love ye your enemies...Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father...Lk.6

They are not guilty , Justified before God ! Doesnt matter their condition !

if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die Rom.8
he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption Gal.6
whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy. Pro.28

account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. 2Pet.3

 

[brightfame52]

Are here,

Christ died for the ungodly....while we were yet sinners...when we were enemies Rom.5....But love ye your enemies...Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father...Lk.6

if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die Rom.8
he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption Gal.6
whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy. Pro.28

account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. 2Pet.3

Again, them who Christ died for, their sins have been purged and they are Justified from them Heb 1:3

3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

He did this when He tasted death for them Heb 2:9

 

[journeymanisnothing]

Again, them who Christ died for...

not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. 1Jn.2 not imputing their trespasses unto them 2Cor.5

 

[brightfame52]

not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. 1Jn.2 not imputing their trespasses unto them 2Cor.5

Them Christ died for, their sins are gone, purged Heb 1:3

3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

That means everyone He tasted death for Heb 2:9 cannot and will not ever be charged with sins, in fact, the Justice of God demands they receive a New Birth.

 

[journeymanisnothing]

Them Christ died for, their sins are gone, purged Heb 1:3

God spoke by the prophets Heb.1:1

let us reason together, saith the LORD: Isa.1:18

Repent.....so iniquity shall not be your ruin. Eze.18:30

turn unto the LORD your God.....for he is gracious and merciful Joe.2:13

spoken unto us by his Son Heb.1:2

If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead. Lk.16:3

that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his namea mong all nations, Lk.24:47

 

[brightfame52]

God spoke by the prophets Heb.1:1

let us reason together, saith the LORD: Isa.1:18

Repent.....so iniquity shall not be your ruin. Eze.18:30

turn unto the LORD your God.....for he is gracious and merciful Joe.2:13

spoken unto us by his Son Heb.1:2

If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead. Lk.16:3

that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his namea mong all nations, Lk.24:47

Everyone Jesus tasted death for have had their sins purged Heb 1:3 and they have been sanctified Heb 10:10, and it doesnt matter their condition is sinful.

 

[journeymanisnothing]

Everyone Jesus tasted death for have had their sins purged Heb 1:3

God spoke by the prophets Heb.1:1
spoken unto us by his Son Heb.1:2

and they have been sanctified Heb 10:10, and it doesnt matter their condition is sinful.

For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. Heb.10:26-27

God spoke by the prophets Heb.1:1

He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Heb.10:28

It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true. I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me beareth witness of me. Lk.6:17-18

Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God Heb.10:29

 

[brightfame52]

God spoke by the prophets Heb.1:1
spoken unto us by his Son Heb.1:2

For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. Heb.10:26-27

God spoke by the prophets Heb.1:1

He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Heb.10:28

It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true. I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me beareth witness of me. Lk.6:17-18

Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God Heb.10:29

All for whom Christ tasted death for, their sins are purged away Heb 1:3 they have no sin to be charged to them, not ever, and it doesnt matter what condition they are in.

 

[journeymanisnothing]

All for whom Christ tasted death for,

Christ died for the ungodly. Rom.5:6

their sins are purged away Heb 1:3

By mercy and truth iniquity is purged: and by the fear of the LORD men depart from evil. Pro.16:6

they have no sin to be charged to them, not ever, and it doesnt matter what condition they are in.

Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy. Mt.5:7

For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment. Jas.2:13

...Moses...wrote of me. Jn.5:46

 

[Mr. G Lee]

The writer of Hebrews wrote Heb 2:9

9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

Now honestly, did the writer write here that Christ tasted death for all mankind without exception here ? Nope he did not. In the original man isnt in the verse:

τὸν δὲ βραχύ τι παρ᾽ ἀγγέλους ἠλαττωμένον βλέπομεν Ἰησοῦν διὰ τὸ πάθημα τοῦ θανάτου δόξῃ καὶ τιμῇ ἐστεφανωμένον ὅπως χάριτι θεοῦ ὑπὲρ παντὸς γεύσηται θανάτου

Man was added by the translators. The word pas can refer to all the whole, the sum total of all the group intended. Context is important n determining the group that the writer has in mind. Lets look at the very next verse 10

10 For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.

Bingo, its the many sons that e suffered and died for, or tasted death for, The word many polys:

many, much, large, many, numerous, great

He tasted death for many Sons, a great number of them, everyone of them. This is important,, because later in the same epistle the writer uses the adjective many again to denote who He tasted death for Heb 9:28

So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

See to taste death back in Heb 2:9 is the exact same thing as " to bear the sins of many;" again, the many Sons of vs 10, everyone of the sons is who He tasted death for, not all of mankind without exception.

See Isa 53:11

He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

He tasted . . . suffer unto death he did not die never to raise . By his wounds we are healed .a Living sacrifice the work of two the father striking the Son bruised the heel crushed the head of the serpent .

Because of his grace. . . to some we are the smell of death others the sweet fragrance of new born gain life .

 

[brightfame52]

Christ died for the ungodly. Rom.5:6

By mercy and truth iniquity is purged: and by the fear of the LORD men depart from evil. Pro.16:6

Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy. Mt.5:7

For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment. Jas.2:13

...Moses...wrote of me. Jn.5:46

The ungodly Christ died for, their sins are purged away by Him, so they are sin free Heb 1:3

3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

AW Pink writes on Heb 1:3

6. His Expiation.

"When He had by Himself purged our sins" (verse 3). Here is something still more wondrous. Striking is it to behold the point at which this statement is introduced. The cross was the great stumbling-block unto the Jews; but so far was the apostle from apologizing for the death of the "Son," he here includes it as among His highest glories. And such indeed it was. The putting away of the sins of His people was an even greater and grander work than was the making of the worlds or the upholding of all things by His mighty power. His sacrifice for sins has brought greater glory to the Godhead and greater blessing to the redeemed than have His works of creation or providence.

"Why has this wonderful and glorious Being, in whom all things are summed up, and who is before all things the Father's delight and the Father's glory; why has this infinite light, this infinite power, this infinite majesty come down to our poor earth? For what purpose? To shine? To show forth the splendor of His majesty? To teach heavenly wisdom? To rule with just and holy right? No. He came to purge our sins. What height of glory! what depths of abasement! Infinite in His majesty, and infinite in His self-humiliation, and in the depths of His love. What a glorious Lord! And what an awful sacrifice of unspeakable love, to purge our sins by Himself"! (Saphir).

"By Himself purged our sins." This has reference to the atonement which He has made. The metaphor of "purging" is borrowed from the language of the Mosaic economy-cf. 9:22. The Greek word is sometimes put for the means of purging (John 2:6 (NAS)

[COLOR=#626262"]6 Now there were six stone waterpots set there for the Jewish custom of purification, containing twenty or thirty gallons each.[/COLOR]
Click link to access powerful study resources in a new window.
Powered by StudyTagger™ from StudyLight.org
" tooltipenable="true">John 2:6 ), sometimes for the act itself (Mark 1:44 (NAS)
[COLOR=#626262"]44 and He *said to him, "See that you say nothing to anyone; but go, show yourself to the priest and offer for your cleansing what Moses commanded, as a testimony to them."[/COLOR]
Click link to access powerful study resources in a new window.
Powered by StudyTagger™ from StudyLight.org
" tooltipenable="true">Mark 1:44 ). Both are included here: the merits of Christ's sacrifice, and the efficacy thereof. The tense of the verb, the aorist, denotes a finished work, literally, "having purged." Another has suggested an additional and humbling thought which is pointed by this metaphor-the filth of our sins, which needed "purging" away. The contrastive and superlative value and efficacy of Christ's sacrifice is thus set before us. His blood is here distinguished from that of the legal and ceremonial purifications. None of them could purge away sins-Hebrews 10:4 (NAS)
[COLOR=#626262"]4 For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins.[/COLOR]
Click link to access powerful study resources in a new window.
Powered by StudyTagger™ from StudyLight.org
" tooltipenable="true">Hebrews 10:4 . All they did was to sanctify to "the purifying of the flesh" (Hebrews 9:13 (NAS)
[COLOR=#626262"]13 For if the blood of goats and bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkling those who have been defiled sanctify for the cleansing of the flesh,[/COLOR]
Click link to access powerful study resources in a new window.
Powered by StudyTagger™ from StudyLight.org
" tooltipenable="true">Hebrews 9:13 ), not to the "purifying of the soul!"


"The manner and power of this purification form the subject of this whole Epistle. But in this short expression, 'by Himself He purged our sins,' all is summed up. By Himself; the Son of God, the eternal Word in humanity. Himself: the priest, who is sacrifice, yea, altar, and everything that is needed for full and real expiation and reconciliation. Here is fulfilled what was prefigured on the day of atonement, when an atonement was made for Israel, to cleanse them from all sins, that they may be clean from all their sins before the Lord (Leviticus 16:30 (NAS)

[COLOR=#626262"]30 for it is on this day that atonement shall be made for you to cleanse you; you will be clean from all your sins before the Lord .[/COLOR]
Click link to access powerful study resources in a new window.
Powered by StudyTagger™ from StudyLight.org
" tooltipenable="true">Leviticus 16:30 ). Thus our great High Priest saith unto us, Ye are clean this day before God from all your sins. He is the fulfillment and the reality, because He is the Son of God. 'The blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanseth us from all sin' (1 John 1:7 (NAS)
[COLOR=#626262"]7 but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin.[/COLOR]
Click link to access powerful study resources in a new window.
Powered by StudyTagger™ from StudyLight.org
" tooltipenable="true">1 John 1:7 ). The church is purchased by the blood of Him who is God (Acts 20:28 (NAS)
[COLOR=#626262"]28 Be on guard for yourselves and for all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood.[/COLOR]
Click link to access powerful study resources in a new window.
Powered by StudyTagger™ from StudyLight.org
" tooltipenable="true">Acts 20:28 , with His own blood). Behold the perfection of the sacrifice in the infinite dignity of the incarnate Son. Sin is taken away. Oh, what a wonderful thing is this!" (Saphir).

 

[Kermos]

Had that Muslim repented of sin and gotten baptized for the remission of his past sins...and endured faithfully until either his end or the end of time, his salvation will be made manifest.
If he didn't turn from sin and he didn't have his past sins washed away by the blood of Christ, he will be lost.
Just because he doesn't partake in Jesus' death and burial doesn't mean it wasn't available to him.
That is what you are inferring...that Jesus didn't die for him.
I can't believe such untruths.

Not at all.
You have infused a new bit of info...that he refused Jesus' offer.
With that truth it is clear that he himself refused what Jesus provided for him.
Jesus died to take away the sin of the world, not just your sect's.
If your sect was the only one that repented and was baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins and endured faithfully until the last day, He still would have died for the entire world.
But the world rejected the offer made freely to them.

All man have access to that forthcoming salvation.
Not all men want it.

You wrote "Had that Muslim repented of sin and gotten baptized for the remission of his past sins...and endured faithfully until either his end or the end of time, his salvation will be made manifest.", but that unbelieving long dead Muslim man of 1502AD NEVER BELIEVED IN JESUS, yet you believe 1 John 2:1-2 means that Jesus propitiated to cover the sin of the unbelieving dead Muslim man, that "son of hell" (Matthew 23:15), thus you include the Muslim man in "every man" (Hebrews 2:9-10) and "the whole world" (1 John 2:1-2), then, in effect, you believe Jesus is a colossal failure; in other words, the Jesus that you preach is so weak that his propitiating advocacy is null and void.

Let's review Apostolic testimony:

My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous, and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world
(1 John 2:1-2)
​

In contrast to what you believe, Lord Jesus succeeds 100% of the time in His propitiating advocacy, so the long dead unbelieving Muslim man is not included in the "every man" (Hebrews 2:9-10) nor "the whole world" (1 John 2:1-2),

A person believing in the Son of God whom the father has sent, this very "believing" is the work of God (John 6:29), not of man (Ephesians 2:8-10), but in Truth (John 14:6) is entirely controlled by Lord Jesus (John 15:16)!

Now let's recap what brought us to this point in our correspondence.

I don't see that man's name in scripture on the "REJECTED" list .
In fact I don't see any "rejected" lists at all.
Do you know who will not be granted eternal life ?
Paul made a list in Gal. 5:19-21..."Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God."

Those who walk after the flesh will not be granted eternal life.
I rejoice in the fact that I was offered the way to walk in the Spirit instead of in the flesh.
Were you offered the same opportunity?
Or not?

As was established in this post, the Muslim man who lived in the year 1502 in the middle of the Ottoman Empire never believed in Jesus, so that long dead Muslim man died being a "son of hell" (Matthew 23:15); therefore, when you wrote "I don't see that man's name in scripture on the 'REJECTED' list", then you convey that the long dead unbelieving Muslim man was saved from the wrath of God by Jesus Christ's propitiating advocacy, so you convey that Jesus saves unbelievers; however, Lord Jesus exclusively saves person's whom Jesus exclusively chooses for the King of Glory says "He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God" and "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent" (John 6:29); therefore, you call Jesus a deceiver.

Lord Jesus successfully rescues and redeems every man, including me by His grace for His glory, (Hebrews 2:9-10) for whom He executed propitiating advocacy without exception (1 John 2:1-2) as shown in this post; in contrast, your inclusion in "the whole world" of the long dead unbelieving Muslim man of 1502AD results in you preaching that Jesus is a failure per the same post;

All glory and power and honor be to the Holy God forever and ever, The Righteous One alone is salvation, Amen!!!

 

[Hopeful 2]

Yes!

For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. Rom.8:13

Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry: Col.3:5

I agree. The key is, the law was made only for the guilty

Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless 1Tim.1:9

The law was meant to show us that we're all sinners. Therefore the law was meant for me to point it at myself, not others. Certainly not against God on earth!

Are you not glad that Jesus made it possible to live without sinning ?
Free from the flesh, free from the Law, free from condemnation because we walk in the Spirit now !
I am !

 

[Hopeful 2]

They are not guilty , Justified before God ! Doesnt matter their condition !

Care to elaborate on that ?
If it "doesn't matter their condition", are you saying that ongoing sinners are justified ?
I can't agree with that.

 

[Hopeful 2]

You wrote "Had that Muslim repented of sin and gotten baptized for the remission of his past sins...and endured faithfully until either his end or the end of time, his salvation will be made manifest.", but that unbelieving long dead Muslim man of 1502AD NEVER BELIEVED IN JESUS,

Then he won't be saved on the day of judgement.

yet you believe 1 John 2:1-2 means that Jesus propitiated to cover the sin of the unbelieving dead Muslim man, that "son of hell" (Matthew 23:15), thus you include the Muslim man in "every man" (Hebrews 2:9-10) and "the whole world" (1 John 2:1-2), then, in effect, you believe Jesus is a colossal failure; in other words, the Jesus that you preach is so weak that his propitiating advocacy is null and void.

I guess I couldn't make it clear to you that without our complicity in salvation there is no salvation.
The Muslim had to "hear", "believe", and "act" on his faith to be included among the brotherhood of believers.

Let's review Apostolic testimony:

My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous, and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world​

(1 John 2:1-2)​

In contrast to what you believe, Lord Jesus succeeds 100% of the time in His propitiating advocacy, so the long dead unbelieving Muslim man is not included in the "every man" (Hebrews 2:9-10) nor "the whole world" (1 John 2:1-2),

Again I have failed to make myself clear.
Jesus' advocacy must be asked for in order to be received.
A man must truly repent of sin in order to ask for advocacy, as "God heareth not sinners".

A person believing in the Son of God whom the father has sent, this very "believing" is the work of God (John 6:29), not of man (Ephesians 2:8-10), but in Truth (John 14:6) is entirely controlled by Lord Jesus (John 15:16)!

It isn't belief if it is forced.
It is brain-washing.

Now let's recap what brought us to this point in our correspondence.
As was established in this post, the Muslim man who lived in the year 1502 in the middle of the Ottoman Empire never believed in Jesus, so that long dead Muslim man died being a "son of hell" (Matthew 23:15); therefore, when you wrote "I don't see that man's name in scripture on the 'REJECTED' list", then you convey that the long dead unbelieving Muslim man was saved from the wrath of God by Jesus Christ's propitiating advocacy,

I hope I cleared up that misconception above.

so you convey that Jesus saves unbelievers; however, Lord Jesus exclusively saves person's whom Jesus exclusively chooses for the King of Glory says "He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God" and "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent" (John 6:29); therefore, you call Jesus a deceiver.

I hope I cleared up that misconception above.

Lord Jesus successfully rescues and redeems every man, including me by His grace for His glory, (Hebrews 2:9-10) for whom He executed propitiating advocacy without exception (1 John 2:1-2) as shown in this post; in contrast, your inclusion in "the whole world" of the long dead unbelieving Muslim man of 1502AD results in you preaching that Jesus is a failure per the same post;

I hope I cleared up that misconception above.

All glory and power and honor be to the Holy God forever and ever, The Righteous One alone is salvation, Amen!!!

And "in Him", we are righteous too !

 

[Hopeful 2]

You are presenting a false Gospel that denies the efficacy of Christs saving death. Every man Christ tasted death for is saved unto Glory Heb 2:9-10

9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

10 For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings

He tasted death for all men, but not all men will be saved on the day of judgement.
So your point is moot.