Tasted Death for every Man !

[Hopeful 2]

The conditions that you mentioned sound very much like fruit of the Holy Spirit of Almighty God.

As repentance from sin and baptism for the remission of sins happens before being given the gift of the Holy Ghost, I must disagree.
Why do you disregard what Peter said in Acts 2:38 ?
"Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."

Let's look for the Scriptural answers to these three questions.

• What is repentance?
• Who controls repentance?
• How does a person repent

Our first step is to visit the linguistic definition.
Let us dig into the word "repent" which means "think differently afterwards". After we believers are born from above by the Holy Spirit (John 3:3), and in like manner given the mind of Christ (1 Corinthians 2:16). The Greek word metanoeó is the English word "repent" in Matthew 4:17. Let us obtain the definition of "repent".

"Turn from" is also listed in the definitions of "repent".
My repentance was "FROM" sin.
What was your "FROM" ?

Repent: think differently afterwards

metanoéō (from 3326 /metá, "changed after being with" and 3539 /noiéō, "think") – properly, "think differently after," "after a change of mind"; to repent (literally, "think differently afterwards")​

(def from 3340. metanoeó HELPS Word-studies section).​

If you used a Strong's Concordance, you would see that the definition of repentance includes "turn from".

The word "repent" does not mean "I change my mind" as asserted by too many people. Try reciting the words of Lord Jesus, where He is commanding the people in Matthew 4:17, except, first, replace the word "repent" with "I change my mind", then, second, replace the word "repent" with "think differently afterwards". God does not change (Malachi 3:6), so this One True God Jesus commands repent.
Godly sorrow brings "thinking differently afterward" leading to salvation (2 Corinthians 7:10), so God's power generates this sorrow within believers hence God calls it "Godly sorrow" thus illuminating and magnifying sin (Romans 5:20).
FIRST BIBLICAL CiTATION FOR REPENTANCE - A DEEP EXAMINATION

Here is the Christian teaching of 2 Corinthians 7:8-10. The passage (from the NASB which explicitly states that the NASB translators add bracketed words for clarity - so I have no problem removing the bracketed words from the NASB - but this is verbatim from the NASB):

I can't trust any version of the bible that has needed three updates in 50 years.
Where was the Holy Spirit on the first year?

The Apostle wrote "the sorrow that is according to God produces thinking differently afterward without regret" (2 Corinthians 7:10).​

I've had to omit some of your post to make it fit the allotted space (10,000 characters)​

It is written..."For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death." (2 Cor 7:10)
If it is forced on us, how can it be repented of ?
It is our choice on whether or not to repent of sin.

SCRIPTURAL CITATIONS ABOUT THE SOURCE OF REPENTANCE
Jesus reveals that God imparts the revelation of the Truth (John 14:6) into believer's thoughts causing believers to "think different after" being saved from the wrath of God.

As the "wrath of God" isn't due until the end of the earth, your point is mistaken.

THE THREE QUESTIONS ANSWERED
God grants repentance into people, as it is written; on the other hand, there is complete absence and silence in scripture for repentance as a work conjured up by man nor by man's "free will" nor "choice" nor "ability".
God grants repentance, and God acts for God's glory! Praise be to the Living God!

Yes, God gave Jews and Gentiles the gift of repentance...to be used or tossed aside.

The Fountain of Living Water, Jesus Christ, says the following about Belief/Faith "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent" (John 6:29) which means "every Christian's faith/belief in Jesus" equals "the work of God".
AND Paul is in accord with Jesus' words for Paul wrote to the Ephesians "by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, [it is] the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are His work, created in Christ Jesus" (Ephesians 2:8-10) which means that no person manipulates his or her own belief/faith in Jesus because Paul wrote "that not of yourselves".
AND Peter is in accord with Jesus' words for Peter declared "God, who knows the heart, testified to them giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He also did to us; and He made no distinction between us and them, cleansing their hearts by faith" (Acts 15:8-9) which means God imparts belief/faith to cleanse believer's hearts.
SO, clearly, Jesus' words in John 6:29 state for us believers to believe in Jesus whom the Father has sent is exclusively granted by/of/through God.
"But now faith, hope, love, abide these three; but the greatest of these is love" (1 Corinthians 13:13). Charity is a form of love.
Let's look at charity as a form of love. "A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another" (John 13:34).

Why would He command something that God will, according to your doctrine, do anyway?

AND John is in accord with Jesus' words for he wrote "Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God; and everyone who loves is born of God and knows God" (1 John 4:7, see the phrase "love is from God" meaning God is the source of true love).
AND John expands with his writing of "God is Love, and the one who abides in Love abides in God, and God abides in him" (1 John 4:16, see the phrase "one who abides in Love" is equivocated with "one who abides" "in God" which extends from God's exclusivity with "God is Love").
SO, clearly, Jesus' words in John 13:34 states that the love, true love (John 3:33), the very righteous love, the Godly love within us children of God, this love is exclusively by/of/through God.
The selfish "love" of unsaved people has reward on full here on earth (Matthew 6:2-4) - they brag about "their" deeds such as "look at what I gave to so-and-so", but the selfless love imparted by God into believers has glory for God such as "I give this to you in the Name of Jesus" and/or "Jesus had me give such-and-such".
Here you point out actions/deeds/works/fruit.

A person is saved by faith alone - not saved by works - truly saved by belief, yet works are the evidence of being saved.

Certainly not the works of the Law that Paul wrote against.

By God's grace for God's glory, believer's good deeds, even coming to Christ, is caused by God for Jesus the Word of God says "he who practices the truth comes to the Light, so that his deeds may be manifested as having been wrought in God" (John 3:21).
AND Paul is in accord with Jesus' words for he wrote to the Philippians "being filled with the fruit of righteousness that [is] by Jesus Christ, to the glory and praise of God" (Philippians 1:11)
SO, clearly, Jesus' words in John 3:21 state actions/deeds/works/fruit in we believers is exclusively by/of/through God.
Basically, everything you wrote about is caused by God.

God made it all available to me.
He did not force me to convert, and He is not responsible for the non-conversion of others, as your doctrine would seem to espouse.

 

[rogerg]

It wasn't "spiritual" knowledge, as Jesus' death was done in front of thousands.
Jesus Himself said..."It is hard to kick against the pricks".
Paul kept denying what he must have felt was important.

No, Saul/Paul had to be, and in fact was, first saved.
Many had observed Christ and His miracles yet of themselves could never believe in, nor have knowledge of, Him as Saviour. It is not possible for human intellect to produce spiritual discernment: a spiritually dead person does not have spiritual discernment.

[Jhn 6:65-66 KJV]
65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
66 From that [time] many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
[Jhn 12:37-39 KJV]

37 But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him:

38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?

39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,

The non-converted are sinners.
The converted are "in Christ", and there is no sin in Christ.

But conversion is only by God, not man. Of himself, man cannot do so. Read Kermos's post above (1776).

I don't recall mentioning "world".

You referenced 1 John 2:2. Post 1772

Men have to hear and believe.
That doesn't mean they saved themselves.
Who could ever think that ?
Men have to respond to the salvation that is freely available to them.

The unsaved cannot hear, nor believe, nor respond. It is not freely available to everyone except those to whom it is given - God must do it all.
You just said, "men have to respond to salvation". According to you, if they do, by responding, they become saved,
so, by that, they would have saved themselves, and by that, Christ cannot be the Saviour.

Nobody but Jesus sided for our sins, so nobody but Him can save us.

So, according to that, then ALL aspects of salvation have been included in Christ's offering, meaning that no response whatsoever from man is necessary, possible, nor permitted, right?

The role...He died for our sins.
That is the gospel.
He provided the blood for our sanctification, justification, atonement, and consecration.
He provided the vehicle whereby we can crucify the flesh with the affections and lusts.

What do you mean by "He provided the vehicle"?
If "He provided the blood, for our sanctification, justification, atonement, and consecration",
there is nothing left that man must do - He did it all - you can't have it both ways.
If it is necessary for us to crucify the flesh to become saved, then we save ourselves.
There is nothing a man can do to bring salvation to himself. Any attempt to do so, God considers as spiritual debt,
not grace.

[Rom 4:4 KJV] 4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

 

[brightfame52]

He tasted death for every man.
Not every man believes it.

Everyone whom He tasted death for will believe it because He brings them to Glory, believing in Him is part of being brought to Glory.

Heb 2:9-10

9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

10 For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.

 

[brightfame52]

Agreed, making it our responsibility to accept what God offered at the death and resurrection of Jesus, in order to be reborn of God's seed.

Not at all.
All I could do was obey what was taught by the apostle Peter on the day of Pentecost.
"Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost." (Acts 2:38)
People who don't turn from sin and get baptized in the name of Jesus Christ, don't get the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Can a dead man accept something ? A person who is dead has no life, next time you see a corpse, offer them something to eat or drink, see what happens. Man by nature is dead to God

 

[brightfame52]

hopeful2

Yes, God gave Jews and Gentiles the gift of repentance...to be used or tossed aside.

Thats false, when God gives the gift of repentance it causes repentance. Also He gives it as part of the New Creation, New Life, Spiritual Resurrection, its of the New Birth, its a New Heart, a New Mind. Again its a result of Christ bringing one to Glory because He tasted death for them. Before New Birth man cant repent towards God because he is dead to God and at enmity against Him.

 

[rogerg]

As repentance from sin and baptism for the remission of sins happens before being given the gift of the Holy Ghost, I must disagree.
Why do you disregard what Peter said in Acts 2:38 ?
"Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."

No, it doesn't, and you've badly misunderstood the phrase "gift of the Holy Ghost".

During Pentecost, the "gift of the Holy Ghost" were unique gifts given during Pentecost. It does not apply to the indwelling of the Holy Ghost nor to His fruit, but of temporarily receiving special gifts such as speaking in tongues, prophecy, the understanding of tongues, etc. (Acts 1:44 - 46 below), and not being indwelled by the Holy Ghost, which had already occurred BEFORE their receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost, and which indwelling had accompanied their salvation: by then, they were ALREADY saved. By the rendering of "they of the circumcision which believed", it demonstrated they believed, and therefore, they had been saved, BEFORE the Holy Ghost had fallen upon them with the special gifts.
As I told you before, those of Acts 2:38, were ORDAINED to eternal life (Acts 13:48), and it was because of God's ordaining of them to eternal life, that they of Acts believed and responded favorably to Christ and the things of Christ.

[Act 13:48 KJV]
48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

[Act 10:44-46 KJV]
44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,

 

[Kermos]

That was really illuminating and outstanding, Kermos - thank you!
The only point I might add, is that IMHO, we are saved by Christ's faith alone, not by our faith. Our faith comes to us as a fruit of the Spirit after salvation - a gift - to those whom He has chosen for salvation. That was probably implied by your point, and I was just too dull to recognize it - sorry.

[Gal 2:16 KJV] 16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.


Absolutely, positively!

Praise God! It is such a blessing to read agreement.

Now, I'm going to ask a favor of both you and brightfame52. Would you both find the paragraph that starts with "The Fountain of Living Water, Jesus Christ, says". There are four paragraphs in this section. Please let me know how you think it can be improved (of course, not the Scripture quotation content). I think you and I wrote essentially the same thing, and your writing was quite clear, and I desire for my writing to be quite clear, too, so if you see room for improvement, then please tell me.

 

[rogerg]

Praise God! It is such a blessing to read agreement.

Now, I'm going to ask a favor of both you and brightfame52. Would you both find the paragraph that starts with "The Fountain of Living Water, Jesus Christ, says". There are four paragraphs in this section. Please let me know how you think it can be improved (of course, not the Scripture quotation content). I think you and I wrote essentially the same thing, and your writing was quite clear, and I desire for my writing to be quite clear, too, so if you see room for improvement, then please tell me.

No improvement or revision needed - your writing is very clear, indeed - far clearer than mine - it was excellent, Kermos. The issue was based upon my misunderstanding - that I focused on the "saved by belief alone" and wasn't entirely sure how you meant it. After rereading the section you mentioned above, I can see that you laid it out perfectly.

 

[Hopeful 2]

No, Saul/Paul had to be, and in fact was, first saved.
Many had observed Christ and His miracles yet of themselves could never believe in, nor have knowledge of, Him as Saviour. It is not possible for human intellect to produce spiritual discernment: a spiritually dead person does not have spiritual discernment.

Every man knows good from evil.
They also recognize a good man.
Seeing, and in our case, hearing of a good man, can change how we behave.
Jesus is that good man.
When I heard that I could live without sinning, I went for it !
I still sinned though, until I was taught how to live a Godly life, but I knew what I wanted.
Your POV is that God forced me to believe, and forced me to turn from sin, and I guess, forced me to get baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins and death of my old self before rebirth from God's seed.
According to your POV all the damned are damned because of God.
I find that notion ludicrous.

[Jhn 6:65-66 KJV]
65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
66 From that [time] many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
[Jhn 12:37-39 KJV]

Those people closed their own eyes to the truth.

37 But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him:
38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?
39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,

People go for what they want.
If they had wanted righteousness, they would have stayed with the Righteous One.

But conversion is only by God, not man. Of himself, man cannot do so. Read Kermos's post above (1776).

It is "by God" only in the sense that He is the One who offers it.

You referenced 1 John 2:2. Post 1772

Conversion is available to the whole world... (1 John 2:2)

The unsaved cannot hear, nor believe, nor respond. It is not freely available to everyone except those to whom it is given - God must do it all.
You just said, "men have to respond to salvation". According to you, if they do, by responding, they become saved,
so, by that, they would have saved themselves, and by that, Christ cannot be the Saviour.

Have I not already written that salvation won't be determined until one's name is found in the book of life on the last day ?
Why would God need to find a name in a book if He caused everyone to quit sinning and come to Him or keep sinning and refuse Him?

So, according to that, then ALL aspects of salvation have been included in Christ's offering, meaning that no response whatsoever from man is necessary, possible, nor permitted, right?

Wrong, as the apostle Peter told us how to respond in Acts 2:38.

What do you mean by "He provided the vehicle"?

By our "immersion", (water baptism), into Him and into His death and burial, we partake in His death and burial. (Rom 6:3-7)
After which, we are raised with Him to walk in newness of life. (Rom 6:4)
At our death with Him, His sanctifying, atoning blood is applied to our vessel.
Without His death, we cannot be crucified with Him. (Gal 5:24)

If "He provided the blood, for our sanctification, justification, atonement, and consecration",
there is nothing left that man must do - He did it all - you can't have it both ways.

You have to accept it, if you are going to get baptized.

If it is necessary for us to crucify the flesh to become saved, then we save ourselves.

Only so far as the drowning man saves himself by grabbing the flotation device tossed by the life guard.
God offers, we grab.
You are not divorced from your own conversion.

There is nothing a man can do to bring salvation to himself. Any attempt to do so, God considers as spiritual debt,
not grace.

You make obedience to God a bad thing, for which you shall suffer eternally...if you don't repent.

[Rom 4:4 KJV] 4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

Paul is referring to the Law.

 

[Hopeful 2]

Everyone whom He tasted death for will believe it

He tasted death for Hitler, and my mom and dad, but to no avail.

 

[Hopeful 2]

Can a dead man accept something ? A person who is dead has no life, next time you see a corpse, offer them something to eat or drink, see what happens. Man by nature is dead to God

A spiritually dead man can.
All are spiritually dead after their first sin.
Not all remain that way...thanks be to God !

 

[Hopeful 2]

hopeful2


Thats false, when God gives the gift of repentance it causes repentance.

Let me ask you something...do you still commit sin ?
If you answer "NO", then good.
But if you answer "YES", then according to you, God didn't give you the gift of repentance and you will be damned.

Also He gives it as part of the New Creation, New Life, Spiritual Resurrection, its of the New Birth, its a New Heart, a New Mind. Again its a result of Christ bringing one to Glory because He tasted death for them. Before New Birth man cant repent towards God because he is dead to God and at enmity against Him.

If one doesn't turn from sin, they get nothing.

 

[Hopeful 2]

No, it doesn't, and you've badly misunderstood the phrase "gift of the Holy Ghost".

During Pentecost, the "gift of the Holy Ghost" were unique gifts given during Pentecost. It does not apply to the indwelling of the Holy Ghost nor to His fruit, but of temporarily receiving special gifts such as speaking in tongues, prophecy, the understanding of tongues, etc. (Acts 1:44 - 46 below), and not being indwelled by the Holy Ghost, which had already occurred BEFORE their receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost, and which indwelling had accompanied their salvation: by then, they were ALREADY saved. By the rendering of "they of the circumcision which believed", it demonstrated they believed, and therefore, they had been saved, BEFORE the Holy Ghost had fallen upon them with the special gifts.
As I told you before, those of Acts 2:38, were ORDAINED to eternal life (Acts 13:48), and it was because of God's ordaining of them to eternal life, that they of Acts believed and responded favorably to Christ and the things of Christ.

[Act 13:48 KJV]
48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

[Act 10:44-46 KJV]
44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,

Your false doctrine is just another accommodation for sin.

 

[Kermos]

As repentance from sin and baptism for the remission of sins happens before being given the gift of the Holy Ghost, I must disagree.
Why do you disregard what Peter said in Acts 2:38 ?
"Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."

Peter says not "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, THEN ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost." (the word in Acts 2:38 is "and" not "then"), so you insinuate illegal time reference into the Apostle Peter's words because the Apostles said aloud in response to Peter's explanation "Well then, God has granted to the Gentiles also the repentance that leads to life." (Acts 11:18).

God grants repentance per Apostolic testimony (Acts 11:18), so when a person repents then at that time the Holy Spirit is in the person (Acts 2:38); furthermore, a person immersed in the Name of Jesus Christ with understanding of Lord Jesus concurrently has the indwelling Holy Spirit of God.

Your attitude seems to be aggressive in your post - just look at your question in your post's opening, yet your implicit statement that I disregarded Acts 2:38 is false witness by you against me.

As is evident, I regard the Apostle Peter's words in Acts 2:38.

"Turn from" is also listed in the definitions of "repent".
My repentance was "FROM" sin.
What was your "FROM" ?

If you used a Strong's Concordance, you would see that the definition of repentance includes "turn from".

"Turn from" is a modern reconstruction for the ancient word metanoéō (repent) that is truly composed of two ancient root words which are (1) metá (Strong's 3326) meaning "changed after being with" plus (2) noiéō (Strong's 3539) meaning "think".

Your repent definition of "turn from" is illegal Greek semantics because neither "turn" nor "from" are represented in metanoéō (repent).

The Greek semantics for metanoéō (repent) require that repent means think differently afterwards, and here is the true definition of repent:

​

metanoéō (from 3326 /metá, "changed after being with" and 3539 /noiéō, "think") – properly, "think differently after," "after a change of mind"; to repent (literally, "think differently afterwards")​

(def from 3340. metanoeó HELPS Word-studies section).​

​

The Lord God Almighty changed my mind to "think differently after" my encounter with the Living God Jesus Christ!

Lord Jesus Himself turned me to Himself!

Praise the Lord for His lovingkindness!

Hallelujah to God for God's works!

All glory to God eternal!!!

I can't trust any version of the bible that has needed three updates in 50 years.
Where was the Holy Spirit on the first year?

There are translational errors in the KJV and the NASB, yet God mercifully provides Greek manuscripts and lexicons for us to refer in order to ascertain accurate linguistics. At least the NASB translators claim to make revisions to accommodate modern English and to improve accuracy. I'm not indicating whether they succeed, just observing.

If you bring this up again, I plan to disregard such.

I've had to omit some of your post to make it fit the allotted space (10,000 characters)​

Yes, I notice that you omitted Christ's words about repentance, when the Lord says "I praise You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and intelligent and have revealed them to babes" (Matthew 11:25).

Lord Jesus also says "He who rejects Me and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day" (John 12:48).

It is unwise to omit the Christ's sayings.

It is written..."For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death." (2 Cor 7:10)
If it is forced on us, how can it be repented of ?
It is our choice on whether or not to repent of sin.

See that man "choosing" is entirely absent from "For the sorrow that is according to God produces a repentance without regret, to salvation, but the sorrow of the world produces death" (2 Corinthians 7:10), so your questions are non-sequitor.

See "God produces a repentance" in 2 Corinthians 7:10.

See "to salvation" in 2 Corinthians 7:10, not "turn from" as you wrote earlier, but truly turn toward as in turned by God toward salvation.

In regard to "repent", you have too much focus on your turning from sin as opposed to God turning a person to Christ.

Clearly, the Most High God causes repentance in man.

As the "wrath of God" isn't due until the end of the earth, your point is mistaken.

Your assertion there is against where Lord YHWH had me post:

​

BIBLE CITATION: "I praise You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and intelligent and have revealed them to babes" (Matthew 11:25).​

​

Jesus reveals that God imparts the revelation of the Truth (John 14:6) into believer's thoughts causing believers to "think different after" being saved from the wrath of God.​

​

Christ saves us children of God from the wrath of God at the moment God causes repentance in God's children along with belief in Jesus, so your "your point is mistaken" is mistaken.

The mention of "the wrath of God" Spiritually fits perfectly in context.

Yes, God gave Jews and Gentiles the gift of repentance...to be used or tossed aside.

No Scripture states what you just wrote.

You changed the word "grant" to the word "gift" in order to diminish the work of God, so let's look at the verse again which exposes your error in thinking that man causes repentance instead of giving the glory to God for man's repentance:

​

BIBLE CITATION: When they heard this, they quieted down and glorified God, saying, "Well then, God has granted to the Gentiles also the repentance that leads to life." (Acts 11:18)​

​

See that God grants repentance as testified by the disciples in Acts 11:18.​

​

The "grant" is to impart with activation of repentance.

Why would He command something that God will, according to your doctrine, do anyway?

Certainly not the works of the Law that Paul wrote against.

"Now, Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was." (Lord Jesus Christ, John 17:5)

God brings glory to God, so God commands people to repent and people are in awe of God because of the Power of God (1 Corinthians 1:24).

You write of man's purported self-power instead of the awesome Power of God.

God made it all available to me.
He did not force me to convert, and He is not responsible for the non-conversion of others, as your doctrine would seem to espouse.

"the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from temptation, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment for the day of judgment, and especially those who indulge the flesh in its corrupt desires and despise authority, daring, self-willed, they do not tremble when they revile angelic majesties" (2 Peter 2:9-10).

 

[rogerg]

According to your POV all the damned are damned because of God.
I find that notion ludicrous.

No, they became damned because of Satan, Adam, and Eve, not God. You should have known that from the Bible.
God was most gracious to extricate anyone from that dilemma.

[Rom 5:19 KJV] 19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

Those people closed their own eyes to the truth.

No, that's not what it says - not even close. You're making it up as you go along because you don't like what
it tells us. Anyone can make stuff up - that doesn't make it true or correct.

People go for what they want.
If they had wanted righteousness, they would have stayed with the Righteous One.

Wow, your comment bear absolutely no resemblance to the verse whatsoever.
They followed what they believed to be righteous but in not having been born again,
they were blind to what that was. Righteousness is in truly believing that Christ is the Saviour - fully and completely.
Many honestly believe that following works for salvation is entirely righteous and correct to do, when it is to
follow Satan. Wanting to earn righteousness to oneself, is an entirely a different matter than of actually being righteous. Righteousness can only be given to someone by God through Christ's faith as a gift, it cannot be attained by anything that someone may, or may not do - acts of sin cannot never bring righteousness.

It is "by God" only in the sense that He is the One who offers it.

No, it is by God because it is given by God, otherwise it is of works.

Conversion is available to the whole world... (1 John 2:2)

Nope. It is only for the sins of the those who will inhabit the world to come - the elect, not for this world.
This world is to be destroyed.

Wrong, as the apostle Peter told us how to respond in Acts 2:38.

Depends on who you mean by "us"? If you mean everyone, then no, that would be incorrect.

Have I not already written that salvation won't be determined until one's name is found in the book of life on the last day ?
Why would God need to find a name in a book if He caused everyone to quit sinning and come to Him or keep sinning and refuse Him?

Suffice it to say that you have it completely reversed. At the end of time, both books will contain, and will
only contain, the names of those written from before the foundation of the world: the elect. All other names will have been blotted out. However, it is too large a topic and too inappropriate to go into now in this thread in detail. You should start your own thread if you want to examine it.

By our "immersion", (water baptism), into Him and into His death and burial, we partake in His death and burial. (Rom 6:3-7)
After which, we are raised with Him to walk in newness of life. (Rom 6:4)
At our death with Him, His sanctifying, atoning blood is applied to our vessel.
Without His death, we cannot be crucified with Him. (Gal 5:24)

Water baptism is not in view, spiritual baptism is. Water baptism is a symbol of spiritual baptism, but it having
no spiritual efficacy of itself whatsoever- just like circumcision. Do you believe circumcision a requirement for salvation too?
The second part of the above is in contradiction to the first part.

You have to accept it, if you are going to get baptized.

If it is already completed as you say - then it is done, and if it is truly done, why would anyone's acceptance of it be pertinent or matter? Were anything else needed, it could only mean that it wasn't really done, and that something else of it remains to be done, but according to you it has been fully completed, and with which, I completely agree.
But you want it both ways.

Only so far as the drowning man saves himself by grabbing the flotation device tossed by the life guard.
God offers, we grab.
You are not divorced from your own conversion.

Not a drowning man, and as brightframe52 has explained to you, a spiritually dead man.
A spiritually dead man cannot grab on to anything - they're dead - dead, dead.
Didn't you read the verses I previously referenced that clearly tell us that?
If someone's salvation is not apart from themselves, then by definition, they must function as their own saviour
because by that, you are saying of itself, Christ's offering is insufficient, but it isn't.

You make obedience to God a bad thing, for which you shall suffer eternally...if you don't repent.

Your inference is incorrect, and you take extreme and inappropriate liberties with my belief,
which is not yours to do.

I definitely believe in obedience to God. My difference with you is that I believe that to know true obedience, and to be able to do it, can only come after, and as a result of, salvation - not to be used to get something from it - you try to use it as a tool to get yourself saved. You do this because you know neither Christ as Saviour, nor do you understand the gospel.

Paul is referring to the Law.

Yes, Paul is referring to law, and anything that someone has to do of themselves to become saved, makes that something a law. If it wasn't a law, then the doing of it, wouldn't, couldn't, be required for salvation. In fact, salvation has no requirements nor laws associated with it, and so, it being a gift, is fully and completely law free from God to those whom He had chosen to give it to.

 

[rogerg]

Your false doctrine is just another accommodation for sin.

Obviously, you do not know what true eternal sin is and you define it according to what you would desire it to be, rather than of what it is.

 

[brightfame52]

He tasted death for Hitler, and my mom and dad, but to no avail.

I dont know nothing about all that

 

[brightfame52]

A spiritually dead man can.
All are spiritually dead after their first sin.
Not all remain that way...thanks be to God !

A spiritually dead man cant act spiritually because he has no spiritual life.

 

[brightfame52]

Let me ask you something...do you still commit sin ?
If you answer "NO", then good.
But if you answer "YES", then according to you, God didn't give you the gift of repentance and you will be damned.

If one doesn't turn from sin, they get nothing.

The ones Christ tasted death for it brings them to Glory Heb 2:9-10

9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

10 For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.

 

[Hopeful 2]

No, they became damned because of Satan, Adam, and Eve, not God. You should have known that from the Bible.
God was most gracious to extricate anyone from that dilemma.

Anyone !
I am glad you see it my way now.