Temporal Salvation?

[LovethroughDove]

Those who are in Christ then removed from Christ Certainly no longer have the eternal life they once had when they were in Him.


“I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser. Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away; and every branch that bears fruit He prunes, that it may bear more fruit.
John 15:1-2


Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away


Do you believe those who are in Christ, then later are removed from Christ because they do not bear fruit, still have eternal life.

No, they do not. They probably didn't have good soil either.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

which would be???????

That you can not fall away to a state of no longer abiding in God and Christ in salvation. (I think I understand you question).

...so how does your flock take your preaching ? all i have seen is personal belief .

Of course, because of the depth of indoctrination gripping the church at this present time, it's not easy to wrestle people away from the errors of the reformers.

 

[jerry63935]

You have to go back to purposeful unbelief to lose your salvation.
And once God turns you over to your decision (he may try to bring you back--like the Galatians and the Corinthians) you can never come back.

gosh there goes the advocate i will take a black marker and scribble that scripture out .i see he may try... what scripture is that ?he may try what Bible did you get that out of?

 

[LovethroughDove]

The demons, even though they know Christ is the Messiah, are DIFFERENT from believers because they merely know that Jesus is the Christ, while we believers have actually placed our trust and confidence in Christ for our redemption.

I'd say they are different than believers because the Christ and us have experienced the temptations of the flesh.

 

[jerry63935]

Of course, because of the depth of indoctrination gripping the church at this present time, it's not easy to wrestle people away from the errors of the reformers.

so what do you call yours? perfect the only one correct ?

 

[JLB]

Why did Jesus even tell that parable if the good soil people are eternally secure? To show you that you have been given the Spirit and you will produce.

Those who are in Christ then removed from Christ Certainly no longer have the eternal life they once had when they were in Him.


“I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser. Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away; and every branch that bears fruit He prunes, that it may bear more fruit.
John 15:1-2

• Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away

Do you believe those who are in Christ, then are “taken away” from Christ, still have eternal life?


JLB

 

[Jethro Bodine]

what he gives us is forever but yet you add conditions even the lost alcoholic believes in God

I'm not adding a condition for salvation.
The condition to be satisfied for salvation has always been believing/ trusting in God's promise.
This is in stark contrast to performing works of righteousness to earn salvation.

 

[jerry63935]

my biggest beef in this thread is john 15 has been used to promote fruit inspectors instead of fruit beares i see nothing about galatians 6 if a man /woman be over taken in fault .you who spiritual condemn them yo hell. psalm 118 his mercy does not endure forever <sarcasm > if you will read real close that is what is going on with the doom and gloom doctrine no 2nd chance... how soon we forget the words of christ those with out sin cast the first stone.. then Christ said to the woman probably draped in a sheet . note they ever brought the man. neither do i condemn you go and sin no more. o but wait we have temporary salvation with a million conditions

 

[Jethro Bodine]

even the lost alcoholic believes in God

By virtue of being lost he does not believe. He may know the gospel is true, but have no interest in it.
Believing implies placing your trust in what you believe, not just agreeing that it's true.
Lot's of lost people give lip service to the truth of the gospel. That does not make them saved.

 

[JLB]

No, they do not. They probably didn't have good soil either.

Thanks for at least replying with an answer.


I think you will agree that those who are in Christ, refer to people who are saved.


JLB

 

[JLB]

my biggest beef in this thread is john 15 has been used to promote fruit inspectors instead of fruit beares i see nothing about galatians 6 if a man /woman be over taken in fault .you who spiritual condemn them yo hell. psalm 118 his mercy does not endure forever <sarcasm > if you will read real close that is what is going on with the doom and gloom doctrine no 2nd chance... how soon we forget the words of christ those with out sin cast the first stone.. then Christ said to the woman probably draped in a sheet . note they ever brought the man. neither do i condemn you go and sin no more. o but wait we have temporary salvation with a million conditions

“I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser. Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away; and every branch that bears fruit He prunes, that it may bear more fruit.
John 15:1-2

• Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away

Do you believe those who are in Christ, then are “taken away” from Christ, still have eternal life?


JLB

 

[LovethroughDove]

Thanks for at least replying with an answer.


I think you will agree that those who are in Christ, refer to people who are saved.


JLB

No, they are not saved people. They are people who are hearing, reading the Word. For some reason you are assuming cause it says "in", that it is born again "in". Why can't it be "in" like my nose "in" a book?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

gosh there goes the advocate i will take a black marker and scribble that scripture out .i see he may try... what scripture is that ?he may try what Bible did you get that out of?

Christ is not the advocate for unbelievers, only for believers.

"4It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age 6and who have fallen c away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace." - Hebrews 6:4-6

Of course, we know that the church says sharing in the Holy Spirit doesn't really mean sharing in the Holy Spirit in this passage because of it's belief that you can not lose the Holy Spirit. Just another example of how the church uses doctrine to dictate the interpretation of scripture instead of letting scripture dictate doctrine.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

so what do you call yours? perfect the only one correct ?

I do not have to be afraid to say I am now being able to see the truth about this.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

my biggest beef in this thread is john 15 has been used to promote fruit inspectors instead of fruit beares i see nothing about galatians 6 if a man /woman be over taken in fault .you who spiritual condemn them yo hell.

So many in the church don't seem to know this passage of scripture exists:

1It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that even pagans do not tolerate: A man is sleeping with his father’s wife. 2And you are proud! Shouldn’t you rather have gone into mourning and have put out of your fellowship the man who has been doing this? 3For my part, even though I am not physically present, I am with you in spirit. As one who is present with you in this way, I have already passed judgment in the name of our Lord Jesus on the one who has been doing this. 4So when you are assembled and I am with you in spirit, and the power of our Lord Jesus is present, 5hand this man over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, a b so that his spirit may be saved on the day of the Lord.

6Your boasting is not good. Don’t you know that a little yeast leavens the whole batch of dough? 7Get rid of the old yeast, so that you may be a new unleavened batch—as you really are. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed. 8Therefore let us keep the Festival, not with the old bread leavened with malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

9I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— 10not at all meaning the people of this world who are immoral, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters. In that case you would have to leave this world. 11But now I am writing to you that you must not associate with anyone who claims to be a brother or sister c but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or slanderer, a drunkard or swindler. Do not even eat with such people.

12What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? 13God will judge those outside. “Expel the wicked person from among you.” - 1 Corinthians 5:1-13

Is Paul telling us to do this so this person can be condemned and go to hell, or so he can be saved when Jesus returns?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

if you will read real close that is what is going on with the doom and gloom doctrine no 2nd chance...

You don't get a second chance once God turns you over to your decision to go back to unbelief. We see from the example of the Galatians and the Corinthians that he doesn't do that immediately. He makes some kind of effort to bring them back. But the scriptures also make it clear that once it's over, it's over. There is no coming back.

Notice, we're talking about unbelief here and living in a lifestyle of unrepentant sin, not the struggles of the weak, yet believing saint.

 

[JLB]

No, they are not saved people. They are people who are hearing, reading the Word. For some reason you are assuming cause it says "in", that it is born again "in". Why can't it be "in" like my nose "in" a book?

Actually the scripture does in fact say these who the Father removed were In Him.


I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser. Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away; and every branch that bears fruit He prunes, that it may bear more fruit.
John 15:1-2

• Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away

 

[Jethro Bodine]

o but wait we have temporary salvation with a million conditions

No, there is only one condition--continued believing.

And again, the salvation one receives is not temporary. It is a salvation that does not end and have to be secured again because it failed, like it did under the old system.
But your possession of the salvation that lasts forever may be temporary based on whether or not you hold firmly to the gospel by which you are saved:

"By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you." - 1 Corinthians 15:2

There's that annoying condition for being saved and staying saved--holding firmly to what you first heard. The Galatians and the Corinthians departed from what they first heard. That's why Paul had to try to set them straight again. The Galatians went back to the law for justification. And the Corinthians caved into a gospel of a dead savior who has not risen from the grave. Those are gospels that can not save a person. People who depart from the original true gospel they heard and who now believe in those 'other' gospels will not enter into the kingdom when Christ returns. Their faith in the real gospel leading up to their departure from that real gospel will have been in vain.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

No, they are not saved people. They are people who are hearing, reading the Word. For some reason you are assuming cause it says "in", that it is born again "in". Why can't it be "in" like my nose "in" a book?

This is just another example of how the church makes the Bible not really mean what it says.
'In me' doesn't really mean 'in me'.
It has to do this to so many passages of scripture to make the Bible line up with it's doctrines.

 

[jerry63935]

“I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser. Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away; and every branch that bears fruit He prunes, that it may bear more fruit.
John 15:1-2

• Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away

Do you believe those who are in Christ, then are “taken away” from Christ, still have eternal life?


JLB

Do you believe those who are in Christ, then are “taken away” from Christ, still have eternal life?

i am not answering your question till YOU post the scripture i asked for..my post was deleted i said teh truth where is the fruit ? 2