Temporal Salvation?

[netchaplain]

Peter didn't go back to unbelief.
Peter got scared.

True! To truly manifest a denial of Christ, one would have to be an unbeliever, which will show in their lifestyle (false works not out of the love of God) and cannot remain hidden in hypocrisy. There's nothing an unregenerate one can do to genuinely manifest Christ; as "their sin finds them out" (Num 32:23), esp. to themselves, for opportunity to choose to be saved.

 

[LovethroughDove]

Yes dear sister, let’s be those who encourage people to remain in Christ, and be fruitful, so they are not removed from Him.

Amen.


Here is how we are instructed to remain in Christ.


Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us. 1 John 3:24




JLB

I understand what you are saying and you must being preaching to those who have not received total revelation. I am speaking to those who have ZERO doubts about their faith!

You are speaking to those who are wishy washy and are in the Word, but have other things coming at them.

See, you even did it ABOVE with what you highlighted. I would have highlighted "And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us."

 

[Jethro Bodine]

I understand what you are saying and you must being preaching to those who have not received total revelation. I am speaking to those who have ZERO doubts about their faith!

You are speaking to those who are wishy washy and are in the Word, but have other things coming at them.

See, you even did it ABOVE with what you highlighted. I would have highlighted "And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us."

You've stopped relating all this to the matter of temporary life vs. eternal life.

 

[LovethroughDove]

Let's take this a little further in scripture to prove my point

John 15:7-8 If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be given you. This is my Father's glory, that you bear much fruit, showing yourselves to be my disciples.

Words Word remain and grow into fruit showing yourselves to be the real deal!

And what is your point?

I think you and JLB were saying that I was off track with "remain in". I was saying that was meaning the "Word".
Before I was born again, I was remaining in the Word........then I asked for the truth and he gave me the Spirit of truth and now I am bearing the fruit showing me to be his disciple.

p.s. I am still a work in progress, but the one thing that I don't want to do in this world.......is disappoint Him. I do think of this often and it makes me sad to think I screw up.

 

[LovethroughDove]

You've stopped relating all this to the matter of temporary life vs. eternal life.

I don't understand. Can you explain?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Before I was born again, I was remaining in the Word

How does one remain in the word as an unbeliever?
Isn't rather that this is about the word remaining in you after you receive it in salvation?

"1Now, brothers and sisters, I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received and on which you have taken your stand. 2By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain." - 1 Corinthians 15:1-2

.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

I don't understand. Can you explain?

Remain in Christ = eternal life

Stop remaining in Christ = no more eternal life

 

[LovethroughDove]

How does one remain in the word as an unbeliever?
Isn't rather that this is about the word remaining in you after you receive it in salvation?

"1Now, brothers and sisters, I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received and on which you have taken your stand. 2By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain." - 1 Corinthians 15:1-2

.

Like I've been saying this whole time........I believed "some" of the Bible and kept on going with it until I was ready for the whole truth and nothing but the truth - - - at the time I would have said I was Christian, but I look back and laugh......cause that's a joke.

 

[JLB]

I understand what you are saying and you must being preaching to those who have not received total revelation. I am speaking to those who have ZERO doubts about their faith!

You are speaking to those who are wishy washy and are in the Word, but have other things coming at them.

See, you even did it ABOVE with what you highlighted. I would have highlighted "And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us."

I’m speaking to myself, first and foremost.

Then I’m speaking to those who have ears to hear.


Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us. 1 John 3:24.


We can’t see the Holy Spirit in others, however we can see if a person is a liar, or murderer or drunkard or anything that is contrary to Christ and His commandments.


He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1 John 2:4




JLB

 

[JLB]

Remain in Christ = eternal life

Stop remaining in Christ = no more eternal life

Very simple, even I can understand.


Amen. Thank you.



JLB

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Very simple, even I can understand.


Amen. Thank you.



JLB

Calvin invented complicated, man-made doctrines that have robbed the gospel of it's simplicity.
It's caused a lot of confusion in the church that has led us away from the truth.

 

[JLB]

Calvin invented complicated, man-made doctrines that have robbed the gospel of it's simplicity.
It's caused a lot of confusion in the church that has led us away from the truth.

 

[JLB]

p.s. I am still a work in progress, but the one thing that I don't want to do in this world.......is disappoint Him.

That’s what I love and appreciate about.

You have a good heart.

Love you.



JLB

 

[netchaplain]

John wrote that believers now have eternal life (1Jo 5:13), because Jesus said He gives them eternal life (Jhn 10:28). Whatever spiritual position we die in is the the spiritual position we are raised in. Thus eternal life can be given only in this life, in order to live it in the next. Plus, how can something given eternally be taken away, which would render it not eternal?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

how can something given eternally be taken away, which would render it not eternal?

The mistake you're making is saying your possession of eternal life is what makes eternal life eternal.
If I gave you a flashlight that shined forever does that mean you will have it forever?
Of course not.
It means the light itself will never fail.
And, it means you should hang on to that light!

Eternal life is defined as eternal not because you can't lose it (in this life) but because that life itself does not come to an end, like it did under the old system.

You have to continue to believe to the very end to continue to possess the life that can never end. Even Calvinists know this. They just believe that the true believer will always continue to believe.

 

[LovethroughDove]

If I gave you a flashlight that shined forever does that mean you will have it forever?

John 14:16-17 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever - the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him.

I don't push the issue too much on an answer from people who say we can lose salvation, cause it teeters on the verge of blasphemy of the Holy Spirit and I'm not looking to have anyone blaspheme.

Jethro, I'm okay if you are speaking to those people who haven't received the Spirit yet. I am not okay if you are insinuating that we can lose the Spirit once we have been given it.

 

[LovethroughDove]

That’s what I love and appreciate about.

You have a good heart.

Love you.



JLB

I love you too! I hope you still love me after what I just stated to Jethro.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

John 14:16-17 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever...

That is true.
....if you keep believing.

The promise of eternal life is conditioned on believing.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

netchaplain , LovethroughDove

The security and 'forever-ness' of salvation is not that you automatically have it forever when you get saved.
The following passages show us that since salvation through the ministry and sacrifice of Christ lasts forever and doesn't have to be redone you should hold on to it and keep believing in it:

"...we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
11Day after day every priest stands and performs his religious duties; again and again he offers the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God, 13and since that time he waits for his enemies to be made his footstool. 14For by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy." - Hebrews 10:10-14

"14Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has ascended into heaven, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess." - Hebrews 4:14

I know it's going to be hard to undo what you presently believe and see it, but it's saying that since the ministry of Jesus and his Sacrifice lasts forever and doesn't have to be redone (like it did under the old system) you should hold on to such a Priest and Sacrifice. The Ministry and Sacrifice of Jesus is what is eternal and doesn't have to be redone, not your possession of it. You have to continue to believe in that which is eternal and doesn't have to be redone to continue to possess that which is eternal and doesn't have to be redone.

 

[netchaplain]

The mistake you're making is saying your possession of eternal life is what makes eternal life eternal.

I think if we see that eternal life means only one thing it's easier to comprehend. It means life eternal, as opposed to eternal death, i.e. second death, which is not life but death. Everyone will will exist forever with an indestructible body, but living eternally relates only to the saved, and dying eternally relates to the unsaved, for unregeneracy is not life but death in the eternal realm.

You have to continue to believe to the very end to continue to possess the life that can never end. Even Calvinists know this. They just believe that the true believer will always continue to believe.

I still have yet to see Scripture that describes one believing and then stops believing. The issue is scripturally discerning between one falsely professing and appearing to look like a Christian, and one who is genuinely a Christian.