ResilientFaith said:
Matureartisan: Jesus looked right at those disciples who were right there with Him and clearly said--"When YOU see the abomination of desolation spoken of by DANIEL THE PROPHET . . . " (Mat. 24:15). Just how did those very disciples who were to see it see the Dome of the Rock (as per Skolfield) when it was not constructed until 691 A. D. ! The Abomination of Desolation is found in that first-century generation!
Those very disciples of Jesus' day saw the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel the Prophet in their lifetime--ca. A. D. 70!
Matthew24:34
in matthew 24 Jesus is talking about the LAST GENERATION,
Mat 24:2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
Not all of the temple has been destroyed, seeing as the wailing wall is yet standing. Nor is there a direct YOU addressed to the disciples in the greek
Mat 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
It was well understood that it would be read by others at a later date.
Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
The sun did not darken in 70 A.D. , neither did the Son of man appear and come to rule.
Greetings, ResilientFaith: Jesus is NOT speaking to a last generation--He specifically said, THIS generation. Jesus used that expression around 20 TIMES. and He ALWAYS meant those contemporaneous to Himself--always, ResilientFaith. I encourage you to look them up and read them in their context!
Furthermore, there is no proof that the wailing wall is even part of Herod's Temple. That is an assumption. Also, Jesus said as He stood in front of that very Herod's Temple, "Not one stone shall be left HERE upon another that shall not be thrown down." Is that not what Jesus Himself said? Why don't we believe Him?
There is no direct YOU in the Greek in Matthew 24:15? What? The Greek word is idete--it clearly means "YOU see." The pronoun "you" is expressed in the form of the verb. Here it is the second person plural second aorist active subjunctive of eidon ("to see"). It is most definitely a direct "you." Jesus said directly to those disciples standing right there with Him--"when YOU see." The parenthetical statement, "whoever reads, let him understand," does not negate that. Many of THAT time frame read this letter by Paul to the Romans. From the context, it is clear that they were the first readers! That is why THEY understood and THEY fled Jerusalem when THEY saw the abomination of desolation! According to Josephus, an eyewitness to the events of the Jewish Wars with Rome, not one Christian remained in the city when it was locked down by the Romans so that no one could leave or enter.
Again, you ignore the clear time indicator given by Jesus Himself because YOU cannot see the fulfillment of something. We must begin with the clear before we attempt to understand the unclear. Jesus clearly said "this generation." As I have noted, whenever He used that expression (20 times!), He always meant His contemporaries. Without exception. Those very disciples and the other saints of that day were to be delivered up to tribulation. Immediately after that tribulation involving THEM, the SYMBOLIC upheavals in the heavens and earth began. I cannot express this more forcefully, ResilientFaith, these things were never intended to literally occur. This is prophetic, figurative, judgment language that would have been easily understood by those disciples right there with Jesus.
Consider Isaiah 13 and 34 when the LORD came in judgment against OT Babylon and Edom. The "stars of heaven and their constellations" did not give their light, and the sun was "darkened in its going forth." The moon did not "cause its light to shine" (13:10). God shook the heavens and the earth was moved out of her place (13:13) Did that literally happen, ResilientFaith, when God judged OT Babylon? Of course not. Figurative upheavals in the heavens and earth were used to described God's wrath and judgment against a nation or peoples!
Consider also Isaiah 34. Did those events literally happen when God "came" in judgment against Edom? Were the mountains literally melted with blood? Were "all the host of heaven" literally dissolved? Were the heavens actually "rolled up like a scroll?" Did all the host of heaven literally "fall down?" When did that happen in OT times? Did God have literal sword that was bathed in heaven with blood when His "sword" came down on OT Edom?
The language of Matthew 24:29 is apocalyptic, figurative, judgment language. Jesus' JEWISH disciples right there with Him who understood the OT prophecies knew exactly what He was saying. He was coming in judgment against that generation of Jews whom He had just condemned--upon whom He had just pronounced the many woes (Matthew 23). He was going to again shake the heavens and THEIR very house, Herod's Temple, was to be left unto THEM desolate.
Do you not believe because you cannot see, ResilientFaith? Furthermore, verse 30 does not say that Jesus was to be seen but that His sign was to be seen--"Then shall appear the SIGN of the Son of Man." Those very disciples right there with Him were to recognize that sign and other signs as easily as THEY recognized the signs of the coming of summer in the budding of not just the fig tree but of all the TREES (see Luke 21). Again, we have direct address (IN THE GREEK)--"When YOU see all these things, know that it [His coming] is near--at the doors!" He did not come to rule but to judge! Why do you think Christ was to come to earth to rule? The kingdom over which He rules is NOT of this world and will never be of this world. That is a false dispensational teaching!
When a time frame is clearly given and when Jesus makes a clear statement about when certain things were to happen, will we believe Him or will we be doubting "Thomases" who refuse to believe because we cannot or will not see? He told those of THAT first-century, pre-A. D. 70 generation that He was coming to THEM (Mat. 10:23; 16:28; 24:34; 26:64) and He DID whether you can see it or not.
In Christ, Matthew24:34
