The Author of salvation to those obeying Him !

[savedbygrace57]

Heb 5:

9And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

In light of this tremendous truth that the writer of hebrews gives the hebrews after indicating how that the Lord Jesus Christ in His priesthood capacity was perfected, in order to, becoming the author of eternal salvation to them obeying Him..

Why is it we find Paul writing this in 2 thess 1:

8In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ..

For He became the Author of eternal salvation to them obeying Him, but He will come with vengeance upon them who obey not His gospel..

You see, to not obey His gospel, is the not to obey Him.. Jesus said Matt 7:


24Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

25And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.

26And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:

27And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.

28And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:

The word doeth in this passage is very interesting, its the word
poie? and one of the definitions is:

to be the authors of, the cause

cause one to

j) to be the authors of a thing (to cause, bring about)

Hence, obedience to Jesus Christ, to His words, His gospel is the Fruit or effect of His efficacious death for them He died for, to them He became perfect in His official High Priest obedience for.

The eternal salvation He is the Author of, is also the causer or author of their doing His words or their obeying Him and His gospel..

The conclusion therefore regarding those in 2 thess 1:8, those who do not obey His gospel, is that he simply did not offer Himself in their behalf, and He was not the causer of their obedience..

Heb 5:

9And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

The word obey is
hypakou?

which means:

to listen, to harken

a) of one who on the knock at the door comes to listen who it is, (the duty of a porter)

2) to harken to a command
a) to obey, be obedient to, sub
mit to

And it is in the present tense participle, meaning, those obeying Him, do so, because it is the fruit of His authoring their eternal salvation..

Obeying Him is the fruit not the cause of their eternal salvation, which is a result of His and not their obedience..rom 5:19

For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

Just like how by one mans sin [ Adam] constituted and made men practically sinners and disobedient, so likewise will by the obedience of Jesus Christ shall many be made practically righteous and obedient..

So the false teachers of our day don't recognize the accomplishment of the obedience and death of Christ for those He became obedient for, for He actually procured for them eternal salvation and a new beginning from a life of estrangement and disobedience to God..He is the active cause of all their coming to and living unto Him and their Father, oh what a so great salvation..

 

[SealedEternal]

The Bible teaches that true salvation is being freed from our enslavement to sin, through the regeneration of the Spirit of God:

Romans 6:1-22 What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase? May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it? Or do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death? Therefore we have been buried with Him through baptism into death, so that as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we too might walk in newness of life. For if we have become united with Him in the likeness of His death, certainly we shall also be in the likeness of His resurrection, knowing this, that our old self was crucified with Him, in order that our body of sin might be done away with, so that we would no longer be slaves to sin; for he who has died is freed from sin. Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him, knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, is never to die again; death no longer is master over Him. For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God. Even so consider yourselves to be dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus. Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace. What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be! Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness? But thanks be to God that though you WERE slaves of sin, you became obedient from the heart to that form of teaching to which you were committed, and having been freed from sin, you became slaves of righteousness. I am speaking in human terms because of the weakness of your flesh. For just as you presented your members as slaves to impurity and to lawlessness, resulting in further lawlessness, so now present your members as slaves to righteousness, resulting in sanctification. For when you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness. Therefore what benefit were you then deriving from the things of which you are now ashamed? For the outcome of those things is death. But now having been freed from sin and enslaved to God, you derive your benefit, resulting in sanctification, and the outcome, eternal life.

Titus 3:5-7 He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit, whom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, so that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

Hebrews 10:14-17 For by one offering He has perfected for all time those who are sanctified. And the Holy Spirit also testifies to us; for after saying, "THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THEM AFTER THOSE DAYS, SAYS THE LORD: I WILL PUT MY LAWS UPON THEIR HEART, AND ON THEIR MIND I WILL WRITE THEM," He then says, "AND THEIR SINS AND THEIR LAWLESS DEEDS I WILL REMEMBER NO MORE."

Matthew 7:16-23 "YOU WILL KNOW them by their fruits. Grapes are not gathered from thorn bushes nor figs from thistles, are they? "So every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears bad fruit. "A good tree cannot produce bad fruit, nor can a bad tree produce good fruit. "Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. "So then, you will know them by their fruits. "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. "Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?' "And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'

1 John 2:3-6 By this WE KNOW that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments. The one who says, "I have come to know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him; but whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him: the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.

1 John 3:4-10 Everyone practicing sin also practices lawlessness, and sin is lawlessness. And you know that that One was revealed that He might take away our sins, and sin is not in Him. Everyone remaining in Him does not sin. Everyone practicing sin has not seen Him, nor known Him. Little children, MAKE SURE NO ONE DECEIVES YOU; the one practicing righteousness is righteous, even as that One is righteous. The one practicing sin is of the devil, because the devil sins from the beginning. For this the Son of God was revealed, that He might undo the works of the devil. No one who has been born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him, and he is not able to sin, because he has been born of God. By this the children of God and the children of the devil are revealed: Everyone not practicing righteousness is not of God; also the one not loving his brother.

1 John 5:2-3 By this WE KNOW that we love the children of God, when we love God and observe His commandments. For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments; and His commandments are not burdensome.

Ephesians 5:5-8 For this you know with certainty, that no immoral or impure person or covetous man, who is an idolater, has an inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God. LET NO ONE DECEIVE YOU with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience. Therefore do not be partakers with them; for you were formerly darkness, but now you are Light in the Lord; walk as children of Light

There are many other passages along these lines, but I think the point is clear. True salvation is being freed from our enslavement to sin through the regeneration of the Spirit of God in our hearts, and we will know by our fruits if we have in fact been saved from our sin. Those who continue to practice sin have not been saved from it, and Christ will declare to them that He never knew them, because they failed to become true children of God. We know that we have if Christ is our Lord, and we do what He says, or in other words keep His commandments and practice righteousness.

Luke 6:46 "But why do you call Me 'Lord, Lord,' and do not do the things which I say?


SealedEternal

 

[savedbygrace57]

I can see you dont understand the OP...

 

[SealedEternal]

What makes you think that?

SealedEternal

 

[Cornelius]

What makes you think that?

SealedEternal

I want to ask that too You are both saying the same thing.


True posts , both of you, but VERY unpopular as you might know.
We indeed need to obey to be saved.

 

[mondar]

I appreciate both posts as an expression of the grace of God. I thank God that he sent Christ to die for me, and then give me the ability me through that death to obey him. I thank God, that we are free to serve him.

 

[savedbygrace57]

What makes you think that?

SealedEternal

Well, explain what you think I am presenting in the OP ?

 

[SealedEternal]

Well, explain what you think I am presenting in the OP ?

The same thing that everyone else thought, and that I had written in my response. Were you saying something different?

SealedEternal

 

[savedbygrace57]

Well, explain what you think I am presenting in the OP ?

The same thing that everyone else thought, and that I had written in my response. Were you saying something different?

SealedEternal

I am speaking to you, are you going to explain what you get out of the OP or not ?

 

[SealedEternal]

I am speaking to you, are you going to explain what you get out of the OP or not ?

It seems to me that you're linking together the necessity of obedience to salvation. The verses I posted were on that same theme. Is that your point or isn't it? If it is, why did you claim I don't understand?

SealedEternal

 

[glorydaz]

I had no idea there were Christians who didn't know we are to walk in obedience to our Lord.
That's pretty basic to our faith. Trust and obey...for there's no other way. Seems simple enough to me.

 

[savedbygrace57]

sealed:

It seems to me that you're linking together the necessity of obedience to salvation.

I did not think you understood what i was saying..

 

[Joe67]

Heb 12:1-2
1 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,

2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God. KJV


Author: Justification

Finisher: Sanctification and Perfection

Joe

 

[SealedEternal]

I had no idea there were Christians who didn't know we are to walk in obedience to our Lord.
That's pretty basic to our faith. Trust and obey...for there's no other way. Seems simple enough to me.

You would think so, but the majority of professing "Christians" today actually deny the need to be obedient to Christ to be saved.

SealedEternal

 

[mondar]

sealed:

It seems to me that you're linking together the necessity of obedience to salvation.

I did not think you understood what i was saying..

I think he understood. He just used a different text. I noticed he used verses from Romans 6 that say we are "free from sin." One must be careful with that concept. There are some who think it means that we can achieve a sinless perfection, but that is not what being "free" from sin is all about.

First, I want to draw attention to the slavery imagry in Romans 6. I will post some verses in the ASV, but will go through the passage and place in red every time the word "doulos" (bond slave) occurs.
Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye present yourselves as servants unto obedience, his servants ye are whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Rom 6:17 But thanks be to God, that, whereas ye were servants of sin, ye became obedient from the heart to that form of teaching whereunto ye were delivered;
Rom 6:18 and being made free from sin, ye became servants of righteousness.
Rom 6:19 I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye presented your members as servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity, even so now present your members as servants to righteousness unto sanctification.
Rom 6:20 For when ye were servants of sin, ye were free in regard of righteousness.
Rom 6:21 What fruit then had ye at that time in the things whereof ye are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death.
Rom 6:22 But now being made free from sin and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto sanctification, and the end eternal life.

With all this slavery imagry, the issue is obviously our slavery to our sin nature.

As an illustration of how we are "free" from sin after regeneration, think of the civil war. Now I know this illustration breaks down, but bear with me. Before the civil war the black man was a legal slave. He could not leave the plantation. He worked for the master on the plantation. After the civil war the black man was freed from the master. Then he could go and get a job from a new master that he chose. Yet where did most of the black men get their new job? They went back to the plantation. So after regeneration (old man is dead Rom 6:6), we have a new master (Christ) and should serve him. This does not mean we cannot go back and serve the old master (sin). We can do exactly that! But that should never be because we are "free."

Unfortunately, it happens all too much that we fail to correctly serve our new master (Christ). The reason for this is explained in Chapter 7.
Rom 7:8 but sin, finding occasion, wrought in me through the commandment all manner of coveting: for apart from the law sin is dead.
Rom 7:9 And I was alive apart from the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died;
The entry of the law into the Christian experience revives sin which is still alive, but is not our master. But when we serve the Law, we again go into bondage with regard to our sin nature.

Who then is the carnal person in verse 14?
Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
The carnal person in this passage is probably the guy in your Church that carries the biggest bible. Unfortunately many have misinterpreted Carnality as something for a person living apart from any desire to serve Christ... the person in the gutter who was once a Christian. That is not carnality. Such a person is simply most likely not a Christian. The carnal Christian in Romans 7:14 is the person serving sin because he serves the law. It is the most Pharisaical Christian in our Church. The Carnal person is the one keeping the law, and the law leads him to sin. In first Corinthians it shows the results of fleshly legalism, it ends up in divisiveness.

I think a discussion on Romans 6 is very important because it defines what happens in regeneration. It tells us the specifics of why regeneration leads to faith, and why the unregenerate cannot have faith (John 6:44). We begin as bond slaves of sin. Christ shed blood is the basis for the action of the HS to choose a time when he regenerates a person, and that person has faith. As a person of faith, we have a new master. So regeneration (new man or new nature) means we have a sin nature, but we are not enslaved to that sin nature as when we were unregenerate, and we now can and will trust in our Lord. As a result of this faith we should lead new lives. We are now legally free from sin, and enabled to serve our new master (righteousness or God-see 6:19 and 22).

So as Paul said....
Rom 6:12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey the lusts thereof: We as Christians are free from the former master, and we should not let the sin nature reign.
Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under law, but under grace. Sin shall not be our lord and have dominion. But the warning that we can serve sin is implicit in this verse. If we again return to the law, sin will again become our master. But these things should not be, for if Christ is our Lord, we serve him. The Law is no longer Lord. The Law is dead, and we must not serve it.
Rom 7:4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also were made dead to the law through the body of Christ; that ye should be joined to another, even to him who was raised from the dead, that we might bring forth fruit unto God.
Rom 7:6 But now we have been discharged from the law, having died to that wherein we were held; so that we serve in newness of the spirit, and not in oldness of the letter.
We must serve Christ, not the law.

If you serve Christ, give God the glory, it is not by your flesh that you serve him, but the HS regenerated you from your slavery to sin. The regenerate can now serve in newness of life, and so we should.

 

[savedbygrace57]

mondar:

I think he understood

I dont think he did, and what about you, do you understand my point ? Let me know what you understand the point to be that i am making..

 

[mondar]

mondar:

I think he understood

I dont think he did, and what about you, do you understand my point ? Let me know what you understand the point to be that i am making..

You are speaking of the perfect obedience of Christ as a necessary requirement for our salvation.

Sealed Eternal was speaking of how this results in us being loosed from the legal slavery of our sin nature.

So are you OK here?

 

[savedbygrace57]

mondar:

You are speaking of the perfect obedience of Christ as a necessary requirement for our salvation.

everyone that Jesus christ died for has a perfect standing before God because of the death of christ on their behalf..This perfect standing is theirs even before they are born dead in trespasses and sin, before they are regenrated, before they believe the gospel..do you believe that ? And also do you believe this is limited to the elect ?

 

[francisdesales]

mondar:

You are speaking of the perfect obedience of Christ as a necessary requirement for our salvation.

everyone that Jesus christ died for has a perfect standing before God because of the death of christ on their behalf..This perfect standing is theirs even before they are born dead in trespasses and sin, before they are regenrated, before they believe the gospel..do you believe that ? And also do you believe this is limited to the elect ?

Baloney. Totally forgets about the role of God's Spirit in the process of sanctification. We are NOT perfect before God even before we were born! Ridiculous. Christ is MANKIND'S representative, not your personal replacement...

 

[glorydaz]

I had no idea there were Christians who didn't know we are to walk in obedience to our Lord.
That's pretty basic to our faith. Trust and obey...for there's no other way. Seems simple enough to me.

You would think so, but the majority of professing "Christians" today actually deny the need to be obedient to Christ to be saved.

SealedEternal

There are professing Christians who say a lot of things.
Some believe Jesus only died for "some"...that God only loves "some"....that only "some" are called to repentance. There are even those who don't believe the Bible is inspired by God. There are some who think we're still bound by the law. Of course, what they think doesn't matter in the least. Grace and truth came through our Lord Jesus Christ and we can rest in His finished work on the cross...in spite of what anyone claims to the contrary.