The Baptism that saves us Now

[for_his_glory]

I don't have the answers. Thats why this is a study.

Is it possible that they had the holy Spirit with them but not yet indwelled them? I need references.

I dont believe it was A baptism of the Holy Spirit.
I believe it was a baptism of the Holy Ghost.

So what I needed was scriptures to prove the Holy Spirit was not in people who believed who He was before His ascension. If not "in" was He with?

Either the Holy Spirit was given to all who believed when they believed.

Or

The Holy Spirit was given when they were baptized with the Holyghost

Or

Was it the Holyghost that was given and would indwell a believer.

Or

The HolyGhost overshadowed all who would receive the Holy Spirit

Or
the Holyghost overshadowed the believer (as Mary) and gives those who believe the Holy Spirit who was with them but not yet in them.

Or
What ever else I may be missing

But here is the passage you presented:

23Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. 24He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me. 25These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you. 26But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

Question how does the father "love him"

Next passage you rendered: Acts 2 kjv

Here is verse 4:
And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

.....................
And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
........................



He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.”

So my thoughts on all this is.. The Holy Ghost is the power of the resurrected body of Christ

Pour out of His Spirit, whose Spirit? The Spirit of God? So if you received the Spirit of God, then the Holyghost, the power of the Glorified body of Christ is poured out and one has revelation.

My question is not when one receieves the Baptism of what you called the Holy Spirit.
But when one actually receives the Holy Spirit.
As for all my "or" earlier.

I asked that because He pours "out of" His Spirit what seems to be the Holyghost. (POWER)
is"REVELATIONAL POWER" POURED OUT

Holy Spirit or Holy Ghost are both the same thing being that of God's Spirit sent down to indwell the believer and to teach them all truths. I have explained all of this with scripture, but it's up to you to read them. Here is more about the Holy Spirit.

Acts 2:1 and when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
Acts 2:2 and suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
Acts 2:3 and there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
Acts 2:4 and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

The disciples could not understand with their carnal minds what Jesus was teaching them, but they knew he was a prophet sent from God and accepted the authority and power which he taught with through miracles, signs and wonders. It would not be until the Spirit of God was taken up out of the tomb and revealed to the hearts of those who believed on him that the same Spirit would be sent back down to dwell in the hearts of those who believed.

Romans 8:6 for to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Romans 8:7 because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
When we repent of our sins and ask Jesus into our hearts as our Lord and Savior we are also receiving the promise of God that his Spirit will come and dwell in our hearts and teach us of all things we need to learn. The baptism that Peter was talking about was a Spiritual rebirth through the word of God. Some people think it is being dunked or sprinkled with water the way John the Baptist did as he was the forerunner of Jesus and there is nothing wrong with that for it is an outward appearance to man that you have received Jesus and the Holy Spirit into your life, but Jesus himself never baptized with water for the baptism of Jesus was for receiving the Spirit of God (Holy Spirit) that helps us to know the will of the Father.

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 2:39 for the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

We receive power and authority through the Holy Spirit to carry on the works of the Lord until His glorious return. In order to stay in Gods will you must posses the mind of Christ to know the works we do are not of ourselves, but that of the Father who started a good work in you. Jesus has started a good work within you and we can only carry out these works through the Holy Spirits guidance as we help meet the needs of others who need a touch from God.

Acts 1:8 but ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.

 

[walking]

Explain please

cant!
idk why!

 

[Tulipbee]

The Holy Spirit baptism is the baptism that saves........baptized into the family of God

John 6:28-29 Then they asked him, "What must we do to do the works God requires?" Jesus answered, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent."

Matthew 16:15-17 "But what about you?" he asked. "Who do you say I am?" Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God." Jesus replied, "Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by man, but by my Father in heaven."

Romans 10:9 That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your that God raised him from the , you will be saved.

John 14:15-17 " If you love me, you will obey what I command. And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever - The Spirit of truth

Matthew 3:15-17 Jesus replied, "Let it be so now; it is proper for us to do this to fulfill all righteousness." Then John consented. As soon as Jesus was baptized, he went up out of the water. at that moment heaven was opened, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and lighting on him. And a voice from heaven said, This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased."

John 14:20 "On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you."

I did a progression of what happens. Seek truth (the actual truth), The Father will give you revelation of Jesus, Revelation will cause your eyes to be opened. You understand why Jesus is Lord and that it's true he didn't remain dead. When you truly believe this, he asks the Father to give you the Spirit and you are baptized into his baptism. You can say "Abba Father" cause you are a child of God now. You will follow Christ to the cross in your life also, cause he is the Way.

The Holy Spirit baptism is our inheritance given on the day you are born again into the family of God.

**Calvinism View of Holy Spirit Baptism**

According to Calvinism, Holy Spirit baptism is the act of God by which He regenerates and indwells a person, bringing them into a saving relationship with Jesus Christ. This baptism is distinct from water baptism, which is a symbol of the believer's union with Christ.

**Calvin's Institutes of Religion**

In his Institutes of Religion, John Calvin writes:

> "The Holy Spirit is the one who regenerates us, who gives us faith, who justifies us, who sanctifies us, who seals us, who adopts us as children of God, and who makes us heirs of eternal life." (Book III, Chapter 1, Section 4)

Calvin also emphasizes that Holy Spirit baptism is a once-for-all event that occurs at the moment of conversion. He writes:

> "The Spirit is not given by measure to Christ, but dwells in Him in all His fullness. And since He is ours, and we are His, it follows that He dwells in us also, not by measure, but according to the measure of our capacity." (Book III, Chapter 1, Section 4)

**Bible Quotes**

* **John 3:5** - "Jesus answered, 'Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit.'"
* **Acts 2:38** - "Peter replied, 'Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.'"
* **Romans 8:9** - "You, however, are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, they do not belong to Christ."

**Cessationalism**

Cessationalism is the belief that the miraculous gifts of the Holy Spirit, such as speaking in tongues and healing, ceased after the apostolic age. Cessationists argue that these gifts were only temporary and were intended to confirm the apostles' message.

**Epilepsy and Speaking Vocally**

People with epilepsy who speak vocally during seizures are not necessarily exercising a spiritual gift. Seizures are a neurological disorder that can cause a variety of symptoms, including vocalizations.

**Conclusion**

In Calvinism, Holy Spirit baptism is the act of God by which He regenerates and indwells a person, bringing them into a saving relationship with Jesus Christ. This baptism is distinct from water baptism, which is a symbol of the believer's union with Christ. Cessationalism is the belief that the miraculous gifts of the Holy Spirit ceased after the apostolic age. People with epilepsy who speak vocally during seizures are not necessarily exercising a spiritual gift.

 

[Tulipbee]

how about this edit... im not God or Jesus. nor the second coming.

can you believe that?

Walking,

Please refrain from using derogatory language in this forum. The word "retard" is offensive and should not be used to describe anyone, regardless of their beliefs or actions.

I understand that you may disagree with the my views, but it is important to be respectful and mindful of others' opinions. Please stay on topic and avoid personal attacks.

As for your question about the errors of Arminianism and the concept of tongues, I would be happy to discuss those with you. However, I would ask that you do so in a respectful and civil manner.

Thank you for your understanding.

 

[GodsGrace]

walking

YOUR LANGUAGE IS UNACCEPTABLE.
YOU ARE BREAKING TOS RULES.
PLEASE FAMILIARIZE YOURSELF WITH OUR TERMS OF SERVICE TO WHICH YOU AGREED WHEN REGISTERING.

A TEMP. BAN FROM THIS FORUM IS IN EFFECT.
NEXT IS A SITE BAN.

DO NOT REPLY TO THIS POST IN THIS THREAD.
USE TALK WITH STAFF IF NECESSARY.

ADDRESSING A MODERATOR IN AN OPEN THREAD IS GROUNDS FOR AN IMMEDIATE BAN.

 

[LovethroughDove]

**Conclusion**

In Calvinism, Holy Spirit baptism is the act of God by which He regenerates and indwells a person, bringing them into a saving relationship with Jesus Christ. This baptism is distinct from water baptism, which is a symbol of the believer's union with Christ. Cessationalism is the belief that the miraculous gifts of the Holy Spirit ceased after the apostolic age. People with epilepsy who speak vocally during seizures are not necessarily exercising a spiritual gift.

I read what you wrote. What is your knowledge (personally) of what saving baptism is? From what has happened with you.

 

[Tulipbee]

I read what you wrote. What is your knowledge (personally) of what saving baptism is? From what has happened with you.

LovethroughDove, A Calvinist Perspective on Saving Baptism

In the Calvinist understanding, saving baptism is a profound act of God's grace, specifically the work of the Holy Spirit in regenerating and indwelling a person, leading them into a saving relationship with Jesus Christ. Let's delve into this concept using insights from John Calvin's "Institutes of the Christian Religion" and biblical references.

Regeneration by the Holy Spirit:

Calvinism teaches that the Holy Spirit is actively involved in the process of regeneration, where the spiritually dead are made alive in Christ. This transformative work of the Spirit is expressed in passages like Titus 3:5: "He saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit."

Indwelling of the Holy Spirit:

Saving baptism involves the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, who takes residence in the believer's heart. This intimate connection is emphasized in 1 Corinthians 6:19: "Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God?"

Union with Christ:

Calvinists distinguish between Holy Spirit baptism and water baptism. Water baptism is seen as a symbolic expression of the believer's union with Christ, signifying identification with His death and resurrection. Romans 6:4 affirms this union: "We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life."

Cessationism and Spiritual Gifts:

Cessationism, as understood in Calvinism, contends that certain miraculous gifts of the Holy Spirit, like tongues and prophecy, ceased after the apostolic age. The focus shifts to the enduring work of the Spirit in the hearts of believers rather than external manifestations.

Your Personal Experience:

While personal experiences can be meaningful, Calvinism emphasizes the objective truth of God's Word and the transformative work of the Holy Spirit in salvation. My experience of being baptized as an infant, while significant to your family and community, is not the focus of Calvinist theology. The emphasis is on the inward work of the Spirit, which is not dependent on external rituals or ceremonies like yours.

As we discuss saving baptism, may our exploration be grounded in the richness of Calvinist theology and the biblical foundations that underpin this perspective.

 

[Corinth77777]

Holy Spirit or Holy Ghost are both the same thing being that of God's Spirit sent down to indwell the believer and to teach them all truths. I have explained all of this with scripture, but it's up to you to read them. Here is more about the Holy Spirit.

Acts 2:1 and when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
Acts 2:2 and suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
Acts 2:3 and there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
Acts 2:4 and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

The disciples could not understand with their carnal minds what Jesus was teaching them, but they knew he was a prophet sent from God and accepted the authority and power which he taught with through miracles, signs and wonders. It would not be until the Spirit of God was taken up out of the tomb and revealed to the hearts of those who believed on him that the same Spirit would be sent back down to dwell in the hearts of those who believed.

Romans 8:6 for to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Romans 8:7 because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
When we repent of our sins and ask Jesus into our hearts as our Lord and Savior we are also receiving the promise of God that his Spirit will come and dwell in our hearts and teach us of all things we need to learn. The baptism that Peter was talking about was a Spiritual rebirth through the word of God. Some people think it is being dunked or sprinkled with water the way John the Baptist did as he was the forerunner of Jesus and there is nothing wrong with that for it is an outward appearance to man that you have received Jesus and the Holy Spirit into your life, but Jesus himself never baptized with water for the baptism of Jesus was for receiving the Spirit of God (Holy Spirit) that helps us to know the will of the Father.

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 2:39 for the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

We receive power and authority through the Holy Spirit to carry on the works of the Lord until His glorious return. In order to stay in Gods will you must posses the mind of Christ to know the works we do are not of ourselves, but that of the Father who started a good work in you. Jesus has started a good work within you and we can only carry out these works through the Holy Spirits guidance as we help meet the needs of others who need a touch from God.

Acts 1:8 but ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.

I believe they are different
And I did not see where you explained at any time.

 

[Corinth77777]

cant!
idk why!

No problem

 

[Corinth77777]

Holy Spirit or Holy Ghost are both the same thing being that of God's Spirit sent down to indwell the believer and to teach them all truths. I have explained all of this with scripture, but it's up to you to read them. Here is more about the Holy Spirit.

The one thing I think I may have changed my mind on after reading some scriptures
Is when the Holy Spirit comes to dwell. I am still unsure because of the fact I do see a difference in Holy Ghost and Holy Spirit.

I am sure they are the same in some way as well.
It could be that the Holy Spirit is with but not in when one believes. I found one passage that kind of might indicate that.

which is John 14:17

When it says: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you

But why if Jesus is there is He saying the Holy Spirit dwelleth with them? Unless the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of the Father,
or words?

In any case here are some scriptures I retrieved from someone that recognized a difference.

Romans 8

Vs.9But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
..........
" Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God."

My issue here is it doesn't mention when.

Maybe this was my issue before: putting the cart before the horse.

For one it says " believes" which indicates continuation. What it does not say is when they believed they were automatically born again.

Would they have to wait until Pentecost?
Another thing is what does born again mean?

if you are born physically you have came through your mothers water into this world.

So then if you are born Spiritually you must have entered into another world- The Kingdom of God.
But by the word


Something is definitely not adding up due to this passage:

And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.

So are they not born again? They entered the Kingdom and this is before the resurrection?

Acts 2:1 and when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
Acts 2:2 and suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
Acts 2:3 and there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
Acts 2:4 and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

The disciples could not understand with their carnal minds what Jesus was teaching them, but they knew he was a prophet sent from God and accepted the authority and power which he taught with through miracles, signs and wonders. It would not be until the Spirit of God was taken up out of the tomb and revealed to the hearts of those who believed on him that the same Spirit would be sent back down to dwell in the hearts of those who believed.

Romans 8:6 for to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Romans 8:7 because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
When we repent of our sins and ask Jesus into our hearts as our Lord and Savior we are also receiving the promise of God that his Spirit will come and dwell in our hearts and teach us of all things we need to learn. The baptism that Peter was talking about was a Spiritual rebirth through the word of God. Some people think it is being dunked or sprinkled with water the way John the Baptist did as he was the forerunner of Jesus and there is nothing wrong with that for it is an outward appearance to man that you have received Jesus and the Holy Spirit into your life, but Jesus himself never baptized with water for the baptism of Jesus was for receiving the Spirit of God (Holy Spirit) that helps us to know the will of the Father.

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 2:39 for the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

We receive power and authority through the Holy Spirit to carry on the works of the Lord until His glorious return. In order to stay in Gods will you must posses the mind of Christ to know the works we do are not of ourselves, but that of the Father who started a good work in you. Jesus has started a good work within you and we can only carry out these works through the Holy Spirits guidance as we help meet the needs of others who need a touch from God.

Acts 1:8 but ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.

 

[Corinth77777]

The one thing I think I may have changed my mind on after reading some scriptures
Is when the Holy Spirit comes to dwell. I am still unsure because of the fact I do see a difference in Holy Ghost and Holy Spirit.

I am sure they are the same in some way as well.
It could be that the Holy Spirit is with but not in when one believes. I found one passage that kind of might indicate that.

which is John 14:17

When it says: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you

But why if Jesus is there is He saying the Holy Spirit dwelleth with them? Unless the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of the Father,
or words?

In any case here are some scriptures I retrieved from someone that recognized a difference.

Romans 8

Vs.9But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
..........
" Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God."

My issue here is it doesn't mention when.

Maybe this was my issue before: putting the cart before the horse.

For one it says " believes" which indicates continuation. What it does not say is when they believed they were automatically born again.

Would they have to wait until Pentecost?
Another thing is what does born again mean?

if you are born physically you have came through your mothers water into this world.

So then if you are born Spiritually you must have entered into another world- The Kingdom of God.
But by the word


Something is definitely not adding up due to this passage:

And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.

So are they not born again? They entered the Kingdom and this is before the resurrection?

So this beggs the question of What Spirit is given on the day of Pentecost. Is it the Holy Spirit, which may mean the Spirit of God or the Holy Ghost which may mean the resurrected bodily power of the Son?..

John 7:39 kjv

He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
This is an interesting passage but confusing
because of what it could be saying.

What it seems to be saying is those who believe on him receive the ?Spirit of God? the Holy Spirit.
But when? Did they receive this Spirit.

They should receive when they believe?
Or Should receive when the Holyghost comes over them?


They are told:

But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.

So here is one place below I don't understand.
When Jesus blew on them and said receive the Holy ghost..I have to check that out in the tyndale's version

Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you. 22And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost


The Codex Sinaiticus Says Holy Spirit. And Jesus I think was seen by other people besides for the 12 before He ascended.


Another thing is did the death and resurrection of Christ have to be preached for people to receive the Holy Spirit
or was that for people to believe who He was. But what about those who believed He was the Christ before He died and resurrected.

So I guess the question goes back to interpretation of John 7-the passage where it speaks of the Spirit was not yet given.

In Verse 31 And many of the people believed on him, .......

Now to the Niddy Griddy VS. 38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believed on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)

So the question that still remains is: What was given at Pentecost?

a. the Holy Ghost?
b. the Holy Spirit
C. the Spirit of revelation
d. The Holy Ghost came over all who believed and put the Holy Spirit in the Believer
e. What one believed now manifested as the Holy Spirit in them by the Power of the HOly Ghost
f. All of the above
g. or are we missing information of spirit
h. or missing more information all together

Here is a passage that just came to me Act 10:47

kjv

Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we.

lets look at one more and hopefully we can discuss these
John 14:

25These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you. 26But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

Here we see that the Comforter is the Holy Ghost....mmmmm

Sounds like revelation to me....

John 14 is one to look into....

 

[Corinth77777]

John 14


15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

Here is good- because one must keep His commandments before they get the Holyghost

17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

Is this saying the Spirit of truth is the Holyghost?

18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

They have yet to "live", but what does live mean here? Does it mean to be born again? Or the quality of good life?

20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

What day? the day they live?

21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

Sounds like the manifestation is life..but I'm sure God can manifest Himself in other ways.


22 Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world?

23 ...........accidentally eraced this


24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

25 These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you.

26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

The Father sends the Holy Ghost in the son's name
The Holy Ghost is the teacher

 

[for_his_glory]

The one thing I think I may have changed my mind on after reading some scriptures
Is when the Holy Spirit comes to dwell. I am still unsure because of the fact I do see a difference in Holy Ghost and Holy Spirit.

I am sure they are the same in some way as well.
It could be that the Holy Spirit is with but not in when one believes. I found one passage that kind of might indicate that.

which is John 14:17

When it says: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you

But why if Jesus is there is He saying the Holy Spirit dwelleth with them? Unless the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of the Father,
or words?

In any case here are some scriptures I retrieved from someone that recognized a difference.

Romans 8

Vs.9But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
..........
" Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God."

My issue here is it doesn't mention when.

Maybe this was my issue before: putting the cart before the horse.

For one it says " believes" which indicates continuation. What it does not say is when they believed they were automatically born again.

Would they have to wait until Pentecost?
Another thing is what does born again mean?

if you are born physically you have came through your mothers water into this world.

So then if you are born Spiritually you must have entered into another world- The Kingdom of God.
But by the word


Something is definitely not adding up due to this passage:

And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.

So are they not born again? They entered the Kingdom and this is before the resurrection?

Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost is that of God's Spirit as both, Holy Spirit and Holy Ghost are both found in scripture being that of God's Spirit. In the OT the Spirit of God fell on many and in the NT the Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost indwelled those of faith in Christ.

KJV
Rom 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
Rom 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
Rom 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

We receive the indwelling of the Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost the moment we accept Jesus as our Lord and Savior when we become Spiritually born again, John 3:5-7; Matthew 3:11; 14:26, Acts 19:1-7.

The indwelling of the Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost (scripture uses both) was not given until the day of Pentecost after Jesus ascended up to heaven and sent down the comforter which is the Holy Ghost.

 

[for_his_glory]

I believe they are different
And I did not see where you explained at any time.

Well, I showed you in scripture where both are used and being the very Spirit of God. I guess you will just have to figure it out for yourself.

 

[Corinth77777]

Well, I showed you in scripture where both are used and being the very Spirit of God. I guess you will just have to figure it out for yourself.

Yes, Now how are they different ?

 

[LovethroughDove]

Your Personal Experience:

While personal experiences can be meaningful, Calvinism emphasizes the objective truth of God's Word and the transformative work of the Holy Spirit in salvation. My experience of being baptized as an infant, while significant to your family and community, is not the focus of Calvinist theology. The emphasis is on the inward work of the Spirit, which is not dependent on external rituals or ceremonies like yours.

As we discuss saving baptism, may our exploration be grounded in the richness of Calvinist theology and the biblical foundations that underpin this perspective.

Thank you for Calvinist explanation. I think it better though, you be able to explain how it happened for you using scripture to correlate.

1 Peter 3:15 But in your hearts set apart Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks "you" to give the reason for the hope that "you" have. But do this with gentleness and respect.

Sorry if I really don't care what Calvin has to say, but "you".

 

[DJT_47]

Holy Spirit or Holy Ghost are both the same thing being that of God's Spirit sent down to indwell the believer and to teach them all truths. I have explained all of this with scripture, but it's up to you to read them. Here is more about the Holy Spirit.

Acts 2:1 and when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
Acts 2:2 and suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
Acts 2:3 and there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
Acts 2:4 and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

The disciples could not understand with their carnal minds what Jesus was teaching them, but they knew he was a prophet sent from God and accepted the authority and power which he taught with through miracles, signs and wonders. It would not be until the Spirit of God was taken up out of the tomb and revealed to the hearts of those who believed on him that the same Spirit would be sent back down to dwell in the hearts of those who believed.

Romans 8:6 for to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Romans 8:7 because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
When we repent of our sins and ask Jesus into our hearts as our Lord and Savior we are also receiving the promise of God that his Spirit will come and dwell in our hearts and teach us of all things we need to learn. The baptism that Peter was talking about was a Spiritual rebirth through the word of God. Some people think it is being dunked or sprinkled with water the way John the Baptist did as he was the forerunner of Jesus and there is nothing wrong with that for it is an outward appearance to man that you have received Jesus and the Holy Spirit into your life, but Jesus himself never baptized with water for the baptism of Jesus was for receiving the Spirit of God (Holy Spirit) that helps us to know the will of the Father.

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 2:39 for the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

We receive power and authority through the Holy Spirit to carry on the works of the Lord until His glorious return. In order to stay in Gods will you must posses the mind of Christ to know the works we do are not of ourselves, but that of the Father who started a good work in you. Jesus has started a good work within you and we can only carry out these works through the Holy Spirits guidance as we help meet the needs of others who need a touch from God.

Acts 1:8 but ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.

There is one baptism and that's immersion in water for the forgiveness of sins. One Lord, one faith, one baptism. Eph 4:5-6

 

[JLB]

The more I see 1 Peter 3:21 from surrounding passages. I am coming to believe that the baptism that saves us now is: God

There is also an antitype which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, 1 Peter 3:21


Do you understand what a type is?

Peter says “antitype”.

The water of the days of Noah destroyed.

The water of baptism was meant to save; not the physical washing of dirt from water, but your heart attitude expressing faith.

The water in baptism doesn’t save, and is only symbolic of your commitment to die to this world and be raised to the newness of life; a life dedicated to Christ as your LORD.




JLB

 

[for_his_glory]

There is one baptism and that's immersion in water for the forgiveness of sins. One Lord, one faith, one baptism. Eph 4:5-6

I will ask you this question. When are we baptized into Christ and for the indwelling of the Holy Spirit?

 

[for_his_glory]

Yes, Now how are they different ?

They are not different is what you are not understanding. I gave you the scriptures that are written that some scriptures use Holy Spirit and some use Holy Ghost as both are the same being the very Spirit of God. Do you believe Yeshua and Jesus are the same? If yes then it is the same with the Holy Spirit and Holy Ghost.