The battle of Ezekiel 38 and it's timing.

[Adstar]

....was describing the future advanced borders of the state of isreal which will be Jesus' Kingdom.

I think the problem I have is that...um....I don't think the 1000 year rule is literal. I think it will be a few months.

Fair enough. What leads you to believe it will only be a few months?

In Zechariah 14 a chapter that i believe is a prophecy of the Day of the Lord and times bejond it. It states:

Zechariah 14
16 And it shall come to pass that everyone who is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the Feast of Tabernacles.

So to me that year to year represents a longer time period then a few months. Also the book of Revelation also refers to the 1000 as being years.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[Adstar]

Strangelove states

I knew that was your position, and glad to hear it, but I was confused I thought that the following paragraph in your post...

Adstar states

So God has promised the descendants of Abraham will have a Land that includes the Nile and the Euphrates. Now Persia borders the land of the Euphrates to the east and Libya borders the land of the Nile to the west and Ethiopia borders the land of the Nile to the south. So at the time of Ezekiel the nations of Libya Ethiopia and Persia will border the greater Messianic Kingdom of the Messiah Jesus.

....was describing the future advanced borders of the state of isreal which will be Jesus' Kingdom.

Well it was. But i am thinking that you may be thinking that i am saying that The Messiah will only be ruling in that limited area and will not be the ruler of the world???

I believe Jesus will be ruling the entire world but the Area that i define above will be like a special area for the saints and the decendants of the 144 000. Kind of like a special paradise kingdom from which the Messiah and His saints will govern the world. I believe the saints will be sent out from this area and will be govenors of cities in the rest of the world, some rulers of ten cities some rulers of one city like the Parable of the Minas mentions in Luke 16.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[Shilohsfoal]

I am not a supporter of the modern state of Israel. To me it is both a deception manufactured by agents of satan to decieve Christians in the end times and is also the final and biggest Jewish concentration camp ever set up. The same people who supported and financed Hitler also supported and financed the set up of Israel. Classical carrot and stick approach to get the Jews to work for the final deception and get them all in a fish bowel so that the beast can finaly wipe them out.

Its more than that my friend.The Israeli goverment is the beast that was,and was not and yet is.
The ten horns renderd unto this beast thier kingdom.That is the seven (heads of the beast)mountains of Jerusalem.And it is there the beast rules his kingdom.If you have any questions concerning this beast you can ask.But for your education I will show you someting that took place in your lifetime concerning this beast that was, and was not and yet is.

Daniel 7;24
And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise;and another shall rise after them;and he shall be diverse from the first,and he shall subdue three kings.

This kingdom described here is the middle east.It was devided from a kingdom into many small countries.The little country whos look is more stout than his fellows is the modern state of Israel.And it is the modern state of Israel that defeated three of the ten nations who renderd thier kingdom unto him.The year was 1967 and the kings the little horn subdued were Jordan,Syria and Egypt.It was called the 6 day war.

The jews have gatherd from all the world to worship the beast and to serve him.

I'll make a bet these ten horns wont be around when Gog and Magog comes upon the mountains of Israel.
I would bet they are in the promised land when Jesus comes.
Rev 17;14
These shall make war with the Lamb,and the Lamb shall overcome them;for he is Lord of lords,and King of kings;and they that are with him are called,and chosen,and faithful.

Those muslim nations might destroy the whore as they would like but they cant have the promised land.

 

[Sinthesis]

Directly from the Word of God himself to the people of Israel upon the occasion of their rebellion against His will when they initially refused to go into the promised land.

Taking about a shadow of the future in the OT, and clearly a shadow of this very topic we are talking about now. This incident also included in it two truthful witnesses to the promised land, Joshua the son of Nun and Caleb the son of Jephunneh. And just like the final two witnesses prophesised in the book of Revelation their witness was also rejected.

Read Numbers 14 for the full story if you want now and come back and read the following:



Deuteronomy 1:39
34 “And the LORD heard the sound of your words, and was angry, and took an oath, saying, 35 ‘Surely not one of these men of this evil generation shall see that good land of which I swore to give to your fathers, 36 except Caleb the son of Jephunneh; he shall see it, and to him and his children I am giving the land on which he walked, because he wholly followed the LORD.’ 37 The LORD was also angry with me for your sakes, saying, ‘Even you shall not go in there. 38 Joshua the son of Nun, who stands before you, he shall go in there. Encourage him, for he shall cause Israel to inherit it.
39 ‘Moreover your little ones and your children, who you say will be victims, who today have no knowledge of good and evil, they shall go in there; to them I will give it, and they shall possess it.

This is when the tribes of Israel where in the desert and refused to go into the Promised Land because of fear of it's inhabitants. God decided to punish the people by forcing them to wonder in the desert for 40 years so that all of the generation that had refused to enter the Promised Land would die and never enter it. But as He says above about the little ones

"WHO TODAY HAVE NO KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL"

This is the crucial statement from God about the little ones (BABIES) they are innocent. Think of Adam and eve before they ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, where they not Good. Did not the coming of the knowledge of Good and Evil to them cause them to fall from their state of goodness?
When did Adam and Eve come to need the Atoning blood of the Messiah Jesus... That’s right, After they came to have the knowledge of Good and Evil. And now here we hear God Himself says about the little ones "WHO TODAY HAVE NO KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL".

That’s why they where spared from the judgment against their parents. All their parents died in the wilderness and never entered the promised land, But the little ones who where innocent where preserved through the 40 years trek in the wilderness to enter into the promised land. And that is a shadow of the 144,000 innocents whom will likewise be preserved through the tribulation and the wrath to also enter the promised Kingdom of the Messiah Jesus.

Don't you just love it when things just fall into place. :D





All Praise The Ancient Of Days

Ok, I see where you're coming from. It's still wrong though. In this parallel view those allowed into the promised land were those innocent only of the particular sin regarding their refusal to trust God to deliver them their inheritance. Caleb and Joshua did trust God, while those 19yrs or less (hardly just "babies" yet it would include those unborn at the time) were not numbered; that is they had no say in the matter and were thus blameless. This is not to say they were sinless.

Further, the 144K are called "virgins" rather than your supposed "innocents" because in shadow-speak they are being related to those who did not fall prey to the Midionite women.

I thank you for bringing this idea to my attention though, because it points to a goldmine of parallel symbolism for my particular eschatological viewpoint.

 

[Strangelove]

Fair enough. What leads you to believe it will only be a few months?

In Zechariah 14 a chapter that i believe is a prophecy of the Day of the Lord and times bejond it. It states:

Zechariah 14
16 And it shall come to pass that everyone who is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the Feast of Tabernacles.

So to me that year to year represents a longer time period then a few months. Also the book of Revelation also refers to the 1000 as being years.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

Well...I guess it's not derailing your thread too much seeing as the 1000 year literal/figurative issue directly effects the timing of the war so....

First thing is I'm reluctant to go to OT prophecy regarding the second advent because there is just so much time between then and whenever Christ comes that those prophecies could be related to other events, not least the first coming of Christ. I know al lot of people like to use Zech 14 but personally I dont see that as a second advent prophecy.

Secondly....when I first read about the 1000 yeart reign...My immediate feeling was that it was figurative. A literal meaning just doesn't make any sense to me. A thosand years is a looooooooong time. Christ reigns on Earth for a thousand years and then Satan is loosed again and goes out and decieves the people who Jesus has reigned over....instantly?? Nah....it doesn't add up. And all this happens in 2 tiny verses in Rev? And theres no description of the idealic ten whole centuries of paradise under His reign?

Thirdly we are told in II Peter 3:8 not to take a thousand years too literally.

Fourth...there is a logical approach to this which I'm not entirely sure about but I can take you through it slowly to see if it makes sense.

Scripture tells us that 'The Beast' and the false prophet and all who are gathered with them die at the end of the 7th bowl/vial plague (armageddon) of the 7th trumpet. It's also specified that the beast rules for '42 months' and that this rule starts with the fall of Babylon sooooooo.......the beasts 42 months begin with the start of the first trumpet plague and finish with the end of the 7th trumpet plagues.

Am I correct up to that point?

 

[Adstar]

Its more than that my friend.The Israeli goverment is the beast that was,and was not and yet is.
The ten horns renderd unto this beast thier kingdom.That is the seven (heads of the beast)mountains of Jerusalem.And it is there the beast rules his kingdom.If you have any questions concerning this beast you can ask.But for your education I will show you someting that took place in your lifetime concerning this beast that was, and was not and yet is.

Daniel 7;24
And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise;and another shall rise after them;and he shall be diverse from the first,and he shall subdue three kings.

This kingdom described here is the middle east.It was devided from a kingdom into many small countries.The little country whos look is more stout than his fellows is the modern state of Israel.And it is the modern state of Israel that defeated three of the ten nations who renderd thier kingdom unto him.The year was 1967 and the kings the little horn subdued were Jordan,Syria and Egypt.It was called the 6 day war.

The jews have gatherd from all the world to worship the beast and to serve him.

I'll make a bet these ten horns wont be around when Gog and Magog comes upon the mountains of Israel.
I would bet they are in the promised land when Jesus comes.
Rev 17;14
These shall make war with the Lamb,and the Lamb shall overcome them;for he is Lord of lords,and King of kings;and they that are with him are called,and chosen,and faithful.

Those muslim nations might destroy the whore as they would like but they cant have the promised land.

I cannot agree with your interpretation. Initally the Beast supports the Harlot, the 10 hornes support Her, but after she has served her purpose the beast that has 10 horns destroys her.

The arab nations you identify as the 10 horns have never supported the Harlot.
The arab nations saught the destruction of the modern state of israel from the very beggining. Any true muslim nation will never accept Jerusalem under the complete control of the modern state of israel.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[Adstar]

Well...I guess it's not derailing your thread too much seeing as the 1000 year literal/figurative issue directly effects the timing of the war so....

First thing is I'm reluctant to go to OT prophecy regarding the second advent because there is just so much time between then and whenever Christ comes that those prophecies could be related to other events, not least the first coming of Christ. I know al lot of people like to use Zech 14 but personally I dont see that as a second advent prophecy.

I believe the OT has prophecy that covers the future right up to the final judgement. Discernment is needed to divide the prophecies about the destruction of the Old physical city of bablyon and the currect spiritual Harlot babylon. But with the Holy Spirit we are given what we to have to seperate them.

Secondly....when I first read about the 1000 yeart reign...My immediate feeling was that it was figurative. A literal meaning just doesn't make any sense to me. A thosand years is a looooooooong time. Christ reigns on Earth for a thousand years and then Satan is loosed again and goes out and decieves the people who Jesus has reigned over....instantly?? Nah....it doesn't add up.

Well we are going to be with Jesus for Eternity so 1000 years to us is going to be like a blink of an eye.

"Instantly".. it might take a few months it might take a year or two but note in the book of Revelation it says about the rule of the Messiah over thoes nations:

Revelation 19
15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

Now He will not be ruling us with an Iron Rod but He will be ruling the nations with an Iron Rod and that measn that His rule over them will be uncompromising and probably not liked by the nations. If decieved into believing they could overthrow the Messiah, then i am sure they would quickly take the opportunity. especally if God gives them over to deception. Like the people of the World today who have rejected the love of the truth, they also are given over to the deception of the Beast. Same thing take 2.

And all this happens in 2 tiny verses in Rev? And theres no description of the idealic ten whole centuries of paradise under His reign?

Yeah the book of Revelation really gets to the point in the last few chapters. I guess thats why it is called The Revelation.

Thirdly we are told in II Peter 3:8 not to take a thousand years too literally.

That was in response to the Christians who thought that Jesus was supposed to return soon after His assention. Because He did not return in the time frame they hoped for they where beginning to loose faith.

Fourth...there is a logical approach to this which I'm not entirely sure about but I can take you through it slowly to see if it makes sense.

Scripture tells us that 'The Beast' and the false prophet and all who are gathered with them die at the end of the 7th bowl/vial plague (armageddon) of the 7th trumpet.

Agreed a 7th trumpet return of the Messiah.

It's also specified that the beast rules for '42 months' and that this rule starts with the fall of Babylon sooooooo

Not sure about this. Could you provide scripture?

.......the beasts 42 months begin with the start of the first trumpet plague and finish with the end of the 7th trumpet plagues.

Am I correct up to that point?

Not sure about your last two points.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[Strangelove]

I believe the OT has prophecy that covers the future right up to the final judgement. Discernment is needed to divide the prophecies about the destruction of the Old physical city of bablyon and the currect spiritual Harlot babylon. But with the Holy Spirit we are given what we to have to seperate them.

Well we are going to be with Jesus for Eternity so 1000 years to us is going to be like a blink of an eye.

"Instantly".. it might take a few months it might take a year or two but note in the book of Revelation it says about the rule of the Messiah over thoes nations:

Revelation 19
15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

Now He will not be ruling us with an Iron Rod but He will be ruling the nations with an Iron Rod and that measn that His rule over them will be uncompromising and probably not liked by the nations. If decieved into believing they could overthrow the Messiah, then i am sure they would quickly take the opportunity. especally if God gives them over to deception. Like the people of the World today who have rejected the love of the truth, they also are given over to the deception of the Beast. Same thing take 2.

Yeah the book of Revelation really gets to the point in the last few chapters. I guess thats why it is called The Revelation.

That was in response to the Christians who thought that Jesus was supposed to return soon after His assention. Because He did not return in the time frame they hoped for they where beginning to loose faith.

Fair points all round Ad. I still got an itch I need to scratch though.

Agreed a 7th trumpet return of the Messiah.

It's also specified that the beast rules for '42 months' and that this rule starts with the fall of Babylon sooooooo

Not sure about this. Could you provide scripture?

13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

Isn't this talking about the beasts reign? This means the beast will continue 42 months from its overt initial reign to it's conclusion no?

The fall of Babylon is at the start of the first trumpet and thus marks the start of the reign of the beast. He reigns through the seven trumpet plagues. And the end is marked by the end of the seventh trumpet where the beast and the false prophet die.

​

So basically the seven trumpets MUST be 42 months in duration.

Is that right?​

 

[Adstar]

Fair points all round Ad. I still got an itch I need to scratch though.

13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

Isn't this talking about the beasts reign? This means the beast will continue 42 months from its overt initial reign to it's conclusion no?

The fall of Babylon is at the start of the first trumpet and thus marks the start of the reign of the beast. He reigns through the seven trumpet plagues. And the end is marked by the end of the seventh trumpet where the beast and the false prophet die.

​

So basically the seven trumpets MUST be 42 months in duration.

Is that right?​

Revelation 13
2 Now the beast which I saw was like a leopard, his feet were like the feet of a bear, and his mouth like the mouth of a lion. The dragon gave him his power, his throne, and great authority.

So satan who is the prince of the world gives over his power to the beast. So He has great power. Note after this.

Revelation 13
3 And I saw one of his heads as if it had been mortally wounded, and his deadly wound was healed. And all the world marveled and followed the beast. 4 So they worshiped the dragon who gave authority to the beast; and they worshiped the beast, saying, “Who is like the beast? Who is able to make war with him?”

So hear it states that only after the beast is (probably assasinated) and miraculiously healed do the people start worshipping Him. So after this all has happened:

Revelation 13
5 And he was given a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies, and he was given authority to continue for forty-two months.

So this forty-two months is the additional time after the beast recieves the wound and was healed. I do not see it as stating that the beast comes to power for only 42 months. But that for the last 42 months he will be seen as God on earth and will be worshipped. Before then He may be ruling for 42 months as a Great world ruler but not yet seen as being God on earth. Or the returned Messiah.


I still don't see how the first trumpet is linked to the fall of babylon? The first trumpet scriptures say:

Revelation 8
7 The first angel sounded: And hail and fire followed, mingled with blood, and they were thrown to the earth. And a third of the trees were burned up, and all green grass was burned up.

That to me is linked to the falling star , the burning mountain that is cast into the sea. I believe that destruction will be happening over a maybe a few days.


All Praise The Ancient of Days

 

[Strangelove]

I still don't see how the first trumpet is linked to the fall of babylon? The first trumpet scriptures say:

Revelation 8
7 The first angel sounded: And hail and fire followed, mingled with blood, and they were thrown to the earth. And a third of the trees were burned up, and all green grass was burned up.

That to me is linked to the falling star , the burning mountain that is cast into the sea. I believe that destruction will be happening over a maybe a few days.

Well....the idea is that, under these kinds of conditions, with all kinds of havoc raining down on the Earth, 'Babylon', which most of us see as the global financial / media stranglehold weilded by the Pharisees centred in Jerusalem....cannot possibly continue.

I think at this time the financial markets, stock exchange etc and Hollywood and all the news media infrastructure will be shut down and have no effect. This is the fall of Babylon. The end of that system and the start of the system of the beast. This is the time when the beasts power will be at it's height.

Rev 14:8-9 talks about Babylon falling and then the warning about taking the mark of the beast.

This all points to the fall of babylon and the start of the beasts reign at the First trumpet. And it ends as we agree at the end of the seventh trumpet. And it's 42 months as stated in scripture.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

I cannot agree with your interpretation. Initally the Beast supports the Harlot, the 10 hornes support Her, but after she has served her purpose the beast that has 10 horns destroys her.

The arab nations you identify as the 10 horns have never supported the Harlot.
The arab nations saught the destruction of the modern state of israel from the very beggining. Any true muslim nation will never accept Jerusalem under the complete control of the modern state of israel.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

Ive not read one verse that says the ten horns support the harlot.All the scripture says is they hate her.
Let us see the scripture that supports your claim.

The only thing that supports the harlot is seven mountains on which she sits.
Rev17;9
And here is the mind which hath wisdom,The seven heads are seven mountains,on which the woman sitteth.

The woman sits upon seven mountains.
She DOES NOT sit upon ten horns.

If your mind has wisdom,dont claim the ten horns support her.They dont carry her nor do they support her.
They hate her.

Rev 17;16
And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast,these shall hate the whore,and shall eat her flesh,and burn her with fire.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Well....the idea is that, under these kinds of conditions, with all kinds of havoc raining down on the Earth, 'Babylon', which most of us see as the global financial / media stranglehold weilded by the Pharisees centred in Jerusalem....cannot possibly continue.

I think at this time the financial markets, stock exchange etc and Hollywood and all the news media infrastructure will be shut down and have no effect. This is the fall of Babylon. The end of that system and the start of the system of the beast. This is the time when the beasts power will be at it's height.

Rev 14:8-9 talks about Babylon falling and then the warning about taking the mark of the beast.

This all points to the fall of babylon and the start of the beasts reign at the First trumpet. And it ends as we agree at the end of the seventh trumpet. And it's 42 months as stated in scripture.

Doc.Babylon is fallen ,is fallen is speaking of a falling away.
Apostacy.An outright fight again our Lord Jesus .Antichrist to its fullest extent.

Come out of her my people that ye be not partakers of her abominations.
Her abominations are proof of her apostacy.
Worshiping the beast ,Taking his mark and killing the saints who testify the truth to thier faces.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Adstar
The ten horns renderd thier kingdom unto the beast.
That kingdom consisted of the seven mountains oj which the woman sitteth.

Rev 17;17
For God hath put in thier hearts to forfill his will,and to agree,and give thier kingdom unto the beast,untill the words of God shall be forfilled.

What is it that you are claiming ?Are you going to xclaim the muslims didnt render to the beast thier dominion?
Are you going to claim those seven mountains was not thiers?Are you going to claim the harlot doesnt sit upon those same seven mountains?Or are you going to claim history is wrong?


The seven kings that have reigned over Israel
Five that were fallen.
Egypt,Assyrian,Babylon,Persia,and Macedonia.
One that was at the time John wrote this-Rome.
Then came the Dispora
The one who would come and continue a short space,who the people of Israel were gatherd under-
Great britian.
The eighth is that kingdom that once was,then was not when John wrote this,but now is again today.
The kingdom that calls itself by the name of Israel.


Rev 17;10-11
And there are seven kings;five are fallen and one is,and the other is not yet come;and when he cometh,he must continue a short space.
And the beast that was,and is not,even he is the eighth,and is of the seven,and goeth into perdition.

Maybe you want to claim John was wrong when he said the beast was(meaning it had once existed before he wrote this verse)
Or maybe you want to claim he was wrong when he said the beast is not(meaning at the time he wrote this ,it didnt exist.Or maybe you are wanting to claim it doesnt exist now when it most truly does.
Dont deny what is in front of your own face else you are blind.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

I think the problem I have is that...um....I don't think the 1000 year rule is literal. I think it will be a few months.

A day is as 1000 years and a 1000 years as a day.
The people Ezekiel was speaking of were at rest because it was the sabboth.
They were keeping the Lord's sabbath.

 

[Codger]

This thread is just more useless Futurist speculation. The sudden and surprising appearance of Modern Israel caused the popularity of Futurism/Dispensationalism in this country. Futurism is nonsense. I'm still waiting for any Futurist to tell me about one, only one, of your thousands of publically stated speculations - like on this thread - that has actually ever come to pass. I have never had anyone to submit even one and never will because the Prophesies you use have long been fulfilled. Ezekiel 38-39 was an apocalyptic prophesy of Israel's great struggle with the Selucids in the second century BC. You would think that after 63 years of endless speculations they would get one right just out of sheer coincidence.

I've been hearing about the invasion of Israel by Russia since 1955 - it never happened and never will.

Name just one Futurist speculation that has come to pass since 1948.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

This thread is just more useless Futurist speculation. The sudden and surprising appearance of Modern Israel caused the popularity of Futurism/Dispensationalism in this country. Futurism is nonsense. I'm still waiting for any Futurist to tell me about one, only one, of your thousands of publically stated speculations - like on this thread - that has actually ever come to pass. I have never had anyone to submit even one and never will because the Prophesies you use have long been fulfilled. Ezekiel 38-39 was an apocalyptic prophesy of Israel's great struggle with the Selucids in the second century BC. You would think that after 63 years of endless speculations they would get one right just out of sheer coincidence.

I've been hearing about the invasion of Israel by Russia since 1955 - it never happened and never will.

Name just one Futurist speculation that has come to pass since 1948.

Your post is the most useless post on this entire board much less this thread .

 

[smaller]

yeah, he likes to swing by with the preterist views.

I say if it all happened already, then why bother to pick up the book?

It's ALL in the past and is therefore MEANINGLESS.

But of course we know that THE WORD is spiritual.

John 6:63
It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

In this way I do not see ANY WORD of Jesus apart from these facts.

IF Mr. Jasher sees it ALL GONE and PAST...I'd only say he missed da boat and understands the WORD only as PAST HISTORY.

There is factually ANOTHER way to see these matters, and it is after the 'order' of God described by Paul in 1 Cor. 15, which Paul termed as FIRST THE NATURAL then the SPIRITUAL.

There was for example a NATURAL ADAM...and when Adam passed from the flesh, there was then A SPIRITUAL ADAM...the LAST Adam.

It is profitable to look at the OLD TESTAMENT in this way as well, and WHY Jesus references things to come citing OLD TESTAMENT EXAMPLES of the NATURAL disasters of Noah and Lot/S&G. Those were NATURAL disasters, but the also speak of the coming SPIRITUAL FULFILLMENT of those same INDICATORS.

It is a very sound principle to abide by when turning to the pages of Revelation OR when reading Jesus' statements about those same matters.

In the same way, JESUS, God IN FLESH came FIRST in the NATURAL BODY that was subject to DEATH.

The NEXT TIME Jesus comes, it will be IN FULL SPIRITUAL ARRAY.

I could cite many texts from the Old Testament that depict this forthcoming, but unfortunately few study in this manner.

Jesus in the Old Testament is sometime referred to as THE LORD OF THE GAP.

Jesus Himself said He is IN OUR MIDST...or in effect IN THE Gap.

It's an interesting study in itself. But as it applies to Ezekiel 38, THIS IS THE SIGN of the final battle:

21 And I will call for a sword against him throughout all my mountains, saith the Lord GOD: every man's sword shall be against his brother.

In effect, this is presently transpiring, right here in this thread, and the participants are not even aware that they are already caught up into this BATTLE.

The MOUNTAIN that God calls forth HIS SWORD upon is THE MINDs of MEN.

Welcome to ARMAGEDDON gentlemen.

Armageddon = Harar-to loom up-hill + PLACE WHERE CROWDS ARE PIERCED

Definition:
Megiddo or Megiddon = "place of crowds"
gadad
Definition:
to penetrate, cut, attack, invade


Y'all can stare at Israel all day long...

here is where THE LORD will arrive:

Isaiah 2:2
And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.

See the 'gathering' of ARMAGEDDON yet?

Isaiah 28:21
For the LORD shall rise up as in mount Perazim, he shall be wroth as in the valley of Gibeon, that he may do his work, his strange work; and bring to pass his act, his strange act.

Perazim = "breaches" "gap"

Gibeon from the root word for CUP.

Remember the INSIDE of the CUP?

Yeah, He WILL BE CLEANING house.

Zerubbable built the SECOND TEMPLE....

Zerubbable means...drumroll....

PLANTED IN BABYLON.

and for extra added value, the TEN KINGS are BELIEVERS. The KINGS OF THE EARTH are DEMONIC SPIRITS who TAKE COUNSEL AGAINST OUR LORD.

Psalm 76:12
He shall cut off the spirit of princes: he is terrible to the kings of the earth.

Ephesians 2:2
Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

IF any reader WANTS to see INTO Revelation matters, they would be WELL advised to GET THE PRINCE ONTO THEIR TABLES OF JUDGMENT....

or BE CAPTURED and TURNED against HIS BROTHERS.

John 16:11
Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

These things happen IN MAN as that is WHERE THOSE KINGS OF THE EARTH and that PRINCE ARE.

So jes keep STARIN' at them physical nations and physical people...all the while you are PRESENTLY being TURNED against EACH OTHERS just as THE WORD foretold.

s

 

[Sinthesis]

This thread is just more useless Futurist speculation. The sudden and surprising appearance of Modern Israel caused the popularity of Futurism/Dispensationalism in this country. Futurism is nonsense. I'm still waiting for any Futurist to tell me about one, only one, of your thousands of publically stated speculations - like on this thread - that has actually ever come to pass. I have never had anyone to submit even one and never will because the Prophesies you use have long been fulfilled. Ezekiel 38-39 was an apocalyptic prophesy of Israel's great struggle with the Selucids in the second century BC. You would think that after 63 years of endless speculations they would get one right just out of sheer coincidence.

I've been hearing about the invasion of Israel by Russia since 1955 - it never happened and never will.

Name just one Futurist speculation that has come to pass since 1948.

You're closer to the truth than any of the other speculators here, and a lot less hostile.

 

[Adstar]

Well....the idea is that, under these kinds of conditions, with all kinds of havoc raining down on the Earth, 'Babylon', which most of us see as the global financial / media stranglehold weilded by the Pharisees centred in Jerusalem....cannot possibly continue.

I think at this time the financial markets, stock exchange etc and Hollywood and all the news media infrastructure will be shut down and have no effect. This is the fall of Babylon. The end of that system and the start of the system of the beast. This is the time when the beasts power will be at it's height.

Rev 14:8-9 talks about Babylon falling and then the warning about taking the mark of the beast.

This all points to the fall of babylon and the start of the beasts reign at the First trumpet. And it ends as we agree at the end of the seventh trumpet. And it's 42 months as stated in scripture.

[FONT=&quot]I do not see the destruction of the 7 trumpets as causing the end of the Harlot. The Harlot will be destroyed before the trumpets sound. The Harlot will be destroyed by the Beast. To me the 7 trumpets are judgements of God upon the World after the beast has done His worst against us and while he is doing that He will fit in the destruction of the Harlot.

To bring in the Mark of the Beast the financial system of today must be destroyed or to put it more correctly faith in cash must be destroyed. You got to destroy the old before bringing in the new and the destruction of the Harlot may be a very big part of that process, seeing that the Harlot is the chief of the current system. But this will all be done before any trumpets sound.



All Praise The Ancient Of Days [/FONT]

 

[Shilohsfoal]

[FONT=&quot]I do not see the destruction of the 7 trumpets as causing the end of the Harlot. The Harlot will be destroyed before the trumpets sound. The Harlot will be destroyed by the Beast. To me the 7 trumpets are judgements of God upon the World after the beast has done His worst against us and while he is doing that He will fit in the destruction of the Harlot.

To bring in the Mark of the Beast the financial system of today must be destroyed or to put it more correctly faith in cash must be destroyed. You got to destroy the old before bringing in the new and the destruction of the Harlot may be a very big part of that process, seeing that the Harlot is the chief of the current system. But this will all be done before any trumpets sound.



All Praise The Ancient Of Days [/FONT]

The harlot does not get destroyed by the beast.She gets destroyed by the ten horns who gave thier land unto the beast.
The harlot belongs to the beast.The harlot is Jerusalem.