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Bible Study The Begotten Word of God

you said
?" Because that is not what we believe.

I said
I couldnt follow your logic in the rest of what you wrote. But I will comment on this part. And I hope you dont take this the wrong way. But why would anyone care what you or I believe. Isnt only what God believes that counts.
Now I have seen quite afew different versions of the trinity, you just gave me another one. But the fact is that it isnt in the Word of God. And the Word of God is the only words that will get us to heaven.

Matt 4:4
4 But He answered and said, "It is written, 'Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.'"
(NKJ)

John 12:49
49 "For I have not spoken on My own authority; but the Father who sent Me gave Me a command, what I should say and what I should speak.
(NKJ)

John 12:48
48 "He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him-- the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.
(NKJ)


Rev 22:18-19
18 For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book;
19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
(NKJ)
 
Squeakybro said:
you said
?" Because that is not what we believe.

I said
I couldnt follow your logic in the rest of what you wrote. But I will comment on this part. And I hope you dont take this the wrong way. But why would anyone care what you or I believe. Isnt only what God believes that counts.
Now I have seen quite a few different versions of the trinity, you just gave me another one. But the fact is that it isnt in the Word of God. And the Word of God is the only words that will get us to heaven.

FG - No offense taken. Well, FYI what I shared is not my "version" of the trinity. It is the accepted stand on the trinity by Christians in general. Oh not every brand of Christian takes this position. But this is fairly universally accepted by all evangelical Christianity. This is not my position or my understanding. If you think not, then feel free to tell of some position/understanding on the trinity that some other evangelical Christians have.

You see, there are a couple of things that confuse the issue here:

1 - Most christians unfortunately do not have a clear understanding of what the Bible teaches on the trinity. They know the basic - nothing more. So if you debate with them online youmaye hear a variety of things.

2 - Most (Dare I say "all"?) non-trinitarians do not know what Christianity teaches on the trinity (and has taught for nearly two milleniums). I have interacted with Christadelphians, JWs, Mormons on line and I have never encountered even one who can express accurately what Christinity teaches on the trinity. Not one. IOW, you guys just do not know what we believe.


John 12:49
49 "For I have not spoken on My own authority; but the Father who sent Me gave Me a command, what I should say and what I should speak.
(NKJ)

FG - Uh, our Lord said these words - not you.

John 12:48
48 "He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him-- the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.
(NKJ)

FG - Again, you did not say these words.

Rev 22:18-19
18 For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book;
19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
(NKJ)

FG - Great. So please quite adding onto God's Word, OK? :) The sword bites both ways.
Click to expand...
 
I never claimed that any of the verses were mine. I post them to show what the Holy Spirit told me. And how the Holy Spirit speaks to me to motivate me.
I have been in many websites over the past 9 years and each one the members agree on what the trinity means. But each website is different. Some believe that the trinity means one being with three personalities. Another believes three beings with one title for all of them together. That the Father is not God by Himself, and Jesus is not God by Himself, and the Holy Spirit is not God by Himself. But all three together are God. Another believes only one being and three manifestations. The thing is not one of them can prove with the Word what they say. When I show them these verses they just dont come back on or they try to pervert them. But its plain what they say. there is one God the Father. there is one God and Father.

1 Cor 8:6
6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for Him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and through whom we live.
(NKJ)

Eph 4:6
6 one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.
(NKJ)

Or I show them what Jesus said. That there is only one true God the Father.

John 17:1-3
1 Jesus spoke these words, lifted up His eyes to heaven, and said: "Father, the hour has come. Glorify Your Son, that Your Son also may glorify You,
2 "as You have given Him authority over all flesh, that He should give eternal life to as many as You have given Him.
3 "And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.
(NKJ)

Or when Jesus said that His God was the same God that I have. Or His Father is the same Father as I have.

John 20:17
17 Jesus said to her, "Do not cling to Me, for I have not yet ascended to My Father; but go to My brethren and say to them, 'I am ascending to My Father and your Father, and to My God and your God.'"
(NKJ)
 
Squeakybro said:
I never claimed that any of the verses were mine. I post them to show what the Holy Spirit told me. And how the Holy Spirit speaks to me to motivate me.

I have been in many websites over the past 9 years and each one the members agree on what the trinity means. But each website is different.

Some believe that the trinity means one being with three personalities. (FG - not just personalities - persons) Another believes three beings with one title for all of them together. (FG - This is clear modalism - and is not accepted by Christianity. They're probably just a bit ignorant in this area.) That the Father is not God by Himself, and Jesus is not God by Himself, and the Holy Spirit is not God by Himself. But all three together are God. (FG - This is biblical - I say the same thing. Doesn't mean we can't refer to the Father as God or the Son as God.) Another believes only one being and three manifestations. (FG - classic modalism.) The thing is not one of them can prove with the Word what they say. When I show them these verses they just dont come back on or they try to pervert them. But its plain what they say. there is one God the Father. there is one God and Father.

FG - Well, all I can say is that if you go to any, say, Christian Bible school or seminary website and look up their definition of the trinity, you won't get most of the above...

1 Cor 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for Him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and through whom we live. (NKJ)

FG - This is not saying what you think, SB. There is but one God. He is the Creator of all things. He is the One from whom all things come, and for whom all things exist. Now there is but one God, but He exists in three persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Here, Paul speaks only of the Father and Son as the one true God (the "One True God applies to both the Father and the Son here). A distinction is being made between the Father and Son, but Paul also considers them as One. The Father is the One from whom all things have come; the Son is the One through whom all things are, and through whom we exist. Earlier in the chapter Paul spoke of there being many so-called gods and so-called lords. Clearly God and Lord are both referring to deity here - since a distinction is being made with "gods" and "lords."

The is one God the Father - of whom are all things and we for Him
There is one Lord Jesus Christ - through whom are all things and through whom we exist.


Eph 4:6 one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all. (NKJ)

FG - In context: There is one body and one Spirit, just as also you were called in one hope of your calling; one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all who is over all and through all and in all.

I don't see the issue here... we all have one God and Father, the Father of the Lord Jesus Christ.

Or I show them what Jesus said. That there is only one true God the Father.

FG - There's also only one true God the Son

John 17:1-3 Jesus spoke these words, lifted up His eyes to heaven, and said: "Father, the hour has come. Glorify Your Son, that Your Son also may glorify You, "as You have given Him authority over all flesh, that He should give eternal life to as many as You have given Him. "And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent. (NKJ)

FG - Here we see the oneness of God expressed in the NT. Jesus refers to His Father as the only true God. He says that the Father sent Him. But within the One True God exists a plurality of persons.

He is not just the Son of God, but He is God the Son. This is the foundational doctrine of Christianity - Jesus Himself said "If you believe not that I AM, you shall die in your sins." (John 8:24 - the word "he" is not in the original, BTW.) This is not just speculation. This means that unless God redeems us Himself, we cannot be redeemed (see also Psa 49:7, 15). We have already talked about the fact that we know the Son is God because He is declared to be God in John 1:1 and in John 20:28 Thomas calls Jesus "My Lord and my God" The literal Greek rendering is "...the Lord of me, and the God of me." You've never given a satisfactory answer for those two critical passages.

And in Hebrews 1 we see some more declarations by the Father Himself. There God the Father calls the Christ His Son and He tells angels to worship the Christ, an honor belonging to YHWH alone (Isa. 42:8). The Father also calls the Son, God.

Or when Jesus said that His God was the same God that I have. Or His Father is the same Father as I have.

John 20:17 Jesus said to her, "Do not cling to Me, for I have not yet ascended to My Father; but go to My brethren and say to them, 'I am ascending to My Father and your Father, and to My God and your God.'" (NKJ)
Click to expand...

Bye for now.

FG
 
you said
FG - This is not saying what you think, SB. There is but one God. He is the Creator of all things. He is the One from whom all things come, and for whom all things exist. Now there is but one God, but He exists in three persons

I said
Now you have shot the whole theory of trinity. Trinity means three and you have added a fourth. God is a being and now you say He exsists in the other three beings. The Father(one) the Son(two) and the Holy Spirit(three). If you add these three with the one God it comes up four. Not going to work.

You said
Or I show them what Jesus said. That there is only one true God the Father.

FG - There's also only one true God the Son

I said
That is perversion. It does say there is one true God. But there is no where in the Word of God that it says one true God the Son.

Rev 22:18-19
18 For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book;
19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
(NKJ)
 
you said
??? Three persons.

One God.

I said
That still adds up to four. Unless your saying that God is not a living being. Now that compels the question who or what do you think God is?
 
Squeakybro said:
you said
??? Three persons.

One God.

I said
That still adds up to four. Unless your saying that God is not a living being. Now that compels the question who or what do you think God is?
Click to expand...
Four what?

FG
 
let's stop the games - please

SB,

You seem to be saying that you know it's impossible for a being to have multiple persons. I would say I've never actually seen a being with multiple persons, but I would have to say that at least one such being exists, because that is the picture the Bible gives us of God.

In general, what we know about the world around us is the key to how we perceive us everything else in the world. Yet God is not "of this world," and we must keep that in mind.

For example, no one is completely loving - all the time. But we should not assume that God does not operate on that basis all the time just because it is not our experience in the world. So regardless of what you feel that you know about this world, that does not mean that a God outside this world cannot be different from what we know from this world. In fact, should we not expect this to be true about God, if God really exists?

I continue to say that God is three persons, yet one being. You continue to insist that it is impossible for a being to have three persons... How do you know this? And one point you have refused to accept: classic Christianity does indeed teach that there is one God, yet three persons. You may not agree with this view of God. But please don't try to make Christianity teach something other than what it has taught for centuries.

If there are multiple G/god's then what we are talking about completely changes in terms of ontology. If there are multiple gods, no single being is the first necessary being. That then makes all creation necessary and reduces "gods" to little more than superheroes.

On the other hand, in trying to define the God, we need to look at the way God has revealed himself in scripture as Father, Son and Holy Spirit as to His person and also to His revealed attributes or characteristics - His omniscience, omnipresence, omnipotence, love, immutability, etc. - in attempting to describe His being. Ultimately, we need to return to who and what God has revealed of himself in Scripture.

And we can add that yes, each person of the trinity is omniscient/omnipresent/omnipotent/immutable/etc. because each person fully assumes the one divine substance.

SB, I think you need to ask yourself, "What do trinitarian-Christians mean by the trinity?" You're spending all this time developing arguments for why it's wrong - yet without having a clear understanding, it appears, of what exactly we do believe. That's called "erecting a straw-man," and it's not really fair or profitable for anyone.

Our discussion has been something like this:

Free Grace: "God is three persons and one person, one substance"

SqueakyBro: "So you're saying that there are three Gods."

FG: "No, there is one God... three persons in the Godhead. Jesus Christ is one person in the Godhead."

SB: "OK, well, the trinity plus Jesus - uh, that's 4 persons, right?"

FG: "No, 1 God. 3 persons."

SB: So you're saying that 3 persons = 3 beings = 3 Gods."

FG: "No, that's not what I said, nor is it what Christianity teaches."
Click to expand...

SB, Jesus the Son is self-aware of His self as the Son. That is what is required for a distinct person. You are self-aware of yourself as SqueakyBro. I am self-aware of myself as FreeGrace. The Father is self-aware of His self as Father.

This may seem difficult to fully comprehend, but it is what the Bible teaches. We have shown that the Bible clearly teaches that Jesus Christ, the Son, is fully God. This may bother you. I'm not telling you to just ignore the uncomfortable feeling that apparently you feel, or to ignore the problem passages you see in such a position. But I am saying that since God's Word clearly teaches that Jesus Christ is God, one thing you cannot do is say that He is not God based on your rationale alone. If certain passages in scripture clearly present an image of Christ as fully God - and they do - then you need to deal with those passages.

Now, let's get back and address some of the arguments and passages I shared earlier. You should not just ignore them, which IMO is what you have done. You have developed this nice little philosophy which makes sense to you - complete with a set of scripture that seems to support your hypothesis. But you have not dealt with the answers to the passages you shared. And you have not, in general, dealt with the passages and arguments I shared.

So like I said before... when you are ready to do so - please let me know. Then let's go point-by-point, passage-by-passage. No shotguns, please. When you do so I am convinced that if you have an open mind to the Spirit's guidance that you will realize that Jesus Christ is indeed God.

Thx,

FG
 
you said

I continue to say that God is three persons, yet one being. You continue to insist that it is impossible for a being to have three persons... How do you know this? And one point you have refused to accept: classic Christianity does indeed teach that there is one God, yet three persons. You may not agree with this view of God. But please don't try to make Christianity teach something other than what it has taught for centuries.

I said
Well now your claiming the oneness theory. You were claiming the three theory. You really have me confused with your explanations. I think where your getting mixed up is in the persons theory. Only persons are on earth, there are not persons in heaven. Then are spiritual beings they dont have flesh and blood. We on earth have an inner man and an outer person.Those in heaven dont have a person.
You could just simplify it and believe the Word.

1 Cor 8:6
6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for Him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and through whom we live.
(NKJ)

Eph 4:6
6 one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.
(NKJ)
 
Benny Hinn might have the gift of healing but I have heard him speak and I am not to impressed. One can have the gift of healing and not have the gift of knowledge or wisdom or discernment. The gift of healing by the laying on of hands is one of the 9 milk gifts.
 
Squeakybro said:
I said
Well now your claiming the oneness theory. You were claiming the three theory. You really have me confused with your explanations.
Click to expand...

FG - C'mon, SqueakyBro. You know that I've said exactly the same thing continually. Please do not claim that I've said something differently if you cannot quote me. When have I said anything different than "one God, three persons"?

Squeakybro said:
I think where your getting mixed up is in the persons theory. Only persons are on earth, there are not persons in heaven. Then are spiritual beings they dont have flesh and blood. We on earth have an inner man and an outer person.Those in heaven dont have a person. You could just simplify it and believe the Word.
Click to expand...

FG - I am not mixed up. I have said exactly the same thing each time. But you are confused about what person is, SB. "Persons" does not refer to human beings only. Sure, it can be used that way - to distinguish from an animal. But God is not an animal. He is a being - a person. Angels certainly appear with a body, don'tthey? God has appeared in the past with a body in theOT. Jesus Christ appeared in the flesh - became flesh - a human being. Jesus Christ is both God and man. Andremember... man was created in the image of God. How can that be ifGodcannot bedescribed as a "person?" This is classic Christianity. I am not saying something that any traditional Christian organization would dispute. If you think so - please list one. So ifyou want to knowwhat Christianity teaches about the trinity - remember that it does not mean "a human being" when it uses the term "person."

Here's what yourdictionary.com says:
A living human. An individual of specified character. The composite of characteristics that make up an individual personality; the self.
Christianity: Any of the three separate individualities of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, as distinguished from the essence of the Godhead that unites them.

Roget's Thesaurus says - an individual, personage, being, among other ideas.

Encarta says -> In Christianity - Father, Son, or Holy Spirit: in Christianity - the Father, the Son, or the Holy Spirit, together being the Trinity.

dictionary.com says -> Christianity. Any of the three separate individualities of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, as distinguished from the essence of the Godhead that unites them.

And here are the other terms I've used in trying to express what classical Christianity teaches on this:

subsistence - the condition of continuing to exist.
Something that has real or substantial existence

essence - identifying nature: the quality or nature of something that identifies it or makes it what it is.
The intrinsic or indispensable properties that serve to characterize or identify something.
The inherent, unchanging nature of a thing or class of things.
Something that exists, especially a spiritual or incorporeal entity.

SB, we could visit Chrtian websites all over the Inet and get thesame definitions for trinity as I've been using...

One God

Three persons.

I think the problem is that you are defining a "person" as "someone on earth." At least thishelps meto understand where you'recoming from now. We often use it here "on earth" in that manner. Many dictionaries defined "person" as a human being. But that is not how Christianity has used it when trying to define the trinity.

The following two verses I dealt with before - more than once. But again you've just ignored my comments and simply re-posted the verses withoutany explanation orrebuttal. So i'l lsimply cut-n-paste my last response back in...

Squeakybro said:
1 Cor 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for Him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and through whom we live. (NKJ)

FG - This is not saying what you think, SB. There is but one God. He is the Creator of all things. He is the One from whom all things come, and for whom all things exist. Now there is but one God, but He exists in three persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Here, Paul speaks only of the Father and Son as the one true God (the "One True God applies to both the Father and the Son here). A distinction is being made between the Father and Son, but Paul also considers them as One. The Father is the One from whom all things have come; the Son is the One through whom all things are, and through whom we exist. Earlier in the chapter Paul spoke of there being many so-called gods and so-called lords. Clearly God and Lord are both referring to deity here - since a distinction is being made with "gods" and "lords."

The is one God the Father - of whom are all things and we for Him
There is one Lord Jesus Christ - through whom are all things and through whom we exist.


Eph 4:6 one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all. (NKJ)

FG - In context: There is one body and one Spirit, just as also you were called in one hope of your calling; one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all who is over all and through all and in all.

I don't see the issue here... we all have one God and Father, the Father of the Lord Jesus Christ.
Click to expand...
SB,

You're just arguing. You are not addressing my points. You are not accepting my definitions for thetrinity or traditional Christianity's definitions for the trinity. You're trying to re-define what we teach/believe.

I have given extensive coverage of John 1 - in parriuclar, John 1:1. You have not yet responded to what I posted on this. I have asked you to claims I have made that we have shown that the Bible clearly teaches that Jesus Christ, the Son, is fully God.. .andyouhave note addressed those specific claims.

Now, let's get back and address some of the arguments and passages I shared earlier. You should not just ignore them, which IMO is what you have done. You have developed this nice little philosophy which makes sense to you - complete with a set of scripture that seems to support your hypothesis. But you have not dealt with the answers to the passages you shared. And you have not, in general, dealt with the passages and arguments I shared.
Click to expand...

This is getting to be a joke and a waste of my time. Please - PM me whe nyou are ready to really address the answers I gave to your verses andwhen you are ready to address John 1. Otherwise - you are just sticking youtr head in the sand.

FG
 
you said
. He is the One from whom all things come, and for whom all things exist. Now there is but one God, but He exists in three persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit

I said
Ok here you said it again. One God, but He. You are saying(atleast that is what i am getting) that He(one) exsists in the Father(two) the Son(three) and the Holy Spirit(four). I'm sorry but that is what your saying. If the Father nor the Son nor the Holy Spirit is He then we have four beings of the trinity. Now before i have seen them say that neither the Father nor Jesus nor the Holy Spirit is God, but their all a part of God. That it takes all three to be God. I have seen them say That there is one God that has three personalities. I have seen them say that there is God the Father and God the Son and God the HOly Spirit and that is three Gods. And I keep seeing you say there are four. I'm not trying to be difficult, I just see something you dont. The Word of God says there is only one God the Father.

1 Cor 8:6
6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for Him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and through whom we live.
(NKJ)

Eph 4:6
6 one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.
(NKJ)

And if Jesus were God then He would have fraised this differently. He would have said I am ascending to My God, and you will ascend to Me.

John 20:17
17 Jesus said to her, "Do not cling to Me, for I have not yet ascended to My Father; but go to My brethren and say to them, 'I am ascending to My Father and your Father, and to My God and your God.'"
(NKJ)
 
Listen SB, you're just not getting it. You don't understand the Trinity. The Athanasian Creed demonstrates that the "three persons, one God" doctrine of the Trinity has been maintained by Christendom for several centuries. Here's one of many, many links:

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/02033b.htm

Don't pollute the doctrine of the Trinity with your attempts to "comprehend" it (ie, "now there are four persons").

Concerning Jesus' identity as God the Son, the Gospel of John is the best attestation of Jesus' divinity, but you are attempting to separate Jesus from "The Word" as spoken about in John's prologue. Perhaps you are confusing John's "LOGOS (Word)" with the spoken word (anything we say every day). The two are very different. But I believe you have polluted this as well, calling "The Word" the "begotten Word." That phrase is definitely not in the Bible.

Here's my suggestion to you. Cross-reference parts of John's prologue with the rest of the New Testament and see what you come up with. You'll see that the "Word" whom John is speaking about is Jesus. I'll start you off. The colour blue will be about "The Word" in John's prologue, while the colour red will be anything pertaining to Jesus in the Bible.

John 1:3 - "All things were made through him, and without him nothing was made."

Colossians 1:16 - "For by him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were CREATED THROUGH HIM AND FOR him."

John 1:4 - "In him was life, and the life was the light of men."

John 8:12 - The Jesus spoke to them again, saying, "I am the light of the world. He who follows me shall not walk in darkness, but have the LIGHT OF LIFE."

John 1:8 - ...He was not that light, but was sent to bear witness of that light...

Luke 3: 15ff - Now as the people were in expectation, and all reasoned in their hearts about John, whether he was the Christ or not. John answered, saying to all, "I indeed baptize you with water; but One mightier than I is coming, whose sandal strap I am not worthy to loose."

John 1:10 - He was in the world, and the world was made through him, and the world did not know him.

John 8:19 - ...Jesus answered, "You know neither me nor my Father. If you had known me, you would have known my Father also.

Everything is in NKJV for your sake.

I've started you off, but now I have to get to work, so feel free to continue. There is no separating Jesus from the Word of God as mentioned in John. And, since Jesus IS the Word, then, as John 1:1 puts it: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."
 
you said

Listen SB, you're just not getting it. You don't understand the Trinity. The Athanasian Creed demonstrates that the "three persons, one God" doctrine of the Trinity has been maintained by Christendom for several centuries. Here's one of many, many links:

I said
I dont think you get it. The Word of God doesnt have the athanasian creed in it. And it doesnt have the necine creed in it either. What the Word of God has is the apostles creed. The apostles creed is there is one God the Father.

1 Cor 8:5-6
5 For even if there are so-called gods, whether in heaven or on earth (as there are many gods and many lords),
6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for Him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and through whom we live.
(NKJ)
 
Squeakybro said:
I said
I dont think you get it. The Word of God doesnt have the athanasian creed in it. And it doesnt have the necine creed in it either. What the Word of God has is the apostles creed. The apostles creed is there is one God the Father.
Click to expand...

No, I don't think you get it. I used the Athanasian Creed as an historic example of Christendom's belief in one God, three persons. It is also the best and simplest answer to counter your "now there are four gods" ideas.

If you want Biblical examples of the Trinity, start another thread and be prepared to have a lot of people get frustrated with you. If you want Biblical examples claiming that Jesus is God, go back to the beginning of this thread and read other peoples' posts (not yours). There is plenty of Biblical evidence for the deity of Christ and the Trinity, but I'd rather not get into it because I know it will fall upon deaf ears.

You haven't addressed anyone's scriptural challenges to your Arianist claims and your Montanist attitude. You haven't even addressed my suggestion that you compare the description of The Word in John's prologue to descriptions of Christ in the New Testament, but I expected that much from you.

Pardon me for being blunt, but you have blatently denied the full deity of Jesus and consistently belittled those who would correct and admonish you for your ignorance. At this point I have come to believe that you deserve nothing less than simple, point-blank retorts.
 
you said
Pardon me for being blunt, but you have blatently denied the full deity of Jesus and consistently belittled those who would correct and admonish you for your ignorance

I said
I like bluntness, its a good way to get past all the wishy washy guile. But as with the trinity not being in the Word of God so deity isnt in the Word of God. Neither is divinity. But if you want to know what deity or divinity means i can help

deity 1 a: often cap : divine nature or rank: the essintial nature of a god or of a supreme being: DIVINITY

di-vin-i-ty 1:the quality or state of being divine: nature or essence of God: GODHEAD (the divinity of Jesus) a celestial being inferior to the supreme God but superior to man<one of the subservient divinities>
 
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