The Bible is a compost heap.....

[Carolyn]

Grazer, I do like your post because it reminds me of the new wine in old wineskins and the kernel of wheat that must fall to the ground and die to produce new life. NOw I don't know how that directly applies, either, but it got me thinking, too. ANd to be sure the cookbook is more like the
Old Testament law or even legalism in the church. DYing to self and allowing God to grow us and change us works best. HE does use Scripture
To guide us and change us so that we grow as He wants us to change, but it frees us and does not stunt us. HE prunes us to produce larger fruit, removing the center of self so that the sun can reach all the branches.

 

[wayseer]

As I said, you simply do not know the Bible as well as you should, or you would know who's litmus test.

You're getting sassy. I'm not bothering with the rest of your post.

Have you possibly thought that it may be you how does not the Bible as well as you should.

You obviously avoided replying to my question so I can only assume that you take a literalist view. If such is the case then you will fail to understand the 'switch' that is contained in Jesus' stories.

 

[JCitoL]

the Bible is a book about the spiritual things viz. about the things in the faith, which means that it is designed specially for the believers and the people that would like to believe, so that if there are some unrighteous believers, such as: yogis, occultists, esotericists, etc., the Bible to be profitable also for their repentance in the faith, so the Scripture really is not a cookbook, nor a sexology book or kama sutra, neither whatever entertaining book

1 Corinthians 2:12-13 "Now we have received, not the spirit of the world(i.e. the spirit of the human(666) religion), but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom(i.e. not in the testimony which the spiritual servants/workers of human spirituality/religion) teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual."

Blessings

 

[Carolyn]

Few gardeners or farmers are out there in cyberland. Compost is what creates good soil that is the most productive. WE are to be planted in good soil if we are to produce 100 fold, or be produtive at all for that matter. Compost is a good thing and a great blessing. You all are making way too much of this and taking it completely wrong..

 

[felix]

Few gardeners or farmers are out there in cyberland. Compost is what creates good soil that is the most productive. WE are to be planted in good soil if we are to produce 100 fold, or be produtive at all for that matter. Compost is a good thing and a great blessing. You all are making way too much of this and taking it completely wrong..

So does a human waste is a good manure. Can we compare with it?

 

[Paul1965]

As Caroline said,some are making toomuch of this. I said in an earlier post and I'll say it again, an analogy is used to make something easier tounderstand or to get a point across (sadly lost on a couple on this thread) it is NOT meant to be taken literally.

 

[Asyncritus]

While I take the point that a compost heap is a source of growth materials in the agricultural sense, it is nonetheless a pity that such an analogy should be used.

We toss unwanted, decaying food, leaves, cow manure, horse dung and other unsavoury materials on to the heap to rot, and therein lies the ugliness of the analogy.

And that is the point - the inherent ugliness of the metaphor.

With a bit of ingenuity, anything can be turned into an analogy - but this one is only one step away from saying that the Bible is like a sewage farm, which is an even uglier metaphor, and really smacks of considerable disrespect verging on total contempt.

If you said such a thing about the koran, they would be declaring jihad against you. Fortunately, the Bible is big enough and mature enough to be able to shrug off such unpleasantness, and the readers of the forum are sufficiently sensible not to be crying for your blood (metaphorically speaking, of course).

I personally have studied it for an very long time, and would never dream of likening it to a compost heap. It is far too wonderful a thing for me to even begin to consider expressing such an opinion.

Yes, the opinion is clever - and that is its only virtue - but is demeaning to something really wonderful and far beyond human ability to construct or generate.

I suppose we could say that a star is just a lump of hydrogen and helium - and that would be true in the main: but go out there and look at them, and feel a little foolish when you recall the words of the Psalmist:

8. 3 ¶ When I consider thy heavens, the work of thy fingers, the moon and the stars, which thou hast ordained;
4 What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visitest him?

19.1 The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.

And Daniel:

3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.

It's similar here:

Proverbs 30:5 Every word of God is pure:[like a compost heap???] he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him.

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. [like a compost heap???]

1 Peter 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, [like a compost heap???]which liveth and abideth for ever.

Psalms 119:9 BETH. Wherewithal shall a young man cleanse his way? by taking heed thereto according to thy word.[to that compost heap???]

And the most respect-engendering one of all:

Psalms 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

A bit of respect, chaps, wouldn't go amiss here.

 

[Grazer]

A bit of respect wouldn't go a miss, for those who look at things differently to the standard. I'm aware of the negative connotations of the metaphor but some can look beyond them.

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[Asyncritus]

If as you say, and I agree, there are negative connotations - no I'd go further and say disrespectful and near contemptuous connotations - then why use it?

Couldn't you think of something less so, and more God-honouring?

 

[Grazer]

If as you say, and I agree, there are negative connotations - no I'd go further and say disrespectful and near contemptuous connotations - then why use it?

Couldn't you think of something less so, and more God-honouring?

Because I like finding God in the obscure and the non-obvious. Because I get bored of the usual. Because thinking along tangents can reveal some amazing things. Because not everything is black and white. Because negative connotations are outweighed by positives. Because anything can be used to honor God with a bit of effort.

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[Paul1965]

Because negative connotations are outweighed by positives. Because anything can be used to honor God with a bit of effort.

We see God in everything around us, even the bad things in life. The trials in our own lives which are the compost heap of our very being, but when we come to Him after enduring these trials we praise Him.

I have a question...Jesus used parables (analogies) for many of his teachings. Okay, he may not have compared His word to a compost heap, but those of you who have questioned or critcized Grazers faith, would you have been so bold had you been in our Saviours company had He done so?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

So does a human waste is a good manure. Can we compare with it?

I guess some would say we can.

"The Bible is like a pile of your ####"

How ridiculous.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

While I take the point that a compost heap is a source of growth materials in the agricultural sense, it is nonetheless a pity that such an analogy should be used.

We toss unwanted, decaying food, leaves, cow manure, horse dung and other unsavoury materials on to the heap to rot, and therein lies the ugliness of the analogy.

And that is the point - the inherent ugliness of the metaphor.

With a bit of ingenuity, anything can be turned into an analogy - but this one is only one step away from saying that the Bible is like a sewage farm, which is an even uglier metaphor, and really smacks of considerable disrespect verging on total contempt.

If you said such a thing about the koran, they would be declaring jihad against you. Fortunately, the Bible is big enough and mature enough to be able to shrug off such unpleasantness, and the readers of the forum are sufficiently sensible not to be crying for your blood (metaphorically speaking, of course).

I personally have studied it for an very long time, and would never dream of likening it to a compost heap. It is far too wonderful a thing for me to even begin to consider expressing such an opinion.

Yes, the opinion is clever - and that is its only virtue - but is demeaning to something really wonderful and far beyond human ability to construct or generate.

I suppose we could say that a star is just a lump of hydrogen and helium - and that would be true in the main: but go out there and look at them, and feel a little foolish when you recall the words of the Psalmist:

8. 3 ¶ When I consider thy heavens, the work of thy fingers, the moon and the stars, which thou hast ordained;
4 What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visitest him?

19.1 The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.

And Daniel:

3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.

It's similar here:

Proverbs 30:5 Every word of God is pure:[like a compost heap???] he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him.

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. [like a compost heap???]

1 Peter 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, [like a compost heap???]which liveth and abideth for ever.

Psalms 119:9 BETH. Wherewithal shall a young man cleanse his way? by taking heed thereto according to thy word.[to that compost heap???]

And the most respect-engendering one of all:

Psalms 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

A bit of respect, chaps, wouldn't go amiss here.

Bingo. Says it all.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Few gardeners or farmers are out there in cyberland. Compost is what creates good soil that is the most productive. WE are to be planted in good soil if we are to produce 100 fold, or be produtive at all for that matter.

No, WE are the soil, and the Word of God is to be planted in good soil. The Word is the thing that grows and to which we bring increase, not the soil, nor the fertilizer of our failures and trials and tribulations that help it grow.

Compost is a good thing and a great blessing. You all are making way too much of this and taking it completely wrong..

God has the unique ability to take something that is unclean and make it good for us. That hardly describes the Word which is clean and NEVER unclean. God can take the unclean things of this world and the refuge of our sinful lives and use them as the fertilizer for the growth within us of that which is pure--his Word.

You all are putting an inaccurate spin on the role of the Word in the believers life. It is that which grows, not the refuge that can fertilize that growth.

 

[reba]

Personally I don't like the title of this thread.... I believe it is ugly and a slam on the Word of God.. At the same time I do see how the Word helps us grow, develop , hopefully mature.... I don't like the way it reads or sounds...the Holy Word of God is not kitchen garbage....

 

[Grazer]

We grow when we are in the word,.the word doesn't need to grow. It's partly why we have the bible. It nurtures us not the other way round.

As for the title of the thread, well I've always been up front and I knew the title would get people's attention.

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[Asyncritus]

We grow when we are in the word,.the word doesn't need to grow. It's partly why we have the bible. It nurtures us not the other way round.

As for the title of the thread, well I've always been up front and I knew the title would get people's attention.

I'm not quite sure what you're talking about, Grazer.

In my opinion, the title of the thread is more than a little ugly, contemptuous and unworthy of being allowed on this Christian forum.

As I said, I take the point being made - but the way it is expressed is objectionable, and the title should at least be moderated somewhat.

As we all know, the very same thing can be said in any number of ways, some objectionable, others quite acceptable. But our speech (and in this case writing) should (Colossians 4:6) "[...] be alway with grace, seasoned with salt...." This title is, I think, ungracious, and leavened rather than seasoned.

Likewise, I noticed a thread where Jesus is described as 'irrational'. That's not too far from 'loopy' or maybe 'crazy' and is totally disrespectful, and probably in breach of the ToS. I certainly take exception to the description, and maybe the mods should give it some thought.

 

[Mike]

It's got me thinking about the bible which is never a bad thing.

It certainly can be a bad thing when someone is increasingly fixated and closed minded toward it being the very Word of God. Questioning our beliefs is productive when it leads to growth. When the person continues to spiral down into disbelief (in his Word), it is destructive. It is a bad thing in this case.

Since God gave me this type of mind, its safe to assume he wants me to use it

And this is the flawed crutch that many people lean on to validate many unGodly lifestyles and practices. Scripture is the Authoritative Word of God, and His Authority will not be undermined. Contributing to the "emerging church" fallacy that we are free to discard and dismiss parts of the Bible is an act of rebellion, IMHO.

I'm aware of the negative connotations of the metaphor but some can look beyond them.

Getting people to wake up from their doldrums with bold statements can be a good thing, but not when it sacrifices the integrity of His Word. Jesus said many bold things that easily cause emotions to flair. You don't have to stray from scripture to find controversial statements. I read the wording of this analogy as a way to put yourself and your desire to be controversial ahead of God's Word. This is exactly what the emergent church does! It melds with society, makes it funner for them, and sacrifices the Truth, because it feels it can relate to drifters more effectively. His Word is His Word. It will attract and repel depending on the heart of the reader. Having fun, wildly popular attention-getters that overshadow the Word He has given us will earn accolades here on earth, but it is not storing up riches in Heaven. I defy you to find one instance in the New Testament where Old Testament scripture was referred to without reverence.

 

[Grazer]

Mike - not sure how I'm undermining the authority of scripture by using an analogy, or by looking at scripture from a different angle other than face on. In previous posts, I've shown where Paul doesn't take passages head on but changes the context. Throughout this forum there are threads showing the different angles people come to scripture at and you get some really good thoughts. I know I have no way of convincing you but this is where God has taken my thinking. He is with me all through this.

Asyn - since more than one mod has commented on this thread and not changed the title, that says it all for me.

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[Jethro Bodine]

And this is the flawed crutch that many people lean on to validate many unGodly lifestyles and practices. Scripture is the Authoritative Word of God, and His Authority will not be undermined. Contributing to the "emerging church" fallacy that we are free to discard and dismiss parts of the Bible is an act of rebellion, IMHO.

Which is exactly why the analogy of the compost heap is bad. It's worse than what happens when the Bible is used like a cookbook (the recipe gets changed according to one's skill to use it, or according to one's tastes). Compost is something that you derive particular nutrients for growth then you cast it away. I doubt any serious Christian would say that's what we do with the Word--derive something good out of it and then throw it away as useless and unclean, like compost.

Good post by the way, Mike.

Grazer, there's nothing wrong with being able to learn from various things in life. It's just that in this case likening the Word to an unclean thing like compost is profane, and it turns out compost isn't really a very good analogy of the Word at all. Compost is discarded after you derive the benefits of it, unlike the Word of God which God says we are to retain and bring increase to. Like I said, it is the failures of our old selves, and the trials and tribulations and persecutions of this life that we draw the good out of (to nurture the increase of the seed of God in our lives) and then cast away.