The fall of Lucifer/Satan

[eddif]

Each and everyone one of us has to search for truth on our own and that can only come by that which has already been written in the full context of knowledge as we compare scripture with scripture, OT with NT. I do not believe we will ever come to all truths, but only know in part as to what God wants us to learn as only the Holy Spirit can open our eyes, ears and heart to receive that which we need to know.

LOL I made a similar post recently (about through a glass darkly).
But
Isiah 9:2 kjv
2. The people that walked in darkness have seen a great light: they that dwell in the land of the shadow of death, upon them hath the light shined.

There are folks on deep darkness and those in darkness.

I am not expecting to arrive at complete change till the last frump and entrance to eternity.

I do think knowledge can increase. My post acknowledged request for help.

eddif

 

[for_his_glory]

LOL I made a similar post recently (about through a glass darkly).
But
Isiah 9:2 kjv
2. The people that walked in darkness have seen a great light: they that dwell in the land of the shadow of death, upon them hath the light shined.

There are folks on deep darkness and those in darkness.

I am not expecting to arrive at complete change till the last frump and entrance to eternity.

I do think knowledge can increase. My post acknowledged request for help.

eddif

Isaiah 9:1-7 is prophecy of the Messiah's birth as once they walked in darkness, but now comes the light, which is Christ Jesus who came as a light unto the world to break the bonds of darkness that Satan had on them. Knowledge will always increase the more we study the written word as the light of Christ still shines through the Holy Spirit He has sent down to teach us all God wants us to learn. Knowledge never ends, but man stifles the knowledge that God gives.


Daniel 12:4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

 

[eddif]

Isaiah 9:1-7 is prophecy of the Messiah's birth as once they walked in darkness, but now comes the light, which is Christ Jesus who came as a light unto the world to break the bonds of darkness that Satan had on them. Knowledge will always increase the more we study the written word as the light of Christ still shines through the Holy Spirit He has sent down to teach us all God wants us to learn. Knowledge never ends, but man stifles the knowledge that God gives.


Daniel 12:4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

I agree .

The Jewish people walked in darkness ( had the oracles of God as shadows). There were some shadows of the messiah / Jesus) in the law.

The Gentiles walked in deep darkness with no shadow teaching about God. ( Without God in the world).

One group saw a great light, and the other group had light shine on them.

Both groups received the Holy Spirit in them.

The two groups became one new man when the middle wall of partition was broken down (by Jesus). IMHO very few people care to discuss the one new man, and what each group gave up. It would be better for me to drop the subject, but what little I do understand is not intended to cause division ( unless my heart is deceiving me). I know that I have a bi-polar tendency. Paul talks about the flesh (sin) and mind (law of God).

The light / word became the man Jesus.
Jesus (second Adam) became a quickening spirit. ( eyes of your understanding)

I will put my law in their hearts and minds.

Parallels I do see, and parallels I have not yet seen.

I suppose it is sometimes narrow minded vs teaching them all things I have commanded you. It is not stuff it down throats, and my continued talk in some areas make some think redneck just leave the status quo alone.

eddif

 

[eddif]

Lucifer fell from having (allowed?) control of the Gentiles.

Lucifer was taking some of the Jews into idol worship.

Lucifer fell from heaven.
Lucifer fell from high control.

Which will we allow ?

The roaring lion (with less power) is still somewhat active. Seeking whom he may devour.

I do suppose folks do google searches when I do not post chapter and verse?

eddif

 

[eddif]

Daniel 12:4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

This whole of Daniel is hard to understand without:

1 Peter 3:18 kjv
18. For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
19. by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison,
20.Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

In Daniel chapter 12 the understanding of how the Jewish people are saved is hidden. The conversation about the river and the two sides of the river.

Daniel 12:2 kjv
2. And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

At the resurrection those in the grave shall awake.

Now how does Daniel go his way (to death) with comfort? Because in the grave Jesus will com to those in Abraham's bosom and preach the gospel. There is one name under which all men are saved (Jesus). There is but one way that the Old Testament saints are saved ( they hear the gospel). There is but one man that can make the trip Into the grave and preach (Jesus- 1Peter 3:19).
Just took me 45 years to get a grip on a little part of this. And I am sure I heard a sermon about some of this years ago and it did not register fully then.

The parable of the rich man and Lazarus shows the aware condition of people in the grave. Aware enough to listen to the gospel and decide to trust Jesus, and when resurrected go to eternal life; or reject the gospel, remain in their sins and awake to eternal damnation.

The man in linen on one side of the river could be on the river (Jesus walked on water) Jesus could go from one place to another.

The day of great trouble was the day all the sins of the world were placed on Jesus at the time of his beating and crucifixion.

I suppose a book might help. And there may be one. The Bible says all this, but the information is sealed in several Bible passages.

Way above Mississippi redneck full understanding ( through a glass darkly)

eddif

 

[for_his_glory]

This whole of Daniel is hard to understand without:

1 Peter 3:18 kjv
18. For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
19. by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison,
20.Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

In Daniel chapter 12 the understanding of how the Jewish people are saved is hidden. The conversation about the river and the two sides of the river.

Daniel 12:2 kjv
2. And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

At the resurrection those in the grave shall awake.

Now how does Daniel go his way (to death) with comfort? Because in the grave Jesus will com to those in Abraham's bosom and preach the gospel. There is one name under which all men are saved (Jesus). There is but one way that the Old Testament saints are saved ( they hear the gospel). There is but one man that can make the trip Into the grave and preach (Jesus- 1Peter 3:19).
Just took me 45 years to get a grip on a little part of this. And I am sure I heard a sermon about some of this years ago and it did not register fully then.

The parable of the rich man and Lazarus shows the aware condition of people in the grave. Aware enough to listen to the gospel and decide to trust Jesus, and when resurrected go to eternal life; or reject the gospel, remain in their sins and awake to eternal damnation.

The man in linen on one side of the river could be on the river (Jesus walked on water) Jesus could go from one place to another.

The day of great trouble was the day all the sins of the world were placed on Jesus at the time of his beating and crucifixion.

I suppose a book might help. And there may be one. The Bible says all this, but the information is sealed in several Bible passages.

Way above Mississippi redneck full understanding ( through a glass darkly)

eddif

eddif I can't agree with some of this as I want to point out where everyone says Jesus went and preached to the spirits in prison. Those who are in their graves have no more conscience and the only thing that goes back to God when one dies is the very breath/spirit that God gave them making them a living soul, Genesis 2:7; Ecc 12:7. But this is another topic.

2 Peter 2:4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;

Jude 1:6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

A little background first to show these angels that are in chains of darkness are separate from the third that followed after Satan as they too rebelled against God leaving their first estate that was their proper place in heaven. These chained angels can not be the same angels as the principalities and power of darkness still in high places under the direction of Satan, Ephesians 6:12.

1 Peter 3:18-19 Jesus never went down to hell (lower parts of the earth) to preach as scripture says He went to preach to the spirits in prison. When Jesus laid in the tomb for three days his body was dead, but His spirit was very much alive. In 1 Peter 3:19 it says Jesus being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit went and preached to the spirits in prison. The spirits in prison that Jesus went to preach to are those angels that are reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. Scripture does not say what Jesus preached to them, but some speculate that He was proclaiming to these fallen angels that Satan had no victory over His death. These angels are separate from the third Satan gathered with him as these angels bound in chains kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day, Jude 1:5-7. These angels were disobedient when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah while the ark was being built, 1 Peter 3:18-19. Big difference between these chained angels and the other ones we read about in Ephesians 6:12. Notice where it says they are reserved in chains meaning they are bound by God and can no longer cause man to sin.

These other angels being a third that oppose God under the leadership of Satan as being his messengers here on earth as they too are created spirits of God that is why God could never destroy any of them because a spirit can not die. (Matthew 25:41; 2 Peter 2:4; Jude 1: 6; Ephesians 6:12). We often call these types of angels demons/devils/evil spirits/unclean spirits for which an everlasting fire is prepared by God for Satan and these angels, Matthew 25:41.

The term demon comes from the Greek "daimon". Demons (fallen angels) are also called evil spirits, unclean spirits and devils in scripture as they are disembodied spirits as angels have no form. The use of the terminology of demons, evil spirits, unclean spirits and devils are interchangeable in scripture as they all mean the same thing. They exist in a demonic realm as principalities, Romans 8:38, 39; Ephesians 6:12, and have a hierarchy of rulership controlled by Satan as being his messengers, Matthew 12:22-30; Mark 3:22; Luke 4:35. They have no physical form, but can viciously posses a body, Matthew 8:16-31; 12:43-45. Demons are numerous in numbering and can also speak like the Legion (2000) of unclean spirits in Mark 5:9.

Strong's Concordance: Demon
Part of speech: noun masculine
Transliteration: daimon
Definition: a demon
Usage: evil spirit, demon

 

[for_his_glory]

Lucifer fell from having (allowed?) control of the Gentiles.

Not sure what you mean here as Satan has much control over those who are not Christ own as Satan also works through others in order to seek and kill those who are God's own.

 

[eddif]

@eddif I can't agree with some of this as I want to point out where everyone says Jesus went and preached to the spirits in prison. Those who are in their graves have no more conscience and the only thing that goes back to God when one dies is the very breath/spirit that God gave them making them a living soul, Genesis 2:7; Ecc 12:7. But this is another topic.

I guess a comment about the post you are commenting on (is about dead people) not demons or fallen angels.

A question abour Lazarus and the rich man. Is it considered fiction. Lazarus is dead, the rich man is dead, Father Abraham is dead. There is a great gulf seperates them from the living (they are inpriosnrd in the grave till the resurrection). There are conversations between Abraham and
And the rich man. The rich man mentions family alive, Lazarus is being comforted.

Without this story/ revelation / parable, my comments do seem to fall apart.

Another area of God? talking to the dead?

Revelation 6;9 kjv
9. And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
10. And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
11. And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

Are the souls of dead saints aware to hear a message of God. Does he not offer of a garment (probably a garment of praise or a wedding garment). Rest ( like Jesus used death) and killed is used. They seem to be waiting in the grave for the resurrection.

I would use Matthew 22:11 but I could not support it very well.

Where did the redneck go wrong? Are my welding glasses too dark?

eddif

 

[eddif]

Not sure what you mean here as Satan has much control over those who are not Christ own as Satan also works through others in order to seek and kill those who are God's own.

Revelation 20:3
3. And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

I can’t discuss the thousand years. Too ignorant.

Evidently there was a time when whole nations were deceived. The great Commission evidently put some Christians in lands today.

eddif

 

[for_his_glory]

I guess a comment about the post you are commenting on (is about dead people) not demons or fallen angels.

No, I was talking about the fallen angels that are symbolically chained being the spirits in a symbolic prison that Jesus went to preach to showing them that Satan thought he did away with Him, but that He is risen.

These parables of Jesus began in Luke 10:25 when a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? From that point moving forward Jesus gave 15 parables, meaning illustrations, beginning in Luke chapter 10-16 that all pertain to what we are to do in order to receive eternal life.

Strong's Exhaustive Concordance: Hell
Hebrew # 7585 Sheol, Hades, or the world of the dead, grave, hell, pit
Greek # 86 place of departed souls, grave, hell

The English word hell, back in 1611, meant about the same as Hades, that being covered or unseen as in grave/pit. We do not see those in the grave as they are unseen to the eye as they are covered with dirt, or some placed in a tomb. The word hell is derived from the Saxon helan, to cover, and signifying merely the covered, or invisible place. The habitation of those who have gone from the visible terrestrial region to the world of spirits.

Abraham's bosom just refers to a place of comfort where the righteous dead wait in their grave until judgement day when at that time they will spend eternal life with the Father, John 5:28, 29. Jesus was raised from the dead, but still many were not persuaded to accept Him as Lord and Savior as they refused the teachings of the Apostles, even today unto the end of days.


The description of the clothing of the High Priest is found in Exodus 28 and 38:1-31. In the NT scribes were of the same sect of the Pharisees and would also be arrayed in purple and fine linen with miters on their heads. There were also a subordinate class of scribes, most of whom were Levites

The rich man in this parable is symbolic of the Mosaic experts (Lawyers) in which Jesus characterizes and condemns them and the Pharisees in Matthew 23:1-36 and Luke 11:37-54.

Luke 10:25 And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?

All these parables in Matthew, Mark and Luke are all about what we have to do to inherit etenal life. Lazarus in this parable represents those in whom we are to reach out to as in what Jesus said in Matthew 25:31-46 about the sheep and the goats as some will inherit eternal life while others will go away into ever lasting punishment and be remembered no more by God, John 5:28, 29.

Darkness (lake of fire) and light (the New Jerusalem) are separate from each other as no one in either place can see each other. All former things are passed away and we will not have any recognition of things of this present earth including family and friends that rejected Christ and will be in a place of outer darkness and nashing of teeth as they are cast into the lake of fire, Isaiah 65:17-25; Rev 21:1-8, Matthew 8:12; 22:13; Luke 20:34-38.

 

[2ndRateMind]

The parable of the rich man and Lazarus shows the aware condition of people in the grave. Aware enough to listen to the gospel and decide to trust Jesus, and when resurrected go to eternal life; or reject the gospel, remain in their sins and awake to eternal damnation.

Yes, I think so, too.

Best wishes, 2RM.

 

[for_his_glory]

The parable of the rich man and Lazarus shows the aware condition of people in the grave. Aware enough to listen to the gospel and decide to trust Jesus, and when resurrected go to eternal life; or reject the gospel, remain in their sins and awake to eternal damnation.

Sorry, but can't agree with this. I explained all this in post #126. Dead is dead and bodies rotting in the ground. Those who have died are literally dead in their graves. There is no more thought action or any conscience nor can anyone accept Jesus from the grave. If one does not accept Christ while still alive on this earth, then there is no second chance from the grave. See. these are lies from Satan who says. whoop it up while you are alive as you will have a second chance when you die.

God breathed life (spirit) into us, Genesis 2:7, that made us a living soul and what goes back to God when this physical body dies (returns to the dust of the ground) is that very spirit of life God gave us, Ecclesiastics 12:7. Only those of faith under the old covenant (OT) and those of faith under the new covenant through Christ Jesus (NT) will God take that spirit back and reserve it until Christ returns. At that time we are raised with a new glorified body, 1Corintians 15:51-58; 1Thessalonians 4:13-18, and then we are given back that spirit of life to have everlasting life with the Father.

According to John 3:13 no one has ever ascended into heaven other than Christ. Scripture says we sleep in the ground until the coming of the Lord. Those whose names are written in the Lambs Book of Life will be raised to15:51-58 everlasting life with God and those who names are not found will face Gods Great White Throne Judgment and will be cast into the lake of fire, John 5:28, 29; Revelations 20:11-15.


​

 

[eddif]

Sorry, but can't agree with this. I explained all this in post #126. Dead is dead and bodies rotting in the ground. Those who have died are literally dead in their graves. There is no more thought action or any conscience nor can anyone accept Jesus from the grave. If one does not accept Christ while still alive on this earth, then there is no second chance from the grave. See. these are lies from Satan who says. whoop it up while you are alive as you will have a second chance when you die.

God breathed life (spirit) into us, Genesis 2:7, that made us a living soul and what goes back to God when this physical body dies (returns to the dust of the ground) is that very spirit of life God gave us, Ecclesiastics 12:7. Only those of faith under the old covenant (OT) and those of faith under the new covenant through Christ Jesus (NT) will God take that spirit back and reserve it until Christ returns. At that time we are raised with a new glorified body, 1Corintians 15:51-58; 1Thessalonians 4:13-18, and then we are given back that spirit of life to have everlasting life with the Father.

According to John 3:13 no one has ever ascended into heaven other than Christ. Scripture says we sleep in the ground until the coming of the Lord. Those whose names are written in the Lambs Book of Life will be raised to15:51-58 everlasting life with God and those who names are not found will face Gods Great White Throne Judgment and will be cast into the lake of fire, John 5:28, 29; Revelations 20:11-15.


​

The chance for salvation in the grave was a one time opportunity. After the one time offer to accept the gospel in the grave there were no more offers. Jesus had died for our / their sins. From the one time offer till now you are absolutely right you have to accept Jesus on earth or perish eternally.
I am not promoting catholic dogma ( if that is the correct term.

If you wish me to leave the forums, I can do that.
All you have to do is say is please leave. No big production needed.

I respect your position / office .

eddif

 

[for_his_glory]

The chance for salvation in the grave was a one time opportunity. After the one time offer to accept the gospel in the grave there were no more offers. Jesus had died for our / their sins. From the one time offer till now you are absolutely right you have to accept Jesus on earth or perish eternally.
I am not promoting catholic dogma ( if that is the correct term.

If you wish me to leave the forums, I can do that.
All you have to do is say is please leave. No big production needed.

I respect your position / office .

eddif

Why would I want you to leave the forums just because we disagree? I have no problem with you.

As to what you said here do you have scripture for any of this as I have never read where dead people can get saved.

Heb 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment

I see no second chance for the dead in that verse.

 

[eddif]

Two scriptures supporting awareness in the grave:
1. (First example)
Luke 16:20 kjv
20. And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,
21. And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
22. And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
23. And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
24. And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
25. But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
26. And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
27. Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:
28. For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
29. Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30. And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31. And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.
The angels took Lazarus to safety ( away from Lucifer)

Abraham is dead, Lazarus is dead, the rich man is dead. They are communicating in their appointed residences awaiting the resurrection.

Although all are dead physically, awareness is there.

I am just a redneck from Mississippi with no letters behind my name to let me give some fancy description of what is going on. Just: they are aware after physical death.
………
2. ( second example)
2. Revelation 6:9 kjv
9. And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
10. And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
11. And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

This example is people who have been killed for their testimony. They are talking with God. Aware in death.

I can not do anything but quote scripture. No fancy explanation,

Give me a time to consider your scriptures.
eddif

 

[for_his_glory]

Two scriptures supporting awareness in the grave:
1. (First example)
Luke 16:20 kjv
20. And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,
21. And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
22. And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
23. And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
24. And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
25. But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
26. And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
27. Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:
28. For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
29. Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30. And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31. And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.
The angels took Lazarus to safety ( away from Lucifer)

Abraham is dead, Lazarus is dead, the rich man is dead. They are communicating in their appointed residences awaiting the resurrection.

Although all are dead physically, awareness is there.

I am just a redneck from Mississippi with no letters behind my name to let me give some fancy description of what is going on. Just: they are aware after physical death.
………
2. ( second example)
2. Revelation 6:9 kjv
9. And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
10. And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
11. And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

This example is people who have been killed for their testimony. They are talking with God. Aware in death.

I can not do anything but quote scripture. No fancy explanation,

Give me a time to consider your scriptures.
eddif

This parable does not support there being any awareness in the grave. If you no longer have the breath/spirit of God that He breathed into you that made you a living soul then you are just a lump of flesh rotting away in the grave. We are not raised up with the same body, but a new glorified body in which none knows what we will be, except we will be like Christ in His glorified body.

Parables are simple stories used to illustrate a moral or spiritual lesson as told by Jesus in the Gospels.
The parable about Lazarus and the rich man teaches us that once you die there is no second chance to receive Christ as your Lord and Savior or to warn others. The rich man was sore plexed as he saw Lazarus in the comfort of God (Abraham's bosom) between the gulf and wanted to let his brothers, who were still alive, to know about Christ before it was to late for them when they died, like it was to late for him.

 

[2ndRateMind]

God obviously put a lid over the children of God, a spirit of disobedience, which remains in place to this day. Heb. 10:22 terms it the evil conscience. Paul says all come into this world bound or covered by that agency, Eph. 2:2

Technically we were divided and separated from that agency in faith. But not to the extent of denial of the reality of it

God has also promised to destroy that covering, when their time to end arrives

We are all God's children, even the worst Islamic terrorist. It behoves us to treat each other that way.

Best wishes, 2RM.

 

[for_his_glory]

We are all God's children, even the worst Islamic terrorist. It behoves us to treat each other that way.

Best wishes, 2RM.

Just to let you know in case you are waiting for a reply, smaller is no longer a member here.

 

[2ndRateMind]

Just to let you know in case you are waiting for a reply, smaller is no longer a member here.

Thanks for that info. I wasn't particularly waiting for a reply, just making a point I thought needed making. One of the things I find most troubling about Christianity, the religion of love, is how much it tends to divide us.

Ah well, let what must be, be. Doubtless God has His reasons.

Best wishes, 2RM.

 

[SamNI]

For me personally there has never been enough sharp scriptural focus to conclude Satan was the falling Lucifer in Isaiah (KJV translators’ oddly borrowing the word from the Latin Vulgate; I can relate to Dr. Peter Gentry’s video on YouTube: Is the Fall of Satan really described in the Bible?).

We probably would all agree that there are issues much more important than our enemy’s origins and alleged fall. When it comes to Satan and the powers of wickedness believers firstly need to be well grounded in Scripture. Our enemy is a very real part of our normal experience in Christ.

Those who are firmly rooted and built up in Him and established in their faith need never be terrified of their spiritual enemy. However, it's not wise to underestimate the potential damage that can be caused by the evil forces of darkness.

Our enemy was liar from the get-go, so he can take the form of an angel of light. Sometimes he pretends or appears to be on the side of righteousness, claiming spiritual authenticity in the world and within the true Church. We need to recognise the devil's character and be wary of his activities in the world around us.

Christ “gave Himself for our sins, that He might deliver us from this present evil age” (Galatians 1:4, NKJV). We need this deliverance because “the whole world lies in the power of the evil one” (1st John 5:19, NASB), and the devil is working in those who are disobedient (Ephesians 2:2).

Those who openly oppose Truth need to “come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, having been held captive by him to do his will” (2nd Timothy 2:26, NASB). The god of this world works on the minds of those who do not believe to stop them seeing the truth (2nd Corinthians 4:4).

When we are wholly submitted to God, through faith in Christ's authority we can resist the devil and he will flee from us. He will be confronted by our spiritual awareness and will recognise the Person of Christ in us. But we should also realise that our enemy can stand in our way, hoping to gain an advantage. Even if we are aware of his schemes, there will be times when he will hinder us: "...we wanted to come to you... and yet Satan hindered us" (1st Thessalonians 2:18).

He can cut through our intentions and thwart our plans, so we need to be set apart (pure and sanctified), fully prepared for conflict. The spiritual forces of wickedness will do their best to disrupt good works, corrupt godliness, block spiritual progress and distort true teaching. We are constantly set against an enemy who wants to frustrate the Holy Spirit's work in and through us. The more we accomplish in Christ the greater the opposition will be. Are we prepared? (Ephesians 6:10-18.)

Demonic activity can poison our attitudes and behaviour, which in turn causes "soulish" friction among true believers (consider James 3:15, 16). Paul's experience indicates our spiritual enemies — working as messengers of Satan — can also cause humbling health problems (see 2nd Corinthians 12:7).

"Put on the full armor of God so that you can stand against the tactics of the Devil" (Ephesians 6:11, HCSB).