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the first commandment

wondering said:
I agree with your reply.
But it seems that those that are adverse to "graven images",,,I mean statues of Jesus, Mary or saints, always state the reason as being that these statues are actually being worshipped.
I just don't see this as bring true.
Click to expand...
The answer lies ion the question- Why do you wear it?
 
FactsPlease said:
The answer lies ion the question- Why do you wear it?
Click to expand...
Certainly not because I worship it.
My main reason is as a witness...
To remind persons about God.
I don't know anybody that worships it.
 
wondering said:
Certainly not because I worship it.
My main reason is as a witness...
To remind persons about God.
I don't know anybody that worships it.
Click to expand...
That means you don't know the meaning of worship.
People still worship the Beatles....
 
Christ completely reformed the mosaic covenant into the new covenant Christian church in His own blood. Heb 9:10 so the new covenant has many similarities to the old covenant:


Nature, structure, requirements:

Both have a Temple:
Altar:
Ark of the covenant
Triple Priesthood: high priesthood, ministerial priesthood, common priesthood.
Sacrifice:
Sacraments:
Eternal flame:
Golden sensor with sweet smelling incense:

Both are the ark of salvation:

Initiation:
Mosaic: Circumcision
Christian: Faith and baptism




Doctrine of constancy or Unchangeable nature of Christ, His church, and His doctrine:

Christ promised to remain with his church Matt 28:19 acts 1:8

Arron and His successors: high priests over the low priests, the Levites:

The common priesthood of the people: ex 19:6


The three fold new covenant priesthood:

High priesthood: “Jesus Christ”
acts 10:14
heb 5:1
heb 8:1
heb 8:3


Ministerial priesthood: “apostles & their successors, and those they ordain” (low priests)
Mk 3:14
Jn 15:16
Jn 20:23
acts 1:15-26
acts 14:23
Acts 16:4
Rom 15:16
1 cor 9:14
1 Tim 3:1-2
1 Tim 2:7
1 Tim 4:14
Phil 1:1
James 5:14

Royal priesthood: “baptized members of Jesus Christ”
1 pet 2:5-9

The holy sacrifice of Christ:

Holy sacrifice of Christ is offered eternally, the office of a priest is to offer sacrifice, Christ is eternal priest so He offers an eternal sacrifice! Both by the high priest and the low priesthood.

once for all:

once bloody on the cross and for all time unbloody sacrifice, pure offering or clean oblation.

Jesus Christ at the last supper ordained the apostles as priests in the order of melchisedec, to offer His eternal sacrifice as he commanded them; do this in memory of me.

Do this in remembrance of me!

Luke 22:19
And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.

1 Corinthians 11:24
And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.

1 Corinthians 11:25
After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, this cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me.

Malachi 1:11

For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name shall be great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense shall be offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name shall be great among the heathen, saith the Lord of hosts.

A pure offering:
A Clean oblation:
An Unbloody sacrifice:

Thanks
wondering said:
This is true.
But it's not the CC that tells them to do this.
I wanted to ask you and donadams if the cherubim on the Ark would be considered graven images.
Thanks.
Click to expand...
images yes
Graven no cos they are not gods or worshiped as gods
And made by divine command
Thanks
 
Hopeful, are you going to spit in a picture of your mother? It’s only paper and some chemicals.
Thanks
 
donadams said:
Hopeful, are you going to spit in a picture of your mother? It’s only paper and some chemicals.
Thanks
Click to expand...
Great point for Hopeful.
But he'll never see it unless you tag him in.

@ plus his name.
 
Hopeful said:
They are wood and stone, and represent nothing but wood and stone.
If it is sacrilege to spit on it, statue worship is idolatry.

Because He may be in the "brother".

Because He is in the persecuted.

Never, and correct.

Huh?

Yes, but statues?
Never.

As an ex-catholic, I held it in an idolatrous fashion.

Of course I do, but I don't need wood and stone in order to do so.
Click to expand...
What about a crucifix?
How is the rosary idolatry? What false god is involved or worshipped?
Please see my thread in the unorthodox forum “spiritual family” may explain much. Thanks
 
donadams said:
What about a crucifix?
How is the rosary idolatry? What false god is involved or worshipped?
Please see my thread in the unorthodox forum “spiritual family” may explain much. Thanks
Click to expand...
Worship of wood and stones, or beads, is idolatry.
To determine if your "treatment" of such man made devices is idolatry, spit on them.
Was that sacrilege?
If it was, the "treatment" is idolatry.
 
Aussie Mark said:
No that's a very imflammatory post. As per wondering earlier post, I too am very curious about where in the Bible you would go to support something that is so unorthodox. I note you have Christian:Yes in your mini profile.
Click to expand...
What inflammatory post? What's so unorthodox?
Jesus having a God (as he said several times)?
 
wondering said:
Why do the witnesses dislike the cross so much?

Protestants dislike the crucifix and prefer the plain cross with no Jesus on it.

Shouldn't we like anything and respect anything that is a representation of Jesus?
No matter what a denomination may believe Him to have been.
Click to expand...
I tink wearign a cross is great. No issues here.

As a Protestant, I suspect it is buried in the reformation where there was an austere reaction in many parts to the imagaery/idolatory in the Church as it was.

From a Protestant perspective I don't think for many it is a conscious choice based on any theology but more something a bit subconscious based on habit/fashion and maybe it has developed into cross + Jesus "looking" a bit Catholic. I have zero issue with any one wearing a cross with Jesus on it for the exact reasons you mentioned in another post.
 
FactsPlease said:
What inflammatory post? What's so unorthodox?
Jesus having a God (as he said several times)?
Click to expand...
I actually replied to the message you posted that I & wondering have questioned you on:

Why- when the Bible says he wasn't executed on it?
Click to expand...
So I think you know exactly which one I am referring to. So please do the right thing and explain where in the Bible it says this?
 
Aussie Mark said:
I actually replied to the message you posted that I & wondering have questioned you on:


So I think you know exactly which one I am referring to. So please do the right thing and explain where in the Bible it says this?
Click to expand...
Come out and say it- I won't be offended. Too many conversations!
 
FactsPlease said:
What inflammatory post? What's so unorthodox?
Jesus having a God (as he said several times)?
Click to expand...
You don't reply to posts F.
In post 37 you stated that there was no cross in the death of Jesus.
In post 43 you stated that I don't know what worship means.. I then asked you what worship means to which you replied
in post 47 that I worship the cross -

So, this IS somewhat inflammatory although you may not have meant your posts to be inflammatory.

Now your reply is stating that Jesus had a God.
Jesus was inferior to God when He was on earth. He even said He could not know when the end would be.
He was not privy to all information as He would have been as the 2nd person of the Trinity. Jesus was LIMITED in His knowledge.

The problem arises because you do not believe in the Trinity.
You believe Jesus is created, made.
When the early church believed He was BEGOTTEN, NOT MADE, one in being with the Father.
Why would John have stated that Jesus, the Word of God, was with God from the beginning which means He was NOT created, but had ALWAYS been with God.

I find it unfortunate that due to the incapacity of the CC to teach its members their faith, you were taken away to join a sect that would like to call itself Christian, but that is not Christian.
 
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