The Lord Loves You

[savedbygrace57]

John 3:16

16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Those God Loved in Jn 3:16, that world, had to be viewed by God as in Union with Christ Jesus, those Chosen in Him. For God's Love for any people is in Christ Jesus Rom 8:39

39Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

In the original " the Love of God " is thv agaphv tou qeou, as you can see it is preceded by the definite article, Identifying this as the exclusive Love of God, God has no other Love for men apart from His saving and Electing Purpose in Christ Jesus !

When writing about God's Purpose of Election in Rom 9, Paul writes in support of it by the comparing of the twins Jacob and Esau, to testify that it was Jacob that was God's Elect, he writes Rom 9:11-13

11(For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth )

12It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

13As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

This makes it plain that God's Love is exclusively associated with His Purpose of Election, which Purpose is in Christ Jesus , which Love He Loved them because of being in Him by Election before the foundation Eph 1:4 and Jn 17:23-24

23I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

24Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

I challenge anyone to prove from scripture that the Love of God in Jn 3:16 is not the same exact Love of God in Rom 8:39. Now it would be above foolish to suppose that everyone in the world of Jn 3:16 was in Christ Jesus, but yet, would have to be if "so loved by God"

 

[savedbygrace57]

The World God so Loved and Christ Loved and gave Himself for Eph 5:25, is that universal society of people He foreknew, and those who Love God Rom 8:28-30. For they are the only People who are His, and because of Christ's Death for them, they do and shall depart from iniquity 2 Tim 2:19

Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

This they do [ depart from iniquity] because Christ by His Death did redeem them from it Titus 2:14

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

1 Pet 1:18-19

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

Being redeemed from a vain manner of Life, is being redeemed from iniquity experimentally, this was accomplished by the Blood of Christ alone !

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

Thats the world God Loved, the Redeemed world Rev 5:9


And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

 

[savedbygrace57]

God's Love to His Elect, which began from Everlasting , by choosing them in Christ, yet it never changes, even when they sinned in Adam their natural head, or even when they themselves enter into the world by natural generation and begin their personal transgressions, being BY NATURE children of wrath as are others[the non elect], as God has always Loved them, He changes them, converts them by giving them a New Birth from above, and hence they come to Love Him, because He first Loved them ! So God's Love makes a difference and change in them, beginning by His making them alive or quickening them while dead in Sins, so Paul writes of them Eph 2:4-5

4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,

5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved )

If anyone does not experience this quickening together with Christ because of God's great Love for them, then God did not Love them at all !

 

[savedbygrace57]

Perception of Eternal Love !


The Love that God has for His Own People is a Love perceived by them to be from Everlasting, David's perception of a Love that God had in His People from Old, or Everlasting Ps 25:6

Remember, O Lord, thy tender mercies and thy lovingkindnesses; for they have been ever of old.

David like all True Saints, know of God's Eternal Love for them in Christ Jesus Rom 8:39, and that His Mercies for their Salvation is from Everlasting to Everlasting Ps 103:17

But the mercy of the Lord is from everlasting to everlasting upon them that fear him, and his righteousness unto children's children;

Jer 31:3

3 The Lord hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I have loved thee with an everlasting love: therefore with lovingkindness have I drawn thee.

This is the only Love God has, and it is not for those whom He did not choose in Christ before the world began Jn 17:23-24

23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

 

[John O]

This is the only Love God has, and it is not for those whom He did not choose in Christ before the world began Jn 17:23-24 (savedbygrace)

Excellent twisting of the word
Joh 17:23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
Joh 17:24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

And in light of 2 Peter 3:9 your interpretation disagrees with the word of God.
2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

John O

 

[savedbygrace57]

God does not Love all mankind without exception !


The False Teachers of our time and time past who teach that God loves all mankind without exception are nothing but deceivers and liars, for scriptures do teach the very opposite Rom 9:13

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

Ps 5:5

5 The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.

Now if God hates all the workers of iniquity, then they could not have been of that People of sinners that God so Loved Rom 5:8

8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners [ workers of iniquity], Christ died for us.

Now, if these are the same as those in Ps 5:5, we have a major contradiction, so to avoid such, it is plainly taught that God does not Love all sinners, for some, as per Ps 5:5 He does hate, and they shall not stand in the day of Judgment, they have no Saviour provided for them ! As God's Love is Immutable and not subject to change, so is His hate for some immutable and not subject to change, for just as His Church is Loved with an everlasting love, His enemies are hated with an everlasting hatred as the edomites symbolized Mal 1:4

4 Whereas Edom saith, We are impoverished, but we will return and build the desolate places; thus saith the Lord of hosts, They shall build, but I will throw down; and they shall call them, The border of wickedness, and, The people against whom the Lord hath indignation for ever.

They are the people of God's curse unto Judgment Isa 34:5

5 For my sword shall be bathed in heaven: behold, it shall come down upon Idumea, and upon the people of my curse, to judgment.

They all shall hear in the Great day Matt 25:41

Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

 

[John O]

God does not Love all mankind without exception !

Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

John 17:24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

To all who love Christ is eternal life given.

John O

2Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is long suffering toward us, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

 

[savedbygrace57]

Sovereign in His Love !

Rom 9:11-15

11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth )

12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

God is Sovereign in both His Love and Mercy, and Grace which all go hand in hand Eph 2:4-5

4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,

5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved )

Now just because we read in scripture that God is Love 1 Jn 4:8 and that He is merciful Ex 34:6;Deut 4:31, does not mean that He is not Sovereign with those qualities of His Nature, for He extends [apply] them unto whosoever He will, and of course witholds them to whomsoever he wills. A case in point are the Angels that left their first estate, God gave them No Mercy 2 Pet 2:4; Jude 1:6, nor not even a glimmer of hope of obtaining mercy, neither is there any proof that God Loved them his fallen creatures, since at no time we read that out of His Love for them, He gave His Son to die for them and their Apostasy !

So you see, God being a God of Love or a Merciful God was not benefit to them, non at all, and the same is true of some men !

 

[savedbygrace57]

We know that Christ's coming into the World was not out of Love to all mankind without exception, neither to identify with the same, but for only His Brethren, and not according to the flesh Heb 2:17

17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

His Brethren in view here are all those who does the will of His Father in heaven Matt 12:50

For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

And secondly, all those He became the Firstborn of Many Brethren to Rom 8:29

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Col 1:18

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

Heb 12:23

23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

Christ came only into this World and assumed the likeness of sinful flesh for those here Eph 1:4-5

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

Yes, only the predestined ones, same as in Rom 8:29

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

These are whom God's Love is limited to !

 

[John O]

Sovereign in His Love !

Rom 9:11-15

11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth )

12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

God is Sovereign in both His Love and Mercy, and Grace which all go hand in hand Eph 2:4-5

4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,

5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved )

Now just because we read in scripture that God is Love 1 Jn 4:8 and that He is merciful Ex 34:6;Deut 4:31, does not mean that He is not Sovereign with those qualities of His Nature, for He extends [apply] them unto whosoever He will, and of course witholds them to whomsoever he wills. A case in point are the Angels that left their first estate, God gave them No Mercy 2 Pet 2:4; Jude 1:6, nor not even a glimmer of hope of obtaining mercy, neither is there any proof that God Loved them his fallen creatures, since at no time we read that out of His Love for them, He gave His Son to die for them and their Apostasy !

So you see, God being a God of Love or a Merciful God was not benefit to them, non at all, and the same is true of some men !

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. God states this because in His foreknowledge He saw Esau rejecting His God. God hates ALL you reject Him and they shall be lost forever.

John O

 

[John O]

We know that Christ's coming into the World was not out of Love to all mankind without exception, neither to identify with the same, but for only His Brethren, and not according to the flesh Heb 2:17

17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

His Brethren in view here are all those who does the will of His Father in heaven Matt 12:50

For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

And secondly, all those He became the Firstborn of Many Brethren to Rom 8:29

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Col 1:18

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

Heb 12:23

23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

Christ came only into this World and assumed the likeness of sinful flesh for those here Eph 1:4-5

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

Yes, only the predestined ones, same as in Rom 8:29

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

These are whom God's Love is limited to !

What does the term predestinate mean as you understand it.

John O

 

[savedbygrace57]

Most religious People think that God's Love is a mere emotion, however that cannot be further from the Truth. The Bible Teaches that God's Love and the Love of Jesus Christ produces effects, results. For God so loved the World that He Gave His only begotten Son. Yes Christ coming into the World to save His Own was an effect of God's Love !

Jn 3:16

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.


Gal 2:20

I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

And Christ's giving of Himself, produces Results for them as Well. And it is by theses results that God's Love produces, it is impossible to conclude that God's Love and that of His Son, the Lord Jesus Christ is unto all mankind without exception !

Here is one of many effects of God's Love to those He loves 2 Thess 2:16-17

16 Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God, even our Father, which hath loved us, and hath given us everlasting consolation and good hope through grace,

17 Comfort your hearts, and stablish you in every good word and work.


Those God Loved, along with that Love He gives [ to the Loved ones] everlasting consolation and good hope through Grace. If we do not have these things abiding within, chances are, God does not Love us, because that is one of the evidences He gives those He Loves.

This hope comes as a result of the New Birth 1 Pet 1:3

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

So it is appropriate to say that God Loves no man that does not receive a New Birth by the Resurrection of Jesus Christ from the Dead !

This means, if Christ had not been raised from the dead, then none of those He died for would be born again, our New Birth is in virtue of His Resurrection !

 

[savedbygrace57]

Whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth !


Heb 12:6

For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

If God Loved all mankind without exception, then would He not chasten every man in the world without exception ? Since scripture states whom the Lord Loveth, he chaseneth !

This word chasteneth is the greek word paideuō and means:


to train children

a) to be instructed or taught or learn

b) to cause one to learn


Now scripture also says this regarding all the Father teaches and cause them to learn Jn 6:45

45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.

This promise is concerning all those whom God Loveth, they will become believers in Christ, for He chastens them all !

These are also the Covenant Seed, those David wrote of here Ps 89:27-33

27 Also I will make him my firstborn, higher than the kings of the earth.

28 My mercy will I keep for him for evermore, and my covenant shall stand fast with him.

29 His seed also will I make to endure for ever, and his throne as the days of heaven.

30 If his children forsake my law, and walk not in my judgments; Which all the elect do by nature !

31 If they break my statutes, and keep not my commandments;

32 Then will I visit their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with stripes. This is Divine chastening !

33 Nevertheless my lovingkindness will I not utterly take from him, nor suffer my faithfulness to fail.

And chastening is always with profit in Holiness Heb 12:10-14

10 For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.

11 Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.

12 Wherefore lift up the hands which hang down, and the feeble knees;

13 And make straight paths for your feet, lest that which is lame be turned out of the way; but let it rather be healed.

14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:

Now it stands to reason, if God Loved all mankind without exception, all men without exception should partake of His Holiness vs 10 and afterward yield the peaceable fruit of Righteousness.

Now if this does not happen for every single person in the world without exception the word of God is a cheat ,a Lie ! Someone is lying, either the writers of scripture or those who teach that God loves everyone in the world without exception !

 

[AwakenedOne]

I have really never heard a christian say that the Lord is vengeful and will torture most people in hell. I have heard christians say that there is a lake of fire prepared for the devil and his angels and that all who are not forgiven of sins through faith in Christ will end up there.

What is the difference??

If God had foreknowledge before He created the earth that billions upon billions of people would end up in an eternal lake of fire being tortured endlessly while only a select few would end up in heaven than that would make God a sadistic, evil monster void of any true love and compassion. It is foolish to preach GOD IS LOVE GOD IS LOVE and then turn around and believe that He foreknew billions and billions of people would burn endlessly and then He created the world knowing this.

But the God I serve is no monster and He is LOVE and His plan is far better and greater than that. Perhaps oneday the love of God will open your eyes and you will get a glimpse of His true plan.

 

[WIP]

What is the difference??

If God had foreknowledge before He created the earth that billions upon billions of people would end up in an eternal lake of fire being tortured endlessly while only a select few would end up in heaven than that would make God a sadistic, evil monster void of any true love and compassion. It is foolish to preach GOD IS LOVE GOD IS LOVE and then turn around and believe that He foreknew billions and billions of people would burn endlessly and then He created the world knowing this.

But the God I serve is no monster and He is LOVE and His plan is far better and greater than that. Perhaps oneday the love of God will open your eyes and you will get a glimpse of His true plan.

I thought there was only one God but you must feel differently as you keep referring to "your God." I would like to hear you describe "your" God in detail but rather than hijack this thread, please start another.

 

[savedbygrace57]

For God so Loved the World !

Jn 3:16

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Many of the followers of antichrist have twisted this scripture to their own destruction and force it to mean something to them that it does not mean at all, and that is that it says here that God Loved every human being of mankind without exception, which is so absurd. One scripture in the bible totally proves that interpretation false, for we must always understand scripture in light of scripture, and that is this scripture here Rom 9::10-13

10 And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac;

11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth )

12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

This scripture reminds us that God views Two manner of people in this world, based upon His Eternal Purpose in Christ Jesus. This was revealed to Rebecca early on in the her history and as it pertained to her Two Sons Gen 25:22-23

22 And the children struggled together within her; and she said, If it be so, why am I thus? And she went to enquire of the Lord.

23 And the Lord said unto her, Two nations are in thy womb, and two manner of people shall be separated from thy bowels; and the one people shall be stronger than the other people; and the elder shall serve the younger.

This actually happened to Eve, though not recorded as Twins, Two manner of People were separated from her bowels in cain and Abel, and similar to, one son was Loved and accepted of God, and one hated and rejected, and so it is in this world up to even now, some according to God's Purpose of Election are either of that manner of People that are Loved, like the Jacobs and Abel's, or they are of the manner that are hated as the cains and the esau's. God in the recordings here of the history of Rachel and her children is showing and typifying the Election of God as a separated People from the reprobates, the seed of the serpent or the children of perdition. Folks Jacob was Loved of God, but his brother was hated of God. God reminds later also of this separation amongst the manner of peoples in the world here Mal 1:2

I have loved you, saith the LORD. Yet ye say, Wherein hast thou loved us? Was not Esau Jacob's brother? saith the LORD: yet I loved Jacob,

A clear discriminating difference made by God again ! God said Yet I Loved only [implied] Jacob !

And folks that is how it is in John 3:16, its only the Jacobs of the World that are Loved by God, those Loved in His Redemptive Purpose in Christ Jesus Rom 8:39

39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

In the original it is:

apo thv agaphv tou qeou thv en Xristw Ihsou tw kuriw hmwn.

The definite article the Love of the God, meaning that this is God's exclusive Love and it is exclusively in Christ Jesus, folks, God knows no other or has any other type Love save that which is grounded in His Election of some in Christ Jesus before the World began 2 Tim 1:9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

That Purpose of His is mentioned again in Rom 9:11

11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth )

Yes, thats Right, God's own Purpose of Election in Christ Jesus before the World began !

And Jacob was Loved according to that Purpose of Election, for you cannot separate God's Love from His Discriminate Choice, also seen in the Early Typical Dealings with Israel, and it reads Deut 7:6-7

For thou art an holy people unto the Lord thy God: the Lord thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.

7 The Lord did not set his love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people; for ye were the fewest of all people:

The Loved of God are The Chosen of God, a Special People unto Himself !

Sorry folks, but that is a discriminate Love God reveals here, not shared with other people of the World !

So, premised upon scriptural evidence, the World Loved in Jn 3:16, is His Chosen World in Christ Jesus Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

And that is the Love of God in Christ Jesus, the One they are Chosen in ! Rom 8:39

39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

If you do not believe in the Discriminate Elective Love of God in Christ Jesus, based upon His own Purpose of Election, we do not believe in the God of which it is written God is Love ! And the World that He so Loved is His Own Chosen People, a Special People above all others.

One Last thing, the very word for world has many different meanings, one of which is this, its the word kosmos:

1) an apt and harmonious arrangement or constitution, order, government

2) ornament, decoration, adornment, i.e. the arrangement of the stars, 'the heavenly hosts', as the ornament of the heavens. 1 Pet. 3:3

3) the world, the universe

4) the circle of the earth, the earth

5) the inhabitants of the earth, men, the human family

6) the ungodly multitude; the whole mass of men alienated from God, and therefore hostile to the cause of Christ

7) world affairs, the aggregate of things earthly

a) the whole circle of earthly goods, endowments riches, advantages, pleasures, etc, which although hollow and frail and fleeting, stir desire, seduce from God and are obstacles to the cause of Christ

8) any aggregate or general collection of particulars of any sort

a) the Gentiles as contrasted to the Jews (Rom. 11:12 etc)

Any aggregate collection of particulars !

What does aggregate mean ? Its a collection of particulars ! what does particular mean ?

of or pertaining to a single or specific person, thing, group, class, occasion, etc., rather than to others or all; special rather than general:

So All those collected together of God's Particular Election in Christ Jesus before the world began, is a World, this cannot be disputed, and that is the World God so Loved in Jn 3:16, the Elect of God !

 

[savedbygrace57]

That Love of God which it is said, For God so loved the World Jn 3:16 is that same Love that the Father had to His Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, and the World that He Loved, He did so as He Loved Him Jn 17:23-24

23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

It is therefore, all for whom God Loved, Jn 3:16 was a World in Union with Christ Jesus before the world began, and so He Loved it with a Love only found in Christ Jesus Rom 8:39

39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

None can be seperated from this Love, and since scripture is clear that many shall be seperated from God's Love into Everlasting Fire, then such ones could not have been any of those God so Loved in Jn 3:16 ! The Fact is, if one was not Loved while in Union as One with Christ before the foundation of the World, then that one was never Loved by God, and that is a Election Union. What did God say to the Chosen Jews , which was but a very small remnant ? Deut 7:6-7

6 For thou art an holy people unto the Lord thy God: the Lord thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.

7 The Lord did not set his love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people; for ye were the fewest of all people:

God was speaking only to Chosen Jews in Christ, before Him in Love and Holiness as here Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

 

[smaller]

For God so Loved the World !

Jn 3:16

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Many of the followers of antichrist have twisted this scripture to their own destruction and force it to mean something to them that it does not mean at all, and that is that it says here that God Loved every human being of mankind without exception, which is so absurd. One scripture in the bible totally proves that interpretation false, for we must always understand scripture in light of scripture, and that is this scripture here Rom 9::10-13

10 And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac;

11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth )

12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

This scripture reminds us that God views Two manner of people in this world, based upon His Eternal Purpose in Christ Jesus. This was revealed to Rebecca early on in the her history and as it pertained to her Two Sons Gen 25:22-23

22 And the children struggled together within her; and she said, If it be so, why am I thus? And she went to enquire of the Lord.

23 And the Lord said unto her, Two nations are in thy womb, and two manner of people shall be separated from thy bowels; and the one people shall be stronger than the other people; and the elder shall serve the younger.

You see Esau as 'other people,' particularly those who don't have 'doctrine' like yours.

The fact is the showing of Gods Blessings and election is shown in the two sons theme and the elder vs. the younger numerous times in the text.

To mention just a few of MANY, and in each case Gods Election, the younger:

Adam: Cain/Abel
Abraham: Ishmael/Isaac
Isaac: Esau/Jacob
Joseph: Mannaseh/Ephraim
Moses: Gershom/Eliezer

There are many more. Even when we see 'renaming,' as God renamed Abram to Abraham, it shows the move from the carnal man to the man of faith whom God Himself has raised and blesses.

Paul breaks this down very interestingly in many places as well, Gal. 4 being my favorite, showing that Ishmael was in fact an ALLEGORY for the son of the flesh, the firstborn, the NATURAL man so to speak as compared to Isaac, the son of Promise.

And he goes on to describe that all of us can in fact fall into the pit of the first born son in works of the flesh, works of the natural man, works of the carnal man, and states flat out that this man, which we are ALL warned off of, WILL NOT INHERIT.

It really has ZERO to do with what you think you see.

God hates all the firstborn. Think EGYPT where the Angel of Death, the Lord Himself KILLED every last one of the what? FIRSTBORN children.

Exodus 11:5
And all the firstborn in the land of Egypt shall die,

This is in fact A GOSPEL PROMISE!

For believers this is understood to be a personal matter.

Esau ain't the other believer with bad doctrine. We all have a son of the flesh to pin to our own respective crosses.

And no son of the flesh will understand this matter either. So if you don't get it, I certainly understand. And even further, I would never ever hold it against you as that is the place that ALL SONS OF GOD come from.

Sons of faith will study the facts of the matters above, and the Spirit will show them the Wisdom of God in these matters.

And they will NEVER EVER see Esau or any other elder son as anything other than their old carnal man subject to the slaveship of slave works.

Don't go back to Egypt. It probably won't work out well for ya!

enjoy!

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[savedbygrace57]

God's Love is not His Providential Care !

People have confused God's providential care for all His creatures with His Eternal Love which is only for His Children Chosen in Christ Jesus before the World began, which is a huge difference. God as creator can and does providentially care and provide for all His Creatures without Loving them All in Christ Jesus, for instance, if one is a chief warden of a prison house of horrible and wicked prisoners of the worst kind, even though while they are under his watch and he must provide for their needs and care for them, give them water and food, medical attention if need be and etc, nevertheless he will do all this without having Loved them, these are things he must do, without having a tender affection for them are he does for his own children, that he provides for, for then is his disposition different ! God does provide those He does not Love in Christ with the necessities of Life because He is their Creator and must sustain them as long as His Purpose deems it necessary. Matt 5:45

That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

True Believers will emulate their Heavenly Father in this, as Jesus instructed here Lk 10:29-37, even though the stranger had religious differences and are our enemies in this cause, nevertheless, we should not withhold common mercies unto them when it is in our power to give it. This does not mean we Love them in Christ as our brother, in fact, they are enemies in that respect, but we do share a common lot together as God's Creatures, and should seek to be merciful to them if need be ! That is how God is towards them, even though He provideth not for their Eternal Salvation in Jesus Christ !

 

[savedbygrace57]

Whats the difference ?

Whats the difference between sinners God hates as in Ps 5:5

5 The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.


Now notice, the scripture states here that God hates not just the iniquity of these sinners, but the worker or workers of iniquity, the very persons who are committing the iniquity !

But now, on the other hand, those Christ died for, scripture testimony states clearly that God Loved them as sinners, as workers of iniquity as per Rom 5:8

But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

Now clearly, the testimony here is that God commendeth His Love towards these, WHILE WE WHERE YET SINNERS !

So clearly, any honest heart can see that there is a difference with God in these Two different sets of sinners. One set is hated, and the other set is Loved.

Now here is the difference. The group that is Loved Rom 5:8, they had all their transgressions charged to Christ, their iniquities were never charged to them but to Christ in order that He would for them make full satisfaction to God's Law and Justice, God sent Christ to be the propitiation for their sins because He Loved them 1 Jn 4:10

Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins.

But those sinners that God hates Ps 5:5 those are all sinners whom sins and transgressions and iniquities are charged unto themselves, Yes iniquity is still charged upon their persons, and never was it charged to Christ in their behalf ! So consequently they will always be before God's Law and Justice, Workers of Iniquity, and even in spite of all their sincere religious endeavors, all they will hear in the Last Day of Judgment is these words Matt 7:22-23

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

So that is the difference, one group of sinners that God Loved while in their wickedness had all their wickedness charged to Christ, whereas, the group of sinners that God hates, had all their wickedness charged to themselves !