The nation of Israel was given the Law,and it was never given to the the Gentiles

[Grubal Muruch]

These are both referring to the Jews who were to give an outward profession of their acceptance of the Gospel message of Jesus Christ. In Mark the baptism of the Holy Spirit had not been given and the disciples, themselves, didn't understand it. They were still teaching John's baptism. At Pentecost, the gospel still had not been preached to the gentiles, and all the Jews from all those foreign lands still were to make a public display of their belief in Jesus Christ.

AMEN!!!

 

[Webb]

Hi Glorydaz

I've always believed the bible is its own best commentary. Mark 16:15,16 has the Christ the Son of God (by whose words we shall be judged) saying that baptism saves. Acts 2:38 has inspired ( of the Holy Spirit ) saying bapism is for the remission of sins.

 

[glorydaz]

Hi Glorydaz

I've always believed the bible is its own best commentary. Mark 16:15,16 has the Christ the Son of God (by whose words we shall be judged) saying that baptism saves. Acts 2:38 has inspired ( of the Holy Spirit ) saying bapism is for the remission of sins.

I certainly agree the Bible is the only way to go.

Let me ask you this. Why did Jesus tell the disciples NOT TO GO to the gentiles, but GO TO the lost sheep of Israel?

These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.

And here ...."But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel."( Matt. 15:24). Why?

If you answer that, then you'll have the answer to why those verses say what they do, and don't forget, the Holy Spirit didn't come until after Jesus' resurrection. He came for the lost house of Israel. John's baptism was the outward sign that God's chosen people had received their Messiah.

John's baptism of repentance was for the Jews. The Jews had the outer washing and the outer circumcision. John's baptism is a picture of spiritual repentance (circumcision of the heart) and spiritual cleansing by the blood of Christ. The water baptism was an outward sign of an inward reality. Anyone can get baptized in water, but only those who are baptized with the Holy Spirit will be saved.

Washing with water could never take away sins. Blood was required for that.

 

[mharold]

Just adding my two cents... If a gentile don't the law then he will live in sin. Roman 7:7- What shall we say then? GOD forbid. Nay i had not know sin, but by the law:for I had not known lust, except the law had said, thou shalt not covet.

 

[glorydaz]

Just adding my two cents... If a gentile don't the law then he will live in sin. Roman 7:7- What shall we say then? GOD forbid. Nay i had not know sin, but by the law:for I had not known lust, except the law had said, thou shalt not covet.

The law was given to show man their sin.

But even before the "law" was given, we have God's "moral law" written in our conscience. Even a gentile who doesn't know the law, still knows lusting is wrong...once he reaches the age of understanding. I believe Paul was speaking of a time before he knew what either his conscience or the law was saying...that it is wrong to lust (covet).

 

[Grubal Muruch]

I certainly agree the Bible is the only way to go.

Let me ask you this. Why did Jesus tell the disciples NOT TO GO to the gentiles, but GO TO the lost sheep of Israel?



And here ...."But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel."( Matt. 15:24). Why?

If you answer that, then you'll have the answer to why those verses say what they do, and don't forget, the Holy Spirit didn't come until after Jesus' resurrection. He came for the lost house of Israel. John's baptism was the outward sign that God's chosen people had received their Messiah.

John's baptism of repentance was for the Jews. The Jews had the outer washing and the outer circumcision. John's baptism is a picture of spiritual repentance (circumcision of the heart) and spiritual cleansing by the blood of Christ. The water baptism was an outward sign of an inward reality. Anyone can get baptized in water, but only those who are baptized with the Holy Spirit will be saved.

Washing with water could never take away sins. Blood was required for that.

AMEN and AMEN...

 

[mharold]

The law was given to show man their sin.

But even before the "law" was given, we have God's "moral law" written in our conscience. Even a gentile who doesn't know the law, still knows lusting is wrong...once he reaches the age of understanding. I believe Paul was speaking of a time before he knew what either his conscience or the law was saying...that it is wrong to lust (covet).

Paul knew the law very well and was a inforcer of the law remember he had help stone Stephen right before seeing Jesus.If you read Roman the whole chapter it bout the law vs faith and how both come together. GOD's "moral law" i don't really know about.. But He made Moses write what he write to let you know what to do if you sin and GOD told everyone what was sin the 10 commandments.
I feel like this if you live in sin you not living for GOD. So how would you know sin? Because it feel good I can say it of GOD. If I cheating on my wife and with another woman and it feel good. I going to say that sin. In Genesis, they commit adultery, Abraham had did. I leave you with this if you know the speed limit you go the speed limit and if you don't know the speed you going to find out.

 

[Webb]

Hi Glorydaz

In light of I Pet.3:15 I am glad to give attention and an answer to your concerns on your post #43.

We agree that the law given through Moses was only to the Jew. Jesus was a Jew. As such He was subject to the law as were all Jews. See Gal.4:4. He kept that law perfectly as no one else could. He didn't come to destroy but to fulfill the law, Matt.5:17 and there is a difference between destroying and fulfilling.

If I understand you correctly we agree on John's baptism.

We also agree that the Holy Spirit ( in the baptismal measure ) didn't come until after Jesus' resurrection. The baptism of the Spirit came on the first Pentecost after the resurrection which may be found in Acts 2.

However, you wrote: "----ONLY THOSE WHO ARE BAPTIZED IN THE HOLY SPIRIT WILL BE SAVED.'' Here we disagree as to what the Bible teaches. If I understand the NT correctly NO ONE today has received the baptism of the Holy Spirit. I know this is in contradiction to what many believe.

 

[glorydaz]

Hi Glorydaz

In light of I Pet.3:15 I am glad to give attention and an answer to your concerns on your post #43.

We agree that the law given through Moses was only to the Jew. Jesus was a Jew. As such He was subject to the law as were all Jews. See Gal.4:4. He kept that law perfectly as no one else could. He didn't come to destroy but to fulfill the law, Matt.5:17 and there is a difference between destroying and fulfilling.

If I understand you correctly we agree on John's baptism.

We also agree that the Holy Spirit ( in the baptismal measure ) didn't come until after Jesus' resurrection. The baptism of the Spirit came on the first Pentecost after the resurrection which may be found in Acts 2.

However, you wrote: "----ONLY THOSE WHO ARE BAPTIZED IN THE HOLY SPIRIT WILL BE SAVED.'' Here we disagree as to what the Bible teaches. If I understand the NT correctly NO ONE today has received the baptism of the Holy Spirit. I know this is in contradiction to what many believe.

You don't think believers have the Holy Spirit dwelling in them, or you think the baptism of the Holy Spirit is something else?

John 14:26 - But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

Jesus said He will come to us. The Spirit of God (Spirit of Christ) the Comforter will dwell in the believer.

John 14:16-18 - "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you."

Here we see Jesus speaking of the coming Holy Spirit (Comforter), who could not come until Jesus was glorified.

John 7:38 - He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)

John 16:7 - "Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you."

Salvation is by grace through faith. "After faith is come," we are filled with the Holy Spirit. He does a work in our heart (circumcision of the heart -godly repentance) and we are sealed by the Spirit and placed "into Christ". When we trust and believe we are saved, and filled by the Holy Spirit. One Faith. One Baptism.

Gal. 3: 25-27 - "But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ."

 

[Grubal Muruch]

You don't think believers have the Holy Spirit dwelling in them, or you think the baptism of the Holy Spirit is something else?

John 14:26 - But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

Jesus said He will come to us. The Spirit of God (Spirit of Christ) the Comforter will dwell in the believer.

John 14:16-18 - "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you."

Here we see Jesus speaking of the coming Holy Spirit (Comforter), who could not come until Jesus was glorified.

John 7:38 - He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)

John 16:7 - "Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you."

Salvation is by grace through faith. "After faith is come," we are filled with the Holy Spirit. He does a work in our heart (circumcision of the heart -godly repentance) and we are sealed by the Spirit and placed "into Christ". When we trust and believe we are saved, and filled by the Holy Spirit. One Faith. One Baptism.

Gal. 3: 25-27 - "But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ."

Webb, knows not of what he or she speaks...

 

[glorydaz]

Paul knew the law very well and was a inforcer of the law remember he had help stone Stephen right before seeing Jesus.If you read Roman the whole chapter it bout the law vs faith and how both come together. GOD's "moral law" i don't really know about.. But He made Moses write what he write to let you know what to do if you sin and GOD told everyone what was sin the 10 commandments.
I feel like this if you live in sin you not living for GOD. So how would you know sin? Because it feel good I can say it of GOD. If I cheating on my wife and with another woman and it feel good. I going to say that sin. In Genesis, they commit adultery, Abraham had did. I leave you with this if you know the speed limit you go the speed limit and if you don't know the speed you going to find out.

LOL I like your speed limit analogy. Before God gave Moses the Ten Commandments, His eternal moral laws were written in man's conscience. That little voice saying, "That's not right...I shouldn't do that," is so well known that they even make stories about a good and bad angel sitting on each shoulder. Earliest man knew he shouldn't take something that belonged to someone else.

If someone is cheating on their wife, it may feel good in the flesh, but it doesn't stop the feelings of guilt that come along with it. If they do it often enough, their conscience gets seared and they don't feel guilty any longer. The more we sin the less our conscience is affected.

Once we come to know the Lord and are saved, He gives us a heart to follow Him instead of our old sinful desires. If we mess up, He will chasten us as sons. Once you're saved, it doesn't pay to cheat on your wife. God has a very big stick and He will apply it liberally. It's no-holds-barred, down and dirty if need be. I've seen severe consequences doled out on the children of God. There is nothing that will separate us from the Love of God once we're His child, and the sooner you learn that the better it will be. ;)

 

[Webb]

Glorydaz

The indwelling and baptism of the Spirit are not necessarily the same. As for Grubal who refuses to honor I Pet.3:15, Webb is most definitely a he.

 

[glorydaz]

Glorydaz

The indwelling and baptism of the Spirit are not necessarily the same. As for Grubal who refuses to honor I Pet.3:15, Webb is most definitely a he.

I can only glean from your answer that you're Pentecostal. If not, please elaborate.

If you are, I'd be more than happy to refute what you're saying....for I know well what it will be.

 

[Webb]

I am Pentecostal only in the sense that the church of my Lord was established on the 1st Pentecost after His resurrection.

 

[Adullam]

I am Pentecostal only in the sense that the church of my Lord was established on the 1st Pentecost after His resurrection.

Good answer! So you are saying that regeneration or the quickening at birth in the Spirit is to be followed up by the baptism in the Spirit which empowers the new believer with ministry gifts and authority?

 

[Webb]

No. I believe the scripture teaches noone has been baptized with the Holy Spirit since Cornelius.

 

[Grubal Muruch]

No. I believe the scripture teaches noone has been baptized with the Holy Spirit since Cornelius.

YIKES!!!

 

[glorydaz]

No. I believe the scripture teaches noone has been baptized with the Holy Spirit since Cornelius.

Okay...I'll bite. Show me where scripture teaches that.

 

[Webb]

Easy---The baptism of the Spirit occured at Pentecost ( Acts 2, for the Jew ) and again at the household of Cornelius ( Acts 10,11 for the Gentile ) thus upon "all flesh" as per the prophet Joel. It cannot be found happening again after that. As John's baptism and its purpose has been fulfilled, so the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

 

[Adullam]

No. I believe the scripture teaches noone has been baptized with the Holy Spirit since Cornelius.

LOL...You do have a sense of humor. This is good!