Bible Study The Old Testament

[HeIsRisen2018]

It just suddenly occurred to me that I was going to write a question last night before bed, but it got too late and I didn't have time since I needed to get up early in the morning for church today. Anyway, I had no idea that the Old Testament was as graphic as it is. People are sleeping with each other and dying all over the place. But I wanted to know why God said that He was going to kill the firstborn child of a man (I do believe that it was the pharaoh) just because the man was too stubborn to listen to Him. Isn't that a little bit unfair since the child was innocent?

 

[for_his_glory]

Could you give the scripture where you read that as it would help us to look it up, thanks.

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

Could you give the scripture where you read that as it would help us to look it up, thanks.

Sure. My Message Bible reads a bit differently but this is basically the same verse I think. I'm pretty sure that it means the same thing.




Exodus 11:5 And all the firstborn in the land of Egypt shall die, from the firstborn of Pharaoh that sitteth upon his throne, even unto the firstborn of the maidservant that is behind the mill; and all the firstborn of beasts.

 

[for_his_glory]

It wasn't just babies as it was the firstborn male of every Egyptian family no matter what the age that were under Pharaoh's rule including his own son that sat with him on his throne. In all reality it was Pharaoh who caused all the firstborn to be killed. Through all the plagues God sent down on Egypt that even afflicted Pharaoh he still defied God's command to let His people go that were held captive by Pharaoh. God told Moses to tell Pharaoh unless he released the captives He would kill all the firstborn in the land except those who were of God, but in Pharaoh's defiance against God he gave no thought of his own firstborn son and still refused to set the captives free. It was Gods punishment against Pharaoh that caused his own son to die. After that he realized that God was the true God and set the captives free.

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

It wasn't just babies as it was the firstborn male of every Egyptian family no matter what the age that were under Pharaoh's rule including his own son that sat with him on his throne. In all reality it was Pharaoh who caused all the firstborn to be killed. Through all the plagues God sent down on Egypt that even afflicted Pharaoh he still defied God's command to let His people go that were held captive by Pharaoh. God told Moses to tell Pharaoh unless he released the captives He would kill all the firstborn in the land except those who were of God, but in Pharaoh's defiance against God he gave no thought of his own firstborn son and still refused to set the captives free. It was Gods punishment against Pharaoh that caused his own son to die. After that he realized that God was the true God and set the captives free.

Alright thanks for explaining that to me. I just feel bad for all of the firstborns because they really didn't need to die like that. I wasn't blaming God, I was just wondering why it had to be so harsh of a punishment when the innocent had to die. I even watched this happen in the Prince of Egypt and I still didn't understand why God couldn't just kill the pharaoh instead since it was his fault for it in the first place.

 

[for_his_glory]

Alright thanks for explaining that to me. I just feel bad for all of the firstborns because they really didn't need to die like that. I wasn't blaming God, I was just wondering why it had to be so harsh of a punishment when the innocent had to die. I even watched this happen in the Prince of Egypt and I still didn't understand why God couldn't just kill the pharaoh instead since it was his fault for it in the first place.

If you kill one another will take over as all that lived under Pharaoh's rule in his kingdom in Egypt were all pagan worshipping many gods as those who lost their life that day would have never been God's own as He alone knew that as their fate had already been sealed.

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

If you kill one another will take over as all that lived under Pharaoh's rule in his kingdom in Egypt were all pagan worshipping many gods as those who lost their life that day would have never been God's own as He alone knew that as their fate had already been sealed.

I'm sorry, I don't understand. Could you please reword this?

 

[jasonc]

It just suddenly occurred to me that I was going to write a question last night before bed, but it got too late and I didn't have time since I needed to get up early in the morning for church today. Anyway, I had no idea that the Old Testament was as graphic as it is. People are sleeping with each other and dying all over the place. But I wanted to know why God said that He was going to kill the firstborn child of a man (I do believe that it was the pharaoh) just because the man was too stubborn to listen to Him. Isn't that a little bit unfair since the child was innocent?

Cough in Exodus i will deal with peshac,which is that.

Slow aND in depth, the firstborn was the continued life of the god pharoah.in ancient Egpyt. The god simply renewed himself

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

Cough in Exodus i will deal with peshac,which is that.

Slow aND in depth, the firstborn was the continued life of the god pharoah.in ancient Egpyt. The god simply renewed himself

Thanks. Even though I haven't been responding to it I still have been reading it.

 

[jasonc]

Thanks. Even though I haven't been responding to it I still have been reading it.

Being born again,the shadow of that is this event.

 

[th1b.taylor]

And thou shalt say to Pharaoh, Thus saith Jehovah: Israel is my son, my firstborn. And I say to thee, Let my son go, that he may serve me. And if thou refuse to let him go, behold, I will kill thy son, thy firstborn.


(Exodus 4:22-23 [Darby])

Admittedly, YHWH knew Pharaoh was going to take each action because he had already, from outside our Time/Space Continuum but He knew that Yisrael, His first born on the earth, of man had suffered and had been cast into Slavery unto death and Ephrayim, Egypt, intended to stamp out God's First Son of mankind.

And it is extremely important to remember that our ways are not YHWH's ways. the He, being our Elohim, is perfect and we must learn all of His ways. Think about it, the Bible that Yashua taught is based on the only 24 books of their Bible also known as the 39 books we know as the Old Testament. We have thirty-nine books because we split Chronicles, Kings and others into two books.

Now, with the trivia aside, the Old testament and the New Testament are both misnomers. A more accurate explanation is, because Yahshua taught every lesson from the Jewish copy of the Bible that we should view the First Testament as the Bible Yashua wrote thhrough the use of scribes and the final twenty-seven books, our New Testament, still carrying the weight of scripture as the only YHWH could ave written/inspired, becoming twenty-seven YHWH inspired Life Application Commentaries on the Bible inspired by Him.

 

[eddif]

It just suddenly occurred to me that I was going to write a question last night before bed, but it got too late and I didn't have time since I needed to get up early in the morning for church today. Anyway, I had no idea that the Old Testament was as graphic as it is. People are sleeping with each other and dying all over the place. But I wanted to know why God said that He was going to kill the firstborn child of a man (I do believe that it was the pharaoh) just because the man was too stubborn to listen to Him. Isn't that a little bit unfair since the child was innocent?

If I mix up what you said I think the hidden purpose begins to surface.
Because of the stubborn nature of man, eventually the innocent son of God would die for the sins of mankind.

Our enemy is not flesh and blood, but in the Old Covenant the enemy is a man / men.

In the time you are quoting it is physical, but later it will be spiritual warfare.


First the physical then the spiritual.
First offer up animals
Second offer up Jesus.

First Joseph between two prisoners - one returned to job other killed.

Second Jesus between 2 others being crucified - one to paradise one eventually to punishment,

First reveal nakedness of body.
Second secrets of heart / life revealed.

Symbolism in Old covenant.
Spiritual reality New covenant.

Feed ox Old covenant.
Pay preacher New covenant.

Seperation from life during time.
Seperation from God for eternity.

Really takes some getting used to.

Redneck
eddif

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

If I mix up what you said I think the hidden purpose begins to surface.
Because of the stubborn nature of man, eventually the innocent son of God would die for the sins of mankind.

Our enemy is not flesh and blood, but in the Old Covenant the enemy is a man / men.

In the time you are quoting it is physical, but later it will be spiritual warfare.


First the physical then the spiritual.
First offer up animals
Second offer up Jesus.

First Joseph between two prisoners - one returned to job other killed.

Second Jesus between 2 others being crucified - one to paradise one eventually to punishment,

First reveal nakedness of body.
Second secrets of heart / life revealed.

Symbolism in Old covenant.
Spiritual reality New covenant.

Feed ox Old covenant.
Pay preacher New covenant.

Seperation from life during time.
Seperation from God for eternity.

Really takes some getting used to.

Redneck
eddif

I'm sorry, I still don't think that I quite understand.

 

[eddif]

I'm sorry, I still don't think that I quite understand.

Hey no problem.
Isaiah 6:9 KJV
And he said, Go, and tell this people, Hear ye indeed, but understand not; and see ye indeed, but perceive not.
10 Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and convert, and be healed.
11 Then said I, Lord, how long? And he answered, Until the cities be wasted without inhabitant, and the houses without man, and the land be utterly desolate,

This passage is repeated in Mark Chapter 4 and Matthew 13. Parables are the language used by Jesus so the multitudes would not understand the spiritual meaning. The disciples did not understand the meaning without explanation,

Things hidden from the foundation of the earth were hidden,

Today with the Holy Spirit a person has a better chance of understanding.

Church doctrine has clouded the understanding of parables. So the whole Old Testament is a mystery to some.

Colossians 2:16’kjv
Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

The reality of Christ is hidden in food drink and days. Hidden from creation. Talked about by spirit filled New Testament folks.

Mississippi redneck
eddif

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

Man,.. my learning disability is rather annoying at times. I still don't think that my question has been answered. (at least in a way that I can understand it)

 

[eddif]

Man,.. my learning disability is rather annoying at times. I still don't think that my question has been answered. (at least in a way that I can understand it)

Look some of the things took decades to understand. Then it was not my expertise that brought understanding, but the grace of God.

Graphic seen on the outside.
But
Anger
Greed
Lust
Hatred
On the Inside are apparently worse.

Matthew 5 lists the good things of the inner man. The Kingdom on the inside of us is where a battle rages. I fight a battle daily and confess sins of the flesh. The Holy Spirt strives against the flesh.

Redneck
eddif

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

Look some of the things took decades to understand. Then it was not my expertise that brought understanding, but the grace of God.

Graphic seen on the outside.
But
Anger
Greed
Lust
Hatred
On the Inside are apparently worse.

Matthew 5 lists the good things of the inner man. The Kingdom on the inside of us is where a battle rages. I fight a battle daily and confess sins of the flesh. The Holy Spirt strives against the flesh.

Redneck
eddif

At least I understand that much.

 

[Razeontherock]

Being born again,the shadow of that is this event.

Wow I NEVER saw that before!!

 

[Razeontherock]

It just suddenly occurred to me that I was going to write a question last night before bed, but it got too late and I didn't have time since I needed to get up early in the morning for church today. Anyway, I had no idea that the Old Testament was as graphic as it is. People are sleeping with each other and dying all over the place. But I wanted to know why God said that He was going to kill the firstborn child of a man (I do believe that it was the pharaoh) just because the man was too stubborn to listen to Him. Isn't that a little bit unfair since the child was innocent?

You want unfair, just wait until you get to Judges. It's absolutely brutal!

There is a reason for ALL of it. It's important to know what kind of literature you're reading; Scripture includes every type known to man. Also what you're reading was written in a different language, and occurred at least some 3900 years ago; very different culture. We have to allow for that in our thinking, so there's lots to learn.

Pharaoh had been killing Israel's first born. God was cutting Pharaoh off, demonstrating what should have been obvious; that Pharaoh was no god at all, and that there WAS a God in Israel.

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

You want unfair, just wait until you get to Judges. It's absolutely brutal!

There is a reason for ALL of it. It's important to know what kind of literature you're reading; Scripture includes every type known to man. Also what you're reading was written in a different language, and occurred at least some 3900 years ago; very different culture. We have to allow for that in our thinking, so there's lots to learn.

Pharaoh had been killing Israel's first born. God was cutting Pharaoh off, demonstrating what should have been obvious; that Pharaoh was no god at all, and that there WAS a God in Israel.

True, but who's to say that the pharaoh's son would have turned out to be like him?