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The Saving results of the Death of Christ !

wondering said:
This is how it is Iconoclast.
No one of the reformed faith is willing to discuss in a civilized manner.
You have no pearls to throw....
Your theology is very far from the nature of God.
The God of love, mercy and justice.

I don't know what you think 1 Thes 2:13-14 has to do with this effectual grace you speak of,
but I guess we won't be discussing it.

I also STILL don't have the answer to my original question to you and others:
HOW does God show His glory to men by CHOOSING to send most of humanity to hell?
Guess I won't be getting that answer anytime soon either.

This is because you lack the love necessary to witness to God.
You just parrot what has been taught to you and don't even use your own words.
This is sad.


I've been reading scripture very seriously for the past 40 years.
Not necessary that I wait for you to do so.

The Early Fathers were taught by the Apostles and had very definite ideas.
Unfortunately, they don't match with yours.
So, yes, everyone that does not agree with them and mainline Christianity are heretical in nature,
although they might be very intelligent persons, as Calvin was and also Spurgeon and also Sproul.
THEY don't decide what Christianity believes...
Jesus did.
The Apostles
and those they directly taught.

You've heard it before I, because what you're hearing on these forums is the truth.
You are not following the truth that Jesus left us with.

If the God you think you know...
Does not resemble Jesus...
You are following the wrong God.

Blessings
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Although wondering really doesn't want a response. I'll respond for any of those who are reading the exchange.
He calls all reformed persons heretical,even though they openly confess Christ.
I do not feel the love of God in this.
He suggests reformed theology does not grasp the nature of God,yet we could produce volume after volume that he could not improve upon.
 
I gave wondering a verse from 1thess2:13 and 14 where it says that they received the word of God which effectually worked in them yet he doesn't see how that speaks of effectual grace or effectually being drawn and giving new life by the Spirit he doesn't see it at all I don't know what hes looking for but this is an example of what you get
 
Iconoclast said:
Jeff, Do you also find it odd how they disregard those gifted men God has given to the church saying I just go by what the bible says,lol.
As if the Puritans did not study the bible at all.
This allows them to make their own rules and call error truth, and truth error
Click to expand...
Yes, I have seen this much in my Christian life, especially with the Pentecostals/charismatics and Catholics (you know, the true church).
 
Hopeful said:
It is written..."And the Lord repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people." (Exo 32:14)
The Lord can and does change His mind.
Click to expand...
Exodus 32:14

the Lord relented from the harm. Moses' appeal for God to change His mind, to relent, succeeded because God had only threatened judgment, not decreed it. A divine intention is not an unchangeable divine decree. Decrees or sworn declarations (cf. Gen_22:16-18; Psa_110:4) or categorical statements of not changing or relenting (cf. Jer_4:28; Eze_24:14; Zec_8:14-15) are unconditional and bind the speaker to the stated course of action regardless of the circumstances or reactions of the listeners. Intentions retain a conditional element and do not necessarily bind the speaker to a stated course of action (cf. Jer_15:6; Jer_18:8-10; Jer_26:3, Jer_26:13, Jer_26:19; Joe_2:13; Jon_3:9-10; Jon_4:2).
Click to expand...

The language used in this passage is called anthropomorphic, or man-centered, language. It is similar to someone moving from one place to another and saying, “Now the house is on my right,” “Now the house is on my left.” Neither of these statements is meant to imply that the house has moved. Rather, it is language from a human perspective to describe that I have changed my position in relation to the house. When Moses said that God relented, it was a figurative way of describing that Moses’ intercession successfully changed the relationship of the people to God. He brought the nation under the mercy of God’s grace, and out from under the judgment of God. God does not change, neither His mind, His will, nor His nature.
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Even your version of the bible makes it clear that God's intentions changed.
He changed His mind regarding the subject matter.
Clearly, a repentance; just as the KJV says.
 
for_his_glory said:
Jesus came to seek and save the lost calling all to repentance, but not everyone will heed His calling.

Luke 5:30 But their scribes and Pharisees murmured against his disciples, saying, Why do ye eat and drink with publicans and sinners?
Luke 5:31 And Jesus answering said unto them, They that are whole need not a physician; but they that are sick.
Luke 5:32 I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
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Those who Jesus call to repentance they will be caused to repent because He saved them and gave them repentance and forgiveness of sins Acts 5:30-31

30 The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree.

31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

Repentance is the fruit of the saving results of Christs death.
 
brightfame52 said:
Those who Jesus call to repentance they will be caused to repent because He saved them and gave them repentance and forgiveness of sins Acts 5:30-31

30 The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree.

31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

Repentance is the fruit of the saving results of Christs death.
Click to expand...
Christ's death is the saving result of repentance.

JESUS SAID:
Repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand.
Matthew 4:17

He didn't say:
You're a member of the Kingdom of God so repent.

As usual...


The cart before the horse...
 
Christ’s Death Actually Saves:

Because those He died for resulted in their eternal redemption, it obtained t for them Heb 9:12

12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

Thats Salvation, the word redemption here means
a ransoming, a redemption
Usage: (in the Old Testament: ransoming from imprisonment for debt, or from slavery, release from national misfortune, etc.), liberation, deliverance, release. specifically, redemption from the penalty of sin

Redemption from the penalty of sin, which penalty is eternal death as Per Rom 6:23

23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

So redemption from the penalty of sin is the Gift of God by and through Christ by His death having obtained eternal redemption for us, which is eternal life from eternal death, which is Salvation ! In fct eternal redemption equates to that eternal inheritance the redeemed is called to Heb 9:15

15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

Eternal inheritance is equivalent to that eternal life in Rom 6:23 10
 
John 12:32-33

32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

33 This he said, signifying what death he should die.

Christs own testimony to His own Saving death, hence there isn't one soul for whom Christ died that shall not come to Him or come to believe on Him and follow Him ! 24
 
brightfame52 said:
John 12:32-33

32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

33 This he said, signifying what death he should die.

Christs own testimony to His own Saving death, hence there isn't one soul for whom Christ died that shall not come to Him or come to believe on Him and follow Him ! 24
Click to expand...
Jesus died for the sins of the whole world, 1 John 2:2. All sin has been atoned for so that "Whosoever that shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved" Romans 10:13.
 
Those Christ died for, they could never die in their sins, because when He died for them, He put away their sins Heb 9:26

26 For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.

This truth is vital to Preaching the Cross, what resulted from Christs Cross work, the sacrificing of Himself for sinners.
 
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