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Growth What is the Evidence of being filled with the Holy Spirit?

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Reba said -

The evidence of the baptism of the Holy Spirit here in Acts on the Day of Pentecost includes cloven tongues like as of fire
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1 When the Day of Pentecost had fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. 2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven, as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled the whole house where they were sitting. 3 Then there appeared to them divided tongues, as of fire, and one sat upon each of them. 4 And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
Acts 2:1-4

I believe when a person gets Baptized in the Holy Spirit and fire by Jesus, then there will be fire.

The scripture here says there appeared to them divided tongues, as of fire, and one sat upon each of them.

I don't believe that the tongues of fire has to appear to the person who is receiving the Baptism of the Holy Spirit.

The holy Spirit and the Spiritual Fire that is the source of the baptism is invisible, unless The Lord allows a person to see it.

The physical manifestation that is evident is the speaking in tongues.

Here is an older photograph of a well known preacher, ministering and teaching about the day of pentecost and the baptism of the holy Spirit, in the actual upper room in Jerusalem.

View attachment 4171


The photograph caught this unique image on film.

It appears there is a tongue of Fire resting on him as he is speaking.

Also it appears there is the outline of an angel caught on film as well.


The Lord worked together with them, with signs following...


JLB
 
So what you are teaching here is, that if there are not people from every nation present when a person gets the baptism of The Holy Spirit, then it is not authentic?
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i quoted the Scripture

Act 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
Act 2:2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
Act 2:3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
Act 2:4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
Act 2:5 And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven.
Act 2:6 Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.
 
Sandy Zalecki said:
“But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.” (Galatians 5:22-23) NKJ

Do you love Him and your neighbor? Anything else is just a pathetic counterfeit.
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Hi Sandy - Your subject concerning neighborly love is the most significant issue to the Christian walk. Considering the content of 1 John 4:20, one can only practically love God within the practice of neighborly love, regardless the vehement level of desire towards love for God!

Due to the Father's work in the believer (Phillip 2:13), we should see an ever growing desire for neighborly love (over all things), which we at times exceeds our practice of it, but as we continue in the subjective process of "being conformed" (Rom 8:29), we also see our continued growth in it. The resting (Heb 4:10) which can be found in this is the fact of our undying desire for neighborly love, in spite of all opposition, esp. that which is from with (old man).

Hope I haven't over-killed my reply!

God's blessings to your Family Sis!
 
I Corinthians 11:19

There must be differences between us. One is an ear the other an eye, etc.

We all belong to the body of Christ. We do not think alike. It is tough trying to think like a kidney when you are a lung.

While I notice devout on the day of Pentacost and when the gentiles were brought in, it sure does not insure I get everything just right.

eddif
 
Some Pentecostals suggest that one may not be "considered" baptized in the Holy Spirit unless the sign was seen. The "sign" they check for is speaking in an unknown tongue (glossolalia).

But that's like saying, "We know this is a freeway entrance because we saw the sign," which is true enough -- but to then say, "This can not be a freeway entrance -- there was NO SIGN seen," doesn't follow.

I know there will be a change in the speed limit because I saw the sign, "Reduce Speed to 35," -- but what if there was no sign posted? Would the judge overturn your speeding ticket because there wasn't a reduce speed sign? It just so happens that only sometimes can we see a sign because only sometimes is there a sign posted.

Ten years after Pentecost, we find Cornelius, a Gentile Military man who is given instruction to send for Peter. Jews were forbidden to associate with Gentiles; so God had to deal with Peter with visions from heaven. After this, the servant came to his door. The Holy Spirit told Peter to go with them.

God's will was made clear to Peter. Later, the Christian Jews in leadership (back in Jerusalem) considered the ramifications and wondered what it could mean. Peter, in his defense of the Gentiles’ acceptance into the church, made it very clear that God “made no distinction between them [Gentiles] and us [Jews]” in the matter of salvation (Acts 15:9).

"The word which God sent to the children of Israel, preaching peace through Jesus Christ He is Lord of all that word you know, which was proclaimed throughout all Judea, and began from Galilee after the baptism which John preached: how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power, who went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with Him. And we are witnesses of all things which He did both in the land of the Jews and in Jerusalem, whom they killed by hanging on a tree. Him God raised up on the third day, and showed Him openly, not to all the people, but to witnesses chosen before by God, even to us who ate and drank with Him after He arose from the dead. And He commanded us to preach to the people, and to testify that it is He who was ordained by God to be Judge of the living and the dead. To Him all the prophets witness that, through His name, whoever believes in Him will receive remission of sins. While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word. And those of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because thegift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. For they heard them speak with tongues and magnify God. Then Peter answered, Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have? And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days." (Acts 10:36-48).
​
About 20 years after Pentecost, Paul went to Ephesus.

"And it happened, while Apollos was at Corinth, that Paul, having passed through the upper regions, came to Ephesus. And finding some disciples he said to them, "Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?" So they said to him, "We have not so much as heard whether there is a Holy Spirit." And he said to them, "Into what then were you baptized?" So they said, "Into John's baptism."
Then Paul said, "John indeed baptized with a baptism of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on Him who would come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus." When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid hands on them, the Holy Spirit came upon them, and they spoke with tongues and prophesied. Now the men were about twelve in all" (Acts 19:1-7).
​
It would have been pointless for Paul to ask, "Have you received the Holy Spirit since you believed?", if believers automatically receive the baptism in the Holy Spirit when they believe on Jesus as Savior.
 
eddif said:
I Corinthians 11:19

There must be differences between us. One is an ear the other an eye, etc.

We all belong to the body of Christ. We do not think alike. It is tough trying to think like a kidney when you are a lung.

While I notice devout on the day of Pentacost and when the gentiles were brought in, it sure does not insure I get everything just right.

eddif
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There you go with those body parts again.....:wink

I agree with your post. Praise the Lord, it would a little hard to function well without a thumb or a big toe.
 
Sparrowhawk said -

It would have been pointless for Paul to ask, "Have you received the Holy Spirit since you believed?", if believers automatically receive the baptism in the Holy Spirit when they believe on Jesus as Savior.
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I don't see how anyone could argue this point!

:amen





JLB
 
Sparrowhawk said -

It would have been pointless for Paul to ask, "Have you received the Holy Spirit since you believed?", if believers automatically receive the baptism in the Holy Spirit when they believe on Jesus as Savior.
JLB said:
I don't see how anyone could argue this point!

:amen
JLB
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With all these years going by it gets hard to keep tabs with what condition a group might be in.

Paul's question was appropriate at the time. Johns Baptism is basically repentance, but with the instructional rider (believe in the one who comes after me). The Acts 19:1-7 passage sets up the receiving the Holy Spirit at the time of baptism into Jesus.
But
Paul laid hands on the group for the definite purpose of receiving Holy Spirit. It is not listed as an automatic occurance. We might look on it as a semi-automatic action.

We have so many individual traditions it is hard to track a timeline.

Today many do not even receive teaching on Holy Spirit (we have not heard of this). Are you going to receive what you are not prepared for? I had a spirit filled grandmother praying for supernatural help in my case (it is sure the only way to explain actions in my life).

Perhaps this thread will work great changes in the informed state of some. It will be a miracle if we agree pretty well.

eddif
 
eddif said:
Sparrowhawk said -

It would have been pointless for Paul to ask, "Have you received the Holy Spirit since you believed?", if believers automatically receive the baptism in the Holy Spirit when they believe on Jesus as Savior.

With all these years going by it gets hard to keep tabs with what condition a group might be in.

Paul's question was appropriate at the time. Johns Baptism is basically repentance, but with the instructional rider (believe in the one who comes after me). The Acts 19:1-7 passage sets up the receiving the Holy Spirit at the time of baptism into Jesus.
But
Paul laid hands on the group for the definite purpose of receiving Holy Spirit. It is not listed as an automatic occurance. We might look on it as a semi-automatic action.

We have so many individual traditions it is hard to track a timeline.

Today many do not even receive teaching on Holy Spirit (we have not heard of this). Are you going to receive what you are not prepared for? I had a spirit filled grandmother praying for supernatural help in my case (it is sure the only way to explain actions in my life).

Perhaps this thread will work great changes in the informed state of some. It will be a miracle if we agree pretty well.

eddif
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Here is a group that is a clean slate, ie; they did not know of John or Jesus.

44 While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word. 45 And those of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. 46 For they heard them speak with tongues and magnify God. Then Peter answered, 47 "Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?" 48And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days.
Acts 10:44-48

Water Baptism came at the end. The group that was with Peter were astonished that the Holy Spirit was poured out on Gentiles, for they heard them speak with tongues.

They sure seemed convinced by the evidence. What other way would they be convinced that Gentiles would have received the Holy Spirit?

Can you see this?

In other words, the scripture does not say, -

...and those of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. For they all noticed that they were walking in the fruit of the Spirit.

The evidence was they heard them speak in tongues.

JLB
 
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JLB said:
Here is a group that is a clean slate, ie; they did not know of John or Jesus.

44 While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word. 45 And those of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. 46 For they heard them speak with tongues and magnify God. Then Peter answered, 47 "Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?" 48And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days.
Acts 10:44-48

Water Baptism came at the end. The group that was with Peter were astonished that the Holy Spirit was poured out on Gentiles, for they heard them speak with tongues.

They sure seemed convinced by the evidence. What other way would they be convinced that Gentiles would have received the Holy Spirit?

Can you see this?

In other words, the scripture does not say, -

...and those of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. For they all noticed that they were walking in the fruit of the Spirit.

The evidence was they heard them speak in tongues.

JLB
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I have heard demon possessed people speak in tongues. Yes, speaking in tongues is an evidence of being filled with the spirit, but the fruit of the spirit must follow or it isn't a true conversion.
 
Sandy Zalecki said:
I have heard demon possessed people speak in tongues. Yes, speaking in tongues is an evidence of being filled with the spirit, but the fruit of the spirit must follow or it isn't a true conversion.
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Now that is a new one.

I have heard that if you don't speak in tongues, then you are not saved.

But I have never heard that one.

If the fruit of the Spirit doesn't follow, it's not a true conversion.

Which fruit of the Spirit, love? Agape Love, like God?

How long after the Baptism of the Holy Spirit with the evidence of speaking in tongues does a person have to "produce" the fruit.

I know new age people who believe in Jesus as the Christ Consciousness, as well as Maitreya Buddha, that are very "nice" and loving, who are peaceful and patient and would never try to suggest that there is only One Way to God. They love everybody, and are very kind.

I also know people who put on a "mask" at Church and are very nice and kind, and speak in a very loving and spiritual way while in Church.

These people have no more produced the Fruit of the Spirit than the man in the moon.


I guess what I'm trying to ask you, is: At what point do you determine that people have had enough time to produce the fruit you are looking for, in order to satisfy the requirement for a "true conversion".


The point that I made is: The biblical evidence of being Baptized in the Holy Spirit is speaking in tongues.

I did not mention "true conversion". That would be a discussion in the OSAS thread.


Thanks Sandy. JLB
 
The evidence for John the Baptist, of Who the Son of God was, the One Who would indeed Baptize with the Holy Spirit, was -

31 I did not know Him; but that He should be revealed to Israel, therefore I came baptizing with water." 32 And John bore witness, saying, "I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and He remained upon Him. 33 I did not know Him, but He who sent me to baptize with water said to me, 'Upon whom you see the Spirit descending, and remaining on Him, this is He who baptizes with the Holy Spirit.' John 1:31-33


This was the evidence for John, of Who the Son of God was.

Today, the evidence is the same, of whom God pours out His Spirit on, are the sons of God.

A person must first have received the Holy Spirit, in order to have have The Spirit produce fruit in their lives.

Without the Holy Spirit, their will be no Fruit of the Spirit.

It is the work of The spirit to produce Fruit. That is why it is called the Fruit of the Spirit. It's not your fruit.

The evidence that a person has received the Holy Spirit, is speaking in tongues.

Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?" So they said to him, "We have not so much as heard whether there is a Holy Spirit." 3 And he said to them, "Into what then were you baptized?" So they said, "Into John's baptism." 4 Then Paul said, "John indeed baptized with a baptism of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on Him who would come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus." 5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 And when Paul had laid hands on them, the Holy Spirit came upon them, and they spoke with tongues and prophesied. Acts 19:2-5


JLB
 
If someone speaks in tongues and then goes home and beats his wife (which I have seen) are they truly converted? If someone speaks in tongues and then goes home and grabs his feces out of the toilet and smears it in his hair (which I have also seen), is that a true conversion? "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, long suffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law. And those who are Christs' have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the spirit." (Gal. 5:22) NKJ Yes, speaking in tongues in an evidence of being filled with the Spirit, but walking in the Spirit is a much more important than speaking in tongues. How long does it take to "walk in the Spirit?" It was immediate with the apostles and those in the upper room. They immediately walked in power. You should see some immediate change if you are spirit filled and some fruits will take time to develop. It depends on how the Lord works in your heart. Everyone is different.
 
Sandy Zalecki said:
I have heard demon possessed people speak in tongues. Yes, speaking in tongues is an evidence of being filled with the spirit, but the fruit of the spirit must follow or it isn't a true conversion.
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How do you know that they were demon possessed?
People fake all kinds of things in order to get attention on them.
 
Deborah13 said:
How do you know that they were demon possessed?
People fake all kinds of things in order to get attention on them.
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I worked for a state funded mental health facility for many years. I knew this guy for three or four years. Believe me he was demon possessed. After working at that place for awhile I learned how to tell who was possessed and who wasn't.
 
Sandy Zalecki said:
If someone speaks in tongues and then goes home and beats his wife (which I have seen) are they truly converted? If someone speaks in tongues and then goes home and grabs his feces out of the toilet and smears it in his hair (which I have also seen), is that a true conversion? "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, long suffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law. And those who are Christs' have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the spirit." (Gal. 5:22) NKJ Yes, speaking in tongues in an evidence of being filled with the Spirit, but walking in the Spirit is a much more important than speaking in tongues. How long does it take to "walk in the Spirit?" It was immediate with the apostles and those in the upper room. They immediately walked in power. You should see some immediate change if you are spirit filled and some fruits will take time to develop. It depends on how the Lord works in your heart. Everyone is different.
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Sandy, I believe that salvation is determined at the end of your faith, not the beginning, nor the middle.

... receiving the end of your faith--the salvation of your souls. 1 Peter 1:9

I believe that a person must continue believe in the work of the cross, to the end.

If a person is born again, and filled with the Spirit, that is the beginning. They have the right to become, sons of God.

That they might become the righteousness of God in Christ.

For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him. 2 Corinthians 5:21

I believe that God would have to be conformed the Image of His Son...

That we should grow up into Him, and reach the fullness of the stature of the perfect Man...

So what a person does or does not do at the beginning of their born again life is not really the question for me...


but walking in the Spirit is a much more important than speaking in tongues.
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Amen! Amen! Amen!

:thumbsup:agreed


JLB


 
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