What is the 'work' that may or may not get burned up in 1 Corinthians 3:8-16?

[Jethro Bodine]

i just know i am secure in Christ by abiding in him and him in me.

Amen, bro, me too. You have to abide in Christ to be secure in Christ. Like the Passover example; you were not protected from the destroying angel if you left the house (Exodus 12:22 NASB).

i believe in a know so salvation

I do too. Non-OSAS is not about not knowing if you're saved or not. It's all about knowing for a fact that you are saved because you believe in Christ's blood for the forgiveness of sin. And we know that we have that blood that justifies applied to us because the faith that secures that blood is the faith that loves (Galatians 5:6 NASB). John goes into great depth in 1 John how love is the evidence that you are a born again believer that has faith in Christ's forgiveness. The obedience of faith in Christ is the visible evidence that you do indeed have the faith that makes you secure in Christ. A life characterized by disobedience shows that a person does not have the faith in Christ that makes one secure in Him.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

God does the testing with fire not us

I don't know where I suggested otherwise.

sorry to say this but it is personal obedience to God when it comes to the ministry.

That is indeed another facet of our labor in whatever ministry it is that God has entrusted to us. But this is not what is being tested in 1 Corinthians 3:8-15 NASB. There is a time and place for the matter of our faithfulness to the trust God has entrusted to us to be judged (1 Corinthians 9:16 NASB). Jonah comes to mind, too.

 

[chessman]

It isn't about our personal obedience, our 'works of righteousness'.

Which bible were you studying? Mine has the following personal pronouns in Paul's instructions to them (including several in v17 and 18):

1 Corinthians 3:4-5, 8, 10-15, 17-18, 21 (LEB) For whenever anyone says, “I am with Paul,” and another, “I am with Apollos,” are you not merely human? Therefore, what is Apollos and what is Paul? Servants through whom you believed, and to each as the Lord gave. Now the one who plants and the one who waters are one, but each one will receive his own reward according to his own labor. According to the grace of God given to me, like a skilled master builder I laid a foundation, and another is building upon it. But each one must direct his attention to how he is building upon it. For no one is able to lay another foundation than the one which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if anyone builds upon the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, grass, straw, the work of each one will become evident. For the day will reveal it, because it will be revealed with fire, and the fire itself will test the work of each one, of what sort it is. If anyone’s work that he has built upon it remains, he will receive a reward. If anyone’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss, but he himself will be saved, but so as through fire. If anyone destroys God’s temple, God will destroy this one. For God’s temple is holy, which you are. Let no one deceive himself. If anyone thinks himself to be wise among you in this age, let him become a fool, in order that he may become wise. So then, let no one boast in people. For all things are yours,​

At least 29 times does Paul use personal prounouns in this chapter. And It's all about personal accountability.

1 Corinthians 3:17 (LEB) If anyone destroys God’s temple, God will destroy this one. For God’s temple is holy, which you are.​

 

[ezra]

Amen, bro, me too. You have to abide in Christ to be secure in Christ. Like the Passover example; you were not protected from the destroying angel if you left the house (Exodus 12:22 NASB).


I do too. Non-OSAS is not about not knowing if you're saved or not. It's all about knowing for a fact that you are saved because you believe in Christ's blood for the forgiveness of sin. And we know that we have that blood that justifies applied to us because the faith that secures that blood is the faith that loves (Galatians 5:6 NASB). John goes into great depth in 1 John how love is the evidence that you are a born again believer that has faith in Christ's forgiveness. The obedience of faith in Christ is the visible evidence that you do indeed have the faith that makes you secure in Christ. A life characterized by disobedience shows that a person does not have the faith in Christ that makes one secure in Him.

back on track it has took me years of study i am ordained gen baptist while they don,t believe in osas. i just use the security of our salvation and it goes over rather well.

 

[ezra]

There is a time and place for the matter of our faithfulness to the trust God has entrusted to us to be judged

its still works personal obedience how is our faith grown ? same way Abraham was he told him to go. he packed up and left .he was instructed. he obeyed made a few errors along the way. but the ultimate test with Issac... his work was turned into gold silver precious stone.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

2) a field growing by God's power

I've been waiting to address this point. This is my reminder to come back to this.
It helps us understand how there are 'people' in God's kingdom that will be removed from his kingdom at the end of the age.

Matthew 13:37-43 NASB (capitals and italics in original)
"37And He said, “The one who sows the good seed is the Son of Man,38and the field is the world; and as for the good seed, these are the sons of the kingdom; and the tares are the sons of the evil one;39and the enemy who sowed them is the devil, and the harvest is the end of the age; and the reapers are angels. 40“So just as the tares are gathered up and burned with fire, so shall it be at the end of the age. 41“The Son of Man will send forth His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all stumbling blocks, and those who commit lawlessness, 42and will throw them into the furnace of fire; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. 43“Then THE RIGHTEOUS WILL SHINE FORTH AS THESUN in the kingdom of their Father. He who has ears, let him hear."

The illustration of the building in 1 Corinthians 3:8-15 NASB and it being purged by fire is analogous to God's field being cleansed by fire of the unwanted growth growing in it in Matthew 13:37-43 NASB. That which is burned away are false brethren in the kingdom.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

back on track it has took me years of study i am ordained gen baptist while they don,t believe in osas. i just use the security of our salvation and it goes over rather well.

Oh, if I only had time to post all my thoughts in this forum.
I have lots to say and one of the things I've wanted to say is OSAS has found such a warm place in the church because it brings in the crowds, which in turn raises revenue. I'm not bashing you. I'm just making an observation. I know you aren't personally responsible for what has happened in the church. You, like me, have simply received what our forefathers have passed down to us through our seminaries.

Just as there is a 'real' prosperity gospel, so it is that there is a 'real' security of salvation message. It's truth is different from popular OSAS doctrine today in that it requires the person to believe and abide in Christ to the very end in order to be saved, and that it is indeed possible to stop believing and be lost along the way.

"you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain." (1 Corinthians 15:2 NASB bold mine)

Those who don't hold fast the word, perhaps because of the labor of another minister who leads them astray into 'another' gospel, will be burned off like hay, wood, and stubble on the Day of Christ's wrath. As a result, the minister who originally led them to Christ through the true gospel will lose his reward. That's why we have to be careful how we build! There are no rewards of people saved at the resurrection who aren't there to be those rewards for us (1 Thessalonians 2:19, Philippians 2:15-16 NASB).

 

[chessman]

the field is the world; and as for the good seed, these are the sons of the kingdom; and the tares are the sons of the evil one;

The world contains good AND evil sons.
The Temple of God (Christians with the Spirit of God living in them) is Holy.
Now when people defile this Holy Temple with false doctrines, it needs a good cleaning. And will (we'll) get it all cleaned up on The Day.

Matthew 13:27-28 (LEB) So the slaves of the master of the house came and said to him, ‘Master, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have darnel?’ And he said to them, ‘An enemy has done this!’ (25 But while his people were sleeping, his enemy came and sowed darnel in the midst of the wheat and went away)​

You might notice a distinct difference (yet you say analogy). The darnel was darnel seed. Nowhere does it say the wheat turned into darnel as it grew. On your view, Jesus should have told a story about wheat turning into darnel. He didn't.

On the otherhand, The Temple is Holy yet get's defiled. Yet, on The Day, get's cleaned up. A defiled temple is still a temple! Just needs a little house cleaning.

 

[JLB]

Those who have believed and later cease to believe, still know Him.

This is the proof, the acid test, that we know Him...

Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:3-4

 

[FreeGrace]

i do firmly believe %100 in the security of our salvation. i just know i am secure in Christ by abiding in him and him in me.

But...we're not saved by "abiding in Him", but by placing our trust in Him to save us. I believe that the concept of "abiding" is about fellowship with Christ, not obtaining or maintaining our relationship to Him.

where i draw the line at would be of this example a man and woman living together with out marriage and seeing no need to be married. granted our s.r citizens chose to live together rather than marriage . they can still have the relationship and not live together or sleep in separate rooms. . continuing in sin like its no big deal. raises red flags. besides i had rather leave this life knowing that i did try that not put forth a effort and still think i was saved. i believe in a know so salvation

The Bible indicates how and why King Saul died:
"13 So Saul died for his trespass which he committed against the LORD, because of the word of the LORD which he did not keep; and also because he asked counsel of a medium, making inquiry of it,
14 and did not inquire of the LORD. Therefore He killed him and turned the kingdom to David the son of Jesse." 1 Chron 10

Very clear: Saul died for his trespass against the LORD, and because he did not keep the LORD's word. So God killed him.

However, what did Samuel tell Saul the day before he died?
“Moreover the LORD will also give over Israel along with you into the hands of the Philistines, therefore tomorrow you and your sons will be with me. Indeed the LORD will give over the army of Israel into the hands of the Philistines!” 1 Sam 28:19

Those who believe that salvation can be lost and those who believe that "true believers" cannot fall away from the faith try to spin this to claim that Samuel only meant that Saul would "join him in death" or "in the grave", which seems to be kinda silly, imho. Why would a believing prophet of God, obviously saved and now residing in Paradise, only mention death or the grave? If Saul was not saved, seems to me that he would have said something quite different.

It seems clear enough that Samuel was telling Saul that the next day, Saul would be joining Samuel where Samuel was residing. This indicates that King Saul, in spite of his miserable life and death by God for disobedience, was saved.

 

[FreeGrace]

no fruit No root .

Yes, I agree. Those believers who have no root will not bear fruit. As we see in the second and third soils.

 

[FreeGrace]

Oh, if I only had time to post all my thoughts in this forum.
I have lots to say and one of the things I've wanted to say is OSAS has found such a warm place in the church because it brings in the crowds, which in turn raises revenue. I'm not bashing you. I'm just making an observation.

"Observation"??!! How would anyone know the reason that "crowds are brought in" the church?? Was a questionnaire passed out at your church?

 

[JLB]

The world contains good AND evil sons.
The Temple of God (Christians with the Spirit of God living in them) is Holy.
Now when people defile this Holy Temple with false doctrines, it needs a good cleaning. And will (we'll) get it all cleaned up on The Day.

Matthew 13:27-28 (LEB) So the slaves of the master of the house came and said to him, ‘Master, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have darnel?’ And he said to them, ‘An enemy has done this!’ (25 But while his people were sleeping, his enemy came and sowed darnel in the midst of the wheat and went away)​

You might notice a distinct difference (yet you say analogy). The darnel was darnel seed. Nowhere does it say the wheat turned into darnel as it grew. On your view, Jesus should have told a story about wheat turning into darnel. He didn't.

On the otherhand, The Temple is Holy yet get's defiled. Yet, on The Day, get's cleaned up. A defiled temple is still a temple! Just needs a little house cleaning.

Unfortunately for OSAS, a darnel was never a part in the Temple.

Unless you can show where the sons of the wicked one has the Holy Spirit dwelling within them.

16 Do you not know that you are the temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you? 17 If anyone defiles the temple of God, God will destroy him. For the temple of God is holy, which temple you are. 1 Corinthians 3:16-17

Those who are born again Christians with the Holy Spirit within them, who inturn began to produce unrighteousness, and defile those around them, will be destroyed by God.

Just read what Paul said to these Corinthian Christians a couple of paragraphs later.

6 Your glorying is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven leavens the whole lump? 7 Therefore purge out the old leaven, that you may be a new lump, since you truly are unleavened. For indeed Christ, our Passover, was sacrificed for us.8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, nor with the leaven of malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
9 I wrote to you in my epistle not to keep company with sexually immoral people. 10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner—not even to eat with such a person.

12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? 13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore “put away from yourselves the evil person.” 1 Corinthians 5:6-13


Don't eat with them or associate with them lest the defiling "leaven" spread throughout the whole community.


Then in the next Chapter, he plainly warns them, them unrighteous immoral Christians, will have no place in God's Kingdom.


9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. 1 Corinthians 6:9-10


Context after context after scriptural context, completely validates this uncomfortable truth... That Christians who have god's Spirit within them, and bring forth unrighteousness, will in the end be good for nothing except to be burned.

7 For the earth which drinks in the rain that often comes upon it, and bears herbs useful for those by whom it is cultivated, receives blessing from God; 8 but if it bears thorns and briers, it is rejected and near to being cursed, whose end is to be burned.
Hebrews 6:7-8

Drinks in the rain is a reference to the Holy Spirit being poured out in our hearts, and our hearts receiving and taking it in.


More Context -

4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame.

7 For the earth which drinks in the rain that often comes upon it, and bears herbs useful for those by whom it is cultivated, receives blessing from God; 8 but if it bears thorns and briers, it is rejected and near to being cursed, whose end is to be burned.
Hebrews 6:4-8

 

[FreeGrace]

This is the proof, the acid test, that we know Him...

Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:3-4

There are believers are who liars. Imagine that!

 

[JLB]

Amen, bro, me too. You have to abide in Christ to be secure in Christ.

Amen!!

 

[Jethro Bodine]

"Observation"??!! How would anyone know the reason that "crowds are brought in" the church?? Was a questionnaire passed out at your church?

Did you not get one?

I don't think it's not well known that 'easy believism' brings in the crowds. That's one reason why the great purging of the kingdom of God at the end of the age will be so necessary:

"10“Those slaves went out into the streets and gathered together all they found, both evil and good; and the wedding hall was filled with dinner guests.
11“But when the king came in to look over the dinner guests, he saw a man there who was not dressed in wedding clothes, 12and he said to him, ‘Friend, how did you come in here without wedding clothes?’ And the man was speechless. 13“Then the king said to the servants, ‘Bind him hand and foot, and throw him into the outer darkness; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’ " (Matthew 22:10-13 NASB bold mine)

 

[JLB]

There are believers are who liars. Imagine that!

... all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.
Revelation 21:8b

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Unfortunately for OSAS, a darnel was never a part in the Temple.

At least not a legitimate part of the temple, the building, the field of God:

"41“The Son of Man will send forth His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all stumbling blocks, and those who commit lawlessness" (Matthew 13:41 NASB)

All the parts of God's building and field composed of hay, wood, and stubble will be burned up at the last and great Judgment. That's why we need to be careful how we build on God's building. If we build the building of God with people which are false (or become false) and can not withstand the coming Judgment they will be burned away from the building of God and we will have no reward for our labor in the building of God. Our work completed will be found to be perishable and will be burned up.

 

[chessman]

"Observation"??!! How would anyone know the reason that "crowds are brought in" the church?? Was a questionnaire passed out at your church?

Observation #2: One person who doesn't believe OSAS says OSAS teaches people to 'live like Hell'. Yet another person that doesn't believe OSAS says OSAS brings crowds and money into the church. Which is it?

How many people who 'live like Hell' crowd into and give lots of money to the churches?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

The world contains good AND evil sons.
The Temple of God (Christians with the Spirit of God living in them) is Holy.
Now when people defile this Holy Temple with false doctrines, it needs a good cleaning. And will (we'll) get it all cleaned up on The Day.

Matthew 13:27-28 (LEB) So the slaves of the master of the house came and said to him, ‘Master, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have darnel?’ And he said to them, ‘An enemy has done this!’ (25 But while his people were sleeping, his enemy came and sowed darnel in the midst of the wheat and went away)

Notice that which gets burned away are people. That's the main point.

Nowhere does it say the wheat turned into darnel as it grew. On your view, Jesus should have told a story about wheat turning into darnel. He didn't.

No, because that would have to happen in regard to literal wheat and tares for that to be a useful analogy. The analogy that does fit, and which the Bible does use is the analogy of the branch (in Christ) that bears no fruit and which is then cut out (of Christ) and burned (John 15:1-11 NASB). I'm not posting that passage to start a detailed discussion about that. I posted it because I have to have a scripture of some kind in my post.