What is the 'work' that may or may not get burned up in 1 Corinthians 3:8-16?

[Eugene]

....who will render to each one according to his deeds
who “will render to each one according to his deeds”:
eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;
but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath,
Romans 2:6-8

Here we go again on OSAS. Talk of a fish out of water? Why do you consistently use scripture out of context? God here is not having Paul speak of Christians in Rom 2:6, Who will render to every man according to his deeds. Paraphrased we might be able to add (IF IT WERE POSSIBLE) because in Rom 3:10 Paul says: As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

Paul is speaking of those not in Christ that will make no mistake ever, and then concludes it as it were with Rom 3:23. For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God. Can we say this aligns with Joh 6:29 . . . This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent; not trying to be as good as they can be and failing?

 

[FreeGrace]

i am to the point of losing all interest in this thread.

Amen.

i have many times posted my view on the security of our salvation . i have showed scriptures etc..

Ditto.

i am not about to attempt to change any body mind. i stand where i stand by studying scriptures.

More ditto.

i have compared general baptist teaching and southern baptist . these are the 2 main streams on either osas or los . here is my question at what point or what sin will cause us to lose our salvation and be eternally damned .. this is something we must think about when passing judgment . yes we are all guilty of it... something to ponder all have sinned and come short.. so have we ever reached the point of danger had we died at that moment . would you or we committed this sin? Be honest :amen

I believe that no one can ever reach a point of any "danger" of losing salvation because of the clear Scriptures on eternal security.

1 Cor 15:3 says that Christ died for our sins. That covers our sins. There is no sin for which He didn't die. But it seems there is great confusion about all this. Some use 1 Jn 1:9 as if to regain salvation, in spite of no contextual evidence for such an idea.

It seems there is no use in further discussion. Minds have been made up regardless of evidence.

 

[JLB]

Here we go again on OSAS. Talk of a fish out of water? Why do you consistently use scripture out of context? God here is not having Paul speak of Christians in Rom 2:6, Who will render to every man according to his deeds. Paraphrased we might be able to add (IF IT WERE POSSIBLE) because in Rom 3:10 Paul says: As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

Paul is speaking of those not in Christ that will make no mistake ever, and then concludes it as it were with Rom 3:23. For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God. Can we say this aligns with Joh 6:29 . . . This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent; not trying to be as good as they can be and failing?

Brother,

Paul is writing to the Church at Rome, that is comprised of Jews and Gentiles.

Please read it in context.

... who “will render to each one according to his deeds”:
eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;
but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath,

You perspective would conclude that Jews and Gentiles who are unregenerate, can obtain eternal life without Christ.

How could you think that Paul, writing to the Church, doesn't refer to the Church, when he says... “will render to each one according to his deeds”:

How is it that you conclude that "each one" doesn't refer to those whom he is writing to?

These following words are written to Christians, both Jew and Gentile, who are in Rome.

2 But we know that the judgment of God is according to truth against those who practice such things. 3 And do you think this, O man, you who judge those practicing such things, and doing the same, that you will escape the judgment of God? 4 Or do you despise the riches of His goodness, forbearance, and longsuffering, not knowing that the goodness of God leads you to repentance? 5 But in accordance with your hardness and your impenitent heart you are treasuring up for yourself wrath in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God, 6 who “will render to each one according to his deeds”:7 eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; 8 but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath, 9 tribulation and anguish, on every soul of man who does evil, of the Jew first and also of the Greek; 10 but glory, honor, and peace to everyone who works what is good, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. 11 For there is no partiality with God.
12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified; 14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.


Who show "the work of the law written on their heart" is a reference to the New Covenant believer who "knows God"

Paul didn't write to the world, but to the Church.

Paul, a bondservant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated to the gospel of God 2 which He promised before through His prophets in the Holy Scriptures, 3 concerning His Son Jesus Christ our Lord, who was born of the seed of David according to the flesh, 4 and declared to be the Son of God with power according to the Spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead. 5 Through Him we have received grace and apostleship for obedience to the faith among all nations for His name,6 among whom you also are the called of Jesus Christ;

7 To all who are in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints:

Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.
Romans 1:1-7


Furthermore, Paul made it clear that he didn't judge those of the world.

9 I wrote to you in my epistle not to keep company with sexually immoral people. 10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner—not even to eat with such a person. 12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? 13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore “put away from yourselves the evil person.” 1 Corinthians 5:9-12

Finally, we can plainly read what Paul wrote in Romans chapter 6, showing this same contrast between those who practice unrighteousness, and those who practice righteousness, [showing the work of the law written on their heart] and have their fruit unto holiness.

15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? Certainly not! 16 Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one’s slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness? 17 But God be thanked that though you were slaves of sin, yet you obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine to which you were delivered. 18 And having been set free from sin, you became slaves of righteousness. 19 I speak in human terms because of the weakness of your flesh. For just as you presented your members as slaves of uncleanness, and of lawlessness leading to more lawlessness, so now present your members as slaves of righteousness for holiness.

20 For when you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness. 21 What fruit did you have then in the things of which you are now ashamed? For the end of those things is death.

22 But now having been set free from sin, and having become slaves of God, you have your fruit to holiness, and the end, everlasting life. 23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.


Those who have becomes slaves of God, produce fruit unto holiness.

Those who present their members as slaves to sin, and practice the deeds of sin, will in the end reap those wages of sin, which is death; eternal death.


JLB

 

[JLB]

here is my question at what point or what sin will cause us to lose our salvation and be eternally damned ..

The sin that isn't forgiven.

If a person is an unbeliever, they don't believe in Jesus Christ, for the forgiveness of their sins.

If a person believes for a while, then no longer believes anymore, then how does his sin get forgiven?


JLB

 

[JLB]

One is free to believe anything they desire to believe. But this is what the Bible SAYS:
The gifts of God are irrevocable. Rom 11:29
Eternal life is a gift of God. Rom 6:23

Let's see what those verse's say.

For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. Romans 6:23

For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. Romans 11:29


Nope, these verse's say more than what you claim.

For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.

This is what you are asking people to do, to receive your version of the scripture.


If we can strike and splice two different scriptures together, by ignoring part of one, and 99% of the other, the anyone could make a mockery of the bible, having it say what they want.

Example:
For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.

It's by taking in the whole scripture and surrounding context, together with the rest of the scriptures that we find the whole truth.

We are not to try and build a doctrine off off one scripture, let alone a part of a scripture, and a part of another scripture, "spliced together".



JLB

 

[ezra]

The sin that isn't forgiven.

If a person is an unbeliever, they don't believe in Jesus Christ, for the forgiveness of their sins.

If a person believes for a while, then no longer believes anymore, then how does his sin get forgiven?


JLB

that is a tip toe around the tulips reply .i am asking specific .yes the sin of unbelief is a sin . saying the sin paul listed the works of the flesh is that the only sins? doe sthe sin of knowing to do good and dont fall in this category . once again my point is not to promote osas . as i said i know i am secure in my salvation . does that give me license excuse to sin? No but i am asking those what is the sin and have you ever committed it?

 

[JLB]

that is a tip toe around the tulips reply .i am asking specific .yes the sin of unbelief is a sin . saying the sin paul listed the works of the flesh is that the only sins? doe sthe sin of knowing to do good and dont fall in this category . once again my point is not to promote osas . as i said i know i am secure in my salvation . does that give me license excuse to sin? No but i am asking those what is the sin and have you ever committed it?

It's a plain and simple answer from the scriptures that have been discussed many times in this thread.

If a person believes for a while, then falls away, in which the no longer believe, then how does one receive the forgiveness of their sins, from that point forward?

12 Those by the wayside are the ones who hear; then the devil comes and takes away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.13 But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away. Luke 8:12-13

If a believer, no longer believes, are they still a believer?


JLB

 

[JLB]

Yet, the saving of one's "soul/life" is common.

Is your soul. spirit or flesh?


JLB

 

[JLB]

i am to the point of losing all interest in this thread. i have many times posted my view on the security of our salvation . i have showed scriptures etc.. . i am not about to attempt to change any body mind . i stand where i stand by studying scriptures. i have compared general baptist teaching and southern baptist . these are the 2 main streams on either osas or los . here is my question at what point or what sin will cause us to lose our salvation and be eternally damned .. this is something we must think about when passing judgment . yes we are all guilty of it... something to ponder all have sinned and come short.. so have we ever reached the point of danger had we died at that moment . would you or we committed this sin? Be honest :amen

If a person who has been forgiven by God, through believing the Gospel and repenting, then later holds unforgiveness towards another, then it's possible to lose the forgiveness that was gained through Christ, by having it revoked, and the punishment re-instated by God Himself.


32 Then his master, after he had called him, said to him, ‘You wicked servant! I forgave you all that debt because you begged me. 33 Should you not also have had compassion on your fellow servant, just as I had pity on you?’ 34 And his master was angry, and delivered him to the torturers until he should pay all that was due to him.

35 “So My heavenly Father also will do to you if each of you, from his heart, does not forgive his brother his trespasses.”
Matthew 18:32-35


JLB

 

[Eugene]

Those who present their members as slaves to sin, and practice the deeds of sin, will in the end reap those wages of sin, which is death; eternal death.

Wow, poor old Moses who was told to go up and die in mount Nebo because of not believing God in Num 20:12, and trespassing against the Lord in Deut 32:51; eternal death huh?

You seem to continue to push your agenda of using any scripture even though it is not speaking of the Christian who is born of God being eternally damned. I'll attempt to get you to see this one last time and there is just no benefit to going further arguing the fact; I personally believe God has received you regardless just as He does them of Rom 14:3. Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.

Even though the Epistle to the Romans is a letter written to Christians, there are different contexts considered such as Rom 3:16-17 saying the gospel of Christ is the power of God unto salvation to everyone that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek, and Rom 1:17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

Now the context changes to judgment with the heading in my Bible as “The Whole World Guilty before God,” and wrath against all unrighteous as we read of those in Rom 1:18 who hold the truth in unrighteousness, and they cannot blame shift their not knowing right from wrong to God because in Rom 1:19-20 it is said Rom 1:19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them, and Rom 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse, and this continues through Romans Chapter One with a description of the immoral man.

Starting with Romans Chapter Two judgment of the unsaved continues with the Moral Man without Christ, and the context heading in my Bible reads: “Gentile pagan moralizers no better than other pagans.” In Rom 2:12 explains that “For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law. Is there really anyone besides our Savior that has ever led a perfect life?

Rom 2:17 begins showing that the religious man without Jesus is judged also, and in Rom 2:28-29 the Jew is really not a Jew unless they keep all the law which none again ever did but Jesus. Again as I said before this total condemnation of the world ends with Rom 3:10 there is none righteous, no, not one, and Rom 3:23, For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God. At last in Rom 3:24 we in Christ hear of justification in Christ, and that freely by God’s grace.

Blessings in Christ Jesus.

 

[ezra]

If a person who has been forgiven by God, through believing the Gospel and repenting, then later holds unforgiveness towards another, then it's possible to lose the forgiveness that was gained through Christ, by having it revoked, and the punishment re-instated by God Himself.


32 Then his master, after he had called him, said to him, ‘You wicked servant! I forgave you all that debt because you begged me. 33 Should you not also have had compassion on your fellow servant, just as I had pity on you?’ 34 And his master was angry, and delivered him to the torturers until he should pay all that was due to him.

35 “So My heavenly Father also will do to you if each of you, from his heart, does not forgive his brother his trespasses.”
Matthew 18:32-35


JLB

so this is the only sin that can send us to hell after being saved

 

[ezra]

It's a plain and simple answer from the scriptures that have been discussed many times in this thread.

If a person believes for a while, then falls away, in which the no longer believe, then how does one receive the forgiveness of their sins, from that point forward?

12 Those by the wayside are the ones who hear; then the devil comes and takes away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.13 But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away. Luke 8:12-13

If a believer, no longer believes, are they still a believer?


JLB

so i can live how i want , just as long as i fully believe in God and forgive others ?

 

[JLB]

so i can live how i want , just as long as i fully believe in God and forgive others ?

Is that what you perceive as being fruitful?

 

[JLB]

so this is the only sin that can send us to hell after being saved

The sin that isn't forgiven.

If a person is an unbeliever, they don't believe in Jesus Christ, for the forgiveness of their sins.

If a person believes for a while, then no longer believes anymore, then how does his sin get forgiven?

JLB

 

[JLB]

Wow, poor old Moses who was told to go up and die in mount Nebo because of not believing God in Num 20:12, and trespassing against the Lord in Deut 32:51; eternal death huh?

11 Then Moses lifted his hand and struck the rock twice with his rod; and water came out abundantly, and the congregation and their animals drank.12 Then the Lord spoke to Moses and Aaron, “Because you did not believe Me, to hallow Me in the eyes of the children of Israel, therefore you shall not bring this assembly into the land which I have given them.”13 This was the water of Meribah, because the children of Israel contended with the Lord, and He was hallowed among them. Numbers 20:11-13

So it's your perspective that striking the Rock a second time, is the same as not believing in Christ for the forgiveness of sins?

Interesting.


JLB

 

[Eugene]

So it's your perspective that striking the Rock a second time, is the same as not believing in Christ for the forgiveness of sins?

Not my words at all. Because of what Moses did, God said that Moses did not believe Him in Num 20:12, and also to die because Moses trespassed against God among the children of Israel at the waters of Meribah-Kadesh. Not only did Moses not get to enter the promised land of Canaan, God put him to death. Sounds pretty serious to me; could we say a sin unto death?

Not believing Jesus is the only means of salvation is what the world is guilty of described in parts of Romans Chapters one, two, and three. The immoral man refuses to believe even though God made Him known to them, the moral man trusts in their natural good works toward others, and the religious man trusts in the law. All are condemned without Christ and the problem you're experiencing is attempting to mix apples and oranges as it were by trying to assign the judgment of the wicked to the righteousness we have in Christ if we we are born of God.

No, I do not believe Moses is in hell; he was seen with Elias (Elijah) talking to Jesus in Mat 17:3 on what has become as the mount of transfiguration.

 

[ezra]

Is that what you perceive as being fruitful?

thank you for proving my point-- which is no man knows the real answer every thing else is just speculation . i rest my case the only thing you could come up with was un belief and not forgiving

 

[JLB]

thank you for proving my point-- which is no man knows the real answer every thing else is just speculation . i rest my case the only thing you could come up with was un belief and not forgiving

Maybe you didn't read these words...

The sin that isn't forgiven.

Maybe you did read these words, but did understand their meaning.

If you don't believe Jesus is the Christ who died for you that your sins would be forgiven then you are still in your sins.

That covers any and all sin.

If you believe Jesus died for you that your sins would be forgiven, but then later on hold unforgiveness toward a person then it's possible for God to re-instate the penalty for your sins.


JLB

 

[JLB]

Not my words at all. Because of what Moses did, God said that Moses did not believe Him in Num 20:12,

Were you aware that believe and obey are synonymous?

Moses struck the rock twice instead of once.

Moses made a single mistake in the order God gave Him.

If Moses didn't "believe" in God, then he would have never have struck the Rock to begin with.

Why would you equate making a mistake in performing a task, is the same thing as unbelief toward Christ and the Gospel?


Personally I think you do know the difference.

Let's examine the language from one of Paul's letter's.

19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery,fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21 envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
Galatians 5:19-21

Focus on this phrase -

...of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Paul was warning these folks, and had warned these people over and over, about the lifestyle of sin.

He list's these things so as to be clear.

Paul uses the word "practice" to denote the repetitive lifestyle of these things.

Those who live in these things have become a slave to to them. I should know, as I have fallen back into drugs and alcohol in my earlier walk with the Lord, and the things that accompany that lifestyle.

I had to learn not to be around people who did these things, and become defiled, so as to partake of those things my self.

Finally I learned through struggling and crying out to God as to why I would I progress in my relationship with Him, then fall back into that lifestyle.

Presenting my members as a slave to sin... putting myself in a situation, around the wrong people, in the wrong places, and end up doing the wrong thing... then fall back into a sinful habit.

Practicing these things... denotes a lifestyle.

If a person cuts themselves, and you put a gauze on the wound to stop the bleeding and take them to the emergency room, does that make you a doctor?

A doctor is someone who "practices medicine" as a lifestyle.



JLB

 

[chessman]

If you believe Jesus died for you that your sins would be forgiven, but then later on hold unforgiveness toward a person then it's possible for God to re-instate the penalty for your sins.

Are there any other sins that you think Jesus didn't die for other than "unforgiveness toward a person" or is this the only one you think His Blood possibly doesn't cover?

If you believe Jesus died for you that your sins would be forgiven,

If you believed that God has not already (versus would possibly, later) made you alive together with Christ then you're just not listening to what Paul says about what it means to be "saved" by God's Grace (versus your own ability to learn who/what to avoid).

Ephesians 2:5-6 (LEB) and we being dead in trespasses, he made us alive together with Christ by grace you are saved, and raised us together and seated us together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus,​

If there is a risk of OSAS leading people to sin more because they can never loose their salvation, then here's the risk of anti-OSAS:

It runs the risk of teaching people they are not already alive togther with Christ, raised from the dead with Him and seated with Him in the Heavenly places. I.e. YOU ARE SAVED. And yes, it was done IN CHRIST, not in your ability to avoid sins.