What is the 'work' that may or may not get burned up in 1 Corinthians 3:8-16?

[chessman]

...THROUGH FAITH. That's the part that's getting left out of the passage. We have God's power for the Day of Salvation through faith:

"Jesus Christ, who according to His great mercy has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4to obtain an inheritance which is imperishable and undefiled and will not fade away, reserved in heaven for you, 5who are protected by the power of God through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time." (1 Peter 1:3-5 NASB italics in original, bold mine)

You left out the part where Peter says just how powerful, permanent, valuable and genuine THIS faith is though:

1 Peter 1:7 (LEB) so that the genuineness of your faith, more valuable than gold that is passing away, but is tested by fire, may be found to result in praise and glory and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ,
​

I wonder why.

 

[JLB]

if you want to believe that unless you dot every I cross every T . you will lose your salvation .

Not at all my point.

But how can you think a person will be forgiven their sins, if they no longer believe?

when peter plainly wrote it was kept by the POWER OF GOD .

That's just it, Peter did not say that.


That's what you "read into" the scripture, and then turn around and tell me I can't see the "eternal security" in scripture that your "see".

It a person no longer has faith in Christ for salvation, then how are they kept by the power of God for salvation.

Here is the question again, so that I will know what you yourself believe.

Do you believe and teach that once you believe, the all your sins past present and future have been forgiven, their is no need to confess your sin, to be forgiven?




JLB

 

[JLB]

You left out the part where Peter says just how powerful, permanent, valuable and genuine THIS faith is though:

1 Peter 1:7 (LEB) so that the genuineness of your faith, more valuable than gold that is passing away, but is tested by fire, may be found to result in praise and glory and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ,
​

I wonder why.

6 In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while, if need be, you have been grieved by various trials, 7 that the genuineness of your faith,being much more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to praise, honor, and glory at the revelation of Jesus Christ, 8 whom having not seen you love. Though now you do not see Him, yet believing, you rejoice with joy inexpressible and full of glory, 9 receiving the end of your faith—the salvation of your souls. 1 Peter 1:6-9

We are certainly living in the time where we will see our faith tested through persecution, from our own Government, then we will know if our faith is genuine, and is able to endure the test... so in the end we will receive the salvation of our souls.

For it is when He comes, and we see Him, in whom we have believed, and He says these words to us...Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: Matthew 25:41

For now, we have salvation by faith.

When the Lord says, Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom, to you personally then you will have the salvation of your soul.

In this life, if you turn away, or fall away, or depart from the faith that is the substance of your salvation that you will receive when He comes, then you will not hear those words from Jesus Christ on the Day of Judgement.

Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, 1 Timothy 4:1



JLB

 

[Jethro Bodine]

most all have the faith yet they return back to the folly and show no signs of returning. you have sinned and fell short so have i.

Talk about beating a dead horse, lol. How many times do you have to hear 'this isn't about your sin, it's about your faith' before it sinks in and you stop talking about the abundance of our sin? I ask this peacefully and lovingly.

For the one who has faith, the repeated failures of his 7 X 70 relationship with God (sin/ask forgiveness, sin/ask forgiveness...) aren't the issue. For the one who has faith those sins are covered by the blood of Christ and get washed away as if they never happened and we continue on in our salvation. But for the one who has stopped believing and relying on Christ's Priesthood and Sacrifice he no longer has the efficacy of Christ's Priesthood and Sacrifice ever before the Father in heaven to keep him clean and justified and saved from the damnation of those sins"

"10If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us." (1 John 1:10 NASB bold mine)
"26For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins" (Hebrews 10:26 NASB bold mine)

Non-OSAS is all about faith, not works. You have to continue in that by which you were saved by in order to continue to be saved.

"...the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand, 2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain (in which case it's irrelevant if you hold fast the word). " (1 Corinthians 15:1-2 NASB bold and underline and parenthesis mine)

Works are only the evidence of whether or not you're holding fast the word in faith that was preached to you and by which you were saved:

"14 Do all things without grumbling or disputing; 15 so that you will prove yourselves to be blameless and innocent, children of God above reproach in the midst of a crooked and perverse generation, among whom you appear as lights in the world, 16 holding fast the word of life, so that in the day of Christ I will have reason to glory because I did not run in vain nor toil in vain." (Philippians 2:14-16 NASB)

I'm confident that you, who have proven himself to be a competent and capable and effective minister of the gospel, will be able to see what I'm saying, if you'll just drill in and focus on what I'm saying here and dismiss the preconceived idea of eternal security that everything about eternal security in the Bible presently filters through. Faith in the word of life is what saved us--holding fast the word of life that saved us is what continues to save us. Our works being the proof that we are indeed the children of God holding fast the word of life by which we are saved. Faith is what you have to have, and continue to have, to access the security--the sure hope--of God's salvation.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Ezra, now look again at the Philippians 2 passage I just posted above:

"prove yourselves to be blameless and innocent, children of God above reproach in the midst of a crooked and perverse generation, among whom you appear as lights in the world, 16holding fast the word of life, so that in the day of Christ I will have reason to glory because I did not run in vain nor toil in vain." (Philippians 2:15-16 NASB)

If the people you minister to with the gospel fail to continue in the word by which they were saved you will have labored in your ministerial race in vain. There will be no reward for you of those people being with you in the kingdom after the world is judged by fire. Why? Because they stopped believing (or didn't believe in the first place) and were as 'hay, wood, and stubble' at the Judgment and were burned up. They stopped believing and lost what they needed to get through the Judgement safely. And you lose them as a crown of exultation on the Day of Christ (1 Thessalonians 2:19 NASB)

You do not have the secure hope of salvation if you stop believing in Christ's ministry. Only those who have, and continue in faith in Christ's ministry have the security of the sure hope of salvation. That is what true Biblical security is all about. Your works are how you can tell if you have the security of salvation by faith in Christ's ministry.

 

[JLB]

No faith--no taking hold of the hope set before us.

For faith is the substance of the thing hoped for... and the evidence of things not yet seen; not yet obtained.


JLB

 

[MarkT]

I'll show you what's wrong with your interpretation. Read the bold parts:

5 What then is Apollos? And what is Paul? Servants through whom you believed, even as the Lord gave opportunity to each one. 6 I planted, Apollos watered, but God was causing the growth. 7So then neither the one who plants nor the one who waters is anything, but God who causes the growth. 8 Now he who plants and he who waters are one; each (servant through whom you believed) will receive his own reward according to his own labor. 9For we are God’s fellow workers; you are God’s field, God’s building.

10 According to the grace of God which was given to me, like a wise master builder I laid a foundation, and another (fellow worker) is building on it.

See, up to this point it's about servants of God working in God's field and building, the Corinthians, and the servant's reward for doing so.

But then all of a sudden you break context and switch from this being about "fellow workers" laboring in the field and building of the Corinthians to the individual Corinthian laboring on himself. "Each man" suddenly becomes the field and building itself, not the "servant" and "worker" laboring in that field and building that it had been up to this point:

But each man must be careful how he builds on it. 11For no man can lay a foundation other than the one which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12Now if any man builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, 13each man’s work will become evident; for the day will show it because it is to be revealed with fire, and the fire itself will test the quality of each man’s work.

In context, the 'each man' is still referring to God's servants and fellow workers laboring in the field and building of the Corinthians, but your interpretation suddenly ignores the context and without any context to do so changes "God's fellow workers" in vs. 9 to the individual Corinthian himself and his own labor on himself.

The letter is written to the church of God at Corinth, as Paul said, to impart spiritual wisdom. Is he not speaking to the entire church and to each man when he says, 'You are God's building'? And he says, 'each man should take care how he builds on the foundation of Jesus Christ.' Was the letter written to Apollos that he should watch out for wood, meaning people, or was it written to any one who builds on the foundation, even any one reading his letter? To me there is no misunderstanding Paul when he uses gold, silver and precious stones. He is using the language of the Proverbs. Pr. 2:1-10, Pr. 3:13-20 Pr. 4:1-8 Get insight. Prize her highly.

 

[MarkT]

Some people say the work is doctrine. You say it is people. But I say if any man builds with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble, he is building a spiritual house, and that work will become manifest; for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test what sort of work each one has done.

 

[JLB]

Some people say the work is doctrine. You say it is people. But I say if any man builds with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble, he is building a spiritual house, and that work will become manifest; for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test what sort of work each one has done.

If a person believes and is saved, and gets baptized, through the preaching of Paul, they have their foundation on Christ. But, then later this person is taught by others who come through town, that they must be circumcised and keep the law of Moses, in which this person begins to do what he is taught and eventually has fully turned to the law of Moses and away from Christ.

6 I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, 7 which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed.9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed. Galatians 1:6-9

This person also spreads this doctrine to others around them causing them to become defiled with "a different Gospel". which is perverted, and so pervert's the person's perspective.

This people will not stand the test on the Day of judgement.

Paul will have no crown of exultation, (reward) for that person, but Paul himself will be saved.

JLB

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Was the letter written to Apollos that he should watch out for wood, meaning people

He was speaking to the Corinthians about the laborers in the field and building of God and how the laborer has to be careful how he builds so that the laborer doesn't end up having built the Corinthians up into that which can not survive the coming fire. Why he is telling them this? Because they are making distinctions between laborers in their part of the field and building of God and exalting one laborer above another according to the wisdom of the world.

"6 Now these things, brethren, I have figuratively applied to myself and Apollos for your sakes, so that in us you may learn not to exceed what is written, so that no one of you will become arrogant in behalf of one against the other." (1 Corinthians 3:6 NASB)

Paul and Apollos are not going beyond what is written. Why? Because they know their reward is based on whether or not they build them up into those who will survive the coming Judgement. What value is it to them to build them up into those who will not be a reward for them at the resurrection, and may even condemn them for tearing down the building of God? None of course. By him telling them this he wants them to compare their ministry and their motives and their love for them to the ministry of the 'angels of light' that are deceitfully swaying them away from their ministry with 'another' gospel. He's defending his and Apollos' ministry among them to show the importance to, both, the field and building of God, and the laborers who work in it. Read this:

2 For I am jealous for you with a godly jealousy; for I betrothed you to one husband, so that to Christ I might present youas a pure virgin. 3 But I am afraid that, as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, your minds will be led astray from the simplicity and purity of devotion to Christ. 4 For if one comes and preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted, you bear this beautifully.
13 For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. 14 No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. 15 Therefore it is not surprising if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness, whose end will be according to their deeds." (2 Corinthians 11:2-12,13-15 NASB)

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Is he not speaking to the entire church and to each man when he says, 'You are God's building'? And he says, 'each man should take care how he builds on the foundation of Jesus Christ.'

But I explained to you that you improperly and without context suddenly changed the context of 'each man' midstream in verse 10 to now mean the individual Corinthian laboring in himself.

"...like a wise master builder I laid a foundation, and another (Apollos--original context) is building on it. But each man (now suddenly you say this means the Corinthian believer himself) must be careful how he builds on it. " (1 Corinthians 3:10 NASB)

You broke the context of the passage by improperly switching the laborer(s) in the passage to the individual believers themselves.

 

[MarkT]

But I explained to you that you improperly and without context suddenly changed the context of 'each man' midstream in verse 10 to now mean the individual Corinthian laboring in himself.

"...like a wise master builder I laid a foundation, and another (Apollos--original context) is building on it. But each man (now suddenly you say this means the Corinthian believer himself) must be careful how he builds on it. " (1 Corinthians 3:10 NASB)

You broke the context of the passage by improperly switching the laborer(s) in the passage to the individual believers themselves.

Who does he mean by 'you' when he says, "But I, brethren, could not address you as spiritual men, but as men of the flesh, as babes in Christ." ? 1 Cor. 3:1 He means the church, God's building, his brethren. So when he says, "Let each man take care how he builds on it", he means each man. Each man is a living stone. Each man is God's temple if God's Spirit dwells in him. 1 Cor. 3:16

 

[ezra]

That is what true Biblical security is all about. Your works are how you can tell if you have the security of salvation by faith in Christ's ministry.

ok so all i have to do is say i am saved and then prove it by works? the Jehovah witness do this every day

 

[JLB]

So when he says, "Let each man take care how he builds on it", he means each man.

The [Corinthian] Church is the building; the work [project].

Paul is the fellow worker along with Apollos.

Paul is the wise master builder, the Corinthian Church is what is being built, ie; the building.

4 For when one says, “I am of Paul,” and another, “I am of Apollos,” are you not carnal?

5 Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers through whom you believed, as the Lord gave to each one? 6 I planted, Apollos watered, but God gave the increase. 7 So then neither he who plants is anything, nor he who waters, but God who gives the increase. 8 Now he who plants and he who waters are one, and each one will receive his own reward according to his own labor.

9 For we are God’s fellow workers; you are God’s field, you are God’s building. 10 According to the grace of God which was given to me, as a wise master builder I have laid the foundation, and another builds on it. But let each one take heed how he builds on it. 11 For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ.12 Now if anyone builds on this foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, 13 each one’s work will become clear; for the Day will declare it, because it will be revealed by fire; and the fire will test each one’s work, of what sort it is.1 Corinthians 3:5-13



JLB

 

[JLB]

ok so all i have to do is say i am saved and then prove it by works? the Jehovah witness do this every day

That's just it, they were never saved.

There is no "born again" experience with them.



JLB

 

[ezra]

That's just it, they were never saved.

There is no "born again" experience with them.



JLB

all it takes is faith..

 

[JLB]

all it takes is faith..

That's just it, their is no faith coming from a false Gospel, that God didn't send His fellow workers to preach.

They don't believe Jesus Christ is Lord.

They believe, like those of Messianic Judaism, that Jesus was a lord, and not the Lord.

They believe Jesus was Michael the arch angel before he became flesh.

They believe He was created by God the Father, as all angels were, not that He was the only begotten of the Father.

No God's word, no faith.




JLB

 

[ezra]

That's just it, their is no faith coming from a false Gospel, that God didn't send His fellow workers to preach.

They don't believe Jesus Christ is Lord.

They believe, like those of Messianic Judaism, that Jesus was a lord, and not the Lord.

They believe Jesus was Michael the arch angel before he became flesh.

They believe He was created by God the Father, as all angels were, not that He was the only begotten of the Father.

No God's word, no faith.




JLB

for once i will agree on this. yes w/o faith it is impossible to please God. there has been so much emphases placed on works .that it sounds like we must qualify with works to be saved. works follow salvation not work for salvation saved by Grace through FAITH not of works unless any man should boast. we place our faith in the finished works of the cross..our payment for forgiveness and by faith we also accept the Resurrection. w/o the Resurrection we would not have the ability to be saved. faith is a key . but it does no good to say we got faith and leave out Grace . its by the GRACE we get saved we accept it by faith.

 

[JLB]

we also accept the Resurrection. w/o the Resurrection we would not have the ability to be saved.

:amen

 

[JLB]

but it does no good to say we got faith and leave out Grace . its by the GRACE we get saved we accept it by faith.

Without God's grace we are lost; I am lost.

Grace is the power of God to do what I can not do in and of myself; Grace is the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Grace.

Grace is the power of God to keep us as well, through our faith.



JLB