What is your definition of a true Christian

[Novum]

Christians are followers of Christ. They believe everything in the Bible and strive to obey everything what Jesus teaches which is in the New Testament. period! Not just part of it, everything!

You are quite simply wrong. Your definition is extremely exclusive, applying only to yourself and relatively few others.

When we try to define a word like 'Christian', the goal is to develop an inclusive definition that is true of all members of the group. Your proposed definition fails to do so.

 

[gingercat]

Christians are followers of Christ. They believe everything in the Bible and strive to obey everything what Jesus teaches which is in the New Testament. period! Not just part of it, everything!

You are quite simply wrong. Your definition is extremely exclusive, applying only to yourself and relatively few others.

When we try to define a word like 'Christian', the goal is to develop an inclusive definition that is true of all members of the group. Your proposed definition fails to do so.

Ok, everyone has opinions and I just expressed mine. Maybe that's why you are not Christian because you don't like what it takes to follow Jesus.

I just explained it very simple and clearly.

 

[Novum]

Ok, everyone has opinions and I just expressed mine. Maybe that's why you are not Christian because you don't like what it takes to follow Jesus.

I just explained it very simple and clearly.

Dictionaries contain objective definitions of words - definitions that are accepted by as many people as possible, definitions that try to capture the most wide uses of the word.

Were we trying to compile a real dictionary definition of the word "Christian", there would be no room for your subjective opinions. We must propose as objective and inclusive a definition as possible.

 

[gingercat]

Ok, everyone has opinions and I just expressed mine. Maybe that's why you are not Christian because you don't like what it takes to follow Jesus.

I just explained it very simple and clearly.

Dictionaries contain objective definitions of words - definitions that are accepted by as many people as possible, definitions that try to capture the most wide uses of the word.

Were we trying to compile a real dictionary definition of the word "Christian", there would be no room for your subjective opinions. We must propose as objective and inclusive a definition as possible.

Ok scholar, suit yourself. Sorry I cannot meet your standard.

 

[Novum]

Ok scholar, suit yourself. Sorry I cannot meet your standard.

It's not my standard. It's how dictionaries are put together - through objectivity and research.

 

[John the Baptist]

There is no shortage of debate over this topic, that's for sure. Before we take a stab at defining "true christian", perhaps we could begin with defining "christian".

we have to conclude that it is meaningless to speak of "True Christians".

Christians are followers of Christ. They believe everything in the Bible and strive to obey everything what Jesus teaches which is in the New Testament. period! Not just part of it, everything!

***
Hi, John here:
I don't agree with you if that is your quote? "We have to conclude that it is meaningless to speak of 'true Christians.' :fadein:

No, anyhow, the ones in Matthew 25 surely were Christians? Virgin ones! They are said of Christ to have a LAMP & SOME OIL! And Adam & Eve before they fell, surely had the Righteous Garment of Christ for their covering? Even Cain up to the time that 'he' made 'shipwreck' is asked of God if he did right, would he not be accepted? Genesis 4:7 The wrong free choice made him go from a real 'accepted' Christian to a 'still' professed one that was rejected, as I see it. :

And the ones of Revelation 3:16-17 finds Christ telling the Truth as always, that it was not the Virgin doctrines that they do have that is the problem, but it is their LOVE for HIM that is the problem! And surely these ones are Christians with 'some love'.

No, anyone who has Been Born Again are Christians at that point! Romans 8:1 (No condemnation, perfect! Yet they lack MATURITY!) These ALL are Christians. The FINISHED MATURE PRODUCT is what I refer to as Real Christians. And that can & does change back & forth by some perhaps? (David for one)

Also, I cannot read minds or motives of 'us' professed Christians. So we can be 'professed' Christians or 'Real Christians' as I understand it, even though I do not know a person's motives. Bad choice of terminology? Perhaps.

One last thought. Lucifer was created perfect. We do not know how long he lived in our idea of time. Yet, he surely would be considered a Christian before his fall, I would think!? I say that because the Gospel had no beginning, but is ETERNAL, or Everlasting. Revelation 14:6

 

[Novum]

Hi, John here:
I don't agree with you if that is your quote? "We have to conclude that it is meaningless to speak of 'true Christians.' :fadein:

Yes, that is my quote. However - and no offense intended - I really just can't parse what you're writing here. :-? Perhaps you could rephrase?

 

[gingercat]

Ok scholar, suit yourself. Sorry I cannot meet your standard.

It's not my standard. It's how dictionaries are put together - through objectivity and research.

You sure are quite a show-off of your knowledge. I am simpleminded and Jesus doesn't reject me or ridicule me or discouraged me because of my shortcomings in expression. Jesus will make me understand if it is important to know.
Thanks but no thanks.

 

[Novum]

You sure are quite a show-off of your knowledge.

It's hardly secret information how dictionaries are put together. :roll:

I am simpleminded

That is your prerogative.

 

[gingercat]

It's hardly secret information how dictionaries are put together. :roll:

I did not say it is secret. I just said you are a show-off. It seems that You want to show-off how smart atheists are in this forum.

According to the dictionary the word "prerogative" means "previlege"; is that what you meant? If so thank you. It sure is!!! :D
I had to look up the word. :wink: English is my second language.

 

[Novum]

I did not say it is secret. I just said you are a show-off. It seems that You want to show-off how smart atheists are in this forum.

I do not mean to "show off", and I apologize if I'm coming across that way. Also, it is impossible for me to speak for other atheists - all I can do is speak for myself.

According to the dictionary the word "prerogative" means "previlege"; is that what you meant? If so thank you. It sure is!!! :D
I had to look up the word. :wink: English is my second language.

Yup! It is certainly your prerogative to choose to be simpleminded. Your choice entirely.

 

[Nocturnal_Principal_X]

Reminder this topic is about "What is your definition of a true Christian." Myself and other moderators reserve the right delete any posts and we deem to go off topic. So please post only things that have to do with this topic. Personal problems are to be done in PMs.

 

[John the Baptist]

What is your definition of a true Christian?

OK: The Word of God says in 1 John 4:6 K.J.

"We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God, heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error."

---John

 

[Nocturnal_Principal_X]

What is your definition of a true Christian?

Check the first page, I provided my answer there.

 

[Imagican]

A person who worships God and follows the example of doing so by imitating Christ....

Well guys, time for your grades. I think mostly you collectively ended up with a D--------------. yes, those are minuses.

Let's see what Christ offered as far as His idea of Christianity. He was asked about the MOST important of ALL the commandments. Before we go there, He also stated that those that would inherit eternal life would be those that followed His commandments. Now, what was His answer to the first question? Love God above ALL else, NUMBER ONE, and the second, much like the first, love your neighbor as yourself. Now, note that He didn't let it end here. What did He go on to add? And ALL the Law and all the Prophets revolve around THESE TWO. Please NOTE the MOST important single word in this last statement. What is it?.............I'm waiting............. The MOST important word in this last statement was/IS........ALL. ALL!!!

Now. let us break this down and we will quickly find that George offered as good an explanation of Christian as could possibly be offered in so few words. He loves God above ALL else and loves his neighbor as himself. Love God above ALL else, and, well, let's see...........what did Christ do?......Well, He said some things. That doesn't really seem to be the answer, He taught some things, but that doesn't seem to answer our question either. So, what did He REALLY do that offered you and I ANYTHING? He........, yeah, I'm waiting, well He..................yeah, yeah, I see it's coming,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,well, HE DIED FOR US. Ok, So? Don't you get it YET? He died for US. While we were YET the enemies of God, His Son DIED FOR US. NOW YOU GET IT? He LOVED US ENOUGH TO DIE FOR US? That's it folks, He LOVED US ENOUGH to DIE FOR US. That's the answer. LOVE. Now, how can we offer this love? In emulation of the EXAMPLE set for US by the SON OF GOD.

So, let us back up again to the answer that was given by Georges:

A person who worships God and follows the example of doing so by imitating Christ...

Boy, except that AV believes that what you 'do' DOESN'T matter, I think that any and every other person that has responded to this thread OUGHT to come into COMPLETE agreement to what has been offered HERE. Loves God above all else, (worships Him AS GOD, follows His will), and, AND follows the example of HOW to do this by IMITATING Christ, (offering the 'same' kind of love that Christ offered to each and every one of us).

George, once again, let me commend you on being able to offer such a direct definition to something that all the others would spend weeks trying to catch up to with hundreds and thousands of useless words. Your grade?
A++++++++++++++++++. Way to go guy.

 

[AVBunyan]

"is" vs. "does"

A person who worships God and follows the example of doing so by imitating Christ....

Boy, except that AV believes that what you 'do' DOESN'T matter,
Your grade? A++++++++++++++++++. Way to go guy.

Well – I guess I’ll way in here – You don’t mind do you?

The question was, “…definition of a true Christianâ€Â. I read it as what “is†a true Christian. You folks took it as what does a true Christian “do†- hence that is why you described a lot of “doing†because you folks are hung up on “doing†and because you don’t understand what the “is†is!

Interpretation – Imagican says that I said that “what you 'do' DOESN'T matter,†- Just depends on how you look at it. I don’t believe anything I did made me a Christian – what Christ did at Calvary and then what the Holy Spirit did made me a Christian. You folks believe what you “do†makes you a Christian – your own postings prove this.

Let me explaining this one more time knowing that you still will not get it (some of you will “see†it while many will not “see†it – II Cor. 4:3).

What makes a true Christian is not what he “does†but what he “isâ€Â. Let’s get the “is†first and then the “does†next just to show you I believe in “doing†but not the way you folks say I believe.

A true Christian is:
1. Regenerated – Tit. 3:5
2. Quickened – Eph 2:1
3. Spiritually circumcised - Col 2:11
4. Justified – Gal. 2:16; Rom. 5:1; Rom 8:30
5. Redeemed - Gal 3:13; Eph. 1:7
6. Raised up – Eph 2:6
7. Sealed – Eph. 1:13
8. Sanctified - 1 Cor 6:11
9. Glorified - Rom 8:30
10. Adopted - Rom 8:15
11. A new creature – II Cor. 5:17
12. Forgiven – Col. 1:14
13. Righteous – I Cor. 1::30
14. Spiritually baptized – Col. 2:9-11
And a few more…
All the above was done by the combined work of the trinity

Now – there are tons of things I believe I should do after I became a Christian. But I have to become a true believer first before I can really do the following:

A true should Christian should and most likely will:
1. Worship God – Phil 3:3; John 4:24
2. Pray – Phil. 4:6
3. Read the scriptures -
4. Seek to live holy, godly and just – Tit. 2:12
5. Do good works - Eph 2:10
6. Witness - 2 Cor 5:20
7. Love his wife - Eph 5:25
8. Teach his family
9. Attend a local church faithfully
10. Preach the word - 2 Tim 4:2
11. Thank the Lord daily – Eph. 5:18
12. Rejoice - Phil 4:4
And about a hundred other things that I don’t have the time or space to mention here –that is what a bible rightly divided is for.

All those things above (1-12) do not make one a Christian – those are things a true Christian does. Now a lost man can fake all the above – goes on all the time in churches today and…..on this forum.

Now – compare your definition with mine – Now compare the number of verses I used as compared with the number of verses you used.

Now Imagican – you were saying? What you were doing was misunderstanding me or misrepresenting me.

Again – what a person did or tries to do does not or cannot make him a saint. What makes a saint is what Christ did at Calvary and the work othe Holy Spirit applying that work.

Now Georges may get an A+++++++++++++ for what a Christian does but I believe Georges and most of the rest of you believes that this, “worships God and follows the example of doing so by imitating Christ†is what you do that makes you a Christian – this is works salvation.

You folks believe your “doings†makes you a true Christian. You folks got it backwards. Whatever happened to Calvary?

I believe what Christ did makes a true Christian.

God bless

 

[ChristineES]

Since I was the one who started this thread, shouldn't I do the grading. :wink:

It seems that everyone had their own idea what a True Christian is. I can tell you now, that I am very sorry that I even started this thread :
Christians can't even agree on what a True Christian is. It is incredibly sad. I was incredibly stupid for even starting this thread. I should have known better.

But I am not surprised or shocked. Jesus gave 2 commandments: 1. To love God with all your heart, your mind, and your spirit, and your strength, and 2. To love your neighbor as yourself. He said all the other commandments rest on these two.
If you read my answer, I said a True Christian was someone who followed Christ and obeyed His Commandments (the two mentioned above). I still hold with that. It is not strange, having LOVE as a commandment. Loving God and your fellow man (and woman). Jesus said it, Paul said it in Corinthians.1Co 16:14 Let all that you do be done in love.
Jesus commanded His Apostles to love one another:Joh 15:17 These things I command you, so that you will love one another.

Jesus also says to love your enemies: Mat 5:43 "You have heard that it was said, 'You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.' Mat 5:44 But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,


It is in The Law:Lev 19:18 You shall not take vengeance or bear a grudge against the sons of your own people, but you shall love your neighbor as yourself: I am the LORD. Lev 19:34 You shall treat the stranger who sojourns with you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.

As it is in both the OT and Nt, I would say love is very important. Think about that for awhile.
God Bless all of you.

 

[gingercat]

Cristine,

Love is very complicated and we can show love for God and for each other in many ways, and Jesus made very clearly in New Testament. If we strive to follow all of His teachings, we don't make many mistakes.

It is very simple but hard to follow because we are so selfish and we make our own interpretation of "love" instead of "Jesus' love".

 

[Imagican]

No, Christine. Don't be dismayed. You seem to have a true desire to follow the 'truth'. Just be diligent in your prayer and reading and you will NOT fail.

It's needed to know one's friends as well as one's advisaries. Hard to know who to 'trust' if this is NOT possible.

I know the feeling though. It is amazing how little most 'Christians' seem to have in common. Not only is 'each' denomination 'different', but each seems to teach that 'all' the others are wrong. Very, very strange if you ask me.

And sorry for not acknowledging you and your answer. I just found Georges definition to be as precise as any that was offered.

As stated above, I don't see how any true Christian can argue with this, (since this is basically what Christ COMMANDED of us). And I commend you for being one of the few that seems to basically agree with this.

Even for those that believe Jesus IS God, if we look back at the OT, it IS basically what God commanded also. This becomes EVEN more apparent when one seriously takes into consideration what Christ offered in, "ALL the law, and ALL the prophets..........''.

So, guys and gals, there IS the answer. One would be 'hard-pressed' to find another answer to the question. It IS a matter of 'doing' to claim Christ AS your Savior. Christ Himself states this. So, do we heed His call? Do we 'pick up the cross and bear the burden? Or, do we simply sit back and 'say', 'Jesus is my Savior'? Do we surely try and emulate the one whose example is the 'purpose' of Christianity, or do we simply 'do' things in His name? I think the example is MUCH more important than what we 'say'.

And, Christine, no intent to 'hi-jack', your thread. I simply tried to step in and create some order. It did seem to be taking a different course than that which you intended and it was time to 'put it back on track'. Please forgive me if you feel I was 'out of line'.

MEC

 

[thessalonian]

Since I was the one who started this thread, shouldn't I do the grading. :wink:

It seems that everyone had their own idea what a True Christian is. I can tell you now, that I am very sorry that I even started this thread :
Christians can't even agree on what a True Christian is. It is incredibly sad. I was incredibly stupid for even starting this thread. I should have known better.

Don't feel bad. Actually in reality from my Catholic perspective I don't neccessarily see contradiction in alot of the definitions. I agree with your definition that a Christian is a follower of Christ. I agree with ginger that it means to come to know him in scripture and strive to follow him. Amen God gave us two commandments and those in fact do help define what a Christian is. And those two commandments for me point to the 10 and so I am in partial agreement with George and Imigican. If we are loving God we are worshipping him alone and not having any idols and honoring his name. If we are loving our neighbor we are honoring our parents, not stealing, not looking with hatred or lust or covetousness at others, etc. The two are a summation of the 10. My answer, which was similar to AV's however, was not meant as a contradiction to the others but to focus the matter of how one becomes and stays a Christian on grace. Grace is what makes all of these things possible. God's grace working in us is what gives us the strength to follow him and the commandments and to love and to have faith. Thus my definition held that emphasis. It does not mean that I disagreed with anyone elses definition. Catholicism is not either or and it is natural for people to look in a dichotomous fashion at things. But that is not the way I see the scriptures and salvation and Christianity at all. It is far broader and more encompassing than most Christians will see it.

You are quite right about love definint a Christian. It is definitely a major part of the equation. Paul says "faith, hope, and love abideth, and the greatest of these is faith". Nope strike that. "the greatest of these is love". Love is even more important that faith, thus James says "faith without works is dead". And once again the commandments are about love. How can one who is plotting the demise of his brother or seeking after his wife be loving him. If he is stealing or coveting his property there is not love there.

Anyway, hope I help patch some of this together and make the thread not look as divergent as it seems. I do have to add that a proper view of God (i.e. trinitarian) is a neccessary part of the definition of a Christian. One cannot say he knows God if he cannot define who he is. I've given my analogy many times on this.

Blessings